Midfield experienced General

[Col city fan]

This team when playing well is lovely on the eye

But when we go a goal down there’s little ‘savvy’ in it to haul the younger players up 

I’m struggling to think of a more inconsistent City team

One of the reasons for this, imo, is we don’t have a midfield general in the side. An experienced bloke who can ‘sort em out’ on the field when needed

 

Discuss....

 

NB please, no Clattermole pics 😆 I’m trying to be serious here....

[adam95581]

I think the point about how we cope when going a goal down was made in another thread and it was shown that we’ve actually got a pretty good record of recovering points. 
 

The bigger issue is what players we have on the pitch when we go a goal down to make the difference. Take the last two games - against Fulham we clearly had the wrong setup and team out but once we changed that (by bringing Under and Barnes on) we looked more balanced and had more of a threat. Last night we made changes so that we could rotate (as BR quite rightly had to do) but with Under, Maddison and Barnes on the pitch we did look more of a threat. 
 

We need to just make sure that we have the right attacking outlets on the pitch. I still think we’re a winger short, especially if we’re trying to fit Praet into a front 3. He’s a good player but he isn’t a winger. 

Edited 4 December 2020 by adam95581
More detail

[weller54]

14 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

This team when playing well is lovely on the eye

But when we go a goal down there’s little ‘savvy’ in it to haul the younger players up 

I’m struggling to think of a more inconsistent City team

One of the reasons for this, imo, is we don’t have a midfield general in the side. An experienced bloke who can ‘sort em out’ on the field when needed

 

Discuss....

 

NB please, no Clattermole pics 😆 I’m trying to be serious here....

Missed a trick with Ross Barkley.

[Ian S]

20 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

This team when playing well is lovely on the eye

But when we go a goal down there’s little ‘savvy’ in it to haul the younger players up 

I’m struggling to think of a more inconsistent City team

One of the reasons for this, imo, is we don’t have a midfield general in the side. An experienced bloke who can ‘sort em out’ on the field when needed

 

Discuss....

 

NB please, no Clattermole pics 😆 I’m trying to be serious here....

I actually agree, we are desperate for a leader but to be honest I cannot think of one we could sign who would get into our team on a regular basis, although some might say on present form anyone half decent would get into the side.

We are well covered in midfield and say we find a midfield general who do you drop out of the first 11 and keep the balance of the side.

[The whole world smiles]

12 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

This team when playing well is lovely on the eye

But when we go a goal down there’s little ‘savvy’ in it to haul the younger players up 

I’m struggling to think of a more inconsistent City team

One of the reasons for this, imo, is we don’t have a midfield general in the side. An experienced bloke who can ‘sort em out’ on the field when needed

 

Discuss....

 

NB please, no Clattermole pics 😆 I’m trying to be serious here....

If this side played consistently to its very best then then we would be winning Premier league and champions leauge titles. This level of consistency is just not realistic within how we are operating currently. 

 

Our whole model is too buy incredible young talent and help them reach their potential then sell on when they arrive at their peak.

 

This model is working absolutely brilliantly for us in terms of becoming and sustaining ourself as a force in English football. 

 

We finished 5th last season and currently sit in 4th place so are inconsistencies are actually pretty consistent. 

 

I know I'm asking for a miracle but this board needs to accept that there will be peaks and troughs over a season and try to avoid mass hysteria when we lose a couple of games. 

 

Finally not 100% sure what you mean by an"general" but we already have one of the best midfield players in the league in youri a player who not only shows leadership qualities and constant communication but is also an incredibly forward thinking player. Oh and Wilf is back and he's the best defensive midfielder in the leauge so between those two and Praet, Choudry, Mendy and even madders as an 8 I think we are pretty well stocked in that area!

[CosbehFox]

How experienced? Do realise Wilf has now played over 120 games for us 

[Babylon]

10 minutes ago, weller54 said:

Missed a trick with Ross Barkley.

Chelsea wouldn’t have let him come here.

[Ric Flair]

10 minutes ago, weller54 said:

Missed a trick with Ross Barkley.

100% agree, or even Loftus-Cheek. 

 

How many clubs have an experienced midfield general though who does exactly what we supposedly need? It's a similar football cliche to needing the perfect plan b 6ft 4 striker on the bench that is happy to just play 20 mins of football every few games and always score and then not want to leave for regular football. They are a dying breed/a bit of a myth in modern football.

[Ric Flair]

3 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Chelsea wouldn’t have let him come here.

Maybe they might if we said we'd not sell them Chilwell without Barkley coming on loan. They very nearly let Spurs have Giroud!!

[CosbehFox]

1 minute ago, Ric Flair said:

100% agree, or even Loftus-Cheek. 

 

As Babylon says though, there is a reason Chelsea loaned them to Villa and Fulham. They wouldn’t want to give them to a competitor. Equally why would we want to develop and pay for a competitors player? We wouldn’t achieve much medium term from it 

[Ric Flair]

Just now, Cardiff_Fox said:

As Babylon says though, there is a reason Chelsea loaned them to Villa and Fulham. They wouldn’t want to give them to a competitor. Equally why would we want to develop and pay for a competitors player? We wouldn’t achieve much medium term from it 

Please see post above, I'm not so sure it was impossible.

[Babylon]

Just now, Ric Flair said:

Maybe they might if we said we'd not sell them Chilwell without Barkley coming on loan. They very nearly let Spurs have Giroud!!

Even if that’s possible (I doubt it would have made a difference), why would we have signed someone on loan to sit say Maddison on the bench and stunt his development. 
 

I don’t even think he’s what we are crying out for. Plus he’s probably be on the bench as we play 9 defenders each week.

[The whole world smiles]

14 minutes ago, weller54 said:

Missed a trick with Ross Barkley.

Imagine the uproar of we were playing/adding value to a Chelsea player over developing our own promising midfielders like Youri, Maddison and Praet imagine if he had bad game or two(which he had at villa). 

 

The club aren't going to sign 26 year old Chelsea cast offs on loan so Chelsea can flog them for huge money next summer. Nor should they we don't operate like that nowadays. 

[StriderHiryu]

29 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

This team when playing well is lovely on the eye

But when we go a goal down there’s little ‘savvy’ in it to haul the younger players up 

I’m struggling to think of a more inconsistent City team

One of the reasons for this, imo, is we don’t have a midfield general in the side. An experienced bloke who can ‘sort em out’ on the field when needed

 

Discuss....

 

NB please, no Clattermole pics 😆 I’m trying to be serious here....

Agreed, we needed it last season too. If Tielemans is absent or has a bad game, we fall apart. What we need is the next coming of Esteban Cambiasso, someone like that even at his age when he came here (34) would do the job. Best example i can think of in the league right now is Moutinho of Wolves. 

 

Who could we get around Europe? Not sure to be honest. Inter Milan want to get rid of Christian Eriksen, so maybe we could take him on loan for 6 months? I'm sure many on here would hate that idea, but it's grounded in some sense of reality as a short term solution.

[Ric Flair]

9 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Even if that’s possible (I doubt it would have made a difference), why would we have signed someone on loan to sit say Maddison on the bench and stunt his development. 
 

I don’t even think he’s what we are crying out for. Plus he’s probably be on the bench as we play 9 defenders each week.

I'm not disagreeing with you particularly but given Rodgers doesn't seem interested in playing 4-1-4-1 with wingers in the league then 2 ACM's are needed as Praet and Maddison aren't dynamic enough in that role together.

[Farrington fox]

We're lacking a Wellens

[Heskey2011]

Youri is becoming a general, takes time...you've got to earn those stripes, watched his last two Belgium games and he was very authoritarian.

[Sharpe's Fox]

Damn so Col hasn't changed his opinion since like 2013, huh?

[Aus Fox]

The OPs point was about bringing in an experienced CM, not a player who Chelsea need developing.

We could do with someone in the vein of Cambiasso when he came here. Some one who has seen it all, done it all and can grab a game by the scruff of the neck - or the oppositions creative player. Bonaventura would have been a shout after leaving AC Milan.

[Shane]

The best midfielders in the league recently (De Bruyne, Bernardo, Liverpools midfield, etc) all have technical ability, but also do the dirty work like tracking back, pressing high & even committing fouls if necessary. 
 

Tielemans, Maddison & Praet quite simply do not have the physicality to match that intensity. Praet does do the dirty work to be fair, but it’s minute compared to some of our rivals midfielders such as Wijnaldum, Holjberg, Sissoko or even midfielders outside the top 6 like McGinn, Ward-Prowse & Soucek.

 

It’s ok to have technical players, but we also need more physical options in the midfield to provide a good balance. For example, Alex Ferguson had technically gifted players like Scholes & Carrick but would always play Darren Fletcher/Ji Sung Park in big games because their workrate, energy & desire was invaluable. We desperately need a Darren Fletcher and Ji Sung Park.

[Mike Oxlong]

 

or 

 

[AKCJ]

Easy to say in hindsight.

 

I don't think a single City fan would have been happy with us signing Ross Barkley.

[shen]

2 minutes ago, Shane said:

The best midfielders in the league recently (De Bruyne, Bernardo, Liverpools midfield, etc) all have technical ability, but also do the dirty work like tracking back, pressing high & even committing fouls if necessary. 
 

Tielemans, Maddison & Praet quite simply do not have the physicality to match that intensity. Praet does do the dirty work to be fair, but it’s minute compared to some of our rivals midfielders such as Wijnaldum, Holjberg, Sissoko or even midfielders outside the top 6 like McGinn, Ward-Prowse & Soucek.

 

It’s ok to have technical players, but we also need more physical options in the midfield to provide a good balance. For example, Alex Ferguson had technically gifted players like Scholes & Carrick but would always play Darren Fletcher/Ji Sung Park in big games because their workrate, energy & desire was invaluable. We desperately need a Darren Fletcher and Ji Sung Park.

Choudhury is arguably that type of player although not quite the same calibre. Mendy is a harrier. Ndidi is unquestionably our best tackler. It's not like Maddison and Tielemans don't track back - that really is a fallacy.
Maddison actually puts in above average number of tackles in his position. Then we have one of the most intelligent pressers in Vardy and the energy of Barnes. I think Cengo has also shown his ability and willingness to press, which really bodes well as we tend to overload the left due to not having Ricardo or Castagne available. But I think the intensity and coordination of pressing is something we have struggled a bit with lately.

 

Tielemans is a bit one-paced which means he's not ideally suited to this style, but he acts as a great passing option and playmaker, as we've seen numerous time this season already. This means we have to adapt a bit and have Praet and probably even Ndidi supporting the press higher up the pitch. Key to this will be getting Soyuncu back though as we'd need his pace and strength to deal with the inevitable direct balls.

[filbertway]

7 minutes ago, AKCJ said:

Easy to say in hindsight.

 

I don't think a single City fan would have been happy with us signing Ross Barkley.

I would, the man's a tank, loves driving forwards with the ball. 

[martyn]

Biggest issue for me is not the lack of a general, rather the lack of mobility in midfield, especially in games where opponents sit back, let us have the ball and wait to hit us in transition. We're so vulnerable to that, even in games where we aren't getting numbers in and around Vardy.

 

Ndidi coming back hopefully helps in that regard. 

 

This team has only ever looked consistently very good when playing 4 at the back with overlapping full backs, and us squeezing the game right up to the half way line and looking to turn over possession in the opposition's half.