6 point deduction - confirmed

[SemperEadem]

1 minute ago, Gamble92 said:

I'm not distracting from the absolute mess that Top has landed us in but -

 

The fact the Premier League know that us going down could cause us to go out of existence and they've pushed for this is wild. 

 

They went for -20. Only ones this really punishes are the fans. Imagine taking 20 points off a team when so many of us have spent so much money following the season to date. You're basically writing a clubs season off in an office room. 

Wasn't that found to be a click bait headline?

[Terraloon]

11 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

1. None of these people have a clue, they're passing themselves off as experts on Twitter for clout.

2. He's implying we're risking a larger points deduction by appealing (which is complete and total nonsense, there's near zero chance it'll actually go up not down) because the potential reward is the points deduction getting wiped out entirely (which is also not happening in a million years and I highly doubt we expect it will.)

 

We're appealing because clubs literally always appeal, that's just how it works. I can't remember a points deduction for a PSR / FFP issue where a club hasn't appealed?

 

The extreme likelihood is our appeal will just be rejected and we'll keep the 6 point deduction but there's an off chance it might be reduced to 3 or 4 points which could make all the difference.

 

 

As I said the PL appeal worries me .

 

The PL won’t necessarily be arguing for the case to be re run but will solely focus on sanctions applied whereas LC will almost certainly be trying to open up again the arguments already ruled on both concerning jurisdiction and authority but if, no ,when they loose yet again those arguments which I suspect even the legal team will be anticipating, then they, LC,  will try and get the 6 points reduced.

 

But that’s where it goes back to the PL appeal because as I keep saying the two minor charges have been proven and whilst they might not in themself lead to additional points deductions they will be arguing as a minimum the 1 point mitigation will be removed but just as likely they will be wanting the way in which the IC calculated the 6 points.

[Ian Nacho]

I think the fact we appealed is right. If the Premier League did then we have no choice to. I doubt we should've if they didn't appeal. 

[Mike Oxlong]

28 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

Holy shit can we ban the next person to claim it's arrogant to appeal a ****ing ruling. 

 

No it isn't, it's just normal, what planet do you live on?

 

It’s not “normal. It should be a decision reached to by weighing the merits of an appeal and the possible benefits and detriments of taking that course of action. You don’t just do it because that’s what happens. I’m just hoping that the decision is based on sound legal advice rather than the apparent feeling of the owner/DoF of being hard done by 

Edited 19 February by Mike Oxlong

[Stopharage]

This club leadership is more in denial than Prince Andrew. 
 

Just take the 6 points, we got off lightly. 

[Spudulike]

2 minutes ago, Ian Nacho said:

I think the fact we appealed is right. If the Premier League did then we have no choice to. I doubt we should've if they didn't appeal. 

Of course we should've. It's how the process works. See @Finnegan posts above.

[Tommy G]

I get people are fed up but the appeal isn't because the club is p*ssed off, there must be something we feel we have some grounds on that could reduce the point s deduction or successfully fight anything coming from the PL. I don't think it's automatic that we will get an increase because of it.

 

One think I am certain about is a Foxestalk doom and gloom reaction to it without letting the dust settle/or get the facts right 

 

EDIT looks like some similar points above. 

Edited 19 February by Tommy G

[OntarioFox]

11 minutes ago, Globalfox said:

No it is not when you read the full commission report there are clear inconsistencies. Any sensible business and good legal advice would say appeal. Are the EPL arrogant in their appeal? The club may get a lot wrong but going after the corrupt EPL and EFL gets my whole support.

I was being silly unless you couldn't tell, but I'll clarify...

It's arrogant of our club to assume that this isn't going to result in heavier sanctions, and potentially put our club's very existence in the EFL at risk if it becomes the deciding factor in which league we find ourselves in next year.

We've already shown there are grey areas around jurisdiction. I wasn't joking when I said that, if the EFL can't confirm which league we're in next year subject to an appeal outcome, we're more likely to be expelled altogether than to have them put everyone else's season on ice to accomodate our heel-dragging.

[The Year Of The Fox]

Wish we showed this much fight on the pitch 

[Spudulike]

2 minutes ago, OntarioFox said:

I was being silly unless you couldn't tell, but I'll clarify...

It's arrogant of our club to assume that this isn't going to result in heavier sanctions, and potentially put our club's very existence in the EFL at risk if it becomes the deciding factor in which league we find ourselves in next year.

We've already shown there are grey areas around jurisdiction. I wasn't joking when I said that, if the EFL can't confirm which league we're in next year subject to an appeal outcome, we're more likely to be expelled altogether than to have them put everyone else's season on ice to accomodate our heel-dragging.

Please make this stop.

[VLC86]

5 minutes ago, Stopharage said:

This club leadership is more in denial than Prince Andrew. 
 

Just take the 6 points, we got off lightly. 

Think you get more than that for noncing nowadays.

 

 

oh, us? My bad.

[Tommy G]

1 hour ago, Jacob7839 said:

Top really has no clue does he

No, which is why he's being advised by someone who does.

[davieG]

[OntarioFox]

5 minutes ago, Spudulike said:

Please make this stop.

Has there ever been a situation where the outcome of an ongoing appeal would determine which league a team plays in though? It's really going to be that tight for us, unless Rowett somehow turns this sinking ship around enough to put us well clear. I'm not even talking about further deductions here - if we go down by one point and we're still fighting for a reduction at the end of the season, what then?

It's already February, there are 14 league games left. It took 31 to get to the outcome of the deduction itself. The likes of Oxford, Blackburn, Portsmouth, Cardiff, Lincoln etc. will rightfully play hell if us dragging our heels puts any of their own confirmed positions into question.

Edited 19 February by OntarioFox

[jv1]

The rules are crap - an utter nonsense and get a grip If you want us in league 1 - it’s a Hail Mary that anyone in their right mind would do - the absolute cretins on here saying we deserve it and close down the club etc etc need to get a grip - deserve it ? Really what for trying to compete - utter garbage and appeal was always going to happen 

Edited 19 February by jv1

[Samilktray]

1 minute ago, jv1 said:

The rules are crap - an utter nonsense and get a grip If you want us in league 1 - it’s a Hail Mary that anyone in their right mind would do - the absolute cretins on here saying we deserve it and close down the club etc etc need to get a grip - deserve it ? Really what forcing to compete - utter garbage and appeal was always going to happen 

Woah chill out man just relax

[Gamble92]

18 minutes ago, SemperEadem said:

Wasn't that found to be a click bait headline?

I'm not sure, we know that they went for much higher for Everton too so I don't see why we'd be any different.

 

Even so, they're pushing for more now. We'd almost certainly go down if we got more points deducted. 

 

Even ignoring our predicament, I despise the way they're using PSR ruling to decide competition in a meeting room. They should be doing everything they can to make sure points deductions are a final resort. Not actively wanting amounts taken off that will allow them to decide promotions and relegations.

[Spudulike]

22 minutes ago, SemperEadem said:

Wasn't that found to be a click bait headline?

 

1 minute ago, Gamble92 said:

I'm not sure, we know that they went for much higher for Everton too so I don't see why we'd be any different.

 

Even so, they're pushing for more now. We'd almost certainly go down if we got more points deducted. 

 

Even ignoring our predicament, I despise the way they're using PSR ruling to decide competition in a meeting room. They should be doing everything they can to make sure points deductions are a final resort. Not actively wanting amounts taken off that will allow them to decide promotions and relegations.

It was a misquote that gathered momentum. Later clarified the PL were actually seeking a 12-point deduction.

[ROB-THE-BLUE]

10 minutes ago, davieG said:

"flawed" is an understatement 

[Swarles Barkley]

[LCFCJohn]

27 minutes ago, Globalfox said:

What are you on about Leicester was never in control of the timeline. Football is being mismanaged by corrupt leaders at the EPL and EFL we beat them before. This time they lost on multiple points which got us down to 6 and there is still room for argument. The EPL and EFL brought football into legal disputes only right we fight them.

It is clear we have no engaged in the process and delayed things. We might not be in control of the timeframe but you are kidding yourself if you think this couldn’t have been dealt with sooner.

 

I accept that your point there might make my argument quite simplistic. In that I think we deserve to be punished for our sheer irresponsibility and negligence of the finances but clearly the PL and EFL rules are fag packet stuff. I guess that yeah, possibly accepting it whilst making them look silly and rewrite their rules is not possible as what would the penalty be. 
 

But the reason the club are getting so much backlash even from our own supporters is because they are ignorantly refusing to accept any responsibility for the financial breaches. And that is why personally, I am just fed up of hearing about it. But it’s far from over anyway as we will no doubt have breached again and be facing further deductions in the coming years so it’s just a massive spiral and a stain on the clubs reputation. 

[LCFCJohn]

34 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

Yeah absolutely, I'm fed up of it too. But I've got absolutely no idea why people thought it was over and done with because we got a points deduction. Clubs always appeal. All clubs always appeal. Nobody ever goes "oh thanks for that points deduction, lovely, now lets move on."

 

The PSR / FFP rules are so stupidly and appalling written it would be daft to just take the ruling and not contest it at all. ESPECIALLY when we're the first club to be done by yet another new and revised bit of legislation that says the league we're not even currently in can impose points deductions and especially when those new rules came in AFTER the financial period in question.

 

There are millions of things to moan about the club for and we've got a thread for every single one of them, people can and should go and absolutely bitch and moan their hearts out. But this is about the one thing the club are currently doing right. I'd be angry if we WEREN'T appealing. NOT appealing would be unbelievably stupid.

 

It’s rock and a hard place. Incompetent wastes of space running the club and corrupt wastes of space running the authorities. 
 

The issue is, the arguments from the clubs side are loop hole thing about jurisdiction which are fair enough and the authorities need to make sure their rules are worth the paper they are written on. 
 

But none of it actually changes the fact we cheated did it? It doesn’t change the fact we ran up a wage bill over 100% of our revenue on mercenaries who we are stuck with. 

[Finnegan]

4 minutes ago, Spudulike said:

 

It was a misquote that gathered momentum. Later clarified the PL were actually seeking a 12-point deduction.

 

Which would have been the biggest Premier League points deduction ever, hence the club calling it "unprecedented" or whatever the term was.

 

Everton's 10 point deduction is, as far as I'm aware, currently the largest ever on behalf of the Premier League and it was reduced to 6 on appeal.

 

Only a handful of clubs have ever gotten more than 10 and I'm pretty sure all of them either went directly into administration or broke rules around going in to administration.

 

[AS78UK]

Think the club have failed to get the fans sentiment again.   We all may feel like the club has been wronged whilst the Man City case goes unresolved, but all we really care about now is to move forward now and start rebuilding the club.   

[Aleksz]

I've thought about it and Finners is spot on. Only natural the club appeals and any increase on the original 6 just because of an appeal is unprecedented. Still think we deserved 6 mind and it's a bit shameless but they gotta do it as it could be the difference between staying in this division or not.