The Politics Thread 2019

[Heathrow fox]

12 hours ago, Buce said:

Yet another bizarre claim from a Leaver - they really do live in a different reality:

EU to blame for football's new handball rule, claims Ian Holloway:

The European Union has been blamed for many of the serious problems in British society, including the power of vacuum cleaners and the shape of bananas, and a new charge must now be added: football’s handball rule.

The former Queens Park Rangers manager Ian Holloway has bizarrely claimed that the EU is responsible for Gabriel Jesus’s late goal for Manchester City against Tottenham being disallowed.

 

The strike was dramatically chalked off after a VAR check established that City’s Aymeric Laporte had handled the ball. Holloway, seemingly unaware of the law changes instituted by Ifab, the International Football Association Board, has no doubt where responsibility lies.

“I don’t think that’s our boys making up that new change of law,” he told The Debate on Sky Sports. “I think that’s people telling us what we should do with our game. Now, they should stop doing that. I hope we get out of Brexit, because that’s what we all voted for, and sort that out, because you cannot have someone telling us how to do our own game.”

Ifab’s five members comprise the English, Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish FAs and Fifa, which represents its other football associations. The Premier League’s VAR hub in Stockley Park is not – or at least not yet – being controlled from Brussels.

I don’t know if this has anything to do with what he said on TalkSport on Monday morning,where he made exactly the same point.It was clear as day to me what he meant.Even in my knackered state.Maybe try listening before you start insulting the bloke.

[Carl the Llama]

40 minutes ago, BlueSi13 said:

Jesus Christ we're the 5th largest economy in the world, we're not San Marino FFS.  Honestly the drama...

 

Meanwhile in other news,

 

Stuart Rose, the former Chairman of the remain campaign says we need to get on with Brexit:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/08/20/stuart-rose-former-chairman-remain-campaign-dismisses-calls/

 

As for the latest polling:

CON: 42% (+17)

LAB: 28% (-6)

LDEM: 15% (-)

BREX: 5% (-5)

GRN: 3% (-)

TIG/CHUK: 1% (-)

UKIP: 0% (-4)

via @KantarTNS, 15 - 19 Aug Chgs. w/ 13 May

 

If this was accurate the Conservatives would have a majority of 192.  Aware that other polls aren't as dramatic as this one but they are all showing a comfortable lead for the Conservatives. The Boris bounce continues so don't expect a change of course anytime soon.  

 

 

How on Earth is the Boris bounce a thing?  Who's looked at him taking over and thought "hmmm yes, that man makes the party look more dependable"?

[DJ Barry Hammond]

1 minute ago, Carl the Llama said:

How on Earth is the Boris bounce a thing?  Who's looked at him taking over and thought "hmmm yes, that man makes the party look more dependable"?

 

Plenty of people.

 

With the absence of any form of opposition, high level of name recognition  and his ‘common-sense’ politic style - Out, no ifs or buts, 20,000 more police, more funds for NHS etc - he’s going to see a swing in the polls.

[z-layrex]

5 hours ago, DJ Barry Hammond said:

 

Plenty of people.

 

With the absence of any form of opposition, high level of name recognition  and his ‘common-sense’ politic style - Out, no ifs or buts, 20,000 more police, more funds for NHS etc - he’s going to see a swing in the polls.

I'll quite happily vote for him in a general election.

[st albans fox]

9 hours ago, Spudulike said:

This 30 days to come up with an alternative to the Back-Stop is a farce. The EU will already know the solution, it's the exact same one they will put in place in the event of a no-deal Brexit. It's just stupid face saving politics.

Merkel/macron playing euro political good cop/bad cop ........and still Rome burns ..... Stuart rose is right ....... the damage that this naval gazing is doing to our economy shouldn’t be under estimated .... the worst possible outcome to the past three years would be all the uncertainty and delay we have been through followed by an acrimonious no deal - had you penned the future after the June 2016 vote like this, it would have represented the worst case scenario (forget the project fear stuff we saw pre vote - economy’s turn around much more slowly than those predictions unless catastrophic events occur). 

 

tick tock ..............

[Buce]

9 hours ago, Heathrow fox said:

I don’t know if this has anything to do with what he said on TalkSport on Monday morning,where he made exactly the same point.It was clear as day to me what he meant.Even in my knackered state.Maybe try listening before you start insulting the bloke.

 

It was on Sky Sports and it is a direct quote. Even in my decaffeinated state it's clear to me what he said.

 

Maybe trying reading before you start talking bollox.

[ozleicester]

Does anyone still think that Brexit will benefit England?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, ozleicester said:

Does anyone still think that Brexit will benefit England?

You don't understand. Out means OUT!

 

 

13 hours ago, BlueSi13 said:

Jesus Christ we're the 5th largest economy in the world, we're not San Marino FFS.  Honestly the drama...

 

 

 

I'm not the son of God but I guess this was aimed at me.

 

We used to be the largest economy in the world. Now we're the fifth and this time next year we'll be, at best, the 7th. 

 

Look at you history, check out all the empires - even you will probably know about the Romans and Greeks, look up the African empires and the south American Empires. We're on the down slope and Brexit is a great way to speed that up. Forget Great Britain, it soon won't even be Britain - just England and Wales and a few islands.

[Buce]

8 minutes ago, FIF said:

You don't understand. Out means OUT!

 

 

 

I'm not the son of God but I guess this was aimed at me.

 

We used to be the largest economy in the world. Now we're the fifth and this time next year we'll be, at best, the 7th. 

 

Look at you history, check out all the empires - even you will probably know about the Romans and Greeks, look up the African empires and the south American Empires. We're on the down slope and Brexit is a great way to speed that up. Forget Great Britain, it soon won't even be Britain - just England and Wales and a few islands.

 

[ozleicester]

9 minutes ago, FIF said:

You don't understand. Out means OUT!

silly me, sorry i didnt realise. 

[Guest]

We're more likely to become the 51st state of America! Mayhap that Trump can get re-elected then offer Bozo the possibility of becoming lifetime leader of the 51st state.

 

I reckon that the Brits might vote for that in a referendum - especially if it means cheaper KFC.

[Spudulike]

4 hours ago, st albans fox said:

Merkel/macron playing euro political good cop/bad cop ........and still Rome burns ..... Stuart rose is right ....... the damage that this naval gazing is doing to our economy shouldn’t be under estimated .... the worst possible outcome to the past three years would be all the uncertainty and delay we have been through followed by an acrimonious no deal - had you penned the future after the June 2016 vote like this, it would have represented the worst case scenario (forget the project fear stuff we saw pre vote - economy’s turn around much more slowly than those predictions unless catastrophic events occur). 

 

tick tock ..............

So if the EU have done their Brexit no-deal preparation like we've been told, they will have a cunning plan for what they will do with the Irish border. Will this plan be any different to what the UK will propose in the next 30 days (or whatever) ?? I suspect not. 

 

Seems to me that it's just more and more deliberate can kicking by the EU to allow enough time for the pro-remain lobby to block no-deal and ultimately Brexit. 

[Kopfkino]

29 minutes ago, FIF said:

You don't understand. Out means OUT!

 

 

 

I'm not the son of God but I guess this was aimed at me.

 

We used to be the largest economy in the world. Now we're the fifth and this time next year we'll be, at best, the 7th. 

 

Look at you history, check out all the empires - even you will probably know about the Romans and Greeks, look up the African empires and the south American Empires. We're on the down slope and Brexit is a great way to speed that up. Forget Great Britain, it soon won't even be Britain - just England and Wales and a few islands.

 

So we'll still be in the top 10 of roughly 200 economies in the world (forecast to be that way until 2050), still part of the G7 and G20, still with one of the pre-eminent diplomatic services in the world, still a top 10 military power, still 2nd in soft power, still the 2nd biggest exporter of education with at least 5 genuinely top of the world institutions, still host to the world's financial capital. If that's insignificant then fair enough. If I could remember the Orwell quote I'd use it. 

[Paninistickers]

9 minutes ago, Kopfkino said:

 

So we'll still be in the top 10 of roughly 200 economies in the world (forecast to be that way until 2050), still part of the G7 and G20, still with one of the pre-eminent diplomatic services in the world, still a top 10 military power, still 2nd in soft power, still the 2nd biggest exporter of education with at least 5 genuinely top of the world institutions, still host to the world's financial capital. If that's insignificant then fair enough. If I could remember the Orwell quote I'd use it. 

All that clout....yet we are giving up membership of a club where this clout and diplomatic skill is at its most potent.

 

Part of the problem has always been the British perception of the EU that France and Germany run it. Not so for other smaller EU countries -  who saw us as one of the big three being pandered to

 

 

 

[Guest]

49 minutes ago, Kopfkino said:

 

So we'll still be in the top 10 of roughly 200 economies in the world (forecast to be that way until 2050), still part of the G7 and G20, still with one of the pre-eminent diplomatic services in the world, still a top 10 military power, still 2nd in soft power, still the 2nd biggest exporter of education with at least 5 genuinely top of the world institutions, still host to the world's financial capital. If that's insignificant then fair enough. If I could remember the Orwell quote I'd use it. 

Didn't you hear that Brexit means making Britain great again. Regaining our world status?

 

Anyway I think I'm pretty safe in regards my statement that the British empire has followed other lesser empires on it's path to oblivion.

 

The British empire at one time contained very nearly a quarter of the world's population and a quarter of the earth's total land area. We ruled :

 

 

Afghanistan -1919

Antigua and Barbuda

Australia-1901 -1986

The Bahamas-1973

Bahrain-1971

Barbados-1966

Belize-1981

Botswana-1966

Brunei-1984

Canada-1867–1982- in 1949 Newfoundland and Labrador voted to join Canada too.

Cyprus-1960

Dominica-1978

Egypt-1922

Fiji-1970

The Gambia-1965

Ghana-1957

Grenada-1974

Guyana pre 1970

Suriname pre 1667, various territorial disputes

India-1974

Iraq-1932-more of a mandate I believe but nonetheless

Jamaica-1962

Jordan-1946

Kenya-1963

Kiribati-1979

Kuwait-1961

Lesotho-1964

Malawi-1964

Malaysia-1957

Maldives-1965

Malta-1964

Mauritius-1968

Myanmar-still seen by the government as Burma though

Nauru-1968

New Zealand-1907–1986

Nigeria-1960

Pakistan-1947

Qatar-1971

St lucia-1971

Saint Kitts and nevis-1983

St Vincent and the Grenadina lines-1979

Seychelles-1976

Sierra lione-1961

Soliman islands-1978

South Africa-1910–1961

Sri Lanka-1948

Sudan -1956

Swaziland-1968

Tanzania-1961

Tonga-1970

Trinidad and Tobago-1962

Tuvalu-1978

Uganda-1962

United Arab Emirates-1971

United States,or as it was then the thirteen colonies which were New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia. -gained independence in 1783 but declared it in 1776

Vanuatu-1980

Yemen-1967

Zambia-1964

Zimbabwe-1980

 

And now it's a couple of remote islands , Wales and Scotland.

 

 

[ozleicester]

58 minutes ago, FIF said:

now it's a couple of remote islands

Oi !!

 

You still own us.. we just pretend you dont.. see the flag for evidence

Edited 22 August 2019 by ozleicester

[StanSP]

 

 

[weller54]

6 hours ago, ozleicester said:

Does anyone still think that Brexit will benefit England?

Only the gullible taken in by the lies and fairytales.. Most of them xenophobics and Little Englanders! 

Let's hope these people are the first to lose their jobs when the sh1t hits the fan. 

 

[LiberalFox]

I don't expect people to change their minds especially when they didn't make their decision for rational reasons in the first place. 

[Paninistickers]

29 minutes ago, weller54 said:

Only the gullible taken in by the lies and fairytales.. Most of them xenophobics and Little Englanders! 

Let's hope these people are the first to lose their jobs when the sh1t hits the fan. 

 

Well, is suspect a sizeable.portion of the 18 million leave voters were pensioners without mortgages to.pay, the need for jobs and children to educate....so when the shite hits the fan, it'll be a case of 'I'm alright jack'

[Facecloth]

13 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

Well, is suspect a sizeable.portion of the 18 million leave voters were pensioners without mortgages to.pay, the need for jobs and children to educate....so when the shite hits the fan, it'll be a case of 'I'm alright jack'

I know two pensioners who voted leave and then ****ed off to live Cyprus (the EU part) less than a year later. Cheers guys.

Edited 22 August 2019 by Facecloth

[weller54]

1 hour ago, Paninistickers said:

Well, is suspect a sizeable.portion of the 18 million leave voters were pensioners without mortgages to.pay, the need for jobs and children to educate....so when the shite hits the fan, it'll be a case of 'I'm alright jack'

I totally agree.. I'm in that catagory but I voted remain for the sakes of my children and Grandchildren.. Why should they not be able to have the same privileges that my generation have had by being part of the EU?... Selfish older, little Englanders who can't see further than the end of their xenophobic noses! 

I hope they rot in Hell. 

 

[Trav Le Bleu]

What I like about Boris is that he has taken over from May, who was unable to get an acceptable deal with the EU and now he has... oh, wait...

 

 

Also, seeing him alongside Merkal yesterday. She, eloquent, fluent, speaking with appropriate tone and pitch, then Boris speaks... buh... duh... wuh... It's so embarrassing.

 

[Kopfkino]

4 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

All that clout....yet we are giving up membership of a club where this clout and diplomatic skill is at its most potent.

 

Part of the problem has always been the British perception of the EU that France and Germany run it. Not so for other smaller EU countries -  who saw us as one of the big three being pandered to

 

 

 

I'm glad there's finally someone on here that will acknowledge the crucial role the UK has played in the EU (SM, our role at the heart of the EU's regulatory power, AFSJ, eastwards expansion) we've had to spend the last few years reading different takes from people saying how we should have done more or variations on us being an 'awkward partner'. And I certainly agree that the perception of it being a Franco-German centric is skewed though not misguided, I certainly think in the future they will dominate more as the eurozone has to change. Hopefully you also recognise the significant problems our departure poses for an EU hoping to expand its influence going forward.

 

 

4 hours ago, FIF said:

Didn't you hear that Brexit means making Britain great again. Regaining our world status?

 

Anyway I think I'm pretty safe in regards my statement that the British empire has followed other lesser empires on it's path to oblivion.

 

The British empire at one time contained very nearly a quarter of the world's population and a quarter of the earth's total land area. We ruled :

 

 

Afghanistan -1919

Antigua and Barbuda

Australia-1901 -1986

The Bahamas-1973

Bahrain-1971

Barbados-1966

Belize-1981

Botswana-1966

Brunei-1984

Canada-1867–1982- in 1949 Newfoundland and Labrador voted to join Canada too.

Cyprus-1960

Dominica-1978

Egypt-1922

Fiji-1970

The Gambia-1965

Ghana-1957

Grenada-1974

Guyana pre 1970

Suriname pre 1667, various territorial disputes

India-1974

Iraq-1932-more of a mandate I believe but nonetheless

Jamaica-1962

Jordan-1946

Kenya-1963

Kiribati-1979

Kuwait-1961

Lesotho-1964

Malawi-1964

Malaysia-1957

Maldives-1965

Malta-1964

Mauritius-1968

Myanmar-still seen by the government as Burma though

Nauru-1968

New Zealand-1907–1986

Nigeria-1960

Pakistan-1947

Qatar-1971

St lucia-1971

Saint Kitts and nevis-1983

St Vincent and the Grenadina lines-1979

Seychelles-1976

Sierra lione-1961

Soliman islands-1978

South Africa-1910–1961

Sri Lanka-1948

Sudan -1956

Swaziland-1968

Tanzania-1961

Tonga-1970

Trinidad and Tobago-1962

Tuvalu-1978

Uganda-1962

United Arab Emirates-1971

United States,or as it was then the thirteen colonies which were New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia. -gained independence in 1783 but declared it in 1776

Vanuatu-1980

Yemen-1967

Zambia-1964

Zimbabwe-1980

 

And now it's a couple of remote islands , Wales and Scotland.

 

 

 

What is this obsession with empires? The British Empire died 50 years ago but it doesn't make us insignificant just because we're not what we once were. You just look silly tbh - empire or insignificant, part of the EU or insignificant are weird takes. 

[Paninistickers]

36 minutes ago, weller54 said:

I totally agree.. I'm in that catagory but I voted remain for the sakes of my children and Grandchildren.. Why should they not be able to have the same privileges that my generation have had by being part of the EU?... Selfish older, little Englanders who can't see further than the end of their xenophobic noses! 

I hope they rot in Hell. 

 

For me, it's the freedom of movement thing that's the most galling. It's one of the very few pure freedoms we have in life - the absolute right to up sticks and live work in Germany, Italy, Hungary, Denmark... wherever. And the older generation (my parents included) have robbed my kids of that chance and, for me - and i use the word deliberately - imprisoned them career and culture wise in the UK.

 

Even more galling is the fact that ending FOM won't affect immigration... , swapping generally white, Christian, European immigrants (who leavers don't like) for the sort of immigration most leavers despise beyond belief - non white, non Christian immigration

 

When I've challenged my parents on this in that they've voted to reduce mine and their grandkids education, career and lifestyle choices .....they retort back with bizarre vagaries....'Boris will sort it out', 'they'll come begging / they need us' 'we won the war' 'it's democracy' etc etc. And I genuinely think their attitude is fairly representative of many (if not most) leavers. It sickens me, tbh

Edited 22 August 2019 by Paninistickers
Typo