Premier League has charged LCFC with an alleged breach of PSR

[Aus Fox]

3 hours ago, Gamble92 said:

New thread idea - if you could give anyone on here -12 rep, who would it be and why?

I’ve told my Mrs with her Amazon purchases we are in serious danger of breaking PSR rules…

She didn’t need a fancy lawyer to tell me to piss off.

[Bluearmyfox28]

12 hours ago, ClaphamFox said:

I've just listened to Kieran Maguire's latest podcast. In it, he reiterates his belief that the PL cannot impose a points deduction on us next season. He reckons that the recent agreement between the PL and the EFL only allows for jurisdiction to be passed from one to the other if a club is promoted or relegated, but does not extend to allowing punishments to be imposed between the PL and EFL. In other words, according to Maguire, while the PL can gain jurisdiction over a club that breached in the Championship, it can only impose a sanction on that club while it is in the PL - ie, the points deduction cannot be passed back down.

 

This runs contrary to what the majority of the media has been reporting, but Maguire seems pretty certain about it. He reckons the PL is going after us now in an attempt to impose a points deduction on us this season and move us down 1-2 places, reducing our prize money and increasing that paid to Ipswich and/or Southampton.

If true we should be all over this. Take the hit now, rather than the possibility of setting us up in a even harder situation when the day comes that we go back up to the prem.

[STUHILL]

I actually think the Premier League would prefer to give us a points deduction this season and be done with it. We would accept that without a fight. Other clubs would cry foul, but ultimately, everything would be resolved and all parties can finally move on. I have never really bought into this idea that the Premier League and EFL want revenge on us. They likely want this done and dusted just as much as us at this point. Hopefully, Maguire is spot on.

[Guest Bilo]

A points deduction now would be the best outcome. It stops the whole pathetic charade right now and, based on precedent, is going to cost the club £3m at the very most as the prize money is reduced. 

 

Far better than it being held back until next season where the same amount could potentially cost us promotion and therefore nine figures. I wonder if that's why the club is much less bullish in its statements previously where the message was very clearly one of fighting it.

[tinpot_fox]

25 minutes ago, Bilo said:

A points deduction now would be the best outcome. It stops the whole pathetic charade right now and, based on precedent, is going to cost the club £3m at the very most as the prize money is reduced. 

 

Far better than it being held back until next season where the same amount could potentially cost us promotion and therefore nine figures. I wonder if that's why the club is much less bullish in its statements previously where the message was very clearly one of fighting it.

It gives the premier league a win and gives the impression you can’t wriggle out of their arbitrary rules and decisions. Imagine changing jobs and your new job punished you for taking dump in chief executives toilet at half time at your last job.

[Guest Bilo]

6 minutes ago, tinpot_fox said:

It gives the premier league a win and gives the impression you can’t wriggle out of their arbitrary rules and decisions. Imagine changing jobs and your new job punished you for taking dump in chief executives toilet at half time at your last job.

I don't necessarily disagree, but the alternatives are grim.

 

We could start on a points deduction next season, or even the threat of one, which severely limits us in the transfer market and hampers our season as it did this season. Or we delay it until we're next in the Premier League and that same situation effectively condemns us to relegation before a ball has been kicked, as it did this. 

 

They're not going to drop this and will get us in the end. Better to do it now while we're already down, and the costs will be relatively minimal, so we can start with a completely clean sheet of paper for next season, and maybe even learn from it. Let them take six points now, knock us down to 19th place so it costs £3m instead of £220m. It's a no brainer for me.

[Pliskin]

7 hours ago, shen said:

Surely the embargo is just for us to buy, not to sell.

I was being sarcastic 🙃 

[teblin]

Iain on when you’re smiling made a point of comparing the club the blackberry and blockbusters, in terms of calling out those fan that say “they gave us the best times”.

 

Keep doing the same thing and not evolving means you will struggle in the end, new voices and people are needed.

[teblin]

This is kind of how I'm feeling at the minute. Tried to write as a bit of an open letter. Not sure the club would read it at all anyway.

 

No one said being a football fan is easy, and with Leicester City, we have certainly experienced some major highs but also some very low points. At the moment, it seems that supporting Leicester City is a bit of a thankless task.

 

Yes, we got promoted last season, but that should never have been allowed to happen, as we shouldn’t have been in the Championship in the first place. The club, the managers, and the players let us down and put us in the position we are in today.

 

Now, after what will probably be our worst ever Premier League season, we have been hit with three charges from the Premier League regarding PSR and other related issues, and things seem to be going from bad to worse. The mismanagement of this football club is beyond belief at the moment, with the only shining light being the academy.

 

I think it is about time that the owners and directors of the business start opening some better lines of communication with the fans. The recent club statement, which ended with “We will not be able to comment further,” just sums up where we are at the minute.

 

That said, I do question the timing of this from the Premier League. Again, I know they will think they are punishing the club and the people who run it, but really, the people they are punishing are the fans and those who work for the club (not the overpaid players, I might add). The uncertainty of another summer, where Leicester fans don’t know where they stand and are unable to plan properly, causes issues.

 

So I beg of the football club and the powers that be: let’s have some clarity and draw a line under all of this so we can look forward to supporting our football team. I’m not saying the club shouldn’t be punished, but let’s get it sorted so we can concentrate on the football.

Edited 23 May 2025 by teblin

[Terraloon]

9 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Have we been told how late the accounts were published? Bearing in mind on 14th January 2025 it was announced no club had breached for 23/24.

It seems that most, and to be fair understandably, made the assumption that because City weren’t charged back in January that the club hadn’t breached PSR for 23/24.

At the time a joint statement with the PL was issued in it the following was perhaps a key indication that a charge was likely to follow:

 

"Accordingly, neither the League nor the club will make any further comment at this stage about any aspect of the club's compliance or otherwise with any of the PSR or related Rules, save to say that no complaint has been brought against Leicester by the League for any breach of the PSRs for the period ending Season 2023/24."

 

The more I read that the more I  realise that there clearly was an issue with the numbers and all that would save a charge for 23/24 was if jurisdiction was denied. It was clear that at that point City could almost certainly have agreed that 23/24 needed to be dealt with and quite possibly agreed  a sanction but that window has now and truly closed.

 

I personally think the notion that a points deduction can happen in 24/25 is folly . Although I can’t find immediately a cut off date for any points deduction at seasons end I believe that precedent lies elsewhere namely there is a cut off point if a club entered an insolvency event.

 

This is all going to untangle and almost certainly at pace.

 

The question of what now comes following the charges is one thing but the bigger question is what do the 24/25 numbers look like and of course how the EFL interpret those numbers for the 3 years to 24/25 ( I am far from sure if there  was a significant wage impact in 24/25 as a consequence of bonuses earned in 23/24 but but paid in 24/25 ) and what the projection for 25/26 looks like.

 

Edited 23 May 2025 by Terraloon

[Jazzy_Jeff]

Is there not also the potential argument that any punishment is a result of a rule change after the breach has taken place? 
 

could at least result in a sensible settlement 

[st albans fox]

18 minutes ago, Terraloon said:

It seems that most, and to be fair understandably, made the assumption that because City weren’t charged back in January that the club hadn’t breached PSR for 23/24.

At the time a joint statement with the PL was issued in it the following was perhaps a key indication that a charge was likely to follow:

 

"Accordingly, neither the League nor the club will make any further comment at this stage about any aspect of the club's compliance or otherwise with any of the PSR or related Rules, save to say that no complaint has been brought against Leicester by the League for any breach of the PSRs for the period ending Season 2023/24."

 

The more I read that the more I  realise that there clearly was an issue with the numbers and all that would save a charge for 23/24 was if jurisdiction was denied. It was clear that at that point City could almost certainly have agreed that 23/24 needed to be dealt with and quite possibly agreed  a sanction but that window has now and truly closed.

 

I personally think the notion that a points deduction can happen in 24/25 is folly . Although I can’t find immediately a cut off date for any points deduction at seasons end I believe that precedent lies elsewhere namely there is a cut off point if a club entered an insolvency event.

 

This is all going to untangle and almost certainly at pace.

 

The question of what now comes following the charges is one thing but the bigger question is what do the 24/25 numbers look like and of course how the EFL interpret those numbers for the 3 years to 24/25 ( I am far from sure if there  was a significant wage impact in 24/25 as a consequence of bonuses earned in 23/24 but but paid in 24/25 ) and what the projection for 25/26 looks like.

 

Any rush to sell players unexpectedly (or decent assets for lowish fees)  in the second half June when the window opens will tell you what the numbers for 24/25 looks like.  we’ve always avoided selling players with high wages because we wanted our cake and to eat it - give us a decent fee and take on the exorbitant salary. If you see daka and bouba leave in that fortnight for reasonable fees then we’ve accepted we have to move a big chunk of their wages onto next years numbers and to kick the can down the road. 

Edited 23 May 2025 by st albans fox

[Terraloon]

22 minutes ago, Jazzy_Jeff said:

Is there not also the potential argument that any punishment is a result of a rule change after the breach has taken place? 
 

could at least result in a sensible settlement 

Possible but I simply don’t think there would be any appetite from either the PL or EFL to offer any sort of Olive Branch and should there genuinely be proof that the breach was subsequent to a rule change then the IC would grant some sort of mitigation on that point

[les-tah]

The funny thing is if its 6 point fine and we win our last game and Ipswich lose we go above them on goal difference 🥲

[Terraloon]

27 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Any rush to sell players unexpectedly (or decent assets for lowish fees)  in the second half June when the window opens will tell you what the numbers for 24/25 looks like.  we’ve always avoided selling players with high wages because we wanted our cake and to eat it - give us a decent fee and take on the exorbitant salary. If you see daka and bouba leave in that fortnight for reasonable fees then we’ve accepted we have to move a big chunk of their wages onto next years numbers and to kick the can down the road. 

The problem in both Daka and Bouba  cases are their valuations will already be  negatively impacted by  the fact their contracts only have one year left.
 

Personally I think the writing was in the wall by the fact that JV wasn’t offered a new deal. Ok age was against him but he would have done a very decent job in the EFL so either  there are plans to bring in someone younger , better,  cheaper or for some other reason and by my calculations that has to be his potential cost  going forward was too much and his contract ending was an opportunity in terms of overall wage reduction that couldn’t be missed

 

It’s important to remember that for the 3 year cycle ending June 26 the allowable loss can’t exceed £61 million 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

11 minutes ago, les-tah said:

The funny thing is if its 6 point fine and we win our last game and Ipswich lose we go above them on goal difference 🥲

Full time, Bournemouth 5-1 Leicester City 

[Ric Flair]

8 minutes ago, Terraloon said:

The problem in both Daka and Bouba  cases are their valuations will already be  negatively impacted by  the fact their contracts only have one year left.
 

Personally I think the writing was in the wall by the fact that JV wasn’t offered a new deal. Ok age was against him but he would have done a very decent job in the EFL so either  there are plans to bring in someone younger , better,  cheaper or for some other reason and by my calculations that has to be his potential cost  going forward was too much and his contract ending was an opportunity in terms of overall wage reduction that couldn’t be missed

 

It’s important to remember that for the 3 year cycle ending June 26 the allowable loss can’t exceed £61 million 

The 2021/22 horror show year drops off doesn't it so let's hope we can get across the line, I think we'll need some sales. We still seemed to spend a fair bit last summer and probably naively thought one of Hermansen or Fatawu would clear us £30-40m profit.

[AjcW]

11 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Have we been told how late the accounts were published? Bearing in mind on 14th January 2025 it was announced no club had breached for 23/24.

14 seconds apparently.

[Chelmofox]

2 minutes ago, Terraloon said:

The problem in both Daka and Bouba  cases are their valuations will already be  negatively impacted by  the fact their contracts only have one year left.
 

Personally I think the writing was in the wall by the fact that JV wasn’t offered a new deal. Ok age was against him but he would have done a very decent job in the EFL so either  there are plans to bring in someone younger , better,  cheaper or for some other reason and by my calculations that has to be his potential cost  going forward was too much and his contract ending was an opportunity in terms of overall wage reduction that couldn’t be missed

 

It’s important to remember that for the 3 year cycle ending June 26 the allowable loss can’t exceed £61 million 

Surely it has to be that Vardy didn't want to spend another season in the Championship. He might only have 1 season left in him.

 

With Daka / Bouba, with xfer fees we really only have to get the amortised value from their contracts. The problem is going to be wages - it someone going to match what we are paying?

[Claudio Fannieri]

Just now, Chelmofox said:

Surely it has to be that Vardy didn't want to spend another season in the Championship. He might only have 1 season left in him.

 

With Daka / Bouba, with xfer fees we really only have to get the amortised value from their contracts. The problem is going to be wages - it someone going to match what we are paying?

I think it was more that the club couldn’t/wouldn’t offer Vards a new contract on anything like the wages he can command with us dropping back in to the championship. 

[Terraloon]

1 minute ago, Ric Flair said:

The 2021/22 horror show year drops off doesn't it so let's hope we can get across the line, I think we'll need some sales. We still seemed to spend a fair bit last summer and probably naively thought one of Hermansen or Fatawu would clear us £30-40m profit.

It does.

 

It’s far from easy to predict what 22/23, 23/24 & 24/25 combined will look like but we do know that 22/23 and 23/24 losses were £109 million and that the PSR excess was £35 million +£13 million. So some £61 million over when deducting allowances maybe £30 million (2x£15 million) & depreciation of £8 million (2 x£4 million) so by my very much back of a fag packet calculation the 24/25 loss  can’t be in excess of £12 million otherwise another charge is likely for 24/25 

[Terraloon]

5 minutes ago, Chelmofox said:

Surely it has to be that Vardy didn't want to spend another season in the Championship. He might only have 1 season left in him.

 

With Daka / Bouba, with xfer fees we really only have to get the amortised value from their contracts. The problem is going to be wages - it someone going to match what we are paying?

If all the club is looking to gain from the sales is the amortisation remaining and maybe a reduction in wages then you know that there is trouble ahead 

 

[Ric Flair]

2 minutes ago, Terraloon said:

It does.

 

It’s far from easy to predict what 22/23, 23/24 & 24/25 combined will look like but we do know that 22/23 and 23/24 losses were £109 million and that the PSR excess was £35 million +£13 million. So some £61 million over when deducting allowances maybe £30 million (2x£15 million) & depreciation of £8 million (2 x£4 million) so by my very much back of a fag packet calculation the 24/25 loss  can’t be in excess of £12 million otherwise another charge is likely for 24/25 

And that feels a very ambitious figure without a major sale before the end of June. KDH was in 23/24 and we layered over probably £20m + of player amortisation from last summers signings. Have appointed and sacked Cooper, appointed RvN and quite likely sacking him before the end of June too.

 

Might well be in the realms of Mads, Bilal and Nelson all needing to go to raise £30-40m profit.

[5waller5]

10 hours ago, Pliskin said:

So the EFL will then go and slap an embargo on us. So we can’t sell them, and then say we’ve breached!

 

10 hours ago, shen said:

Surely the embargo is just for us to buy, not to sell.

If you can’t buy then you can’t sell as you’d have no players? 

[Lad1966]

3 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

And that feels a very ambitious figure without a major sale before the end of June. KDH was in 23/24 and we layered over probably £20m + of player amortisation from last summers signings. Have appointed and sacked Cooper, appointed RvN and quite likely sacking him before the end of June too.

 

Might well be in the realms of Mads, Bilal and Nelson all needing to go to raise £30-40m profit.

Niddi will be sold - that will be pure profit.