Maddison

[HighPeakFox]

1 minute ago, Kevin Russell said:

I get the feeling you are running rings around me psychologically - so I’ll concede you are right and move on!

No mate, not at all  Just crossed wires. I agree with you that people are hypocritical about loyalty - maybe that's clearer.

[KFS]

Just now, HighPeakFox said:

Would it have been more acceptable to you if he'd said 'you cannot win 'em all'?

I get the concept that we’ll go on winless runs, but I’d have preferred if he and others acknowledged the manner of our last two defeats honestly, yes.

[Kevin Russell]

1 minute ago, TrentFox said:

In a team that’s crying out for a sprinkle of magic, are people seriously having a go at Madders on the back of creating 2 points out of thin air yesterday? Wow.  

I completely agree with this. Look at Arsenal....creative players are the hardest to find and the easiest to lose patience with. I recall how quickly the great football brains on here turned against Mahrez when his form dipped. It was painfully obvious that Mahrez was/is a superb player and it is similar with Madders (although admittedly he is not at Mahrez’s level).

[HighPeakFox]

Just now, KFS said:

I get the concept that we’ll go on winless runs, but I’d have preferred if he and others acknowledged the manner of our last two defeats honestly, yes.

I think he did, really, and Vardy certainly did. I'd much prefer this mature attitude than foot-stamping - after all, that's what naffs me off about the odd poster here.

[Kevin Russell]

1 minute ago, HighPeakFox said:

No mate, not at all  Just crossed wires. I agree with you that people are hypocritical about loyalty - maybe that's clearer.

Ha ha - message received!

[KFS]

1 minute ago, HighPeakFox said:

I think he did, really, and Vardy certainly did. I'd much prefer this mature attitude than foot-stamping - after all, that's what naffs me off about the odd poster here.

Vardy did yep. All I’m saying is we get quite a few interviews from James about wanting to be at the top. I’ll go as far as saying he’s got similar technical ability to Beckham when he’s on it. But he’s one of a few of our team who contribute to our soft underbelly at times. I’d like to see him being a bit more aggressive in play and attitude.

 

That’s what takes him to the next level IMO.

[AKCJ]

14 hours ago, Aus Fox said:

People  complain about his lack of numbers, but even in a poor period of form for him he is still creating the chances. We’ve just not been putting them away.

The most mental thing about this is we're 1st in the league for shot conversion rate.

 

The link up between he and Vardy is so rare. I think that could well be the first Vardy goal Maddison has assisted since last season's game at Bramall Lane.

 

Saw he's second in the league for chances created since his debut. I can only imagine he's behind someone like De Bruyne.

[foxinsocks]

4 minutes ago, KFS said:

Vardy did yep. All I’m saying is we get quite a few interviews from James about wanting to be at the top. I’ll go as far as saying he’s got similar technical ability to Beckham when he’s on it. But he’s one of a few of our team who contribute to our soft underbelly at times. I’d like to see him being a bit more aggressive in play and attitude.

 

That’s what takes him to the next level IMO.

It's about work rate and he needs to keep the ball moving rather than garnering free kicks. One bit of magic every 5 games is not enough

[StriderHiryu]

2 minutes ago, AKCJ said:

The most mental thing about this is we're 1st in the league for shot conversion rate.

 

The link up between he and Vardy is so rare. I think that could well be the first Vardy goal Maddison has assisted since last season's game at Bramall Lane.

 

Saw he's second in the league for chances created since his debut. I can only imagine he's behind someone like De Bruyne.

That speaks to our profligacy in front of goal from players other than Vardy. I have to say that many fans from other clubs rate Maddison very highly. I have a Chelsea supporting friend and he always says the same thing to me; when Chelsea play Leicester if Leicester finished half the chances Maddison makes for the team during any of the games, they would have won every game we played against them last season.

 

Maddison does blow hot and cold but without doubt he is one of our match winners. Yesterday proved it, he could not have complained if he was hooked instead of Perez, but when it mattered most, he picked a fantastic pass that won us the game. That's what top class players do, they make the difference.

 

It should also be noted that in playing that pass yesterday, it was a combination of him and Ndidi winning the ball back together. I can't actually remember the last time we had Maddison and Ndidi start a game together because Maddison got injured at the end of last season, and Ndidi at the start of this. And Maddison plays a lot better when Ndidi is in the team as he has someone that can protect him and let him be even more dangerous when drifting between the lines. 

[ealingfox]

I'd hate to sound entitled but the main set-piece taker and #10 at a top-half club should be aiming for more than 1 league assist in an entire year imo.

Edited 7 December 2020 by ealingfox

[Guest Fktf]

6 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

That speaks to our profligacy in front of goal from players other than Vardy. I have to say that many fans from other clubs rate Maddison very highly. I have a Chelsea supporting friend and he always says the same thing to me; when Chelsea play Leicester if Leicester finished half the chances Maddison makes for the team during any of the games, they would have won every game we played against them last season.

 

Maddison does blow hot and cold but without doubt he is one of our match winners. Yesterday proved it, he could not have complained if he was hooked instead of Perez, but when it mattered most, he picked a fantastic pass that won us the game. That's what top class players do, they make the difference.

 

It should also be noted that in playing that pass yesterday, it was a combination of him and Ndidi winning the ball back together. I can't actually remember the last time we had Maddison and Ndidi start a game together because Maddison got injured at the end of last season, and Ndidi at the start of this. And Maddison plays a lot better when Ndidi is in the team as he has someone that can protect him and let him be even more dangerous when drifting between the lines. 

Agree with the sentiment, but wasn't it nacho doing the initial press?

[HighPeakFox]

Just now, ealingfox said:

I'd hate to sound entitled but the main set-piece taker and #10 at a top-shelf club should be aiming for more than 1 league assist in an entire year imo.

You're right - but given he created 46 chances, perhaps some onus is on the finishers.

[ealingfox]

Just now, HighPeakFox said:

You're right - but given he created 46 chances, perhaps some onus is on the finishers.

 

Not unless you're also aware of the average quality of those chances, which is why 'chances created' is a nonsense stat tbh.

[HighPeakFox]

2 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

Not unless you're also aware of the average quality of those chances, which is why 'chances created' is a nonsense stat tbh.

Please enlighten me, in that case.

[Kevin Russell]

2 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

Not unless you're also aware of the average quality of those chances, which is why 'chances created' is a nonsense stat tbh.

If you watched the Braga and Sheff Utd games and look at his assists since he’s been here - are you arguing that Maddison is not a creative player? If so, I am afraid I have to completely and utterly disagree.

[HighPeakFox]

1 minute ago, Kevin Russell said:

If you watched the Braga and Sheff Utd games and look at his assists since he’s been here - are you arguing that Maddison is not a creative player? If so, I am afraid I have to completely and utterly disagree.

I think he's arguing that a lot of those chances created are at best against the odds - I don't know better, which is why I've asked for that information.

[StriderHiryu]

13 minutes ago, Fktf said:

Agree with the sentiment, but wasn't it nacho doing the initial press?

Yep you're right, got to give credit where it's due! Well played the Nacho man!

 

 

 

[Ashley]

8 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

Please enlighten me, in that case.

Well we are the Leagues most prolific attacking side from chances created to goals scored so 🤷‍♂️

[ealingfox]

4 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

Please enlighten me, in that case.

 

Just now, HighPeakFox said:

I think he's arguing that a lot of those chances created are at best against the odds - I don't know better, which is why I've asked for that information.

 

I don't know either, I'm simply suggesting that chances created is an unsatisfactory metric for assessing creative output, especially stacked against the cold, hard currency of goals and assists. Therefore I don't really accept 46 chances created as an adequate substitute for more than 1 assist in a year.

 

46 times he'd dribbled past 3 players in the box and pulled it back to a teammate with the goal gaping, or 46 times he'd laid it off to a teammate in the channel 35 yards out who then lashed it 6 foot wide. If they both go down as chances created then it's not telling you much at all.

 

6 minutes ago, Kevin Russell said:

If you watched the Braga and Sheff Utd games and look at his assists since he’s been here - are you arguing that Maddison is not a creative player? If so, I am afraid I have to completely and utterly disagree.

 

I'm not suggesting he isn't a creative player, I'm suggesting he's an underperforming one.

[urban fox]

I think that most people are agreed that he needs to improve his corner taking but as we have very little height in the team perhaps it is a case of trying to drive the ball in rather than floating it across which would be meat and drink for most centre halves against us. (that does not mean i advocate us having a lump upfront by the way!) hence not clearing the first man?

As someone, who in their playing days couldn't take a decent corner to save his life, i do not have the answer but it would be nice occasionally to see someone else take a few, just to mix it up a bit and add some variation. We have some excellent dead ball players such as Albrighton, Fuchs and Under which i feel would be better placed sometimes. There was one free kick recently that was perfect for a left footer and i thought Fuchs would have had a pop (and was lining it up) but madders took over and floated it in instead which was easily cleared. Yes he has scored some great free kicks when he is on it but he has to realise that sometimes someone else would be better placed, especially from the left hand side.

We never seem to try a low corner to someone lurking on the edge of the box for example and are too predictable when you rely on the same person taking everything. Just my opinion.

[HighPeakFox]

6 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

I don't know either, I'm simply suggesting that chances created is an unsatisfactory metric for assessing creative output, especially stacked against the cold, hard currency of goals and assists. Therefore I don't really accept 46 chances created as an adequate substitute for more than 1 assist in a year.

 

46 times he'd dribbled past 3 players in the box and pulled it back to a teammate with the goal gaping, or 46 times he'd laid it off to a teammate in the channel 35 yards out who then lashed it 6 foot wide. If they both go down as chances created then it's not telling you much at all.

That's fine - therefore, we need @StriderHiryu to analyse said chances created and enlighten us both

 

I would only add that we do miss some gilt-edged chances at time, but I doubt we're alone in that.

[coolhandfox]

I rather have a poor Maddison then not at all, we look a better side with him in it, then when he's missing.

 

Whilst I think Jack Grealish is playing better at them moment, Maddison stats still stack up

 

JM APPS 77  GOALS 14, ASSISTS 11

JG APPS 79  GOALS 14 ASSISTS 11

 

Edited 7 December 2020 by coolhandfox

[Kevin Russell]

50 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

 

I don't know either, I'm simply suggesting that chances created is an unsatisfactory metric for assessing creative output, especially stacked against the cold, hard currency of goals and assists. Therefore I don't really accept 46 chances created as an adequate substitute for more than 1 assist in a year.

 

46 times he'd dribbled past 3 players in the box and pulled it back to a teammate with the goal gaping, or 46 times he'd laid it off to a teammate in the channel 35 yards out who then lashed it 6 foot wide. If they both go down as chances created then it's not telling you much at all.

 

 

I'm not suggesting he isn't a creative player, I'm suggesting he's an underperforming one.

So a great player in a spell of poor form. One that we are lucky to have. We are in agreement!

[Jimbo]

Trying to think how to put this without it seeming I'm having too much of a dig at Maddison. He's a very creative player, very technically gifted and a bright spark in our team but.....

 

Yesterday he frustrated the hell out of me. And its something I've noticed more and more of him. He likes to dictate the play going forward, nothing wrong with that but he massively slowed everything down yesterday. There were a number of times when a little "give and go" was on with Tielemans but he kept hold of the ball and turned away, for example. He likes to keep hold of the ball for far too long sometimes. Sometimes it works, more often than not, the attack breaks down. 

 

When teams come at us, or stupidly leave space in behind like yesterday, he's massively affective at playing those sorts of passes to Vardy. When they don't, and for large parts of the game yesterday Sheffield United were very compact, the pace and flow of the game needs to increased. He receives the ball and slows it down, gives teams time to get back in formation and forms their lines. 

 

I love Maddison, apart from his corners, but I do wish he'd increase his intensity and up the tempo of the game sometimes. When he's not playing and Teilemans assumes the role of playmaker, our tempo is upped as he tries the killer ball far quicker than Maddison does. 

 

Great player, and rightly selfish at times, just want to see more urgency in his game sometimes, rather than trying to pick the lock, so to speak, just batter the door down

[Crocyfox79]

Just a shame his distribution from set pieces let’s him down in the last few matches but his pass to set the winner up yesterday was first class just hope he can get back into form for the euros next year