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urban.spaceman

James Maddison

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2 minutes ago, Jimbo said:

20 years is a bit of a stretch. A decade maybe.

 

I'm not saying for 1 minute that we're about to spunk between £70million - £100million on transfers or we're about to start breaking our wage structure with 200k a week contracts. 

 

But 10 years ago would you have believed we would have players in 120k a week?? Would you have believed we'd spend £70 million in one transfer window on 2 players??

 

You're right that it will take time, if at all, to be on par with them, it's probably not going to happen. But we can close the gap within a few years of continued and sustained success

But that's only because premier league income has gone up. In that time, United have gone from paying players 100k a week to 400k a week. We can never match them until we're a global brand with 70k fans going down a week. 

 

Our only chance to match them on the pitch is exploiting them being fat and lazy with money, with exceptional management across the board. That includes trading players when right to do so and buying good replacements. 

 

I'd be happy if the owners decided to pump in loads of money, but it looks like we aren't and they aren't likely to forget the style club management that's got us here.  

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3 minutes ago, Babylon said:

But that's only because premier league income has gone up. In that time, United have gone from paying players 100k a week to 400k a week. We can never match them until we're a global brand with 70k fans going down a week. 

 

Our only chance to match them on the pitch is exploiting them being fat and lazy with money, with exceptional management across the board. That includes trading players when right to do so and buying good replacements. 

 

I'd be happy if the owners decided to pump in loads of money, but it looks like we aren't and they aren't likely to forget the style club management that's got us here.  

We are working to our model and it's paying off.  Of course until we can close the gap, if we ever do, then we will lose players like Maddison but to put a 20 year time scale on it is short sighted.  

 

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31 minutes ago, Babylon said:

We can't spend like them, so we can't behave like them. So quite honestly, people just need to accept that teams that can tripple the wages we can offer, are going to steal our players. 

 

What we need to do is invest wisely and sell for good money when it suits us. 

I understand that. Which is why I wrote that we’d have to do so ‘at some point’ in order to compete in a sustained way. It’s also why I closed by saying we are ‘a way off doing so.’
 

We have to grow into being a top four club and build sustainably which means selling players as and when - but we have already begun to spend bigger, offer bigger wages and will continue to do so. In a few years time it may just be that clubs in the top four can not double or triple the wages of our players. But to get there we gonna need to take some risks, tie our best players down to big and long term deals - just like we have our manager!

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24 minutes ago, Jimbo said:

We are working to our model and it's paying off.  Of course until we can close the gap, if we ever do, then we will lose players like Maddison but to put a 20 year time scale on it is short sighted.  

It's just a number I picked out of thin air, that said I'm not sure why it's short sighted, look how long ground expansion is taking to just 40,000 seats. It takes decades to grow a fanbase naturally without doing a Man City or a Chelsea and pumping in the GDP of a small country into your club. 

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in five years time we're far more likely to be a mid table club than a top four club. The reality is clubs like Man Utd's floor is our ceiling. Long term you can't expect us to be great in the transfer market whilst the elite clubs continue to be so poor. 

 

We should just continue to do what we're doing by looking to excel in the transfer market and occasionally sell our best players to elite clubs for big money and replace them with talented players and hopefully repeat the process. Do that enough times over a number of years and then we may be equipped to make the step up. 

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I don't know about anyone " stealing " our players. Those days are long gone, as was shown with Maguire. if they want one of our players they will have to pay an extortionate price,  Not just  Man united either. Our owners said when they bought the club their intention was to make us a top six club and I have no doubt that is what they will do if not already.

 

We are not a feeder club like Southampton and we have become contract smart with any new players coming in ( forget clauses we got burned on that once before ) Players p*ssed off with not being allowed to Go ?  It took two years of Mahrez's  sulks and tantrums before we let him go and then at a very good price. Again the club put down a marker at that kind of behaviour and any player thinking he can act like that little sh*t will think twice.

 

What is happening in the game at the moment is a lot of new money coming in even for clubs of our size and it is literally game changing. No one jumps anymore when clubs like Man united clicks their fingers and expect us to roll over. We are financial sound nowadays and simply do not have to sell if we don't want to.

 

Man united are fast becoming a third or even fourth club when it comes to top players choices. Everyone knows how badly run the club is with clueless owners who are only there to milk them. They now sound and look desperate and it been long overdue.

Edited by TRAD-DAD
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1 hour ago, Babylon said:

So you think having a squad of pissed off players, with pissed off agents is going to keep us high up the league? 

What like Man U?  Pogba/Lingard/Sanchez/Lukaku being a few examples?     

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10 minutes ago, Gerard said:

in five years time we're far more likely to be a mid table club than a top four club. The reality is clubs like Man Utd's floor is our ceiling. Long term you can't expect us to be great in the transfer market whilst the elite clubs continue to be so poor. 

 

We should just continue to do what we're doing by looking to excel in the transfer market and occasionally sell our best players to elite clubs for big money and replace them with talented players and hopefully repeat the process. Do that enough times over a number of years and then we may be equipped to make the step up. 

Do that enough times and you become Southampton.

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3 minutes ago, Grebfromgrebland said:

Do that enough times and you become Southampton.

 

Which is probably our destiny anyway. 

 

It's really difficult to keep up with the elite clubs when their income is four times ours. I read that Maddison wants £180k a week, we can't afford to give contracts like that out so we'll probably sell him in 6-18 months anyway. It's tough to be expected to compete long term when you're bringing a knife to a gun fight. 

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14 minutes ago, mozartfox said:

What like Man U?  Pogba/Lingard/Sanchez/Lukaku being a few examples?     

Indeed and they are underperforming and shit because of it. But it's easier for clubs like Man U to get over as they have the money to just kick out someone on 400k a week without batting an eyelid. 

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He is good but not yet a £100m player. His final ball still needs quite a bit of work especially when compared to more polished players like De Bruyne, Hazard, Mahrez, Pogba, etc. In fact, if Perez can stay on his feet, even Perez is better.  Maddison has the right ideas though and has good dribbling and a nice turn. He is not ready for Man Utd - they will surely not buy anyone from Leicester again if they pay £100m for Maddison after £85m for Maguire.  But then again, we should not sell for anything less. Maddison would be better served staying with us for his development - he could turn out to be a bit like Paul Scholes for Man Utd but he is not quite there yet.

Edited by Tom12345
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Every club is a selling club, Man U < Real Madrid (Ronaldo), Liverpool < Barc Coutinho. I wouldn't be surprised to see Salah at Real Madrid before long. 

 

Only 3 club in the world that aren't sale clubs Man City, Real Madrid and Barc

 

Its not who you sell it who you recruit, Southampton are where they are because who they brought not who they sold. 

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1 hour ago, Gerard said:

 

Which is probably our destiny anyway. 

 

It's really difficult to keep up with the elite clubs when their income is four times ours. I read that Maddison wants £180k a week, we can't afford to give contracts like that out so we'll probably sell him in 6-18 months anyway. It's tough to be expected to compete long term when you're bringing a knife to a gun fight. 

We could afford contracts like that if we were in Europe consistently, and conveniently enough now seems the perfect opportunity to almost cement ourselves in that picture and just go for it. Get top 4, pay top 4 wages, buy top 4 players and do it again next season. We are absolutely capable of it. We're better than at least half of the so called big 6 already and we need to take advantage of it this time. 

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3 minutes ago, 4everfox said:

We could afford contracts like that if we were in Europe consistently, and conveniently enough now seems the perfect opportunity to almost cement ourselves in that picture and just go for it. Get top 4, pay top 4 wages, buy top 4 players and do it again next season. We are absolutely capable of it. We're better than at least half of the so called big 6 already and we need to take advantage of it this time. 

That work out brilliantly for Leeds...........

 

All good until you have a bit of a blip and finish 5th and can't pay the bills 

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The problem is not just the wages these clubs can pay.

 

If you are a Man Utd player there are potentially millions to be earned in product endorsement and image rights etc. from their mainly Asian fan base. Beckham was a fantastic player, a good looking chap and all round nice bloke, but does anyone seriously believe he would have ended up marrying a spice girl and getting world wide recognition and acclaim as a celebrity, and not just for his prowess on the field, if he had come through the ranks at LCFC and spent most of his career here. I am sure that his talent would have been equally recognised but the rest came about because he was part of the global brand that is Man Utd. HM got a taste of what it would be like when he was the darling of the media at the world cup and obviously decided he wanted more of the same.

 

I always thought that Maddison came across as a decent, grounded sort of guy when interviewed on TV but if these rumours regarding wage demands and release clauses around a new contract have any truth in them then my opinion of him will plummet. Smacks of greed and arrogance. If he thinks he will get more than the senior squad players like Vardy/Kasper etc. then he has no understanding of how things work and a VERY over inflated opinion of himself, which will soon see him become disliked by other squad members.

 

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Money for EPL clubs comes not from the fans in England or Europe, but from across the world.

This means that clubs who attract the biggest world wide "interest" get the most viewing.

Those who are viewed the most attract the biggest sponsors, the biggest broadcasting shares and other opportunities.

 

The system is rotten, but its the system in which we operate.

 

The meritocracy element disappeared long ago I am afraid.

Edited by Dahnsouff
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5 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

That work out brilliantly for Leeds...........

 

All good until you have a bit of a blip and finish 5th and can't pay the bills 

You do realise that our owner is a multi billionaire right? I'm pretty sure that if he really wanted to he could just go full blown Chelsea 2002 or Man City 2009 without even taking a zero off his bank balance. Not that I want that, I prefer our current method. 

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1 minute ago, 4everfox said:

You do realise that our owner is a multi billionaire right? I'm pretty sure that if he really wanted to he could just go full blown Chelsea 2002 or Man City 2009 without even taking a zero off his bank balance. Not that I want that, I prefer our current method. 

Yes but FFP rules were brought in to stop just that sort of thing so that uppity little clubs outside of London or the North west can't join the cartel now even if they are totally minted. Our way is the only way now. organically grow, bringing in more sponsorship deals, advertising revenue and TV money from CL etc consistently over a few seasons and then we can start attracting, afford the wages of and retain, the sort of players that we need.

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