Tactics Under Maresca

[Gamble92]

Jut realised my warning points are gone. This is a proud day for me and my family. 

[The whole world smiles]

I get a bit disheartened with foxestalk sometimes, It can be far to negative and hysterical for my tastes. but this last page reminds me why I love it so much and spend so much time here. 

 

Great stuff @StriderHiryu

[StriderHiryu]

10 minutes ago, Mickyblueeyes said:

Many good things from the game. 
 

I can’t understand why so many were against Winks. He’s got the technique to do really well at this level. I think he’ll thrive from being the main point of the midfield. A lot of good things game from him. 
 

To be expected, alongside the good was a lot of rust/learning. If ever we needed a pre-season stacked with games against opposition like Northampton, this was it. 

He is way better than I thought he would be. I'm not just judging him by this one game against lower league opposition, but looked back at some of his games for Spurs. He was quite good under Poch, that's how he got into the England team and whilst it was a little different, he was basically the "shuttler" of the ball for them. Under all of the rest of their managers he didn't look good, but they were not playing to is strengths.

 

The way we are using him, I think he would also be pretty good in the Premier League. Like top-half / maybe pushing Conference League european football good.

 

Ricardo is the one that I think deserves special praise. He's one of the best fullbacks we've ever had, from an attacking point of view, the very best. He's playing a brand new position but I thought he was excellent... not that I expected anything else. He's a very intelligent footballer and is a bit of an all-rounder. You might think playing him in that position would take away from his game, but I think there's the possibility that he becomes a spare man not picked up who can drive at the opponent, and that is one of his strengths.

[kingfox]

As great as you are Strider, hopefully no opposition spies come across this thread as the Championship season materialises, otherwise we’re fvcked. 

[Lillehamring]

4 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

Part 2:

 

Use of the Goalkeeper

Playing out from the back isn't something new for us, Puel and Rodgers did this with Leicester for many seasons now. But we never quite used the goalkeeper in the way that Guardiola teams do, and this was evidenced today numerous times.

 

 

^Maresca's style of play in a nutshell, all stemming from playing out from the back and using the goalkeeper:

- Coady receives the ball, keeps his calm and despite having a man harrying him, turns BACKWARDS and plays a short pass to Stoalrcyk.

- Stolarcyk plays a ball forwards short and snappy to take an onrushing player out of the game.

- Winks (who was class by the way), receives and turns and plays a quick ball to Ricardo, where he expects him to be.

- Ricardo plays a quick bounce-pass back to Winks. This sequence takes two more players out of the game, meaning now 3 players have been taken out. 

- Using a few quick diagonal grounded passes via the triangles shown in part one, Castagne plays the ball into Vardy. If he was more alert he may have been able to get a shot away, but regardless he keeps the move alive and crosses to Marcal-Madivadua.

 

Overall this was not the best chance, but the point here is that chance is initially created because of the use of our structure: Coady, Stolarcyk, Ricardo and Winks. We are about to sign a new goalkeeper who is exceptional with his feet and can use either foot. This is going to make a HUGE difference to our attacking play.... despite being a goalkeeper.

 

 

This next passage of play is kind of bonkers. Look at the positions of Stolarcyk and Coady... they are playing like they are the two CBs in a back 4, even though one of the players is our goalkeeper. But why do this?

- Coady is trying to lure the attacker to close him down.

- Stolarcyk provides a passing outlet to pass to if this happens.

 

Now in this instance, the move backfires. Coady goes to play a pass into the two double-pivots, but the sideways pass is played badly, causing a turnover. However, the situation is remedied through good positioning. We will absolutely concede goals through doing this, even Man City do. But the net positive will lead to a lot more chances being created over time. The clever part here is that with the GK playing as a pseudo CB, it allows our RB to form an extra midfielder to pass to.

 

This type of play is often referred to as "back-to-front" play. Brighton at the moment are the best team in England at doing it and although they use a slightly different approach you see here the benefits it can provide.

 

 

 

 

Imagine Ward trying to playing this type of football!

[StriderHiryu]

Part 5:

 

Improvements to Attacking Patterns of Play

 

We only scored one goal today, but I recognised a lot of the attacking patterns of play Man City have deployed over the years on show

 

Inside Channel Runs

 

 

 

 

 

This pattern is the one that has now become so synonymous with Manchester City and Kevin De Bruyne, that you might be bored of seeing it. But what if instead of KDB doing it, it was... Wilfred Ndidi? At the top are two examples of KDB doing it, the bottom two you can see pretty close copies of a Leicester man doing it. Now imagine that instead of Dennis Praet or Wilfred Ndidi doing it, it was Cesare Casadei, the top scorer at the U20 World Cup who scored 7 goals from midfield? That's why we are trying to sign him on loan, and this is the role he will play for us.

 

In Swinging Crosses

 

 

 

Usually when you have inverted wingers / wide forwards, crosses aren't seen too often because when the player gets to the byline they struggle to cross with their weaker foot. But who says they have to cross with their weaker foot? Top are some examples of Man City doing it over the years, at the bottom see Castagne try it after a failed inside channel run. Notice how the way he plays it is very similar, slow, lofted, and going for accuracy rather than power. It's also done in such a way that the attacker can volley it in rather than head it in. After you've spent a lot of the game dragging the opponent this way and that, sometimes the more direct approach works equally well.

 

In this game we used Madivadua and Daka as wide left options and Castagne and Albrighton as wide right options. Improvements to these areas will make a big difference to our game and I'd expect to see new players come into support this style. Interestingly, we've been linked with Joel Piroe who is a great player but IMO would not suit these wider positions. I would be surprised if we didn't sign or loan a winger with great dribbling, electric pace and proven finishing ability by the end of the window. Probably several!

 

Other Patterns

 

I'll hold of posting any more patterns, because Man City have so so many. Maybe over 20 patterns I can think of and probably more. That's why they are so good at breaking down the opposition... yes they have great players, but they are also coached superbly.

 

I am really excited for seeing the team play this season and I think this new era for the club could be very promising indeed. Let's not get carried away too quickly yet, but I've seen a lot of what's good in Man City in our team already, and perfecting a system usually takes months if not years.

 

[PhillippaT]

4 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

Imagine Ward trying to playing this type of football!

How many relegations do we want?

 

Yes.

[StriderHiryu]

53 minutes ago, kingfox said:

As great as you are Strider, hopefully no opposition spies come across this thread as the Championship season materialises, otherwise we’re fvcked. 

To be honest the amount of stuff that has been analaysed about Man City is off the charts, but they haven't been stopped and if anything got stronger. Just because you know what the opposition is going to do doesn't mean you will stop them. For the first time in a long while we start the season with clearly the best team and squad in the entire division, even with all of those players that have left. And we will only get stronger.

 

This type of coaching is perfect for flat-track bullies. And that's what we will be this season.

 

3 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

Imagine Ward trying to playing this type of football!

Well... whilst Ward is one of the worst keepers I have seen play for us, he is not too bad with his feet. I think that's the reason why we signed him... for £12M (!!!). But it's everything else that he is terrible at. That said, it was interesting that he played no part at all today in the game. Stolarcyk also did look a bit rattled at times, but I could see him getting to an acceptable level of play with enough time.

 

The new keeper we are bringing in has a range of passing and dribbling that is incredible. Like it's so good I think he could play Harry Winks position in this system!

[Bluearmyfox28]

9 hours ago, wardyfox86 said:

Casadei, Piroe, Borges could complete this tactic.

Give me Rak-Sakyi as well and I’ll be in dreamland.

[Rhysm]

4 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

He is way better than I thought he would be. I'm not just judging him by this one game against lower league opposition, but looked back at some of his games for Spurs. He was quite good under Poch, that's how he got into the England team and whilst it was a little different, he was basically the "shuttler" of the ball for them. Under all of the rest of their managers he didn't look good, but they were not playing to is strengths.

 

The way we are using him, I think he would also be pretty good in the Premier League. Like top-half / maybe pushing Conference League european football good.

 

Ricardo is the one that I think deserves special praise. He's one of the best fullbacks we've ever had, from an attacking point of view, the very best. He's playing a brand new position but I thought he was excellent... not that I expected anything else. He's a very intelligent footballer and is a bit of an all-rounder. You might think playing him in that position would take away from his game, but I think there's the possibility that he becomes a spare man not picked up who can drive at the opponent, and that is one of his strengths.

I hope we aren't overly reliant on Ricardo. Great player as he is, appearances likely to be intermittent with injury 

[fuchsntf]

6 minutes ago, Rhysm said:

I hope we aren't overly reliant on Ricardo. Great player as he is, appearances likely to be intermittent with injury 

There are others who will slot into that role...We won't be dependant on Ricardo..

Plus it can also be done from the left

NOT just the right side..

[ronnup]

5 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

He is way better than I thought he would be. I'm not just judging him by this one game against lower league opposition, but looked back at some of his games for Spurs. He was quite good under Poch, that's how he got into the England team and whilst it was a little different, he was basically the "shuttler" of the ball for them. Under all of the rest of their managers he didn't look good, but they were not playing to is strengths.

 

The way we are using him, I think he would also be pretty good in the Premier League. Like top-half / maybe pushing Conference League european football good.

 

Ricardo is the one that I think deserves special praise. He's one of the best fullbacks we've ever had, from an attacking point of view, the very best. He's playing a brand new position but I thought he was excellent... not that I expected anything else. He's a very intelligent footballer and is a bit of an all-rounder. You might think playing him in that position would take away from his game, but I think there's the possibility that he becomes a spare man not picked up who can drive at the opponent, and that is one of his strengths.

 

I watched him quite closely yesterday,  and was impressed. Knows when to come home, when to turn, a few times played really instictive passes knowing where people would be which it this point isn't easy. He's going to be great in this league, really liked what I saw. 

[Dan LCFC]

13 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

Putting my comments from the match thread here for now. I'll add some pictures / videos, though I suspect some of the Twitter analysts might beat me to it!

 

------------------------------------

 

Going to talk about structure and team shape stuff.

 

- Playing Pep's 433 / 3421 system with an inverted fullback, which is Riccy P.

- Doyle starts at LB but actually plays as a LCB.

- Riccy starts as RB but actually plays a CDM, sometimes he goes forwards even more to make another 8.

- Passing is all about round the corner and quick vertical transitions, something that we did not do under Puel and Rodgers.

- Basic idea is to lure players in and then exploit the half-spaces they leave in behind them.

- In general, passing is short and crisp, but Coady has the licence to go long. He's the only one (and the keeper) that have that option.

- Attacks start with Coady, who is the director from the back.

- Winks is the "bounce pass" option, used to get out of trouble and play people in when half spaces appear. Try to imagine Ndidi do what Winks did in that first half . That's why we signed him.

- We use the inverted fullback to give us one man advantage in midfield, but also setup passing triangles so players always have two options to pass to at any time.

- We play a lot into midfield to compress the game and draw the opposition out of their shape.

- The game plan is about shifting their defensive block to create opportunities where they are outnumbered, out of position, or both.

- When the time is right we go for the diagonal switch via Coady to find a totally unmarked player.

- The keeper steps up a LOT sometimes in parallel to the back 3 to make an extra option. We use him to generate a one-man advantage and play around the opposition press. That's why we need a keeper who first and foremost can play with his feet.

 

All this stuff is already working. It needs refinement and tweaking, but it's there for all to see.

 

What we are lacking is up front. Pep creates underlaps and overlaps to create a lot of cut-back opportunities. We did see some of this, Wanya also had the option to drive in and shoot on one occasion too. This looks a bit crap right now, but hey when Man City do it they have Riyad Mahrez and co, not a player that hasn't played in the first-team and a converted wing-back. 

 

Wingers are what we need to complete the puzzle. Players who are fast, can beat a man via dribbling, work hard off the ball and can finish.

 

This style of play will dominate this division. It will come down to keeping certain players free from injury and / or squad depth, both of which I believe we will have in abundance.

The exact conclusion I came to. I thought we were better than I expected us to be.

[Scotch]

3 hours ago, Rhysm said:

I hope we aren't overly reliant on Ricardo. Great player as he is, appearances likely to be intermittent with injury 

The right side isn't really what I'm worried about. I think if Ricardo isn't fit to play that RB/coming in to the double pivot, JJ would be good in that role. 

 

It's the left side. The LB coming in to make the back 3. Doyle done it yesterday and I think it suited him when we were in possession but not sure about when he had to stay out at LB. I think VK may be decent enough in that role but I don't think it suits Thomas at all. I suspect though that Doyle was brought in for that Specific reason so would guess that him and VK will cover there, leaving Souttar, Faes, Coady and Vestergaard as our out and out CB options. 

[coolhandfox]

Pleasing to read the managers comments’ too often under Rodger last 2 season in charge we only had one or two players in the box.
 

"The idea also is to have players like Dennis [Praet] and Kiernan [Dewsbury-Hall] arrive into the box, but with wingers and strikers and attacking players… four or five players in the box.

"It’s always better when you have more players in the box. Something will happen. I said from the first day, you need people in the box. Otherwise, it becomes difficult with only one or two players. The opponent [will] have four or five defenders."

Edited 16 July 2023 by coolhandfox

[Scotch]

So what are we thinking about how the potential lineup is looking giving the signings and rumours? As far as I can tell its starting to shape up something like...

 

Off the ball....

 

                        Hermansen

Ricardo      Faes          Coady          Doyle 

                            Winks    

               Casedei              KDH

New RW                                         New LW

                        Vardy/Daka

 

On the Ball....

 

                        Hermansen

       Faes            Coady               Doyle

                Ricardo          Winks

New RW     Casedei       KDH     New LW 

                         Vardy/Daka

              

Obviously assuming we get Casedei and Msds and Nacho and Barnes leave. If Nacho stayed, he would be starting ST and Barnes would be LW

Edited 16 July 2023 by Scotch

[Stuntman_Mike]

12 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

Part 2:

 

Use of the Goalkeeper

Playing out from the back isn't something new for us, Puel and Rodgers did this with Leicester for many seasons now. But we never quite used the goalkeeper in the way that Guardiola teams do, and this was evidenced today numerous times.

 

 

^Maresca's style of play in a nutshell, all stemming from playing out from the back and using the goalkeeper:

- Coady receives the ball, keeps his calm and despite having a man harrying him, turns BACKWARDS and plays a short pass to Stoalrcyk.

- Stolarcyk plays a ball forwards short and snappy to take an onrushing player out of the game.

- Winks (who was class by the way), receives and turns and plays a quick ball to Ricardo, where he expects him to be.

- Ricardo plays a quick bounce-pass back to Winks. This sequence takes two more players out of the game, meaning now 3 players have been taken out. 

- Using a few quick diagonal grounded passes via the triangles shown in part one, Castagne plays the ball into Vardy. If he was more alert he may have been able to get a shot away, but regardless he keeps the move alive and crosses to Marcal-Madivadua.

 

Overall this was not the best chance, but the point here is that chance is initially created because of the use of our structure: Coady, Stolarcyk, Ricardo and Winks. We are about to sign a new goalkeeper who is exceptional with his feet and can use either foot. This is going to make a HUGE difference to our attacking play.... despite being a goalkeeper.

 

 

This next passage of play is kind of bonkers. Look at the positions of Stolarcyk and Coady... they are playing like they are the two CBs in a back 4, even though one of the players is our goalkeeper. But why do this?

- Coady is trying to lure the attacker to close him down.

- Stolarcyk provides a passing outlet to pass to if this happens.

 

Now in this instance, the move backfires. Coady goes to play a pass into the two double-pivots, but the sideways pass is played badly, causing a turnover. However, the situation is remedied through good positioning. We will absolutely concede goals through doing this, even Man City do. But the net positive will lead to a lot more chances being created over time. The clever part here is that with the GK playing as a pseudo CB, it allows our RB to form an extra midfielder to pass to.

 

This type of play is often referred to as "back-to-front" play. Brighton at the moment are the best team in England at doing it and although they use a slightly different approach you see here the benefits it can provide.

 

 

 

 

Brilliant work 

 

I love the second clip that was cut off just before Doyle air kicked and the ball went out off his standing foot, I suppose Enzo didn't teach that 

[moore_94]

27 minutes ago, Scotch said:

So what are we thinking about how the potential lineup is looking giving the signings and rumours? As far as I can tell its starting to shape up something like...

 

Off the ball....

 

                        Hermansen

Ricardo      Faes          Coady          Doyle 

                            Winks    

               Casedei              KDH

New RW                                         New LW

                        Vardy/Daka

 

On the Ball....

 

                        Hermansen

       Faes            Coady               Doyle

                Ricardo          Winks

New RW     Casedei       KDH     New LW 

                         Vardy/Daka

              

Obviously assuming we get Casedei and Msds and Nacho and Barnes leave. If Nacho stayed, he would be starting ST and Barnes would be LW

Piroe upfront 

[Scotch]

Just now, moore_94 said:

Piroe upfront 

Hopefully. 

 

Also, I forgot to factor in Braybrooke and Will Alves when fit. The former covering Winks and the latter covering either of the #8's. 

[SafewayFox]

17 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

Putting my comments from the match thread here for now. I'll add some pictures / videos, though I suspect some of the Twitter analysts might beat me to it!

 

------------------------------------

 

Going to talk about structure and team shape stuff.

 

- Playing Pep's 433 / 3421 system with an inverted fullback, which is Riccy P.

- Doyle starts at LB but actually plays as a LCB.

- Riccy starts as RB but actually plays a CDM, sometimes he goes forwards even more to make another 8.

- Passing is all about round the corner and quick vertical transitions, something that we did not do under Puel and Rodgers.

- Basic idea is to lure players in and then exploit the half-spaces they leave in behind them.

- In general, passing is short and crisp, but Coady has the licence to go long. He's the only one (and the keeper) that have that option.

- Attacks start with Coady, who is the director from the back.

- Winks is the "bounce pass" option, used to get out of trouble and play people in when half spaces appear. Try to imagine Ndidi do what Winks did in that first half . That's why we signed him.

- We use the inverted fullback to give us one man advantage in midfield, but also setup passing triangles so players always have two options to pass to at any time.

- We play a lot into midfield to compress the game and draw the opposition out of their shape.

- The game plan is about shifting their defensive block to create opportunities where they are outnumbered, out of position, or both.

- When the time is right we go for the diagonal switch via Coady to find a totally unmarked player.

- The keeper steps up a LOT sometimes in parallel to the back 3 to make an extra option. We use him to generate a one-man advantage and play around the opposition press. That's why we need a keeper who first and foremost can play with his feet.

 

All this stuff is already working. It needs refinement and tweaking, but it's there for all to see.

 

What we are lacking is up front. Pep creates underlaps and overlaps to create a lot of cut-back opportunities. We did see some of this, Wanya also had the option to drive in and shoot on one occasion too. This looks a bit crap right now, but hey when Man City do it they have Riyad Mahrez and co, not a player that hasn't played in the first-team and a converted wing-back. 

 

Wingers are what we need to complete the puzzle. Players who are fast, can beat a man via dribbling, work hard off the ball and can finish.

 

This style of play will dominate this division. It will come down to keeping certain players free from injury and / or squad depth, both of which I believe we will have in abundance.

Loving the post as usual mate.

 

Any ideas on how/what RCB is needed to mitigate the gaping space that is left behind when Ricky pushes further up the pitch? 
 

The chances that we’re going to create for teams (from our mistakes/over playing) with them playing an aimless ball into that channel scares me.

[An Sionnach]

As usual in football , unless you have elite players who can impose themselves , this weeks grand plan ends up in the bin very quickly. The opposition will soon neutralise it . You have to be versatile and keep them guessing.

[Beachyboy]

52 minutes ago, Scotch said:

So what are we thinking about how the potential lineup is looking giving the signings and rumours? As far as I can tell its starting to shape up something like...

 

Off the ball....

 

                        Hermansen

Ricardo      Faes          Coady          Doyle 

                            Winks    

               Casedei              KDH

New RW                                         New LW

                        Vardy/Daka

 

On the Ball....

 

                        Hermansen

       Faes            Coady               Doyle

                Ricardo          Winks

New RW     Casedei       KDH     New LW 

                         Vardy/Daka

              

Obviously assuming we get Casedei and Msds and Nacho and Barnes leave. If Nacho stayed, he would be starting ST and Barnes would be LW

There has to be some room In the starting 11 for JJ, with the lack of wide options he could be tried as a winger in pre season or rotated in/out with one of the CBs/ FBs as they can’t play every game.

Edited 16 July 2023 by Beachyboy

[Scotch]

3 minutes ago, Beachyboy said:

There has to be some room In the starting 11 for JJ, with the lack of wide options he could be tried as a winger in pre season or rotated in/out with one of the CBs/ FBs as they can’t play every game.

I think he'll play plenty. Rotated with Ricardo primarily as neither can stay fit for an entire season and he could step into that CM slot like Enzo wants but also rotated at LB ( along with VK) too as he can pull into the LCB slot much better than Thomas would be able to. 

[Lillehamring]

9 hours ago, StriderHiryu said:

To be honest the amount of stuff that has been analaysed about Man City is off the charts, but they haven't been stopped and if anything got stronger. Just because you know what the opposition is going to do doesn't mean you will stop them. For the first time in a long while we start the season with clearly the best team and squad in the entire division, even with all of those players that have left. And we will only get stronger.

 

This type of coaching is perfect for flat-track bullies. And that's what we will be this season.

 

Well... whilst Ward is one of the worst keepers I have seen play for us, he is not too bad with his feet. I think that's the reason why we signed him... for £12M (!!!). But it's everything else that he is terrible at. That said, it was interesting that he played no part at all today in the game. Stolarcyk also did look a bit rattled at times, but I could see him getting to an acceptable level of play with enough time.

 

The new keeper we are bringing in has a range of passing and dribbling that is incredible. Like it's so good I think he could play Harry Winks position in this system!

Yeah, i was thinking more about his catastrophic positioning - which he couldn't get right from inside the 6 yard box!

[Lillehamring]

10 minutes ago, Beachyboy said:

There has to be some room In the starting 11 for JJ, with the lack of wide options he could be tried as a winger in pre season or rotated in/out with one of the CBs/ FBs as they can’t play every game.

I don't know where - he looked awkward playing the IRB and didn't really push up to support the attack, and he's nowhere near as effective as castagne, praet, ricardo (or even ndidi based on yesterday's game!) going forward - i think he could play the LB/LCB role, but we now have  Doyle, Kristainsen and Thomas who are all much more natural leftsided players.

 

Personally, i'd sell him, given his age and his england call up i'm sure we could push for 15-20M from a mide-level PL team.