An unpopular opinion...?

[GingerrrFox]

This is probably going to be a divisive opinion and maybe not many people will agree with me. However I think it’s the way forward for Leicester City. 
 

If you read Sir Alex Ferguson’s autobiography when he discusses moving away from Ruud Van Nistelrooy and evolving his Manchester United team, he spoke about how he felt football had moved away from having a 20+ goal a season striker who has to be fed chances in the box and cannot create for others.
 

If you look at the trios of Tevez/Rooney/Ronaldo, Firmino/Mane/Salah or Bergkamp/Henry/Pires which have been successful, it’s because they are a whole unit, they are interchangeable and they create for each other as well as being able to put the ball in the back of the net. 
 

Look at Rashford/Martial/Greenwood today as an example of a trio that are being primed for the future, they are going to be a unit that if they stay together will make United title winners again in the not too distant future.

 

Earlier in the season there was an article in the Athletic that said our expected goals was only 14.27 but our actual goals tally was 27 at the time. It was predicted that it would be unsustainable and we would see a drop off. This has proved to be the case with our 15th position in the form table for the last 12 rounds of matches. Our team right now is built around providing chances for Jamie Vardy and this puts pressure on both the team to feed Vardy and for Vardy to regularly convert those chances at high percentages. It is not a sustainable game plan because it relies on one man being at the top of their game consistently and is too one dimensional and predictable for the opposition. 
 

So the potential unpopular opinion from me is that I think it is time to start the process of moving on from Jamie Vardy and bring in a striker who is not just a goal scorer. We will never be able to sign a star such as Mbappe or Haaland, however buying a more complete striker who can contribute to chances being made as well as putting them away is what we need to progress as a football team in my opinion. It’s time to buy a striker who will genuinely push Vardy to be the starter in that position and is in a different mould of striker to Vardy. 

 

No doubt Vardy still has a role in the squad, especially against teams where they will look to make things difficult for us and we can sacrifice a midfielder for an extra striker. Vardy is a legend for Leicester fans and rightly so, this is not meant to take anything away from how good he has been for us or his achievements for the club and I am happy for him that he has won individual recognition with the golden boot award. However for me it is becoming apparent his acceleration is dropping off - a few seasons ago he would have blitzed past Lindelof on the through ball that we saw today in the first half. He also doesn’t seem to be able to repeat high intensity sprints like he used to, which was another key asset to his game as the opposition became tired. For me, it’s time to genuinely bring in a successor to Jamie Vardy’s crown who can compete for his position in the team and either replace him now or in the not too distant future. 

[Number 6]

Didn't he put 3 on a plate for his teammates against Sheff Utd the other week?

[Freeman's Wharfer]

Quite easy for Ferguson’s Manchester United to move out a 20 goal a season striker when a) the quality around him wasn’t too bad and b) they had the resources to replace either with another or several other top class players.

 

The day we lose Vardy we probably drop 4 or 5 places in the league table.

[GingerrrFox]

3 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

Didn't he put 3 on a plate for his teammates against Sheff Utd the other week?

Yeah and all the pundits were making a huge deal out of it because it is completely un-Vardy like. Funnily enough it’s also the first time since the restart in March that we put in a quality performance and came away with a much needed result, you’ve just agreed with my point of view in this post.
 

Can he replicate that performance and play in that style regularly moving forwards? If so then that is the Vardy we need next season. 

Edited 26 July 2020 by GingerrrFox

[The Horse's Mouth]

we dont have the players, you need to have integrated them first 

[ALC Fox]

We do need a plan B, that's for sure. Brendan's right, we need more creativity in the final third.

 

It would also help if we could actually hit the target. Not only that but the opportunities to exploit Man Utd's weaknesses were there.

 

De Gea was in horrendous form but we never tested him. The shots didn't need to fly into the top corner, they just needed to be on target. He has mistakes in him but never put him under pressure.

 

Maguire too. Vardy may look like his acceleration has dropped somewhat but he's still Usain Bolt compared to Harry Maguire, yet he was never targeted.

 

I know it's easier said than done but they were the two glaring weaknesses in Man Utd's team and we didn't lay a glove on them.

 

(Just to clarify. It's not Vardy's time yet  but we do need genuine alternatives to break teams down.)

[inckley fox]

1 minute ago, GingerrrFox said:

This is probably going to be a divisive opinion and maybe not many people will agree with me. However I think it’s the way forward for Leicester City. 
 

If you read Sir Alex Ferguson’s autobiography when he discusses moving away from Ruud Van Nistelrooy and evolving his Manchester United team, he spoke about how he felt football had moved away from having a 20+ goal a season striker who has to be fed chances in the box and cannot create for others.
 

If you look at the trios of Tevez/Rooney/Ronaldo, Firmino/Mane/Salah or Bergkamp/Henry/Pires which have been successful, it’s because they are a whole unit, they are interchangeable and they create for each other as well as being able to put the ball in the back of the net. 
 

Look at Rashford/Martial/Greenwood today as an example of a trio that are being primed for the future, they are going to be a unit that if they stay together will make United title winners again in the not too distant future.

 

Earlier in the season there was an article in the Athletic that said our expected goals was only 14.27 but our actual goals tally was 27 at the time. It was predicted that it would be unsustainable and we would see a drop off. This has proved to be the case with our 15th position in the form table for the last 12 rounds of matches. Our team right now is built around providing chances for Jamie Vardy and this puts pressure on both the team to feed Vardy and for Vardy to regularly convert those chances at high percentages. It is not a sustainable game plan because it relies on one man being at the top of their game consistently and is too one dimensional and predictable for the opposition. 
 

So the potential unpopular opinion from me is that I think it is time to start the process of moving on from Jamie Vardy and bring in a striker who is not just a goal scorer. We will never be able to sign a star such as Mbappe or Haaland, however buying a more complete striker who can contribute to chances being made as well as putting them away is what we need to progress as a football team in my opinion. It’s time to buy a striker who will genuinely push Vardy to be the starter in that position and is in a different mould of striker to Vardy. 

 

No doubt Vardy still has a role in the squad, especially against teams where they will look to make things difficult for us and we can sacrifice a midfielder for an extra striker. Vardy is a legend for Leicester fans and rightly so, this is not meant to take anything away from how good he has been for us or his achievements for the club and I am happy for him that he has won individual recognition with the golden boot award. However for me it is becoming apparent his acceleration is dropping off - a few seasons ago he would have blitzed past Lindelof on the through ball that we saw today in the first half. He also doesn’t seem to be able to repeat high intensity sprints like he used to, which was another key asset to his game as the opposition became tired. For me, it’s time to genuinely bring in a successor to Jamie Vardy’s crown who can compete for his position in the team and either replace him now or in the not too distant future. 

Absolutely. If he can play alongside Vardy for a year or so it will only help his integration into our set-up.

 

The only serious attempt we ever had to sign a Vardy mk.2 was, perhaps, Musa. I'm surprised that four years have passed without us trying again. Perhaps Puel and Rodgers have stated that they don't want us to continue to depend on a rapid on-the-shoulder attacker.

 

The club's post-2016 obsession with becoming a possession-based side because, they imagine, aspiring clubs need to play like Man City rather than like we did back then, has always been a bit of a mystery to me. I'm not sure how much evidence there is that smaller teams aspiring to the top bracket need to play that way. But perhaps the reduced emphasis on pace is connected with this philosophy.

 

[Sampson]

Where are we going to find another consistent 20 goal a season striker?

 

We're Leicester not Man Utd. Lineker was our last 20 goal a season striker in the top flight and it took us 30 years to replace him.

 

You don't just find players like Vardy to evolve the side. He's a once in a lifetime player.

 

We're up there because of Vardy not in spite of him. He's what sets us apart from a side like Everton or West Ham.

 

The only reason we managed to keep Vardy was because he didn't develop until he was much older. 

 

If we got a younger player scoring goals he'd be gone within 12 months.

Edited 26 July 2020 by Sampson

[ozvaldo]

1 minute ago, Freeman's Wharfer said:

Quite easy for Ferguson’s Manchester United to move out a 20 goal a season striker when a) the quality around him wasn’t too bad and b) they had the resources to replace either with another or several other top class players.

 

The day we lose Vardy we probably drop 4 or 5 places in the league table.

God knows where we’d be without Vardy’s goals this season. But we need to plan and be ready to move on from relying solely on him. We can’t keep playing him forever.  We have to evolve. And it’s clear he’s lost that nasty edge. He probably would have had another 3-4 self-made goals this season had he put defences under pressure like he used to. 

He’s an absolute legend. However, this transfer window, in my opinion, is crucial in the success and growth of us for the next 4-5 seasons. 

[jeffschlupp]

The top teams, Liverpool aside, have 20 goal a season strikers but they also have goals from elsewhere. Aguero would have 20+ goals every season if he stayed fit, but they get goals from wide areas because they have players of the same ability out there.

 

Vardy's problem is that he is our only world class player across the front line. So you stick Lindelof on him and you nullify his game, and therefore you turn our attack into a mid table one at best. When we were at our best, we had Perez and Barnes on top form causing problems and dragging players out of position for Vardy, and then either they'd score themselves or they'd play through Vardy for him to score.

 

It was the same when Riyad was here, it's very difficult to mark multiple world class players out of games.

 

If you get a player like Zaha, you have two players with genuine goalscoring/creative potential and running power. That's a nightmare to defend against, even worse when you add in Barnes and two overlapping full-backs.

 

A wide player is an absolute must in this window. We have replaced Mahrez to an extent 'in aggregate', to borrow a phrase from Moneyball, by bringing in Maddison/Tielemans and changing the system to a more midfield dominant one. But you can't escape the fact you need a more threatening option on the flank than Perez in general play.

[TeamRocket]

I understand what your saying but dude let the guy have his moment golden boot winner. I dunno which lcfc player has won in my time as a lcfc fan. 

[don_danbury]

i'd be very surprised if a front 3 of rashford, martial and greenwood win a prem. especially under ole.

[FOXSE]

This could make sense if Vardy had 0 or 1 assists..... But he had 5. This makes Him one of the more productive strikers in terms of assists. And he scored more than everyone else. Sterling had 1 assist this season. Staggering.

 

Mane, 7. Rashford 7, martial 6. So in the general area for Vardy.

[Facecloth]

He has a decent assist record tbf, its about getting the right players in and around him as much as anything, who'll get in there and take chances. But I do agree the way we play we relys on him too much, and there is a risk of becoming a palace/zaha like situation. 

 

We need to improve our creativity, we need better wide players, who'll chip in with assists and goals.

[GingerrrFox]

6 minutes ago, ozvaldo said:

He’s an absolute legend. However, this transfer window, in my opinion, is crucial in the success and growth of us for the next 4-5 seasons. 

This point is crucial.

 

We cannot wait until Jamie Vardy is on the downturn before we look to find his replacement because it creates un-necessary pressure and reduces the chances of success because that player is expected to hit the ground running. 
 

The striker to take this club forward has to be a different style of player to Jamie Vardy for me. Looking for Jamie Vardy Mk 2 is near impossible because as someone said above he is a near once in a lifetime player. We need to evolve rather than trying to find a poor mans replacement. 

Edited 26 July 2020 by GingerrrFox

[shailen]

I actually agree we need to start planning for life without Vardy but he's still miles ahead of anyone else in the squad and at this current moment in time we won't be able to get anyone better. Nacho will be a good replacement when Vardy becomes ineffective but it will be hard to find another striker who will have to play second fiddle to Vardy and Nacho next season and be of the quality to reach similarish levels. 

[Guest]

It does seem like a faintly ludicrous thing to say, especially on the day he's won the golden boot and his first player of the year award. Nonetheless, I don't think you're wrong necessarily and it's something that, sooner or later, we're going to have to seriously think about. There needs to be some sort of transition/handover period because otherwise we're going to be in a position where we're scrambling for a replacement and we'll inevitably bollocks it up.

 

If we are going to continue in a possession style - which I think we almost certainly are, whether it's Rodgers overseeing it or someone else - I think we are going to need forwards who can interchange and participate more actively in the build up. When we were battering everyone and he was scoring every week, Rodgers and a lot of others were very keen to point to his non-involvement in build up as something we'd implemented by design to conserve his energy and make the most of his predatory instincts, but when we go months without him getting so much of a sniff at goal it starts to look much more like a bug than a feature.

 

His touch and link play are certainly better now than when he joined but they're still not what you'd call strengths of his. It's easy to be critical of our wingers and creative midfielders for not giving him anything to work with but there's sometimes nothing on for them except the inch-perfect slide rule pass in behind. There were people arguing in another thread about who was better between him and Jimenez - while I think Vardy is almost certainly the better striker, I think we as a team would probably look more fluid and more cohesive in an attacking sense with Jimenez. Maybe with someone like that, more of an all-rounder, we'd get more from the wingers and creators in the team. Maybe not and I'm talking shit, who knows?

 

I'm also far from convinced he's going to be able to carry on at this level for too much longer at all. I don't buy the idea that he's got more left in the tank because he's spent less time as a professional than your average forward - what, so his body has been better served by years working in a factory and smashing vodka every weekend than it would have been by working with top fitness professionals as an athlete? 

[Royston.]

Brendan knows this.

We have perez, barnes and iheanacho.

It was so good we didnt have to bother the second half of the season and still got europe

 

[Sampson]

Think we just need better attacking players around him tbf. If Barnes could finish he could have got 15+ league goals this season.

 

The bigger issue right now is we've still never replaced Mahrez.

Edited 26 July 2020 by Sampson

[Bats8711]

Didn’t read replies but entire premise is flawed because Vardy most certainly can and does create opportunities

[splinterdream]

Vardy is immense and golden boot and he shod have scored lots more, its the rest of the side that's letting us down. Goals have to come from Maddison, Perez, Barnes, Tielemens, Gray, and they have to a certain extent.  We have had a dry second half of the season which may be for numerous reasons, I don't think any of us can work out why. 

[SouthStandUpperTier]

Just now, Sampson said:

Think we just need better attacking players around him tbf. If Barnes could finish could have got 15+ league goals this season.

 

The bigger issue right now is we've still never replaced Mahrez.

Someone on the coaching staff needs to tell Harvey to aim for the goalkeeper. Then he might start tucking them away in the corner.

[Tielemans63]

Improving the quality of the players playing in support of him should be the top priority. Imagine how many he might have scored with better wingers either side of him or with a more consistent strike partner?

 

I get the point that we need to start succession planning though, most definitely.

Edited 26 July 2020 by Paddy.

[Arriba Los Zorros]

27 minutes ago, GingerrrFox said:

This is probably going to be a divisive opinion and maybe not many people will agree with me. However I think it’s the way forward for Leicester City. 
 

If you read Sir Alex Ferguson’s autobiography when he discusses moving away from Ruud Van Nistelrooy and evolving his Manchester United team, he spoke about how he felt football had moved away from having a 20+ goal a season striker who has to be fed chances in the box and cannot create for others.
 

If you look at the trios of Tevez/Rooney/Ronaldo, Firmino/Mane/Salah or Bergkamp/Henry/Pires which have been successful, it’s because they are a whole unit, they are interchangeable and they create for each other as well as being able to put the ball in the back of the net. 
 

Look at Rashford/Martial/Greenwood today as an example of a trio that are being primed for the future, they are going to be a unit that if they stay together will make United title winners again in the not too distant future.

 

Earlier in the season there was an article in the Athletic that said our expected goals was only 14.27 but our actual goals tally was 27 at the time. It was predicted that it would be unsustainable and we would see a drop off. This has proved to be the case with our 15th position in the form table for the last 12 rounds of matches. Our team right now is built around providing chances for Jamie Vardy and this puts pressure on both the team to feed Vardy and for Vardy to regularly convert those chances at high percentages. It is not a sustainable game plan because it relies on one man being at the top of their game consistently and is too one dimensional and predictable for the opposition. 
 

So the potential unpopular opinion from me is that I think it is time to start the process of moving on from Jamie Vardy and bring in a striker who is not just a goal scorer. We will never be able to sign a star such as Mbappe or Haaland, however buying a more complete striker who can contribute to chances being made as well as putting them away is what we need to progress as a football team in my opinion. It’s time to buy a striker who will genuinely push Vardy to be the starter in that position and is in a different mould of striker to Vardy. 

 

No doubt Vardy still has a role in the squad, especially against teams where they will look to make things difficult for us and we can sacrifice a midfielder for an extra striker. Vardy is a legend for Leicester fans and rightly so, this is not meant to take anything away from how good he has been for us or his achievements for the club and I am happy for him that he has won individual recognition with the golden boot award. However for me it is becoming apparent his acceleration is dropping off - a few seasons ago he would have blitzed past Lindelof on the through ball that we saw today in the first half. He also doesn’t seem to be able to repeat high intensity sprints like he used to, which was another key asset to his game as the opposition became tired. For me, it’s time to genuinely bring in a successor to Jamie Vardy’s crown who can compete for his position in the team and either replace him now or in the not too distant future. 

Hate to say this, but I agree. Good example with van nistelrooy

 

Vardy is too too limited. It holds us back. Like it or not.

[dooflip]

I agree with the sentiment of your post, kind of. But I’m a bit baffled because you seem to have contradicted yourself/answered your own question if you like.

 

you talk about an attacking unit. Such unit consists of multiple players. Look at our attacking unit and tell me where the weak links are. The answer is everywhere apart from vardy. He’s the only strong bit. 5 assists this season, he’s not greedy, he’s a team player. So suggesting he is purely a striker who just plays on the shoulder and puts chances away is a bit wide of the mark. Brendan has changed his game big time. He drops a lot deeper now, have you not been watching him? He doesn’t just sit on the shoulder. Is the vardy we have seen the vardy we are used to? No not really. Is his altered game under Rodgers a good thing? Tbh I prefer the old vardy, but im surprised you don’t as you’ve talked about wanting a forward who plays in others and works deeper. So I’m just a bit confused by your post to be honest.

 

when brendan came in he talked about needing wide strikers, the one he brought in hasn’t set the world alight and I think would be better as a 10. So wide strikers is what we need.

 

aside from my above ramblings, yes we absolutely need to prepare for the future. But vardy is one of, if not the best player our club has ever had and he is still more than good enough to lead the line, he just can’t do it on his own, don’t forget he hasn’t had riyad to help for some time.