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Coronavirus Thread

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2 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

They literally take a list of deaths, and compare that to the list of positive tests, and if they match that is counted.  They don't have time or ability to start delving into whether Covid was the primary cause or not.

 

Who is they? 

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24 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

My best mates dad recently passed away. He suffered from dementia and was rushed to hospital and died a few hours later. His covid test was negitive so was diagnosed with pneumonia which is a common killer in dementia sufferers. 

 

Even though the covid test was negitive, the death certificate stated the cause of death was covid 19. My mate has been given no reason or explanation why this was the case and plans to fight it.

 

Now they are both conditions that effect the lungs but this is something that's happened (I've seen the death certificate) and appears to be completely wrong from the drs in question

My grandad died a few months ago of bacterial pneumonia. Was put down as covid as the doctor just assumed it was without a test. But he was tested in the ambulance which later came back negative,but was already down as covid. My family opted for a post mortem and got it changed.

Edited by Kopic
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Excess deaths, death certificate records, and official stats based on positive tests in the last 28 days, all come up with a similar figure.  There are loads of anecdotal evidence of wrongly recorded death certificates etc., but unless they can prove that the excess deaths are substantially caused by lockdown-related rather than directly covid-related (and they can't, at least not for this year just gone) then we can take them as being basically correct. 

 

If 80,000 should be recorded as 20,000, then we would have a serious issue.  If 80,000 should be 75,000, that's just playing round the edges and is not the sort of difference that would change anything.

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Just now, Sol thewall Bamba said:

It's deaths by ANY cause up to 28 days after a positive test. This has been widely publicised for months. 

 

I know and I've addressed that issue on the previous page, which is to do with media reporting, not medical records. 

 

What I am challenging is people's assertions that doctors are going around writing Covid-19 on death certificates even where the person was in a fatal accident.

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13 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

I know and I've addressed that issue on the previous page, which is to do with media reporting, not medical records. 

 

What I am challenging is people's assertions that doctors are going around writing Covid-19 on death certificates even where the person was in a fatal accident.

Oh no of course not, but they're still counted in the numbers. 

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2 hours ago, Buce said:

 

Purely out of curiosity, why? Does it really matter?

I think it does. I would have thought that research, and consequently funding, into diseases such as dementia and cancer,  would be based on numbers, obviously the more people who have a serious disease, the more important it is to try to reduce the effects for those people or even find a cure. If the numbers of people that die from a dementia related problem go down by a large amount due to it not being on their death records, then the amount of funding will reduce. Many families who have had relatives suffer and die from serious illnesses invest both time and money in trying to help others who are connected to those illnesses, that’s why they feel it’s important to state the true nature of death on a death certificate.

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49 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

I think it does. I would have thought that research, and consequently funding, into diseases such as dementia and cancer,  would be based on numbers, obviously the more people who have a serious disease, the more important it is to try to reduce the effects for those people or even find a cure. If the numbers of people that die from a dementia related problem go down by a large amount due to it not being on their death records, then the amount of funding will reduce. Many families who have had relatives suffer and die from serious illnesses invest both time and money in trying to help others who are connected to those illnesses, that’s why they feel it’s important to state the true nature of death on a death certificate.

Your best post on this thread imo

Agree 100%

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3 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

The people have done everything they have been asked to do, and any suggestion that a lack of following the rules had been at fault is utter nonsense.  The government are fully 100% accountable and should be held to that.  We will judge them once this is over, and see how we performed.  So far it looks like a pretty poor outcome overall.

Tish and pish

i must have seen hundreds if not thousands of examples where I’ve seen the rules not being followed. From pubs full of punters on the East Coast, literally laughing off social distancing to chumps not wearing masks in shops

Together with governmental strange decisions this is why we have such unenviable stats around Covid.

The latest one, incidentally down my local shop  a few days ago, where a couple of young lads not only entered the shop with no masks but came in smoking joints.

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2 hours ago, RobHawk said:

That's actually a great question, and to me or you it doesn't matter. 

 

But my mate was his full time carer and he went to great lengths to protect his Dad from covid. When it all kicked off in March, he moved in with his Dad and was still living there. 

 

He has a partner and a 4 year old he didn't see face to face for months and literally prioritised his dad's welfare over everything. What has since happened is horrible for him to deal with but with the above in mind, it saying covid on the death certificate feels like a huge slap in the face for him when there is no evidence to support that being the case.

Had never thought about this. Fair point.

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4 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:
 

208,641 vaccinations announced today.

 

204, 076 first doses.

4565 second doses.

 

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations

 

Very disappointing numbers, especially with all the new centres opening, I expected 350k ish.

I would expect there to be a few logistical hiccups due to redirecting vaccines to the newer centres

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I know I said it yesterday but I'm guessing low numbers are influenced (in some measure) probably by people affected by weather and therefore can't get to their vaccination centres/hubs/GP. Presumably in northern areas where there's been shit weather for quite a while - floods, snow etc? Guessing this might also affect distribution to such places?

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What I don't get is why they seem to 'push' everything and blame Covid for deaths.

 

You'd think if anything they'd want to be 'hiding' Covid deaths - i.e Putting deaths down as other reasons, especially if there is cause for other underlying health conditions being the actual reasons.

 

It doesn't really matter I guess, a death is a death, as unfortunate and sad as that is the 'positive' of putting anything and everything down as a Covid death must be that our statistics for other deaths must be dramatically lower in the past year.

 

I mean our high statistics are hardly anything to be proud of.

 

This is why we need some context of these stats.

 

How many people have died with Covid? How many people have died because of Covid?

 

In the last couple of pages i'm reading people who have tested negative still being put down as a Covid death, I don't get it.

 

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7 minutes ago, Matt said:

What I don't get is why they seem to 'push' everything and blame Covid for deaths.

 

You'd think if anything they'd want to be 'hiding' Covid deaths - i.e Putting deaths down as other reasons, especially if there is cause for other underlying health conditions being the actual reasons.

 

It doesn't really matter I guess, a death is a death, as unfortunate and sad as that is the 'positive' of putting anything and everything down as a Covid death must be that our statistics for other deaths must be dramtically lower in the past year.

 

I mean our high statistics are hardly anything to be proud of.

 

This is why we need some context of these stats.

 

How many people have died with Covid? How many people have died because of Covid?

 

In the last couple of pages i'm reading people who have tested negative still being put down as a Covid death, I don't get it.

 

You could just go on excess deaths for 2020.

 

It gets mentioned pretty much every day so I don't know why people are still unsure. 

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Guest Harrydc

Do people actually want to return to the old normal? I seen a tweet earlier which gained a lot of traction complaining about our past behaviours, stating how we used to "get close to one another" and "touch the same things" and how disgusting it was lol. I also seen one saying how strange it is that we used to go to work and infect people with our cold... 

 

This doesn't fill me with much hope for the future if people are going to continue being scared of eachother after this (whenever that may be). It saddens me to know children are going to grow up thinking these kind of behaviours are normal. 

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6 minutes ago, Harrydc said:

Do people actually want to return to the old normal? I seen a tweet earlier which gained a lot of traction complaining about our past behaviours, stating how we used to "get close to one another" and "touch the same things" and how disgusting it was lol. I also seen one saying how strange it is that we used to go to work and infect people with our cold... 

 

This doesn't fill me with much hope for the future if people are going to continue being scared of eachother after this (whenever that may be). It saddens me to know children are going to grow up thinking these kind of behaviours are normal. 

I know what you mean but all this has honestly made me think differently about hygiene. Some of the things we’ve done over the years really haven’t been very clever have they. 

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