Rodgers

[Babylon]

2 hours ago, ealingfox said:

 

Have you got any examples of these wildest expectations? A poster saying we should be top of the table perhaps? Or someone saying we should be winning the league again?

 

All I can see is people being pissed off at losing to both Villa and West Ham at home and taking 26 points from 22 games. The last 2 results would have been disappointing even in 14/15, so why is it entitlement and unrealistic to be disappointed now

 

It comes in many forms, from unrealistic expectations of owner or club spending. Overestimating the squads ability.  Thinking regular top 4 finishes is actually a possibility for a club like Leicester, I'd even go as far as saying regular top 6 finishes is expecting too much. The club have said challenge the top 6, that doesn't mean they expect to be in it, so neither should our fans.

 

So, if the aim is to challenge the top 6, that more often than not also means regular finishes 7th, 8th, 9th as well. So even contemplating sacking a manger who just finished 5th is ludicrous. Plus, if you are going to finish 7th downwards regularly, you're going to lose games to teams like West Ham and Villa. So not going over the top about a few losses. That doesn't mean don't aim for the top, you should start every season aiming to win the league, but you have to be realistic as well when things don't go that way. 

[Chocolate Teapot]

8 minutes ago, Babylon said:

It comes in many forms, from unrealistic expectations of owner or club spending. Overestimating the squads ability.  Thinking regular top 4 finishes is actually a possibility for a club like Leicester, I'd even go as far as saying regular top 6 finishes is expecting too much. The club have said challenge the top 6, that doesn't mean they expect to be in it, so neither should our fans.

 

So, if the aim is to challenge the top 6, that more often than not also means regular finishes 7th, 8th, 9th as well. So even contemplating sacking a manger who just finished 5th is ludicrous. Plus, if you are going to finish 7th downwards regularly, you're going to lose games to teams like West Ham and Villa. So not going over the top about a few losses. That doesn't mean don't aim for the top, you should start every season aiming to win the league, but you have to be realistic as well when things don't go that way. 

The more you think about it the more the idea of breaking the top 6 is actually mental. Spurs and arsenal make double what we make. They can speculate on players and squad depth way more than we can so if something goes marginally wrong (like injuries) we'll feel it far more than any of them will.

 

Rodgers getting his salary though will inevitably bring pressure for him. He's paid as if he were a top 5 manager in the world so its fair that he faces scrutiny. Some of the expectations on here though are mental.

[ealingfox]

15 minutes ago, Babylon said:

It comes in many forms, from unrealistic expectations of owner or club spending. Overestimating the squads ability.  Thinking regular top 4 finishes is actually a possibility for a club like Leicester, I'd even go as far as saying regular top 6 finishes is expecting too much. The club have said challenge the top 6, that doesn't mean they expect to be in it, so neither should our fans.

 

So, if the aim is to challenge the top 6, that more often than not also means regular finishes 7th, 8th, 9th as well. So even contemplating sacking a manger who just finished 5th is ludicrous. Plus, if you are going to finish 7th downwards regularly, you're going to lose games to teams like West Ham and Villa. So not going over the top about a few losses. That doesn't mean don't aim for the top, you should start every season aiming to win the league, but you have to be realistic as well when things don't go that way. 

 

What I'm asking for is examples of people suggesting finishing in the top 4 is a possibility for us.

[winteriscoming]

I do find it worrying that he is out thought tactically by managers with less experience than him. I admit he got it spot on against pep. Potter, Lampard, Moyes (granted he is prob more experienced) all got it tactically right against him. Even smith at villa. How can you go from beating a side 8-1 on aggregate last season to losing against them. Yes I admit we miss vardy but it’s worrying how we are going. 

[Babylon]

39 minutes ago, Abrasive fox said:

The more you think about it the more the idea of breaking the top 6 is actually mental. Spurs and arsenal make double what we make. They can speculate on players and squad depth way more than we can so if something goes marginally wrong (like injuries) we'll feel it far more than any of them will.

 

Rodgers getting his salary though will inevitably bring pressure for him. He's paid as if he were a top 5 manager in the world so its fair that he faces scrutiny. Some of the expectations on here though are mental.

What we’ve done already is huge, I don’t think people appreciate sometimes how well we’ve done to break top 5 twice, let alone winning it. It doesn’t happen very often any more.

[foxpleasure]

1 hour ago, jeffschlupp said:

While I agree Rodgers needs some time and patience, we should not keep looking back to what happened last season and say he's untouchable. That logic would've got us relegated in 2016-17, and far too many of our own fans were apparently happy to watch Ranieri piss the previous 10 years of progress up the wall and straight back into the Championship.

Who's saying he's untouchable? We finished 5th last year and we are currently 4th even with the horrendous injury problems that we are working through. Come on.

[foxpleasure]

1 hour ago, ealingfox said:

 

What I'm asking for is examples of people suggesting finishing in the top 4 is a possibility for us.

Chris Sutton?

[Leicester_Loyal]

I think he'll still be here, he'll cost too much to get rid of and we'll end up mid table and getting to the last 16 or 8 in the EL.

 

I think it's a combination of things at the minute:

 

• Our injuries are killing us
• A lot of our players are internationals now, so there's hardly any rest time inbetween our own games
• More games in general this season, with the Europa League, plus it's a shorter season
• Our finances have took a hit due to COVID, without this we might have been able to sign one or two more players
• Rodgers isn't as good as we'd like him to be, he still has his flaws, mostly tactics in certain games and then some weird subs
• This squad isn't as good as we think it is, I think a lot of us think certain players are world class when they're good but not that level yet (Maddison, Cags etc.)

[DMU Fox]

2 hours ago, Babylon said:

It comes in many forms, from unrealistic expectations of owner or club spending. Overestimating the squads ability.  Thinking regular top 4 finishes is actually a possibility for a club like Leicester, I'd even go as far as saying regular top 6 finishes is expecting too much. The club have said challenge the top 6, that doesn't mean they expect to be in it, so neither should our fans.

 

So, if the aim is to challenge the top 6, that more often than not also means regular finishes 7th, 8th, 9th as well. So even contemplating sacking a manger who just finished 5th is ludicrous. Plus, if you are going to finish 7th downwards regularly, you're going to lose games to teams like West Ham and Villa. So not going over the top about a few losses. That doesn't mean don't aim for the top, you should start every season aiming to win the league, but you have to be realistic as well when things don't go that way. 

I think you've summed up rather neatly where I'm at. I think BR has flaws, but then so do nearly all managers in some shape or form, and realistically we are not going to get much better. Top 10 finishes, competing for the latter stages of the cup competitions and getting into Europe every so often would suit me perfectly. That is very much successful.

 

Not only that, the squad we have has players in there that cover circa 5 or 6 managers. The squad reflects that we move managers on every 18 months which is not very sustainable in the long run. Many of the problems we have in the squad has come from that, which is why we are still have stuck with Slim, Silva until recently amongst others. Sticking if BR if he can deliver the above would suit perfectly, whilst getting the squad into a better position. In any case, any new manager would still have to work with the squad we have got. That doesn't change.

 

Arguably, there may have been some mixed messages from the club potentially or things open to speculation, where some fans do think that being in the top 6 is where we target ourselves. Actually we should probably be clearer to us as fans, and say that we would obviously like to be top 6, but it's not game over if we finish 7th or 8th for example.  

[Nick]

17 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Again... (sigh)

26 points from 22 fixtures in 2020 IS NOT a couple of games....

Here’s the rub, for me. Is he being given time and patience by people like yourself (overlooking the win/loss ratio) simply because he’s Brendan Rogers?

If so, look more closely and then decide 

Get a grip man 😂 
 

Let last season go and move the **** on!

 

We all did after your first couple of seasons of posting on FT and we try not to judge you on your past too much but the crap above really doesn’t help!

 

😆😘😂

[UHDrive]

3 hours ago, Babylon said:

What we’ve done already is huge, I don’t think people appreciate sometimes how well we’ve done to break top 5 twice, let alone winning it. It doesn’t happen very often any more.

Agreed although what does ambition mean if we dont realistically see us breaking into the top 5 next season or the one after. For me this isn't about our history as I'm well versed in ours but my point is that we are an advanced club in both global brand and infrastructure. I dont see us as a mid table team anymore, more like a 7th-4th placed team. 

[Fox92]

Why do people keep banging on about last season? It's last SEASON. We don't play football in years.

 

If we were bottom of the league now with 0 points I would understand.

Edited 20 October 2020 by Fox92

[filbertway]

His most annoying trait for me is that he refuses to acknowledge a system isnt working until st least 65/70 minutes has passed.

 

In fact the only time he seems to switch things up is when were looking comfortable. 

 

I'd love to hear his reasoning.

[Col city fan]

3 hours ago, Nick said:

Get a grip man 😂 
 

Let last season go and move the **** on!

 

We all did after your first couple of seasons of posting on FT and we try not to judge you on your past too much but the crap above really doesn’t help!

 

😆😘😂

Oh shut up Nasty Nick ffs!

😆

[Mr Weller]

Some here are the very definition of entitled, which is progress of a sort but hardly to be admired.

 

In what universe is there a manager who won’t have a bad run? As long as we’re doing well overall (which we are) then it’s ludicrous to talk of sacking managers.

[weller54]

3 hours ago, Nick said:

Get a grip man 😂 
 

Let last season go and move the **** on!

 

We all did after your first couple of seasons of posting on FT and we try not to judge you on your past too much but the crap above really doesn’t help!

 

😆😘😂

Col..

You're fvcking nicked!!..😂

[Col city fan]

Just now, weller54 said:

Col..

You're fvcking nicked!!..😂

And you can go and do one an all!

😆

Nick or Swan Lesta or whoever he fookin is is just trying to unnerve me, knowing as he does that I’m gaining on him in Superbru

Well it won’t wash... 

👍

[Babylon]

2 hours ago, UHDrive said:

Agreed although what does ambition mean if we dont realistically see us breaking into the top 5 next season or the one after. For me this isn't about our history as I'm well versed in ours but my point is that we are an advanced club in both global brand and infrastructure. I dont see us as a mid table team anymore, more like a 7th-4th placed team. 

There is ambition and realism. Everyone should start the season WANTING to win every game and finish top. But you have to also be realistic and know that money more often than not dictates the positions in this league and that currently puts us 8th. Possibly 9th with West Ham spending a lot. 
 

It takes us overperforming compared to budget and a big team underperforming for us to break the top 6, let alone the top 4.

 

 

 

[TRAD-DAD]

Yes we have progressed as a club and often reached beyond our size and dreams, but there has to be a realistic ceiling and I think we have reached it. For me and many old time fans just being at the top table was all we wanted after years of being a yo yo club and thankfully for the time being those bad old days are behind us.  we are now a well established  premiership club because our owners. Be thankful for that. anything else is a bonus. We are going to win more than we lose and have some outstanding games when we are on song this eason. If you take the bigger picture of where we are now and where we could be in the doldrums of the Championship or worse without our owners than you should all be very grateful. 

 

[UHDrive]

1 hour ago, TRAD-DAD said:

Yes we have progressed as a club and often reached beyond our size and dreams, but there has to be a realistic ceiling and I think we have reached it. For me and many old time fans just being at the top table was all we wanted after years of being a yo yo club and thankfully for the time being those bad old days are behind us.  we are now a well established  premiership club because our owners. Be thankful for that. anything else is a bonus. We are going to win more than we lose and have some outstanding games when we are on song this eason. If you take the bigger picture of where we are now and where we could be in the doldrums of the Championship or worse without our owners than you should all be very grateful. 

 

We have reached the ceiling?!? Seriously?! Its fans like you with that attitude that will see us back in league 1 as quick as it took us to come up. 

 

I'm happy that the investment I.e. £100mil+ for the training ground and the rest for the stadium itself is there and progressing. It would be idiotic to suggest that we have reached our ceiling considering we are spending on infrastructure that puts us well inside the top 6 on cutting edge investment and player pulling power. 

 

Nothing stops evolving, except some fans it seems 

[sacreblueits442]

10 hours ago, Babylon said:

It comes in many forms, from unrealistic expectations of owner or club spending. Overestimating the squads ability.  Thinking regular top 4 finishes is actually a possibility for a club like Leicester, I'd even go as far as saying regular top 6 finishes is expecting too much. The club have said challenge the top 6, that doesn't mean they expect to be in it, so neither should our fans.

 

So, if the aim is to challenge the top 6, that more often than not also means regular finishes 7th, 8th, 9th as well. So even contemplating sacking a manger who just finished 5th is ludicrous. Plus, if you are going to finish 7th downwards regularly, you're going to lose games to teams like West Ham and Villa. So not going over the top about a few losses. That doesn't mean don't aim for the top, you should start every season aiming to win the league, but you have to be realistic as well when things don't go that way. 

...I am sure when the chairman said he wanted us to be a top four club, he meant it!!!

You set goals in business and seek to implement them. We surpassed the goal in less time than he had stipulated. Finishing outside the top four should not be seen as failure but when you have one foot in the door it is a bit disheartening when you lose the other shoe.

   We do not know how long this ride and our current profile will last and we need to grab hold of cups and entries in European football for as long as we can, and to cherish them.The club is in the best shape than it has ever been and as fans, we are aspirational in our outlook, and why not! 

 We are going to continue to be a frustrating team to watch, we just haven't got the balance of the team right and that is down to Rodgers, although the injuries do not help.

  Rodgers draws complaints due to his dogmatic approach to the game, no substitution in the first half unless forced to do so, no substitution at half time unless forced to do so and substitution on 60-70 minutes in an attempt to rescue a situation that should have been addressed 20 minutes into the match. These dogmatic ideas are ingrained in him and after 14 years attempting to win by playing the beautiful game, finally deciding to  relinquish possession to gain an advantage is an option he viewed as not playing the game, but if his ideology was wrong in that instance, why shouldn't they be wrong now?

Edited 20 October 2020 by sacreblueits442

[Babylon]

46 minutes ago, sacreblueits442 said:

...I am sure when the chairman said he wanted us to be a top four club, he meant it!!!

You set goals in business and seek to implement them. We surpassed the goal in less time than he had stipulated.

The accounts state our ambitions every single year and they are “to challenge the top six”. People harping back to some bullshit interview in Thailand upon promotion are barking up the wrong tree. 
 

We don’t invest enough money to do that, end of story. 

[sacreblueits442]

1 minute ago, Babylon said:

The accounts state our ambitions every single year and they are “to challenge the top six”. People harping back to some bullshit interview in Thailand upon promotion are barking up the wrong tree. 
 

We don’t invest enough money to do that, end of story. 

...we didn't when we won the league!!!

You can't dismiss a goal and having achieved it then say it has no relevance. We may not be spending in comparison to the big teams but we set our goals and should we fall short then we fall short.

[Babylon]

2 hours ago, UHDrive said:

We have reached the ceiling?!? Seriously?! Its fans like you with that attitude that will see us back in league 1 as quick as it took us to come up. 

 

I'm happy that the investment I.e. £100mil+ for the training ground and the rest for the stadium itself is there and progressing. It would be idiotic to suggest that we have reached our ceiling considering we are spending on infrastructure that puts us well inside the top 6 on cutting edge investment and player pulling power. 

 

Nothing stops evolving, except some fans it seems 

Those infrastructure projects are to cement us in a different bracket of club. But not the top bracket, we are talking taking us up a level so we aren’t seen as of similar size to Southampton, Brighton. And more in the bracket of the likes of Everton, Newcastle. (Which whether you like it or not, are seen as bigger clubs)

 

Promlem is on the pitch we’ve been outperforming those clubs already. So as I say, those projects realistically are about helping us cement our position at this end of the table.

 

But in terms of ceiling, for the foreseeable we have reached it as we are already overperforming.

 

To break through that ceiling and we are talking about becoming a big six club. That is getting harder and harder without outside investment of huge amounts. They are demanding more and more cash based on name and are getting their way. 
 

It’s a nigh on impossible task and I just down think people get it. We need to double our revenue to compete financially with the worst of the six!
 

 

[Babylon]

8 minutes ago, sacreblueits442 said:

...we didn't when we won the league!!!

You can't dismiss a goal and having achieved it then say it has no relevance. We may not be spending in comparison to the big teams but we set our goals and should we fall short then we fall short.

I have no idea what you are talking about.