Cifuentes OUT

[Richmondfox]

51 minutes ago, Chelmofox said:

JV is incapable of releasing the ball quickly, and Okoli is poor with the ball full stop. Alex Neil really did his homework on us.

 

There was a moment right of the end of the game when it felt we had a bit of urgency behind us. JV received the ball almost on the halfway line (he was the last defender). He held the ball for a moment. His natural instinct was to pass sideways or go back to the keeper, and he couldn't pass sideways. He travelled sideways a bit and resisted the urge to pass back to Jakub, and then ended up passing poorly out of play. 

 

He is good if he is given time and room and there is an opening available. He isn't able to switch up play quickly / create opportunities that aren't handed to him on a plate. 

 

Read somewhere on here that JV has been our best defender this season. It's a really poor take. He's been good when he is allowed to play to his strengths, but he is so easy to nullify and all the other teams just need to observe what Millwall did against him.

 

When he was appointed, I didn't think JV fitted Cifuentes style. JV's approach is to hold the ball and draw the attackers in to create space. But doing so slows down play and allows the opposition to get into any position they fancy (defensive or attacking). I felt Cifuentes wanted quicker transitions, which JV cannot offer. 

 

The big change Cifuentes needs is to drop JV and approach transitions in a different way.  Playing JV means we have to play a certain way. Maybe managers become obsessed with how good JV can be with his passing they forget the drawbacks, or in Cifuentes case, are willing to live with them for the time being. But it's got to change. 

Just like with Thomas and the peno.  He had  no pressure in front of him, controlled the ball and had Monga in front a few metres away.  The idiot couldn’t help but stop and stink out the play no matter the cost.

 

It’s frustrating seeing 7 passes to get the ball where one pass was on. 

[SafewayFox]

2 hours ago, markko said:

I saw a little bit of the game yesterday but watched all of the Hull game. In the first half we were dreadful. I have been surprised at how well we have been doing. I expected a bit more of the last two games. We have a lot of players who don't want to be here but that we can't shift. I would consider taking them out of the first team as they are a sticking plaster. Daka has not scored in 34 games now. Just take that in. We have a striker who has not scored for nearly a season. Ayew gets a lot of stick but he does what he is good at reasonably  well. I would give the new lad a bit longer but we have to get a striker in. We need to be able to score goals. Soumare, Faes, Daka, Winks will all he gone in the summer and we will have to rebuild. They were all poor on Tuesday and if that is trying well.....

I hate to break it to you, Faes is likely here for another year of just draining resources and my love for football.

[markko]

2 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

I hate to break it to you, Faes is likely here for another year of just draining resources and my love for football.

I thought he was on his way on the summer. I can't stand him either. I wonder if he was not playing whether he would push for a move and accept a wage cut to go?  Especially World Cup year. I may have him all wrong but he thinks he is much better than he is.

[SafewayFox]

Just now, markko said:

I thought he was on his way on the summer. I can't stand him either. I wonder if he was not playing whether he would push for a move and accept a wage cut to go?  Especially World Cup year. I may have him all wrong but he thinks he is much better than he is.

He’s wanted out every window, if you’re on LinkedIn look for his agents post a while back (bizarrely after a defeat against Everton, if memory serves me correctly).

 

Wout, like 90% of our other dossers aren’t saleable due to their wages vs their ability (lack there of).

 

I keep saying it but Rudkin this summer merely sold players that their agents/other clubs took a punt on, I genuinely despise our club at the moment.

[kingfox]

6 hours ago, LCFCJohn said:

In other words, the possession at all costs philosophy managers and clubs who go down that route.

 

There were plenty of us who didn’t enjoy ‘Enzoball’ as it is dull as hell and so hard to watch. We got piled on and criticised for being behind the times and this way is the only sustainable way. Bollocks is it. Football has moved on again and this method is getting us (and clubs like Southampton and Norwich) nowhere.

Pretty much the perfect observation. 
 

I’ve said numerous times in the past year that being more direct is the way to go. 
 

In terms of possession leaders and various passing statistics, Leicester, Southampton, West Brom, Swansea and Norwich rank highly in pretty much every metric. It’s been a average to shit start for every single one of those teams. 
 

The top six currently consists of…

Coventry - 2nd for direct speed

Middlesbrough - Joint best defence in the league

Millwall - 2nd for forward pass%

Bristol City - 3rd for direct speed

Stoke - Joint best defence in the league

Charlton - 1st for forward pass% 

 

Leicester City don’t come close in any of those metrics. 
 

I’ve watched a few videos from the Norwich fan channels in recent weeks, everything they are saying about their team is pretty much a carbon copy of ourselves. 
 

Boring to watch, soft mentality, all possession but do nothing with it, was some of the comments made on one of the Norwich fan channels yesterday. 
 

Remind you of anyone?  

 

As I said in this thread yesterday, if we’re not careful, we’ll end up like Norwich in a season or two. 

[MPH]

9 hours ago, SafewayFox said:

Aluko hasn’t had a sniff which is criminal.

 

Page was played to make the lad sign and whilst Winks was sulking like a little child.

 

Alves and Nelson who actually have Championship experience, were deemed not needed or “training well” yet not making the squad.

 

Marti’s treatment of the academy here is not a positive.

Didn’t have to play page though did he? Others in his position.. Aluko has played twice hasn’t he?

 

Nelson, I’m sure there’s something else going on that we don’t know about.. Alves didn’t take his chance although it’s fair to say you can’t be judged on a half of football, but the fact he has been loaned to a league 1 club should explain everything

[Leicester_Loyal]

Started out playing a few youngsters, so I think most of us would accept a bottom half finish as we knew long term we're improving the squad, clearing out the deadwood etc. Now he's not playing any youth except Monga, starting all the overpaid dross that doesn't want to be here, and we're still gonna be struggling to stay in this division.

[LCFCJohn]

13 minutes ago, kingfox said:

Pretty much the perfect observation. 
 

I’ve said numerous times in the past year that being more direct is the way to go. 
 

In terms of possession leaders and various passing statistics, Leicester, Southampton, West Brom, Swansea and Norwich rank highly in pretty much every metric. It’s been a average to shit start for every single one of those teams. 
 

The top six currently consists of…

Coventry - 2nd for direct speed

Middlesbrough - Joint best defence in the league

Millwall - 2nd for forward pass%

Bristol City - 3rd for direct speed

Stoke - Joint best defence in the league

Charlton - 1st for forward pass% 

 

Leicester City don’t come close in any of those metrics. 
 

I’ve watched a few videos from the Norwich fan channels in recent weeks, everything they are saying about their team is pretty much a carbon copy of ourselves. 
 

Boring to watch, soft mentality, all possession but do nothing with it, was some of the comments made on one of the Norwich fan channels yesterday. 
 

Remind you of anyone?  

 

As I said in this thread yesterday, if we’re not careful, we’ll end up like Norwich in a season or two. 

And sadly, I didn’t a single stat to tell me that. It is plainly obvious before you even look at that side of things. 

[moore_94]

Other than chopping and changing players the tactics will remain the same

[moore_94]

16 minutes ago, MPH said:

Didn’t have to play page though did he? Others in his position.. Aluko has played twice hasn’t he?

 

Nelson, I’m sure there’s something else going on that we don’t know about.. Alves didn’t take his chance although it’s fair to say you can’t be judged on a half of football, but the fact he has been loaned to a league 1 club should explain everything

Aluko hasn't played a single minute under Martí

[honeybradger]

I know he's injured but I think loaning Will Alves out was a mistake (not taking the foot injury into account).

 

He showed at Cardiff that he's a bit of an impact off the bench specialist and offers something different to our other wingers. I think he would have gained us points where our other subs have failed to so far this season.

 

If Cifuentes genuinely came into the club with the intention of integrating the academy players im sure he would be reaping the rewards in comparison to where we are now.

[Noahfence]

2 minutes ago, honeybradger said:

I know he's injured but I think loaning Will Alves out was a mistake (not taking the foot injury into account).

 

He showed at Cardiff that he's a bit of an impact off the bench specialist and offers something different to our other wingers. I think he would have gained us points where our other subs have failed to so far this season.

 

If Cifuentes genuinely came into the club with the intention of integrating the academy players im sure he would be reaping the rewards in comparison to where we are now.

I watched nearly every minute of his loan at Cardiff (I’d given up on watching us at that point) and he was definitely great as a super sub.
 

Really struggled to get into games when he started. Cardiff being shocking didn’t help but the game would definitely pass him by at times.
 

Probably my bias showing but he’d have been a better option off the bench than Reid IMO. I think he needed a season of playing most weeks which he wouldn’t have got here under Marti 
 

 

[honeybradger]

5 minutes ago, Noahfence said:

I watched nearly every minute of his loan at Cardiff (I’d given up on watching us at that point) and he was definitely great as a super sub.
 

Really struggled to get into games when he started. Cardiff being shocking didn’t help but the game would definitely pass him by at times.
 

Probably my bias showing but he’d have been a better option off the bench than Reid IMO. I think he needed a season of playing most weeks which he wouldn’t have got here under Marti 
 

 

Players dont only have to find their feet through starting. A season of starting for Huddersfield would have been good but being our first or second attacking option off the bench at championship level could have benefitted him similarly.

[Noahfence]

1 minute ago, honeybradger said:

Players dont only have to find their feet through starting. A season of starting for Huddersfield would have been good but being our first or second attacking option off the bench at championship level could have benefitted him similarly.

I do agree. If it was up to me he’d have been on the bench for us. Instead we’re being treated to Reid & Ayew stumbling over themselves. 

[whoareyaaa]

15 hours ago, Dan said:

Should be an instant dismissal if true - not strong enough.

if its from the top then its not going to be a dismissal is it 

[Paninistickers]

3 hours ago, MPH said:

Nelson, I’m sure there’s something else going on that we don’t know about.

Just a hunch, but I think so too. 

 

There's something about the situation that reminds me of the Croatian lad who went to Celtic on loan. 

[Dahnsouff]

1 minute ago, Paninistickers said:

Just a hunch, but I think so too. 

 

There's something about the situation that reminds me of the Croatian lad who went to Celtic on loan. 

Benkovic? Wasn`t he just injured so often he was deemed unreliable?

[Philkeavo]

16 hours ago, Dan said:

The entire debate around Cifuentes just sums up how utterly hopeless the club is nowadays.

 

I'm quite decisive about these managers and getting increasingly impatient. I've been unconvinced pretty much since the opening day when we bundled past a team I'd have expected just about anybody in the EFL to have beaten on the day with the squad they had available and the fact they hadn't even played a single friendly - it felt harder to not win and we scraped it. That entire thing was a red flag.

 

We ended up having an OK August despite the disgrace at Preston with 3 wins out of 4, without playing particularly well. Comparisons to Maresca's start I thought were kind the performances looked well off it to me even despite these results.

 

So for me he started unconvincingly and has pretty rapidly declined to just looking pure NPC, absolutely nothing about the bloke. We have no style of play, no obvious first XI, we have despite our bleak financial situation STILL refused to make any potential short-term pain, long-term gain moves that clubs like Sunderland (poignant example) did a few years ago. I'm not one of those who would just play the U21 side in every game but I think we had a quite unique situation where it was pretty imperative to put some emphasis towards doing this and we still didn't have the balls to actually do it. That falls at his feet. As somebody who doesn't really believe in the 'stability' sort of buzz word, stability for the sake of stability, for me I'm happy to dispense with him already. I'd caveat this by saying if another manager was to come in and repeat this, they'd have probably under 10 games for me as well. There is literally nothing, NOTHING good about what he's done here. He's been Van Nistelrooy bad.

 

But then you remember the reason he is here in the first place. We were the 3rd club in the division to confirm our status as a Championship side for the 2025/26 season behind Birmingham and Southampton. Yet were the 23rd club in the division to have a manager in place, ahead of Sheffield Wednesday who are clearly a joke anyway. They wasted months for absolutely no good reason. We inadvertently had an advantage with knowing where we would be, a chance to get ahead of the pack, yet just dozed off and let far inferior resourced clubs gazump us anyway.

 

This is some of the most inept procedure you will ever see in sport. I think in pure footballing terms Aiyawatt & Rudkin are arguably even worse than Chansiri because as egregious as the latter is, and as disgusting as he is, he didn't have the benefit of inheriting a club that were on the cusp of European football. The sheer level of incompetence needed to even be in this division from that position is staggering.

 

Then you remember that these are the same people who would be selecting the replacement. It's just beyond hopeless. The probability of them landing on the right man is probably about as close to Tottenham winning the Premier League this season. It would take a pure freak, pure luck.

 

Cifuentes should go but the chance we get the right replacement are basically nil as well. Cifuentes, like Van Nistelrooy before him, only regains any credibility for me if he starts publicly making life hard for the board. But I would imagine he was selected precisely because they were confident he wouldn't do that.

 

We're in terminal decline. Make no mistake - unless we by some miracle are sold in the next couple of years, Aiyawatt is taking us to historical lows. He's the most inept owner in the EFL today.

Absolutely brilliant yet depressing summary Dan 👏👏👏

[JimJams]

Don't think loaning Alves was a mistake at all.  Monga wasn't starting games at the beginning of the season and got in due to a combo of Mavs form and injury.  But off the bench he'd have got the nod over Alves.  I doubt Will would have seen much pitch time at all had he stayed and everyone would be bemoaning his lack of minutes saying he should have gone out on loan.

[Paninistickers]

Gonna be interesting what he does next game. He's waved so many red flags so far yet he can still use this appalling period to reset. 

 

He has so many options available, it seems to have led to some kind of indecision paralysis. 

 

We have players at his disposal that could play a variety of styles; low block or high press. Wingers or full backs bombing on. Pack midfield. Three at the back. Instead, he's chose the most basic of set ups. It's vanilla in the extreme. 

whatever the formation, the tactics, none would accommodate BdcR or LT. 

 

 

 

 

[Chelmofox]

15 minutes ago, JimJams said:

Don't think loaning Alves was a mistake at all.  Monga wasn't starting games at the beginning of the season and got in due to a combo of Mavs form and injury.  But off the bench he'd have got the nod over Alves.  I doubt Will would have seen much pitch time at all had he stayed and everyone would be bemoaning his lack of minutes saying he should have gone out on loan.

Loans for Alves and Sammy were the right choice. Sammy has excelled this time, Alves has been injured but from what i saw he was doing ok. Be good for him to be selected straight away after recovery.

[Phil Mitchell]

We aren’t what we used to be and quite a few on here still need that reality check. The bloke paid half a million to be here, give him the time of day to sort this mess out. He’s earnt his chance to have a go. End of chat. Phil

[dillonpanthers87]

24 minutes ago, Phil Mitchell said:

The bloke paid half a million to be here

 

27 minutes ago, Phil Mitchell said:

He’s earnt his chance to have a go

He's having a go right now. The loss of his prev. wages, doesn't come into it for me. 

[Long Eaton Fox]

This is the worst and overrated squad in my memory. A few younger players have a chance of breaking through. The rest are just going through the motions. Marti must be given the chance to see the situation through and it's not going to be quick. Sack him now and and this situation will continue until the league 1 scenario reappears 

[john ridley]

1 hour ago, Long Eaton Fox said:

This is the worst and overrated squad in my memory. A few younger players have a chance of breaking through. The rest are just going through the motions. Marti must be given the chance to see the situation through and it's not going to be quick. Sack him now and and this situation will continue until the league 1 scenario reappears 

Whoever came in would get the same  response I e nothing. Might as well keep him ,nothing will  change till the swamps drained.