Coronavirus Thread

[dsr-burnley]

9 minutes ago, reynard said:

Unfortunately the vaccine is not effective, it seems, until around 14 days from 1st dose and only fully effective around a week after 2nd dose. There is some interesting stuff coming out of Israel where Pfizer are getting some very up to date info. Really looks as is lifting restrictionsin any meaningful way will only be able to take place once the over 50s etc have all had their second dose and a week after that final person otherwise the vaccines don't appear to be that effective in stopping infection etc. I might have read it all wrong though as I'm not a scientist. So I guess pubs and theatres etc won't be open until May/June possibly.

https://www.israel21c.org/israeli-hmos-pfizer-vaccine-immunity-best-after-14-days/

What you have read is correct, but the headline is inaccurate and sets you off on the wrong track.  The point is that a single dose of the Pfizer vaccine appears to provide 33% protection (or 60% according to the pther survey) after 14 days.  No figures have been produced for what happens after 15 days, or 21 days, or 28 days, or 12 weeks.  As you say, it's not effective at all before 14 days, but it can't be because of the very nature of vaccines.

 

Before long Israel will be able to produce figures of infection rates between 14 and 21 days after the first jab.  And not long after that, the UK will be able to produce its own figures of infection rates within 4 weeks, 5 weeks, 6 weeks and so on.  The UK official estimate was that a single does provides 89% protection after 21 days; the 33% protection rate after 14 days doesn't confirm or deny that.  Further info needed.

[Col city fan]

Jesus Christ, how many deaths in the last 24 hours! And that’s WITH lock-down

😩
Great work again on the vaccines though 

Edited 20 January 2021 by Col city fan

[StanSP]

Just now, Col city fan said:

Jesus Christ, how many deaths in the last 24 hours! And that’s WITH lock-down

😩

As tragic as every death is, these deaths are unlikely to be as a result of this lockdown.

 

Given the time-frames, it's likely these deaths are the effect of not being in lockdown or the lack of restrictions we had after November's lockdown finished...

[reynard]

3 minutes ago, dsr-burnley said:

What you have read is correct, but the headline is inaccurate and sets you off on the wrong track.  The point is that a single dose of the Pfizer vaccine appears to provide 33% protection (or 60% according to the pther survey) after 14 days.  No figures have been produced for what happens after 15 days, or 21 days, or 28 days, or 12 weeks.  As you say, it's not effective at all before 14 days, but it can't be because of the very nature of vaccines.

 

Before long Israel will be able to produce figures of infection rates between 14 and 21 days after the first jab.  And not long after that, the UK will be able to produce its own figures of infection rates within 4 weeks, 5 weeks, 6 weeks and so on.  The UK official estimate was that a single does provides 89% protection after 21 days; the 33% protection rate after 14 days doesn't confirm or deny that.  Further info needed.

Thanks. I think it does show that real care needs to be taken until we have more evidence by people who have been vaccinated. Even though 33% protection is better than none it still isn't that high.

Edited 20 January 2021 by reynard

[Leicester_Loyal]

24 minutes ago, Rain King said:

Is the vaccine being rolled out in random order throughout Leicestershire GPs?

 

My healthy 70  year old family member has had it today but still heard no mention about my 74 year old shielding Dad getting it.

I believe so, depends on your area and your GP. People have been missed out though, so you could ring your GP up to make sure they're aware your shielding dad hasn't had it yet, just incase he has been missed out.

[urban.spaceman]

1 hour ago, StanSP said:

The scientists warned last week it'll get worse before it gets better. They said this week and next week deaths will rise up, probably as a knock-on effect of any December/Xmas gatherings... 

Was just thinking that. Worrying that the hangover from a more lax December is still ahead of us. Can only hope vaccinations continue to snowball.

[Corky]

That decision to put London into Tier 2 seems ever more baffling.

 

I'm not surprised by the death figures, they positivity rate was so high it was going to happen.

[Finnaldo]

1 hour ago, Col city fan said:

Jesus Christ, how many deaths in the last 24 hours! And that’s WITH lock-down

😩

Deaths are usually 3 weeks+ after it’s caught right? So we’re probably still seeing deaths from the last couple weeks of December. 
 

2 hours ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

346,922 vaccinations announced today.

 

343,163 first doses.

3759 second doses.

 

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

Incredible numbers! 

Yep another excellent day for the vaccination effort, looking like the other day was a blip. I have heard supply is getting a bit tight in some places, to be expected I guess with how much progress we’ve made in such little time. I imagine as time goes on and production ramps up it’ll become a lot less of an issue. Future’s bright in that regard!

[Leicester_Loyal]

1 hour ago, Finnaldo said:

Deaths are usually 3 weeks+ after it’s caught right? So we’re probably still seeing deaths from the last couple weeks of December. 
 

 

Yep another excellent day for the vaccination effort, looking like the other day was a blip. I have heard supply is getting a bit tight in some places, to be expected I guess with how much progress we’ve made in such little time. I imagine as time goes on and production ramps up it’ll become a lot less of an issue. Future’s bright in that regard!

Another thing I read earlier is that it depends who is being vaccinated as to how many they can do. A frail 85 year old is obviously going to take more time than someone who's fit and healthy at 71, so that's why we have ups and downs, but the younger the average age of the people being vaccinated, the more we should be able to do daily. I believe they also go into care homes, so they can easily get 50-100 there done in a day, whereas asking 50-100 80 year olds to come to the GPs is going to take a lot longer.

[Finnaldo]

1 minute ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

Another thing I read earlier is that it depends who is being vaccinated as to how many they can do. A frail 85 year old is obviously going to take more time than someone who's fit and healthy at 71, so that's why we have ups and downs, but the younger the average age of the people being vaccinated, the more we should be able to do daily. I believe they also go into care homes, so they can easily get 50-100 there done in a day, whereas asking 50-100 80 year olds to come to the GPs is going to take a lot longer.

Yes mate I’ve heard similar, one of my mates who a biomedicine graduate theorised it may take some time when they get to the 50 and 60 y/os, e.g. the last real vulnerable age groups, because getting folk of working age in for jabs is a lot harder than an age group that are mostly retired! 
 

Either way, so far so good. 

[AS78UK]

Speaking to a colleague at work today, there grandma had Covid in October, survived and was one of the first patients to get covid Pfizer vaccine in December, she had the second dose earlier this month.   Scarily she has now tested positive for Covid again. They believe a different strain....but what does that say about the vaccine.....

[StanSP]

2 minutes ago, AS78UK said:

Speaking to a colleague at work today, there grandma had Covid in October, survived and was one of the first patients to get covid Pfizer vaccine in December, she had the second dose earlier this month.   Scarily she has now tested positive for Covid again. They believe a different strain....but what does that say about the vaccine.....

How long was it before the 2nd dose and the positive test?

[Magictv]

6 minutes ago, AS78UK said:

Speaking to a colleague at work today, there grandma had Covid in October, survived and was one of the first patients to get covid Pfizer vaccine in December, she had the second dose earlier this month.   Scarily she has now tested positive for Covid again. They believe a different strain....but what does that say about the vaccine.....

The vaccine offered 95% protection (https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577) so perhaps she is just one of the unlucky 1/20 . From what I've read (can't find the link now, may have got it mixed up with Astrazeneca one) I had seen that the vaccine reduced severity even in those who did catch covid afterwards, let's hope it has that effect in this case.

[Costock_Fox]

1 hour ago, Corky said:

That decision to put London into Tier 2 seems ever more baffling.

 

I'm not surprised by the death figures, they positivity rate was so high it was going to happen.

It’s the new variant

[Wymsey]

I currently work on a Covid-positive ward at the Leicester Royal Infirmary, and we had 3 deaths today and have a few end-of-life patients.

 

An elderly woman came into the ward this afternoon, end-of-life; their husband was already on this ward for a few days (they have been married for over 50 years).

 

When he came to see his wife in her side-room (not too long after she was admitted), and saw how she was, he told the Healthcare Assistant in the room "I've seen enough, please can I return to my bed".

 

Was heart-breaking to witness that, especially as apparently she was up and talking a couple of days ago.

 

 

Edited 20 January 2021 by Wymsey

[Nod.E]

5 hours ago, StanSP said:

As tragic as every death is, these deaths are unlikely to be as a result of this lockdown.

 

Given the time-frames, it's likely these deaths are the effect of not being in lockdown or the lack of restrictions we had after November's lockdown finished...

Some people still don't understand 10 months in.

 

Not saying the number isn't shocking. But as you say, it's nothing to do with what has happened over the past couple of weeks.

[dsr-burnley]

4 hours ago, AS78UK said:

Speaking to a colleague at work today, there grandma had Covid in October, survived and was one of the first patients to get covid Pfizer vaccine in December, she had the second dose earlier this month.   Scarily she has now tested positive for Covid again. They believe a different strain....but what does that say about the vaccine.....

Maybe it says more about your colleague's Grandma, that her immune system doesn't work?

Edited 21 January 2021 by dsr-burnley

[Leicester_Loyal]

 

[simFox]

3 hours ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

 

He forgot to mention people on FT, plenty people on here seem to live to think staying home is dead easy for some. Especially children who already have less than privileged lifestyle now watching their parents struggling even more.

[Facecloth]

3 hours ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

 

Great speech, but go an check his voted record. Would suggest he's less bothered about those struggling than that rousing speech implies.

[simFox]

6 hours ago, dsr-burnley said:

Maybe it says more about your colleague's Grandma, that her immune system doesn't work?

Her immune system seemed to work the first time she had it?

 

It is my undertanding you can still catch it and spread it on, vaccine just stops you from dieing. Seeing as Covid only kills 0.05% of the people it infects and the vaccine is only 90% effective. Lets hope she's not in the 10%

 

 

[simFox]

4 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

Great speech, but go an check his voted record. Would suggest he's less bothered about those struggling than that rousing speech implies.

I havet checked, but lets not forget people vote on what they thought was best at the time.

 

I heard a pro-lockdown chap on the news comment after sage talked about increasing restrictions, despite the vaccination, and he was beginning to raise an eye brow. I guess people are starting to question "how do we get out of it"

 

Turns out we are now at 2010 levels of daily deaths. Thats terrible, no one wants to go back to those days with bodies lying the streets and living in fear of whos next... what a terror 2010 was. And dont get me talking about 2000, cant quite believe i made it through back then.

[Facecloth]

6 minutes ago, simFox said:

I havet checked, but lets not forget people vote on what they thought was best at the time.

 

I heard a pro-lockdown chap on the news comment after sage talked about increasing restrictions, despite the vaccination, and he was beginning to raise an eye brow. I guess people are starting to question "how do we get out of it"

 

Turns out we are now at 2010 levels of daily deaths. Thats terrible, no one wants to go back to those days with bodies lying the streets and living in fear of whos next... what a terror 2010 was. And dont get me talking about 2000, cant quite believe i made it through back then.

Even his recent votes have been against help the worst off in society, including no the free meals for kids during the holidays. A lifetime of voted against helping the worst off in society can't be erased by one rousing speech. Hopefully this was a point of realisation for him, maybe we'll see him be more compassionate in future.

Edited 21 January 2021 by Facecloth

[reynard]

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20210114-covid-19-how-effective-is-a-single-vaccine-dose?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB

 

 

A reasonable article if you have the time to read it. Does make you wonder if out approach in delaying the second vaccination might prove to be the wrong way to go and reinforces the message that those who have only had one dose should act as if they haven't had any.  There's still a long long way to go with this.

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, simFox said:

He forgot to mention people on FT, plenty people on here seem to live to think staying home is dead easy for some. Especially children who already have less than privileged lifestyle now watching their parents struggling even more.

Consider it this way: the prevailing argument has always been that introverts should get out more, rather than extroverts stay in more. Now that circumstances have forced the shoe to be on the other foot for a while, perhaps in future there might be more empathy, consideration and meeting in the middle on the topic.