Jamie Vardy

[Kendal Fox]

Think for me the biggest potential travesty with Vardy and the way he is being used (or misused) is that only playing 20 minutes here or 30 minutes there is simply no way of establishing just how good he could be for England.

Guys like Andy Cole, even Heskey at least were given chance after chance, playing the full 90 minutes. But for Vardy, to be given literally minutes, every other game is a big difference. Fine, if he plays 2 or 3 matches for the full duration and fails, criticise him. But not the way he is being used at the moment.

Edited 25 June 2018 by Kendal Fox

[StriderHiryu]

Whilst Vardy could feel hard done by in not getting more time for England, he's behind a striker that has scored 30+ goals for the last two seasons and currently has 5 in 2 at the current World Cup. You can't really knock Kane given his England performances even if we'd love for Vardy to be the main man.

 

We aren't the only squad that has these "issues", Argentina have Messi, Higuain, Aguero and Dybla to choose from and had to leave Icardi at home despite scoring 29 times in Serie A.

 

Most England fans seem to like Vardy as he always puts in a shift and represents the common man with his rise to glory.  In fact most like him and Maguire and it's pretty awesome that we have two players at the World Cup and playing a part with the team. Happy Days indeed and we have a good chance of seeing Chilwell, Gray, Maddison and Hamza possibly join these ranks in the next few years.

 

It beats watching our team play in League One, that's for sure!

[CosbehFox]

23 minutes ago, Kendal Fox said:

Think for me the biggest potential travesty with Vardy and the way he is being used (or misused) is that only playing 20 minutes here or 30 minutes there is simply no way of establishing just how good he could be for England.

Guys like Andy Cole, even Heskey at least were given chance after chance, playing the full 90 minutes. But for Vardy, to be given literally minutes, every other game is a big difference. Fine, if he plays 2 or 3 matches for the full duration and fails, criticise him. But not the way he is being used at the moment.

 

Let's look at it another way. 

 

England play a system which has been developed over about 12 to 18 months. This system currently plays 1 out and out striker. The possession is in front of opposition defences. It brings out the best of the current squad. 

 

Vardy doesn't fit and he has an extremely good striker ahead of him. It doesn't mean Vardy is a bad player. In fact the formation for example suits Maguire because he can take the ball and attempt to play it a bit. 

 

I wouldn't call the omission or lack of minutes for Vardy a traversy or a disgrace. It's just he doesn't fit the system what England work best in. A good comparison would be how Vardy at Leicester prefers to play in a system where he has a support striker/attacking midfielder rather than a out and out striker (Slimani for example). 

[Kendal Fox]

9 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

Let's look at it another way. 

 

England play a system which has been developed over about 12 to 18 months. This system currently plays 1 out and out striker. The possession is in front of opposition defences. It brings out the best of the current squad. 

 

Vardy doesn't fit and he has an extremely good striker ahead of him. It doesn't mean Vardy is a bad player. In fact the formation for example suits Maguire because he can take the ball and attempt to play it a bit. 

 

I wouldn't call the omission or lack of minutes for Vardy a traversy or a disgrace. It's just he doesn't fit the system what England work best in. A good comparison would be how Vardy at Leicester prefers to play in a system where he has a support striker/attacking midfielder rather than a out and out striker (Slimani for example). 

I get what you are saying, though I'd argue that Vardy showed with his record breaking 11 consecutive PL goals and title winning season of 2015/16 that his style would have been worth incorporating into England's set-up as another approach they could use.

Ultimately though, it begs the question, just why is he even in the England squad if he is not going to be used in a meaningful way??

Edited 25 June 2018 by Kendal Fox

[FoxFossil]

On 24/06/2018 at 16:34, RumbleFox said:

Where did this fashion for people thinking it makes them look cool to slag England come from?  Some people are a bit weird.  X

Just experience I suppose. Given Southgate was brought in to bring forward young players, I've always felt this might be the basis for a decent team in 4 years time. Some people are just sick of hearing Media hype about how brilliant England are, when our eyes tell us differently. Improving? Yes. Finished article? No.

But in 2022 the core of the England team will be from the European champions, LCFC ofcourse.

[CosbehFox]

31 minutes ago, Kendal Fox said:

I get what you are saying, though I'd argue that Vardy showed with his record breaking 11 consecutive PL goals and title winning season of 2015/16 that his style would have been worth incorporating into England's set-up as another approach they could use.

Ultimately though, it begs the question, just why is he even in the England squad if he is not going to be used in a meaningful way??

 

Because Plan B when we are facing a team who play a higher line or chase a game needing defenders to be pressed would be perfect for Vardy. 

 

Vardy’s goals for England have mostly come against the top international teams

Edited 25 June 2018 by Cardiff_Fox

[Jacnah]

21 hours ago, mad biker said:

It`s the title winning season for me,  not just Gel boy either, hate Spuds and everyone that plays for em, Dier, Alli and Rose should be nowhere near the national squad they are just shite ! 

 

I think I just heard your mum calling you down for tea.You should get out more and not just stay in your room all the time, perhaps meet people and get a friend.................................................

[mad biker]

1 hour ago, Jacnah said:

I think I just heard your mum calling you down for tea.You should get out more and not just stay in your room all the time, perhaps meet people and get a friend.................................................

Think this forum should show peoples ages  Jacnah  :-)

[Phube]

i think the main problem for Vardy and Sterling as to why two players who scored 38 goals in the league last season look ‘poor’ for England is the lack of a decent player who can play a pass.

 

I took this screen shot from the Panama game (before Kane got the sixth), see how open Sterling is (in the perfect Vardy position) with Stones the “best passing defender since Rio” perfectly teed up to set him free (yellow pass). So where does the ball end up? Sideways to Loftus-Cheek (blue arrow) who passes it back to Stones and the moment has gone like that!

 

England play summed up in one passage of play.

 

 

[Lesterlad]

He does get service

[lcfc sheff]

10 hours ago, Phube said:

i think the main problem for Vardy and Sterling as to why two players who scored 38 goals in the league last season look ‘poor’ for England is the lack of a decent player who can play a pass.

 

I took this screen shot from the Panama game (before Kane got the sixth), see how open Sterling is (in the perfect Vardy position) with Stones the “best passing defender since Rio” perfectly teed up to set him free (yellow pass). So where does the ball end up? Sideways to Loftus-Cheek (blue arrow) who passes it back to Stones and the moment has gone like that!

 

England play summed up in one passage of play.

 

 

Brilliant Analysis, the likes of Sterling and Vardy don't just become useless overnight it either has to be the system they play in or the players surrounding them.

As we know, Our midfield isn't exactly great which suggests the latter is true. 

[Finnegan]

41 minutes ago, lcfc sheff said:

Brilliant Analysis, the likes of Sterling and Vardy don't just become useless overnight it either has to be the system they play in or the players surrounding them.

As we know, Our midfield isn't exactly great which suggests the latter is true. 

 

If only England had a midfielder experienced in slotting through balls forward to this sort of striker. 

 

[notnow john]

11 hours ago, Phube said:

i think the main problem for Vardy and Sterling as to why two players who scored 38 goals in the league last season look ‘poor’ for England is the lack of a decent player who can play a pass.

 

I took this screen shot from the Panama game (before Kane got the sixth), see how open Sterling is (in the perfect Vardy position) with Stones the “best passing defender since Rio” perfectly teed up to set him free (yellow pass). So where does the ball end up? Sideways to Loftus-Cheek (blue arrow) who passes it back to Stones and the moment has gone like that!

 

England play summed up in one passage of play.

 

 

Great point but your arrows need work??

[STUHILL]

17 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

If only England had a midfielder experienced in slotting through balls forward to this sort of striker. 

 

Last time they asked him to play, he said he was too tired... 

[Dan LCFC]

17 hours ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

Let's look at it another way. 

 

England play a system which has been developed over about 12 to 18 months. This system currently plays 1 out and out striker. The possession is in front of opposition defences. It brings out the best of the current squad. 

 

Vardy doesn't fit and he has an extremely good striker ahead of him. It doesn't mean Vardy is a bad player. In fact the formation for example suits Maguire because he can take the ball and attempt to play it a bit. 

 

I wouldn't call the omission or lack of minutes for Vardy a traversy or a disgrace. It's just he doesn't fit the system what England work best in. A good comparison would be how Vardy at Leicester prefers to play in a system where he has a support striker/attacking midfielder rather than a out and out striker (Slimani for example). 

Same as how I feel. It used to properly annoy me under Hodgson as no-one could really cite any kind of system (Hodgson himself said "systems win you nothing") and it felt to me like he was just automatically shoehorning in the big names (and no doubt about it, he was).

 

At least with Southgate you can see a plan, a style of play, and unfortunately Vardy just doesn't really fit. It plays with one striker and as good as Vardy can be, you cannot knock Kane's goalscoring record - granted that hat-trick v Panama was possibly the spawniest hat-trick I've seen  even more than his against us a few years ago.

 

Did feel for Vardy against Panama though, basically the fall guy while we try and get Sterling a goal / some confidence.

[Dan LCFC]

17 hours ago, FoxFossil said:

Just experience I suppose. Given Southgate was brought in to bring forward young players, I've always felt this might be the basis for a decent team in 4 years time. Some people are just sick of hearing Media hype about how brilliant England are, when our eyes tell us differently. Improving? Yes. Finished article? No.

But in 2022 the core of the England team will be from the European champions, LCFC ofcourse.

Agree that people have got carried away, and the important thing about it is that I don't want people to come down on the players too hard when they don't meet their inflated expectations. I think it's good that there's genuine camaraderie with England and the fans now after the last few years of dross but I can't help but feel the Belgium game may be what the Uruguay game was to Russia - a bit of a reality check. We're good, quarter finalists maybe even semis but I will be gobsmacked if we win it.

[FLAN]

12 hours ago, Phube said:

i think the main problem for Vardy and Sterling as to why two players who scored 38 goals in the league last season look ‘poor’ for England is the lack of a decent player who can play a pass.

 

I took this screen shot from the Panama game (before Kane got the sixth), see how open Sterling is (in the perfect Vardy position) with Stones the “best passing defender since Rio” perfectly teed up to set him free (yellow pass). So where does the ball end up? Sideways to Loftus-Cheek (blue arrow) who passes it back to Stones and the moment has gone like that!

 

England play summed up in one passage of play.

 

 

The end result was likely to be the same given how useless sterling is in front of goal 

[CosbehFox]

12 hours ago, Phube said:

i think the main problem for Vardy and Sterling as to why two players who scored 38 goals in the league last season look ‘poor’ for England is the lack of a decent player who can play a pass.

 

I took this screen shot from the Panama game (before Kane got the sixth), see how open Sterling is (in the perfect Vardy position) with Stones the “best passing defender since Rio” perfectly teed up to set him free (yellow pass). So where does the ball end up? Sideways to Loftus-Cheek (blue arrow) who passes it back to Stones and the moment has gone like that!

 

England play summed up in one passage of play.

 

 

5-0 up in 30 odd degrees, you aren't playing risky balls like you're arrows are showing. 

 

England's 3rd goal on Sunday showed that when required there are players what can do what you are getting at. 

[Phube]

18 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

5-0 up in 30 odd degrees, you aren't playing risky balls like you're arrows are showing. 

 

England's 3rd goal on Sunday showed that when required there are players what can do what you are getting at. 

 

You tell that to Sterling, he had a great annoyed jumpy stamp!

[Sol thewall Bamba]

19 hours ago, Kendal Fox said:

Think for me the biggest potential travesty with Vardy and the way he is being used (or misused) is that only playing 20 minutes here or 30 minutes there is simply no way of establishing just how good he could be for England.

Guys like Andy Cole, even Heskey at least were given chance after chance, playing the full 90 minutes. But for Vardy, to be given literally minutes, every other game is a big difference. Fine, if he plays 2 or 3 matches for the full duration and fails, criticise him. But not the way he is being used at the moment.

 

Are we going to drop Kane to do it though? No. He's just been unlucky that our best striker in 20 years has come along at the same time as him. 

[Jacnah]

15 hours ago, mad biker said:

Think this forum should show peoples ages  Jacnah  :-)

hahah...great idea...that would be an interesting in so many ways

[Sol thewall Bamba]

1 hour ago, Finnegan said:

 

If only England had a midfielder experienced in slotting through balls forward to this sort of striker. 

 

Shame he ended his own career. 

[Guest MattP]

13 hours ago, Phube said:

i think the main problem for Vardy and Sterling as to why two players who scored 38 goals in the league last season look ‘poor’ for England is the lack of a decent player who can play a pass.

 

I took this screen shot from the Panama game (before Kane got the sixth), see how open Sterling is (in the perfect Vardy position) with Stones the “best passing defender since Rio” perfectly teed up to set him free (yellow pass). So where does the ball end up? Sideways to Loftus-Cheek (blue arrow) who passes it back to Stones and the moment has gone like that!

 

England play summed up in one passage of play.

 

 

Where on earth is the Panama midfield?

[lcfc sheff]

2 hours ago, Finnegan said:

 

If only England had a midfielder experienced in slotting through balls forward to this sort of striker. 

 

Give Ruben enough time and he’ll help in that department, mason mount will be starting for England next year as well I reckon.

[foxfanazer]

2 hours ago, Finnegan said:

 

If only England had a midfielder experienced in slotting through balls forward to this sort of striker. 

 

Shelvey looks different in this pic