FoxesDeb Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 15 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said: Then I guess the answer comes down to how one defines their own interests and I personally tend to agree with the utilitarian view that one's vote should be about generating the most value for everyone affected by the policies of the winning government, even if that means personal loss. To a limit. I obviously wouldn't expect people to vote themselves into destitution, at least I didn't expect that before the last half decade of polling. I suppose this is where I question whether people living outside the UK should still have a vote. I'd guess most people who bother to use it would be doing it for personal financial reasons? I'm really not sure that many people, if they're honest, vote without considering their own interests. The only real vested interest I have in the UK is my future pension. There are many Brexit issues which affect us emigrants, as an example I now need to take a driving test in Spanish as my UK license will become invalid next month as a direct result of Brexit. That won't be changed as a result of my vote in the next GE though, but my future pension could be.
Charl91 Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 1 hour ago, FoxesDeb said: So you would vote to adversely affect your finances and therefore your family, in empathy with a country you no longer live in? Isn't that what people do when they give to charity...? 1
FoxesDeb Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 Just now, Charl91 said: Isn't that what people do when they give to charity...? What, vote for a Government who may bring in changes to the laws affecting my pension? Not when I give to charity, no!
Tommy Fresh Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 7 hours ago, urban.spaceman said: Oh you absolute cvnt. Remember his comments about Grenfell, and he's still relevant for some reason 2
zorro en españa Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 3 hours ago, FoxesDeb said: As a voter who now lives abroad, at the next GE I will be voting for the party who will be looking after my financial interests within the UK best. If that happens to be the Tory party would I be wrong? I suppose you have to consider how those you vote for will respect how it spends our money and the impact this will have on all our futures. There is a lot of evidence to suggest that this government has wasted millions of taxpayers’ monies and the British taxpayer is going to be paying a long time for (what I genuinely consider) to be fiscal mismanagement. So, if the electorate votes in this administration again I fear there will be no end to this abuse of power. If we think this is acceptable, and this administration is best for our financial future, I think we all need to consider what check/ balance can ever restrain it? Regards being here in Spain: I think many Spaniards look upon what has happened with regard to Brexit with an element of bemusement and bewilderment. We are treated, on the whole, really well. How we deal with Europeans in the UK will, invariably, rebound on how we are treated here. I am not sure this administration is the best for us (especially the rhetoric of the present Home Secretary) and is certainly worth considering for our futures. Deb - I think you would be wrong. 2 1
HighPeakFox Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 1 hour ago, FoxesDeb said: Fwiw I probably won't be using it, but I just asked the question why people wouldn't vote for the party they felt would best serve their own interests, in my situation. What if that party was led by Stalin/Hitler/Pol Pot/Mugabe/Idi Amin etc etc - that might be a good reason why they wouldn't. Our current govt do not give a monkey's about you, me, or any other sucker that might fall for their (to me) blatant lies, contempt for nearly all of us, sleaze and corruption - their entire modus operandi is to own all the money and the law, which they seem to think they should be exempt from. So they might offer you a short-term gain, but is it big enough for you to vote for such an immoral clusterf**k? I somehow doubt it very much. 2 1
FoxesDeb Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 7 minutes ago, zorro en españa said: I suppose you have to consider how those you vote for will respect how it spends our money and the impact this will have on all our futures. There is a lot of evidence to suggest that this government has wasted millions of taxpayers’ monies and the British taxpayer is going to be paying a long time for (what I genuinely consider) to be fiscal mismanagement. So, if the electorate votes in this administration again I fear there will be no end to this abuse of power. If we think this is acceptable, and this administration is best for our financial future, I think we all need to consider what check/ balance can ever restrain it? Regards being here in Spain: I think many Spaniards look upon what has happened with regard to Brexit with an element of bemusement and bewilderment. We are treated, on the whole, really well. How we deal with Europeans in the UK will, invariably, rebound on how we are treated here. I am not sure this administration is the best for us (especially the rhetoric of the present Home Secretary) and is certainly worth considering for our futures. Deb - I think you would be wrong. Thanks for actually answering my question And I agree, most of the Spaniards I meet, and indeed other Europeans, seem a bit incredulous regarding Brexit, they don't really seem to comprehend it. I think that's partly because they see the benefits of the union whereas many in the UK only seemed to see negativity. I'm still hopeful for an agreement with the driving licenses, it seems the UK is offering an exchange for Spaniards so I'm hoping it will be reciprocated. But ultimately the Spanish don't have to offer us anything, after all it was our choice to leave. Something many UK citizens here seem to forget.
WigstonWanderer Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 2 hours ago, FoxesDeb said: What reasons other than finances do emigrants vote on? Perhaps emigrants shouldn’t vote at all. That’s the view I took when I moved to Australia. 1
weller54 Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 3 hours ago, Zear0 said: Few reasons spring to mind: They've raised VAT They've raised national insurance They've spunked billions on illegal procurement projects to line their own pockets at the cost of the tax payer. They're indifferent to the cost of living fueled by inflation which isnt great for finances. Windfall tax on record profits for gas companies? Nope, they keep that as they've 'had a tough time'. Noting your current situation, Brexit is a financial shit show one would suspect. The PM didn't even know what the single market was until it went. There's confidence in their financial competency for you. These are reasons off the top of my head over my tea why the historic view that conservative governments are some panacea of financial sensibility is out on its arse. I think it was a hard earned and now lost perception. I feel the grain of truth to Conservatives good, everyone else bad when it comes to the economy is dead in the water. They don't give a flying f*** about us is the main 'why' Ah yes , but... We've taken back control 😂
rachhere Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Fox in the North said: Not sure what to say to this, other than I am shaking my head in disgust. There really needs to a review of the civil service and the underlying culture there. I know we all knew that before to be fair, but this just highlights it to a whole new level. Edited 13 January 2022 by rachhere
FoxesDeb Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 10 minutes ago, WigstonWanderer said: Perhaps emigrants shouldn’t vote at all. That’s the view I took when I moved to Australia. Maybe when the time comes we should have a poll here for who I should vote for
urban.spaceman Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 19 minutes ago, Fox in the North said: No coming back from that. "At the time Britain was in Step 2 of lockdown easing - which banned indoor gatherings and imposed the rule of six outside." How many audiences with the Queen has he had since? Knowing the above was happening?
StanSP Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 12 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said: How many audiences with the Queen has he had since? Knowing the above was happening? And the next one is about to be super awkward...
Sly Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 38 minutes ago, Fox in the North said: I was just reading this and was going to post it. This won’t stop at the single party, we’ve scratched the surface now and we’re turning stones over. We’re going to keep finding more and more dirt. I wouldn’t even call this lot Conservatives. They’re doing lasting damage to party with the current shenanigans.
CosbehFox Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 He’s fcuked that it’s the Telegraph publishing that along with the royal family slant as well which will affect older demographics 1
Zear0 Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 4 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said: He’s fcuked that it’s the Telegraph publishing that along with the royal family slant as well which will affect older demographics When even the Torygraph are sticking the knife in, he's in trouble. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/13/no-10-party-inquiry-will-reveal-farcical-culture-say-whitehall-sources
urban.spaceman Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 18 minutes ago, StanSP said: And the next one is about to be super awkward... National broadcasters are already clamouring for rights to it. Can't wait for the Helen Mirren/Kenneth Branagh version
SecretPro Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 59 minutes ago, Fox in the North said: The end is nigh A. Its the Torygraph, and they want him gone. B. They threw the Queen into the mix for added outrage. They really, really want him gone.
SexyGammonFox Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 Boris loyalist Andrew Bridgen on newsnight now making some very good points as to why the PM should go now. The end is nigh. 2
orangecity23 Posted 13 January 2022 Posted 13 January 2022 Johnson should go, but I don't believe he'll resign - he's got no shame, and the moral integrity of a blamange made of lies. Do find Labour a bit two faced when it comes to all these resignation demands though - Jess Phillips on Question Time now demanding him gone and furious that Sue Gray is investigating him when "he is her boss". Shame Labour didn't extend these principles to our dear Leader when he was caught window cleaning in the first lockdown - or when the dear Leader was cleared of loaning Council money to his daughter's failed business, after an investigation by Councillors who he is the boss of. That's the sickening thing about our politics really - even among Labour, who are the better of two evils, they are still full of charlatans and chancers sticking their noses in the trough. Our entire democratic system is messed up, only two possibilites to run a government, safe seats that promote long tenured incompetents malingering in the system. The very fact that we elect people by glorified popularity contests that are only likely to be won by liars and Narcisists. A while back I listened to an interesting podcast about an experiment in Bolivia where they tried out a new system for electing student councils - they basically picked willing people at random with a lottery. Then found out it worked better than when they just ran elections! Really a fun listen, but may cause you to dream of a world where we bin off all our current politicans and just draw our leaders out of a hat. https://www.pushkin.fm/episode/the-powerball-revolution/ 3
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