Coronavirus Thread

[CosbehFox]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53244626

 

Quite damning that a lack of communication and data is holding us back when it comes to the next stage 

[zorro en españa]

12 hours ago, st albans fox said:

Cases in the states seem to have flattened out for the time being .....is the next move further upwards or slowly down ????? 

SAF - your remark surprised me ..... so much so that I went back to a post I wrote (15 June) about active cases in the 10 closest fought Republican held States and compared to close of play yesterday.  So, first figure quoted is the number of active cases 14 June, second figure is active cases 30 June

 

Texas - 28,905 up to 79,955

Florida - 57,889 up to 125,011

Pensylvania - 20,537 down to 16,974

Ohio - 30,078 up to 36,444

Georgia - 53,784 up to 69,234

Michigan - 15,074 down to 13,436

N Carolina - 19,478 down to 18,483**

Arizona - 28,172 up to 68,172

Indiana - 8,965 down to 8,308

Tennessee - 10,061 up to 15,306

** interesting this one as NC has had several days where new cases have been over a thousand.  It may be the indicator that States can cope providing the c20,000 barrier is not breached.  As can be seen three (of five) that had gone above 25k last time are now looking down the barrel of a gun and interestingly the rhetoric of the three State governors is beginning to change as is the behaviour of the people (I believe).

 

What is noticeable is the death rate seems relatively steady, although there were 700+ yesterday.  I can only imagine how the health authorities are coping in the States being hardest hit.  SAF - I think the trend upwards will continue for the next few days but let’s hope the slow realisation that this virus seems easily spread will continue to change people’s behaviours.  I hope Fauci’s prediction that it could reach 100k cases a day does not come to fruition.

 

 

 

 

Edited 1 July 2020 by zorro en españa

[davieG]

 

[Leicester_Loyal]

Anyone who coughs or spits like that is fair game for a jab to the face.

[Sampson]

1 hour ago, davieG said:

 

I'm not sure about that one with the person who cuts a hole in the mask because it's hard to breathe being on here though. Cutting the hole is silly but that's a legitimate concern.

 

My nephew is asthmatic and struggles to breathe properly with a mask. Asthmatics are exempt from wearing masks on public transport by the UK government if they find it a struggle with them on, but most bus drivers and passengers are completely unaware of that and so he either isn't allowed on the bus, gets dirty looks and comments from other passengers or people assume he's just faking it so people he doesn't have to wear one.

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, Sampson said:

I'm not sure about that one with the person who cuts a hole in the mask because it's hard to breathe being on here though. Cutting the hole is silly but that's a legitimate concern.

 

My nephew is asthmatic and struggles to breathe properly with a mask. Asthmatics are exempt from wearing masks on public transport by the UK government if they find it a struggle with them on, but most bus drivers and passengers are completely unaware of that and so he either isn't allowed on the bus, gets dirty looks and comments from other passengers or people assume he's just faking it so people he doesn't have to wear one.

That’s an interesting one re the asthma 

 

a loosish fitting surgical mask shouldn’t be too restrictive for him - perhaps it’s also a feeling of being restricted which exacerbates the asthma symptoms ??

[leicsmac]

"US President Donald Trump's administration has secured almost all the world's upcoming supply of the drug Remdesivir. The drug, produced by the firm Gilead Sciences, is the first approved by authorities in the US to be used to treat Covid-19.It has been shown to help people recover faster from the disease.

 

A statement from the Department of Health and Human services says Trump struck an "amazing" deal with Gilead for 500,000 doses which amounts to 100% of Gilead's production in July, 90% of it in August and 90% in September."

 

Are there ethical guidelines in place for this or is it just a case of the richest/fastest bidder first gets as much as they want and everyone else suffers, US healthcare-style? Genuinely curious because I honestly don't know how it works.

[rachhere]

22 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

"US President Donald Trump's administration has secured almost all the world's upcoming supply of the drug Remdesivir. The drug, produced by the firm Gilead Sciences, is the first approved by authorities in the US to be used to treat Covid-19.It has been shown to help people recover faster from the disease.

 

A statement from the Department of Health and Human services says Trump struck an "amazing" deal with Gilead for 500,000 doses which amounts to 100% of Gilead's production in July, 90% of it in August and 90% in September."

 

Are there ethical guidelines in place for this or is it just a case of the richest/fastest bidder first gets as much as they want and everyone else suffers, US healthcare-style? Genuinely curious because I honestly don't know how it works.

I was talking about this with my husband last night. Apparently developing countries are allowed to manufacture their own non-brand version of the drug, but in Europe we aren't and because of the patent have to source from the drugs company. Surely in this situation there has got to be a way round these restrictions? I think this was our own research as well which proved the effectiveness of the drug? It would be interesting to know how many of those drugs the US would expect to use in that time frame, and whether they are going to end up stockpiling a lot of what they order...

[Sampson]

41 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

That’s an interesting one re the asthma 

 

a loosish fitting surgical mask shouldn’t be too restrictive for him - perhaps it’s also a feeling of being restricted which exacerbates the asthma symptoms ??

No. I don't think it's just a feeling but a real medical problem.

 

I think it's the creation of warmer air with more carbon dioxide when you're wearing a mask and it causes the same problems as to why he gets asthma symptoms in hot, humid weather. It creates a kind of bubble of hot humid air around the mouth and nose.

 

It seems to be recognised as an issue by the UK government as they've actively said people with asthma or COPD shouldn't wear masks on public transport. But no public transport drivers have even seem to be made aware of it, let alone joe public who will just either have a go and tell him to get off the bus or spend the whole journey giving dirty looks.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/metro.co.uk/2020/05/19/people-asthma-shouldnt-wear-face-masks-experts-warn-12723945/amp/

 

[Innovindil]

30 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

"US President Donald Trump's administration has secured almost all the world's upcoming supply of the drug Remdesivir. The drug, produced by the firm Gilead Sciences, is the first approved by authorities in the US to be used to treat Covid-19.It has been shown to help people recover faster from the disease.

 

A statement from the Department of Health and Human services says Trump struck an "amazing" deal with Gilead for 500,000 doses which amounts to 100% of Gilead's production in July, 90% of it in August and 90% in September."

 

Are there ethical guidelines in place for this or is it just a case of the richest/fastest bidder first gets as much as they want and everyone else suffers, US healthcare-style? Genuinely curious because I honestly don't know how it works.

First paid first served I'd imagine. It's a US company isn't it? And I also think I heard muricans pumped some millions into the development of it. 

 

Actually surprised people are this desperate for it. Think its priced at around $2500 a treatment and doesn't have any effect on survival rate at all, just recovery rate. Doesn't sound all that wonderful but tbh I've only casually been following it, so could be missing something important. 

[StanSP]

Confused

 

 

[WigstonWanderer]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

"US President Donald Trump's administration has secured almost all the world's upcoming supply of the drug Remdesivir. The drug, produced by the firm Gilead Sciences, is the first approved by authorities in the US to be used to treat Covid-19.It has been shown to help people recover faster from the disease.

 

A statement from the Department of Health and Human services says Trump struck an "amazing" deal with Gilead for 500,000 doses which amounts to 100% of Gilead's production in July, 90% of it in August and 90% in September."

 

Are there ethical guidelines in place for this or is it just a case of the richest/fastest bidder first gets as much as they want and everyone else suffers, US healthcare-style? Genuinely curious because I honestly don't know how it works.

I get the impression that this drug is more of a scam anyway. Hugely expensive and not very effective. Hyped up so Gilead can get a pay off.

 

The Dexamethasone result seemed more exciting and is a older cheap drug.

Edited 1 July 2020 by WigstonWanderer

[Chrysalis]

12 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

First paid first served I'd imagine. It's a US company isn't it? And I also think I heard muricans pumped some millions into the development of it. 

 

Actually surprised people are this desperate for it. Think its priced at around $2500 a treatment and doesn't have any effect on survival rate at all, just recovery rate. Doesn't sound all that wonderful but tbh I've only casually been following it, so could be missing something important. 

Given it only affects recovery we probably didnt bid, the NHS is about the extremes only, they will care about death rate but not the comforts of recovery, which is why we only hospitalise those who are about to drop dead.

[leicsmac]

28 minutes ago, rachhere said:

I was talking about this with my husband last night. Apparently developing countries are allowed to manufacture their own non-brand version of the drug, but in Europe we aren't and because of the patent have to source from the drugs company. Surely in this situation there has got to be a way round these restrictions? I think this was our own research as well which proved the effectiveness of the drug? It would be interesting to know how many of those drugs the US would expect to use in that time frame, and whether they are going to end up stockpiling a lot of what they order...

As folks have said below, I guess it comes down to just how effective this particular drug is.

 

I do however think it highlights, yet again, just how incredibly self-centred the current US administration is.

 

23 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

First paid first served I'd imagine. It's a US company isn't it? And I also think I heard muricans pumped some millions into the development of it. 

 

Actually surprised people are this desperate for it. Think its priced at around $2500 a treatment and doesn't have any effect on survival rate at all, just recovery rate. Doesn't sound all that wonderful but tbh I've only casually been following it, so could be missing something important. 

 

10 minutes ago, WigstonWanderer said:

I get the impression that this drug is more of a scam anyway. Hugely expensive and not very effective. Hyped up so Gillard can get a pay off.

 

The Dexamethasone result seemed more exciting and is a older cheap drug.

If it turns out it's not all that it would be darkly hilarious how Trump basically got conned...except for the part where it's government money he's wasting and it would be a great many ordinary folks who would pay the price.

[Innovindil]

3 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

As folks have said below, I guess it comes down to just how effective this particular drug is.

 

I do however think it highlights, yet again, just how incredibly self-centred the current US administration is.

 

 

If it turns out it's not all that it would be darkly hilarious how Trump basically got conned...except for the part where it's government money he's wasting and it would be a great many ordinary folks who would pay the price.

I dunno honestly. I think it comes down to how you slice the cake. It's supposed to save an average of 4 days recovery time, which is probably a zillion dollars worth per American. But it's not some super drug that's going to save people as I've said the difference in survival rates in the test results I saw were negligible. 

 

It's a good drug to have and a help, but imo, meh. 

[st albans fox]

19 hours ago, zorro en españa said:

SAF - your remark surprised me ..... so much so that I went back to a post I wrote (15 June) about active cases in the 10 closest fought Republican held States and compared to close of play yesterday.  So, first figure quoted is the number of active cases 14 June, second figure is active cases 30 June

 

Texas - 28,905 up to 79,955

Florida - 57,889 up to 125,011

Pensylvania - 20,537 down to 16,974

Ohio - 30,078 up to 36,444

Georgia - 53,784 up to 69,234

Michigan - 15,074 down to 13,436

N Carolina - 19,478 down to 18,483**

Arizona - 28,172 up to 68,172

Indiana - 8,965 down to 8,308

Tennessee - 10,061 up to 15,306

** interesting this one as NC has had several days where new cases have been over a thousand.  It may be the indicator that States can cope providing the c20,000 barrier is not breached.  As can be seen three (of five) that had gone above 25k last time are now looking down the barrel of a gun and interestingly the rhetoric of the three State governors is beginning to change as is the behaviour of the people (I believe).

 

What is noticeable is the death rate seems relatively steady, although there were 700+ yesterday.  I can only imagine how the health authorities are coping in the States being hardest hit.  SAF - I think the trend upwards will continue for the next few days but let’s hope the slow realisation that this virus seems easily spread will continue to change people’s behaviours.  I hope Fauci’s prediction that it could reach 100k cases a day does not come to fruition.

 

I was noting that the number of cases country wide had stopped accelerating and was plateauing ...around the world we’ve seen the plateau followed by a slow decline. My musing was whether this general plateau would, be followed by another acceleration upwards ??

 

looking at some of the state numbers today, it could be the latter .....

 

EDIT: yesterday did reach 50k which is certainly at the upper end of any idea of a plateau..... assumption that Fauci knew what he was talking about when he said it could go towards 100k on this particular wave ......

Edited 2 July 2020 by st albans fox

[foxile5]

6 hours ago, StanSP said:

Confused

 

 

He's not confused he's just a piece of excrement. 

 

He wants the public kudos of being seen to support the NHS but his politics are that it ought to be privatised.

 

He's banking on the public not accessing his voting record. There's also the post truth nature of society now - the truth is what they say it is. 

[StanSP]

9 minutes ago, foxile5 said:

He's not confused he's just a piece of excrement. 

 

He wants the public kudos of being seen to support the NHS but his politics are that it ought to be privatised.

 

He's banking on the public not accessing his voting record. There's also the post truth nature of society now - the truth is what they say it is. 

I meant I was confused  

[foxile5]

6 minutes ago, StanSP said:

I meant I was confused  

Oh. I hope I cleared it up. 

[zorro en españa]

9 hours ago, st albans fox said:

I was noting that the number of cases country wide had stopped accelerating and was plateauing ...around the world we’ve seen the plateau followed by a slow decline. My musing was whether this general plateau would, be followed by another acceleration upwards ??

 

looking at some of the state numbers today, it could be the latter .....

Oh OK - thanks.

 

Yea - 51k new cases yesterday.  Breaking records every day.  Under 700 deaths though but now on the brink of 400 deaths per million, seventh in the world and quite far behind France (457 per M) in sixth ..... at the rate of increase the States will go sixth this month.  Tragic comments.

 

 

[st albans fox]

3 minutes ago, zorro en españa said:

Oh OK - thanks.

 

Yea - 51k new cases yesterday.  Breaking records every day.  Under 700 deaths though but now on the brink of 400 deaths per million, seventh in the world and quite far behind France (457 per M) in sixth ..... at the rate of increase the States will go sixth this month.  Tragic comments.

 

 

I suspect that a fair proportion of the new wave of cases are in less vulnerable parts of the population which means any consequences for deaths will be delayed somewhat as spread to those sections of the society will take a little longer. Add to that the advances medics have made in treating patients with severe responses to the virus and it could take some while for that measure to go up significantly.  One assumes that this who are more vulnerable will be more inclined to be careful not to contract the virus. this wave may well be more notable for the strain it puts on the hospitals (and consequences for staff and patients suffering other illnesses) than the straight covid death count that’s published. 

[StanSP]

 

[StanSP]

 

 

[filbertway]

41 minutes ago, StanSP said:

 

Looks a good sesh does that!

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, StanSP said:

 

whilst it annoys me that our frontline workers have to put themselves in harms way because of idiots like this, the fact that they enter the house and aren't wearing masks makes it tough for the idiots to take the restrictions seriously.  you can understand kids thinking 'if it was that dangerous then the police would have a mask on' ……..