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brucey

Schmeichel vs Zieler

By brucey, in Leicester City Forum

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chris_lcfc_85

chris_lcfc_85

Posted
Posted
17 hours ago, Jimmy said:

Zieler is far from our biggest problem and the defence has been crap all season long, get a functioning defence together so many of Zieler's "faults" wouldn't get a mention so given the defence is the problem maybe its time the changes were made there and everyone gets off Zieler's back.

 

I heard so horrible comments directed towards him yesterday which no player should receive during the game.

 

The fact anyone wants him dropped for Ben Hamer is frankly daft

Totally agree with this.

Some moron behind me on Saturday shouted out for Hamer to come on after 30 mins of the game!!! crazy!

 

There's no doubt he's not as vocal etc as Kasper but not all keepers are. He's back up for a reason but certainly not as bad as some people are saying. Our general defending currently as a team is poor

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MC Prussian

MC Prussian

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Bert said:

It's simply plain to see. It's also not just a handful of fans saying it, look around the forum, social media etc there's a hell of a

lot people saying similar stuff. Doesn't command, organisation and communication isn't near what Kaspers is. Kasper has them on the toes from minute one. Have you seen evidence of Zieler doing this? Can't say so myself. Maybe in time Zieler will be very reliable but at the minute he isn't and the sooner Kasper is back the better. 

I think we've been spoilt with Kasper over the years and of course you'll get a lot of people comparing him and Zieler. The latter isn't the type of world class German goalkeeper, for that he lacks the presence in the box like Neuer or Ter Stegen do.

This has been analyzed to death way before Zieler made his way back to England. But then again, I suppose if he had that presence about him, we wouldn't have been able to sign him in the first place.

 

May I also remind everyone that we were originally interested in signing 1. FC Köln's Timo Horn instead of Zieler.

 

However, like I've said before, the style and verbal/non-verbal communication between keeper and defense isn't the issue here and some may even call it irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. You can think of Zieler what you want, but he isn't the problem and I believe he's more than just decent. At present, he just the scapegoat of the week.

It's our heroes from last season who have difficulty coping with expectations, pressure, whatever you want to call it.

 

At least you seem to give the guy more time - signs of patience which some other fans are definitely lacking.

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funkyrobot

funkyrobot

Posted
Posted
On 28/11/2016 at 14:15, MC Prussian said:

I think we've been spoilt with Kasper over the years and of course you'll get a lot of people comparing him and Zieler. The latter isn't the type of world class German goalkeeper, for that he lacks the presence in the box like Neuer or Ter Stegen do.

This has been analyzed to death way before Zieler made his way back to England. But then again, I suppose if he had that presence about him, we wouldn't have been able to sign him in the first place.

 

May I also remind everyone that we were originally interested in signing 1. FC Köln's Timo Horn instead of Zieler.

 

However, like I've said before, the style and verbal/non-verbal communication between keeper and defense isn't the issue here and some may even call it irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. You can think of Zieler what you want, but he isn't the problem and I believe he's more than just decent. At present, he just the scapegoat of the week.

It's our heroes from last season who have difficulty coping with expectations, pressure, whatever you want to call it.

 

At least you seem to give the guy more time - signs of patience which some other fans are definitely lacking.

To say the Zieler isn't one of the problems is burying your head in the sand. I know he isn't the only one. Add Central defence, centre mid, both wingers and vardy onto this list. However this thread is specifically about Zieler and he's simply not been up to it. Maybe a more realistic thread for someone to set up as a more equal comparison is Zieler Vs Hamer. 

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cc_star

cc_star

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, eblair said:

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/10684357/premier-league-goalkeepers-ranked-by-goals-they-should-have-conceded-according-to-opta

table in there which emphasises how bad schmeichel has been relative to zieler

It's the other around... And it highlights just how bad Zieler is

 

Zieler is the 2nd worst keeper to have played in the Prem this season... and that's without taking inot account Schmeichel's other attributes

 

Goalkeeper                                          Team               Conceded            Expected conceded   Goals prevented

Kasper Schmeichel Leicester 11 12.86 1.86
Ron-Robert Zieler Leicester 13 6.26 -6.74
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eblair

eblair

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, cc_star said:

It's the other around... And it highlights just how bad Zieler is

 

Zieler is the 2nd worst keeper to have played in the Prem this season... and that's without taking inot account Schmeichel's other attributes

 

Goalkeeper                                          Team               Conceded            Expected conceded   Goals prevented

Kasper Schmeichel Leicester 11 12.86 1.86
Ron-Robert Zieler Leicester 13 6.26 -6.74

yeah sorry miswrote, was trynna point out how shite zieler has been... apologies

 

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Babylon

Babylon

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, eblair said:

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/10684357/premier-league-goalkeepers-ranked-by-goals-they-should-have-conceded-according-to-opta

table in there which emphasises how bad zieler has been relative to schmeichel

Those sorts of stats are absolute tosh and are based on nothing more than expected averages. If one keeper has shit loads of shots straight down his throat, then his stats will look great.

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cc_star

cc_star

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Those sorts of stats are absolute tosh and are based on nothing more than expected averages. If one keeper has shit loads of shots straight down his throat, then his stats will look great.

There will be shots straight at him & there will be shots like Schmeichel's injury time stop Vs Copenhagen

 

However, over several games it will even out & provides a good comparison

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TheMightySystem

TheMightySystem

Posted
Posted

I would rather judge a goalkeeper on saves they are expected to make rather then the saves that they are not expected to make.

We know that Kasper is the better keeper but Zieler hasn't made any mistakes in goal and hasn't really had much of a chance with the goals he has conceeded, its primerily down to the defense. Yes Schmeichel may have saved a few of the chances but Schmeichel is world class, Zieler isn't and thats ok as he is backup. If he starts dropping the ball in like Gomes last season when Kante scored then I will be concerned.

As for how vocal he is and his preference to stay on his line. I seem to remember Schmeichel being criticised 2 seasons ago for the exact same thing, how many goals did we conceed in our first season back because Schmeichel wouldn't move off his line? Not critising him but just pointing out that Zieler will get better with time when he learns more about his team mates and what they are and are not capable of.

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norwichfox

norwichfox

Posted
Posted

How does it work to have a negative figure for "goals prevented" in that table? It must mean that Zieler's actually scored 6.74 opponents goals, I can remember Huth's o.g. but not Zieler's. I see that Jack Butland is fit again for Stoke and that's not going to improve our chances of points from that game.

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cc_star

cc_star

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, TheMightySystem said:

I would rather judge a goalkeeper on saves they are expected to make rather then the saves that they are not expected to make.

We know that Kasper is the better keeper but Zieler hasn't made any mistakes in goal and hasn't really had much of a chance with the goals he has conceeded, its primerily down to the defense. Yes Schmeichel may have saved a few of the chances but Schmeichel is world class, Zieler isn't and thats ok as he is backup. If he starts dropping the ball in like Gomes last season when Kante scored then I will be concerned.

As for how vocal he is and his preference to stay on his line. I seem to remember Schmeichel being criticised 2 seasons ago for the exact same thing, how many goals did we conceed in our first season back because Schmeichel wouldn't move off his line? Not critising him but just pointing out that Zieler will get better with time when he learns more about his team mates and what they are and are not capable of.

 

The table grades each shot based on how many times shots like that are scored, keepers can perform better or worse than expected and are ranked as such.

 

Stats don't tell the whole picture but they provide data to back up what we can all see

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TheMightySystem

TheMightySystem

Posted
Posted
Just now, cc_star said:

 

The table grades each shot based on how many times shots like that are scored, keepers can perform better or worse than expected and are ranked as such.

 

Stats don't tell the whole picture but they provide data to back up what we can all see

Fair enough, guess im just an outlier who doesn't think he was at fault, the only one I think he could have done a bit better on was the second Watford goal but even then it was an absolute belter of a strike.

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Babylon

Babylon

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, cc_star said:

There will be shots straight at him & there will be shots like Schmeichel's injury time stop Vs Copenhagen

 

However, over several games it will even out & provides a good comparison

The stats are meaningless, it doesn't take anything into account other than averages. E.g. You face so many shots on average you concede x amount of them.

 

Quality of the chances the striker gets could dictate what sort of shot he faces. We leave ourselves wide open and present good chances to the oppo he stands less chance, compared to him facing shots from long distance. 

 

Whether they are from 5 yards or 35 yards they count towards his stats so it's stupid and nothing much should be taken from it.

 

Kasper is a better keeper for us (despite his shitty kicking), and I'll be glad when he's back but I'm reading nothing in to this.

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