Ukraine

[Chelmofox]

13 minutes ago, Bordersfox said:

Likewise the corruption within Ukraine's governing elite is well reported.  Zelensky appears to want to tackle that, whether he can effectively time will tell.  

 

I thinks it's absolutely fine to call that out and comment upon those things. 

 

However, what on earth that has got to do with Russia invading a sovereign state and committing atrocities is beyond me.  It's simple nonsense for anyone to imply that it is anyway relevant to Putin's decision to invade illegally, unleashing death and mayhem amongst soldiers and civilians.  The man himself presides over what is basically a repressive, dictatorial, police state.  

Ironically, a lot of the historical corruption comes from the Russian state trying to instil a puppet government, much like they did in Belarus. And yes, this is something Zelensky tasked himself to sort out. Its tough trying to be a sovereign state that neighbours Russia.  I agree its absolutely fine to call these things out. The world is hardly free of Nazi sympathisers. Just look at the US.

 

Your last point is bang on though, and i can't believe we are still having this argument a year and a half later, as well as the 'poking the bear arguments'. I refused to respond to the previous poster, but the argument that Bucha wasn't 'that bad', and a small town anyway completely sick. 

 

I think many have conveniently forgotten that when this started Russia had a huge convoy of tanks headed to Kyiv. 

[SpacedX]

21 minutes ago, Bordersfox said:

There are, of course, numerous articles online from reputable news sources and organisations including Freedom House highlighting issues with far right groups in Ukraine and those that historically have been central to militia identity - such as the Azov Brigade.  

 

Politically they have not made much headway, Zelensky is Jewish and he was elected by over 70% of the electorate.  So it depends what we define as a problem.  However, having militias operating and being tolerated by the state with far right members/history I would class as a problem. 

 

Likewise the corruption within Ukraine's governing elite is well reported.  Zelensky appears to want to tackle that, whether he can effectively time will tell.  

 

I thinks it's absolutely fine to call that out and comment upon those things. 

 

However, what on earth that has got to do with Russia invading a sovereign state and committing atrocities is beyond me.  It's simple nonsense for anyone to imply that it is anyway relevant to Putin's decision to invade illegally, unleashing death and mayhem amongst soldiers and civilians.  The man himself presides over what is basically a repressive, dictatorial, police state.  

And I am inclined to agree - and these points have been repeatedly discussed with the Kremlin apologists that now lurk on this thread - particularly police harassment of the ethnic Russian population in the Donbas region alongside the white supremacist leanings of the Azov Battalion. How this manages to be inflated to the claim that "Ukraine has a real far right NAZI problem amongst its population" by supporters of the Russian Federation, an authoritarian state, a nation hardly renowned for its tolerance and a regime that has hilariously employed the Wagner Group militia since the invasion of Crimea to do its dirty work is utterly beyond me. 

[Countryfox]

Has he gone yet ??

 

Of all the things Dirk the fox has said the one that has p1ssed me of the most was ..  “I’ll leave you all to it with your Ukrainian flags”.  
 

When you consider what that nation and the innocent people that live there have suffered ..  and are still suffering …. unimaginable things to men women and children  ..  yes I support them, and yes I would wave their flag.
 

What a fvckin weird thing to say. 

[Raj]

What's going on??

[Zear0]

11 minutes ago, Raj said:

What's going on??

Ukraine invaded Russia

[LCFCJohn]

26 minutes ago, Raj said:

What's going on??

Dmtiry Peskov popped by the thread, got butt hurt that people don’t support Russia and sulk off again basically. 

[casablancas]

Fcuking hell , there is a big old turd in this thread. Seems like it won’t flush. 

[iniesta]

Interesting to see flags at the game yesterday draped in neo-Nazi Azov symbols….

[MPH]

On 09/09/2023 at 06:04, turlo said:

I would be interested to know if Roepcke has actually been to the area to investigate and interview locals to establish if there's any further evidence to support which direction of the missile came in from? Surely if he was based in this area, as you suggest, he would've been out to the area to investigate further ie interview locals who witnessed the incoming missile. Are there any other videos out there, which capture the incoming missile or interviews with locals who witnessed the direction the mssile came in from? I couldn't see anything in his recent posts or articles stating he was in this area of Ukraine. 
 

One questionable point he uses to conclude that the missile came from the North west direction is that the reflection of a small objecton the car roofs, is proof that the missile came from that the Northwest direction. Many have commented (some with very detailed explanations) that its just as likely that the object reflected on the car roof was coming from the opposite direction rather than from behind the camara as he's suggesting. Whether Roepcke or any of the other twitter commenters are experts in physics or forensic video analysis is something I dont know. 
 

One point he has subsequently acknowledged in a follow up tweet (see below), is the more advanced missiles used by both Russia and Ukraine can be programmed to take an indirect flight path to their target. They do this to avoid the strongest points in the defending air defence system. 



Ropckes reputation took a hit last summer during the Kherson counter offensive for using very inaccurate geolations of Ukraines force movements to report breakthroughs in the south that never happened. This wasn't a one off either, which is why his credibility diminished with some followers of Russia's invasion of Ukraine due to instances of shoddy research and reporting. 

 

also, our friend Dirk didn’t mention that this guy only drew  his conclusions from

a video that Zelensky posted. No investigations at all..

[Zear0]

Just now, MPH said:

 

also, our friend Dirk didn’t mention that this guy only drew  his conclusions from

a video that Zelensky posted. No investigations at all..

It was actually a magical high definition video that Zelenskyy didn't release. Someone did their freeze frame magic on a different video. Can't think why... 

[Countryfox]

Storm shadows launched and hit a ship and sub in Crimea .. 

[MPH]

1 hour ago, Countryfox said:

Storm shadows launched and hit a ship and sub in Crimea .. 

 

 

Seems like Ukraine are paying a lot more attention to the Black Sea and ports around Crimea. I feel like they are starting to cut off its protections and supplies and ability to target advancing  Ukrainian troops.

[String fellow]

North Korean leader Kim to Putin: "I hope that we will always be together in the fight against imperialism and for the construction of a sovereign state."

While Putin hailed "the future strengthening of co-operation", concluding: "We act in the name of peace, stability and prosperity of our common region."

 

Fighting against imperialism? Constructing a sovereign state? Acting in the name of peace?

And here was I thinking that the Russians are the imperialists, trying to construct a puppet state, and using almost every war-like means at their disposal to achieve it!

Either I've been brainwashed by western propaganda or Putin and his buddy are the ones telling porkies.

(If I were an ordinary Russian, I'd be pretty alarmed at the sight of Putin cosying up to Kim.) 

 

 

 

Edited 13 September 2023 by String fellow

[turlo]

17 minutes ago, MPH said:

 

 

Seems like Ukraine are paying a lot more attention to the Black Sea and ports around Crimea. I feel like they are starting to cut off its protections and supplies and ability to target advancing  Ukrainian troops.

Apparently one of the oil riggs that Ukrainian special forces took control of a few days ago had a radar system on it, which made it easier for some of the missiles to get through. There reports coming out of locals on Crimea that both the ship and sub were badly damaged as they were in dry dock for repairs when they were hit.

 

[leicsmac]

13 minutes ago, String fellow said:

North Korean leader Kim to Putin: "I hope that we will always be together in the fight against imperialism and for the construction of a sovereign state."

While Putin hailed "the future strengthening of co-operation", concluding: "We act in the name of peace, stability and prosperity of our common region."

 

Fighting against imperialism? Constructing a sovereign state? Acting in the name of peace?

And here was I thinking that the Russians are the imperialists, trying to construct a puppet state, and using almost every war-like means at their disposal to achieve it!

Either I've been brainwashed by western propaganda or Putin and his buddy are the ones telling porkies.

(If I were an ordinary Russian, I'd be pretty alarmed at the sight of the Putin cosying up to Kim.)  

 

 

 

Every single despot who strode out on the pathway of despotism has believed their campaign to be righteous.

[MPH]

23 minutes ago, String fellow said:

North Korean leader Kim to Putin: "I hope that we will always be together in the fight against imperialism and for the construction of a sovereign state."

While Putin hailed "the future strengthening of co-operation", concluding: "We act in the name of peace, stability and prosperity of our common region."

 

Fighting against imperialism? Constructing a sovereign state? Acting in the name of peace?

And here was I thinking that the Russians are the imperialists, trying to construct a puppet state, and using almost every war-like means at their disposal to achieve it!

Either I've been brainwashed by western propaganda or Putin and his buddy are the ones telling porkies.

(If I were an ordinary Russian, I'd be pretty alarmed at the sight of the Putin cosying up to Kim.)  

 

 

 

 

 

We shouldn't be surprised with anything that comes out of the mouth of Either Putin or Kim. Besides, it would be more  concerning if it was a larger nation like India or China  that were brazenly supplying weapons. I'm waiting for a breakdown in relationships between Russia and North Korea. 2 leaders who will never play second fiddle to anyone are both going to try and pull the Alpha Male card.  It's  bound to end in tears.

[turlo]

some before and after light Satellite images of the ships that were hit today

 

 

[Countryfox]

4 hours ago, turlo said:

Apparently one of the oil riggs that Ukrainian special forces took control of a few days ago had a radar system on it, which made it easier for some of the missiles to get through. There reports coming out of locals on Crimea that both the ship and sub were badly damaged as they were in dry dock for repairs when they were hit.

 

This has indeed made a hole in their defences and analysts are confident that said hole will be used again in the near future to wreak havoc on the Russian fleet ..  

[Lionator]

I can’t believe Poland have stopped supplying weapons to Ukraine over some petty grain. When Putin and his tanks are rolling into Warsaw they’ll hopefully end up regretting their decision. 

[Zear0]

1 minute ago, Lionator said:

I can’t believe Poland have stopped supplying weapons to Ukraine over some petty grain. When Putin and his tanks are rolling into Warsaw they’ll hopefully end up regretting their decision. 

Don't underestimate the depths politicians will sink in the run up to an election...

[leicsmac]

1 minute ago, Lionator said:

I can’t believe Poland have stopped supplying weapons to Ukraine over some petty grain. When Putin and his tanks are rolling into Warsaw they’ll hopefully end up regretting their decision. 

Poland know that if that happens Article 5 gets triggered and the world burns with them, so they know it won't happen. So they obviously feel they have some flexibility on this matter.

 

Doesn't stop it being really not morally square, though.

[LCFCCHRIS]

To be honest I’m unsure why Ukraine have chosen to get so annoyed over the grain thing. Possibly they are losing money over Poland banning the sale of Ukrainian grain however threatening to sue Poland over it seems to me the definition of biting the hand that feeds you (weapon supplies etc). 

[MPH]

On 09/09/2023 at 06:39, Chelmofox said:

Ironically, a lot of the historical corruption comes from the Russian state trying to instil a puppet government, much like they did in Belarus. And yes, this is something Zelensky tasked himself to sort out. Its tough trying to be a sovereign state that neighbours Russia.  I agree its absolutely fine to call these things out. The world is hardly free of Nazi sympathisers. Just look at the US.

 

Your last point is bang on though, and i can't believe we are still having this argument a year and a half later, as well as the 'poking the bear arguments'. I refused to respond to the previous poster, but the argument that Bucha wasn't 'that bad', and a small town anyway completely sick. 

 

I think many have conveniently forgotten that when this started Russia had a huge convoy of tanks headed to Kyiv. 

 

It’s worth noting that tackling corruption has been  a particular  request  and  conditional  for joining the EU and  NATO..

[Zear0]

9 minutes ago, LCFCCHRIS said:

To be honest I’m unsure why Ukraine have chosen to get so annoyed over the grain thing. Possibly they are losing money over Poland banning the sale of Ukrainian grain however threatening to sue Poland over it seems to me the definition of biting the hand that feeds you (weapon supplies etc). 

Poles have got no more kit to give so it's notable that they're picking the same fight with other nations who have done the same thing.  As I mentioned above, the Poles go to the polls () shortly and suspect this is little more than an incumbent government trying to appear hardball for some Polish farming votes.  Everyone will be friends again shortly.

[Grebfromgrebland]

1 hour ago, MPH said:

 

It’s worth noting that tackling corruption has been  a particular  request  and  conditional  for joining the EU and  NATO..

Which was one of the drivers of us leaving the EU