Tunisia vs England - Monday 18th June 19:00

[Dr Marco]

Same old boring England....but fook me we still believe! it's coming home...etc

[Ric Flair]

Just watched One Night In Turin again, I don't think I can express just how good Italia 90 was. Come on boys, give us something to believe again!!

[Col city fan]

8 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Just watched One Night In Turin again, I don't think I can express just how good Italia 90 was. Come on boys, give us something to believe again!!

Spot on. And genuinely made even better by ‘Nessun Dorma’

Brilliant tournament.

[Dr Marco]

IT'S FACKING COMIN' HOME !

 

GET IN !

[Max Wall]

13 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Just watched One Night In Turin again, I don't think I can express just how good Italia 90 was. Come on boys, give us something to believe again!!

I've watched every World Cup from 1978 onwards. Italia 90 was our one missed opportunity. We were as good as any team in that tournament. we were never going to win in '86 even if Diego's handball had been spotted.

Personally, I think we've been pretty poor in every other one.

Let's hope this squad can over achieve. A semi final appearance would be verging on miraculous in my book.

Edited 10 June 2018 by Max Wall

[Ric Flair]

10 hours ago, Max Wall said:

I've watched every World Cup from 1978 onwards. Italia 90 was our one missed opportunity. We were as good as any team in that tournament. we were never going to win in '86 even if Diego's handball had been spotted.

Personally, I think we've been pretty poor in every other one.

Let's hope this squad can over achieve. A semi final appearance would be verging on miraculous in my book.

 

I think we missed big opportunities in 98, 02 and 06 as well!!! We always had a squad capable of going the distance where as now it's a pipe dream. We've never had that effectiveness and refusal to be beaten attitude, we've also never dealt well with pressure. 

 

Anything around QFs or more will be immense though this year.

[Max Wall]

Just now, Ric Flair said:

I think we missed big opportunities in 98, 02 and 06 as well!!! We always had a squad capable of going the distance where as now it's a pipe dream. We've never had that effectiveness and refusal to be beaten attitude, we've also never dealt well with pressure. 

 

Anything around QFs or more will be immense though this year.

I agree we had much better squads in 98, 02 and 06. Never believed at any point we would win it though.

When Lineker equalised against the Germans in 90, I really believed we would, at least until the end of extra time. Also agree that we've never dealt with pressure well, hence so many penalty exits. Whilst many think that's just a lottery, it really isn't, it's about staying cool and executing.

[ScouseFox]

32 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I think we missed big opportunities in 98, 02 and 06 as well!!! We always had a squad capable of going the distance where as now it's a pipe dream. We've never had that effectiveness and refusal to be beaten attitude, we've also never dealt well with pressure. 

 

Anything around QFs or more will be immense though this year.

it’s an absolute disgrace we didn’t win anything under sven. the squads for 02, 04 & 06 were remarkable. 

 

we were pretty unlucky but even so, we had pretty much world class players in every position (bar left mid) in every tournament. 

[ozleicester]

All of you writing England off.... have you heard of a team called Leicester City?

 

 

Its coming home

[Ric Flair]

11 hours ago, ScouseFox said:

it’s an absolute disgrace we didn’t win anything under sven. the squads for 02, 04 & 06 were remarkable. 

 

we were pretty unlucky but even so, we had pretty much world class players in every position (bar left mid) in every tournament. 

Yeah it really was, especially the first two tournaments where we actually played well. 2006 was a bit more of a battle against some fairly ordinary opposition but we then saved our best performance vs Portugal and even with 10 men had chances to win it, it was simply poor mentality and pressure being too huge for a lot of them. Now we don't have the players and although the pressure and expectation is much lower, I just don't see how we are solid enough to cope with 4 weeks of tournament football. Southgate is doing a lot of good work at the finer details which I think England have badly missed in the last 2 decades and he is trying gallantly to build a proper team spirit that you need to get through the horrible tension and often turgid games in knockout football. We need heroes this summer, ones who can shake the shackles off and even just for a few weeks of their career not look down, it does happen but never to us. I am however absolutely buzzing now for this to start, I'm regaining a smidgen of pride for them again much to my worry for falling for it once again.

[CosbehFox]

www.eurosport.co.uk/football/world-cup/2018/the-hod-complex-england-and-the-1998-world-cup_sto6795833/story.shtml

 

That is a superb read, albeit very long. It focuses on Hoddle's 1998 World Cup. You can see some crossover in what Southgate is doing. 

 

It also showcases how Hoddle lacks person skills, can be a real oddball personality but at the same time, there is some genius in him somewhere. Notable how he appeared intent on building a team like Southgate now. 

Edited 11 June 2018 by Cardiff_Fox

[Footballwipe]

Think 2002 was our best chance, personally. 2004 and 2006 were great, too but 2002 is the only tournament of those I truly believe we'd have gone on to win if we'd not lost when we did.

 

1998 we'd have faced Holland in the Quarters and Brazil in the Semis... not sure we'd have gone over against those. 2002 was the one. Beat Brazil and it's Turkey and an understrength Germany in the final. One of the best routes we could have asked for, 2002 was on a plate for us. Feel like 2004, as much as a great opportunity as it was, was a pie in the face waiting to happen with Greece.

 

I've said it before though in this section of the forum. For all the talk about opportunities in every tournament mentioned there we had such a zip of optimism, the belief from the nation, the backing with car flags and bunting seemingly everywhere. We were fizzing with confidence and that's exactly what I have such fond memories of. That's what I want back, just that optimism once again.

[SouthStandUpperTier]

14 minutes ago, Footballwipe said:

Think 2002 was our best chance, personally. 2004 and 2006 were great, too but 2002 is the only tournament of those I truly believe we'd have gone on to win if we'd not lost when we did.

 

1998 we'd have faced Holland in the Quarters and Brazil in the Semis... not sure we'd have gone over against those. 2002 was the one. Beat Brazil and it's Turkey and an understrength Germany in the final. One of the best routes we could have asked for, 2002 was on a plate for us. Feel like 2004, as much as a great opportunity as it was, was a pie in the face waiting to happen with Greece.

 

I've said it before though in this section of the forum. For all the talk about opportunities in every tournament mentioned there we had such a zip of optimism, the belief from the nation, the backing with car flags and bunting seemingly everywhere. We were fizzing with confidence and that's exactly what I have such fond memories of. That's what I want back, just that optimism once again.

No team with Danny Mills in it was ever going to win anything.

[ClaphamFox]

2 hours ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

www.eurosport.co.uk/football/world-cup/2018/the-hod-complex-england-and-the-1998-world-cup_sto6795833/story.shtml

 

That is a superb read, albeit very long. It focuses on Hoddle's 1998 World Cup. You can see some crossover in what Southgate is doing. 

 

It also showcases how Hoddle lacks person skills, can be a real oddball personality but at the same time, there is some genius in him somewhere. Notable how he appeared intent on building a team like Southgate now. 

 

Fascinating. I've always thought that France '98 was a massive missed opportunity - we had such a good combination of steel and flair in that team. Really interesting to read about Hoddle's managerial idiosyncracies.

[Ted Maul]

On 09/06/2018 at 23:17, Ric Flair said:

Just watched One Night In Turin again, I don't think I can express just how good Italia 90 was. Come on boys, give us something to believe again!!

Might have to give it a watch. 

 

Italia 90 was before my living memory, but my dad had the video and I watched it loads as a kid.

[AKCJ]

On ‎09‎/‎06‎/‎2018 at 11:23, Bert said:

Reports coming out this morning claim 

 

Pickford

 

Walker Stones Maguire

Trippier Henderson Alli Rose

Lingard Kane Sterling. 

 

 

Would prefer Rashford to start against a side we should dominate.

 

Lingard should play against Belgium.

[stripeyfox]

3 hours ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

www.eurosport.co.uk/football/world-cup/2018/the-hod-complex-england-and-the-1998-world-cup_sto6795833/story.shtml

 

That is a superb read, albeit very long. It focuses on Hoddle's 1998 World Cup. You can see some crossover in what Southgate is doing. 

 

It also showcases how Hoddle lacks person skills, can be a real oddball personality but at the same time, there is some genius in him somewhere. Notable how he appeared intent on building a team like Southgate now. 

 

That match v Argentina was a classic. I remember when Campbell "scored" what probably would have been the winner but unfortunately it was (rightly) disallowed for Shearer's unnecessary elbow to the 'keepers throat.

 

I was still rolling around on the floor of the pub before we realised it hadn't been given.

 

 

[davieG]

15 hours ago, Max Wall said:

I agree we had much better squads in 98, 02 and 06. Never believed at any point we would win it though.

When Lineker equalised against the Germans in 90, I really believed we would, at least until the end of extra time. Also agree that we've never dealt with pressure well, hence so many penalty exits. Whilst many think that's just a lottery, it really isn't, it's about staying cool and executing.

Shocking record

 

[SouthStandUpperTier]

21 minutes ago, stripeyfox said:

That match v Argentina was a classic. I remember when Campbell "scored" what probably would have been the winner but unfortunately it was (rightly) disallowed for Shearer's unnecessary elbow to the 'keepers throat.

 

I was still rolling around on the floor of the pub before we realised it hadn't been given.

 

 

Me too, then I shat my pants when I realised Argentina were on the break having taken the free kick quickly with half our team celebrating in the corner.

[Izzy]

On 10/06/2018 at 12:18, Max Wall said:

I've watched every World Cup from 1978 onwards. Italia 90 was our one missed opportunity. We were as good as any team in that tournament. we were never going to win in '86 even if Diego's handball had been spotted.

Personally, I think we've been pretty poor in every other one.

Let's hope this squad can over achieve. A semi final appearance would be verging on miraculous in my book.

 

"I'm not saying we'd definitely have beaten Argentina if we'd have got to the final.....but my house would have been on it"

Bobby Robson

[SouthStandUpperTier]

On 10/06/2018 at 12:18, Max Wall said:

I've watched every World Cup from 1978 onwards. Italia 90 was our one missed opportunity. We were as good as any team in that tournament. we were never going to win in '86 even if Diego's handball had been spotted.

Personally, I think we've been pretty poor in every other one.

Let's hope this squad can over achieve. A semi final appearance would be verging on miraculous in my book.

 

I respectfully disagree. I think England were very ordinary in Italia '90 except for the semifinal against West Germany, where they played their best game and should have won. In the group stage they struggled to draws against RoI and Holland, then just sneaked past Egypt 1-0 thanks to a set piece goal. Second round they beat Belgium in an even game only thanks to an individual piece of brilliance from Platt in the last minute of ET. Then they were completely played off the park by Cameroon in the QF, only winning due to Cameroon's lack of discipline in conceding 2 late penalties. I've been watching the World Cups since Mexico '86, and in that time you can count England's good performances on one hand (vs Poland and Paraguay in 86, West Germany in 90, Argentina in 98 and Denmark in 02).

Edited 11 June 2018 by SouthStandUpperTier

[Izzy]

29 minutes ago, SouthStandUpperTier said:

I respectfully disagree. I think England were very ordinary in Italia '90 except for the semifinal against West Germany, where they played their best game and should have won. In the group stage they struggled to draws against RoI and Holland, then just sneaked past Egypt 1-0 thanks to a set piece goal. Second round they beat Belgium in an even game only thanks to an individual piece of brilliance from Platt in the last minute of ET. Then they were completely played off the park by Cameroon in the QF, only winning due to Cameroon's lack of discipline in conceding 2 late penalties. I've been watching the World Cups since Mexico '86, and in that time you can count England's good performances on one hand (vs Poland and Paraguay in 86, West Germany in 90, Argentina in 98 and Denmark in 02).

 

Interesting perspective there mate.

 

My view is that the RoI and Holland teams were no mugs so a draw against both wasn't a disaster. From memory Bobby Robson went to 3 at the back I think for the Egypt game (bought in Mark Wright?) but yeah, that was a scrappy win.

 

That Belgium team were pretty handy too and Scifo was a quality player. It was pretty even but I think we deserved it and Platt's goal deserved to win any match.

 

Cameroon were a bit of an unknown quantity and put up a good fight. I remember Lineker saying he lost 10lbs during that game as it was hot as fvck. We should have beaten Germany and as Bobby Robson said, we'd have given Argentina a good game in the final.

 

I just thought we had all the momentum in 1990 and our name was on the cup. I've never been so upset as an England fan losing that semi - it was heartbreaking.

 

 

[SouthStandUpperTier]

1 minute ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

Interesting perspective there mate.

 

My view is that the RoI and Holland teams were no mugs so a draw against both wasn't a disaster. From memory Bobby Robson went to 3 at the back I think for the Egypt game (bought in Mark Wright?) but yeah, that was a scrappy win.

 

That Belgium team were pretty handy too and Scifo was a quality player. It was pretty even but I think we deserved it and Platt's goal deserved to win any match.

 

Cameroon were a bit of an unknown quantity and put up a good fight. I remember Lineker saying he lost 10lbs during that game as it was hot as fvck. We should have beaten Germany and as Bobby Robson said, we'd have given Argentina a good game in the final.

 

I just thought we had all the momentum in 1990 and our name was on the cup. I've never been so upset as an England fan losing that semi - it was heartbreaking.

 

 

It was heartbreaking. I just felt they rode their luck a bit en route to the semifinal. Then they produced a really good performance against a West Germany who had smashed Yugoslavia and Holland. If England had got through somehow, and reproduced that standard in the final, they'd have beaten Argentina (even without Gazza I think).

[Stadt]

In lieu of playing our best 11, the best Southgate 11 I'd go for would be,

 

Pickford

 

Walker

Maguire

Stones

 

Alexander-Arnold

Henderson

Loftus-Cheek 

Rose

 

Lingard

Sterling

 

Kane

 

Got the feeling Alli will play despite being mediocre for England in essentially every game he's played. I'll be disappointed if Cahill is in over Maguire, Rashford or Welbeck over Vardy too.

[Max Wall]

Just now, SouthStandUpperTier said:

I respectfully disagree. I think England were very ordinary in Italia '90 except for the semifinal against West Germany, where they played their best game and should have won. In the group stage they struggled to draws against RoI and Holland, then just sneaked past Egypt 1-0 thanks to a set piece goal. Second round they beat Belgium in an even game only thanks to an individual piece of brilliance from Platt in the last minute of ET. Then they were completely played off the park by Cameroon in the QF, only winning due to Cameroon's lack of discipline in conceding 2 late penalties. I've been watching the World Cups since Mexico '86, and in that time you can count England's good performances on one hand (vs Poland and Paraguay in 86, West Germany in 90, Argentina in 98 and Denmark in 02).

 

Precisely. That's why it was such a huge opportunity in 1990. If you go back to my original post, I didn't say we were an amazing team, I said we were as good as any team in it. Argentina shithoused their way to the final and Germany made a meal of beating them. There really was no stand out team that year. That, I believe, was our best opportunity. That's the only point I was making. Not sure what point of mine you are disagreeing with.

Edited 11 June 2018 by Max Wall