Politics Thread (encompassing Brexit) - 21 June 2017 onwards

[urban.spaceman]

?

[The Fox Covert]

4 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

?

Looks more like a remake of 'Allo 'Allo to me. Where's Rene Artois?

[Bellend Sebastian]

9 minutes ago, The Fox Covert said:

Looks more like a remake of 'Allo 'Allo to me. Where's Rene Artois?

If they can recreate Peter Cushing digitally for Rogue One a CGI Gordon Kaye for a new series of Allo Allo is surely an inevitability

[urban.spaceman]

10 minutes ago, The Fox Covert said:

Looks more like a remake of 'Allo 'Allo to me. Where's Rene Artois?

It is literally the cast of 'Allo 'Allo. 

(Gordon Kaye died last December)

[Guest Markyblue]

11 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

?

As well as completely missing what the picture is ,she then dismisses anti semitism because thats not really a problem is it. Unbelievable. 

[Realist Guy In The Room]

On 29/08/2018 at 20:50, Markyblue said:

Hahaha keep convincing yourself of that. Not met one person who voted for brexit who regrets it. In your strange anti democratic world you can moan and moan, convincing yourself that really everyone really wants to stay .wake up,grow up and move on were leaving. 

Pleased to meet you.

I voted leave because I believed what I was told to my face by a sitting MP and his leave campaign team.  Every word of it has turned out to be bullshit.  

Not only that, my business is fvcked, a load of my clients businesses were fvcked so they relocated to the mainland and others will have to follow if the ‘no deal scenario’ plays out and others have already gone under.

I was happy that Leave won because I voted for it and bought into the vision of ‘Brittania rules the waves’ but that was really ignorant of me.  What I failed to see was what was right before my eyes and that was the progression of industry had developed and flourished because of things like the single market and the customs union.  Passporting for financial services is hugely essential for the operation of the Insurance industry and is at real risk.

Businesses have been set up and jobs created on the back of the ease of trade we have.

What’s become clear to me is that what Brexiteers want to achieve is possible.  It absolutely is.  The problem is, we’ll need to reinvent the wheel to do it over the course of probably 20-30 years of hardship and the absolute best result we can hope for is to end up close (not better as that is actually impossible due to the legal nature of existing trade agreements) to what we have now.  Even to achieve that, what we’d need is for most countries in the world to bend over and let us ram them from behind which isn’t going to happen.

The government wanted to look to be strong so triggered Article 50, I get that.  The vote was democratic, I get that too, but what I dont get, is when there isn’t a single thinf left to cling to and when the bloody Prime Minister of our country, quite obviously lies to our faces about what’s to come, how there are still people that say, ‘yeah.  This is exactly what I wanted’.

The last 4 months i’ve been on my fvcking knees and it’s all down to this shit.  Everything I worked for has near enough gone.  My health has deteriorated and quite frankly, there have been times when I could quite easily have swam out to sea and let myself go.

If we continue down the path we’re going, we’re fvcking oursleves for no other reason than pride and ego.  We’ve been fooled by people like Mogg who sound and look convincing but really, they’re nothing more than snakeoil salesman.

All around me I hear conversations full of spite and hatred, friends and families split and divided.  If this is the future it disgusts me.

I wish we could go back to before this was even a spark in David Camerons mind.  I want my country back.

Edited 31 August 2018 by Realist Guy In The Room

[lifted*fox]

The realest talk from anyone in this thread since it started, tbqh. Fair play. 

 

[Guest Markyblue]

1 hour ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

Pleased to meet you.

I voted leave because I believed what I was told to my face by a sitting MP and his leave campaign team.  Every word of it has turned out to be bullshit.  

Not only that, my business is fvcked, a load of my clients businesses were fvcked so they relocated to the mainland and others will have to follow if the ‘no deal scenario’ plays out and others have already gone under.

I was happy that Leave won because I voted for it and bought into the vision of ‘Brittania rules the waves’ but that was really ignorant of me.  What I failed to see butwas what was right before my eyes and that was the progression of industry had developed and flourished because of things like the single market and the customs union.  Passporting for financial services is hugely essential for the operation of the Insurance industry and is at real risk.

Businesses have been set up and jobs created on the back of the ease of trade we have.

What’s become clear to me is that what Brexiteers want to achieve is possible.  It absolutely is.  The problem is, we’ll need to reinvent the wheel to do it over the course of probably 20-30 years of hardship and the absolute best result we can hope for is to end up close (not better as that is actually impossible due to the legal nature of existing trade agreements) to what we have now.  Even to achieve that, what we’d need is for most countries in the world to bend over and let us ram them from behind which isn’t going to happen.

The government wanted to look to be strong so triggered Article 50, I get that.  The vote was democratic, I get that too, but what I dont get, is when there isn’t a single thinf left to cling to and when the bloody Prime Minister of our country, quite obviously lies to our faces about what’s to come, how there are still people that say, ‘yeah.  This is exactly what I wanted’.

The last 4 months i’ve been on my fvcking knees and it’s all down to this shit.  Everything I worked for has near enough gone.  My health has deteriorated and quite frankly, there have been times when I could quite easily have swam out to sea and let myself go.

If we continue down the path we’re going, we’re fvcking oursleves for no other reason than pride and ego.  We’ve been fooled by people like Mogg who sound and look convincing but really, they’re nothing more than snakeoil salesman.

All around me I hear conversations full of spite and hatred, friends and families split and divided.  If this is the future it disgusts me.

I wish we could go back to before this was even a spark in David Camerons mind.  I want my country back.

Sorry things haven't worked out for you. But how is everything you were told been bullshit. First for me the benefits of leaving have been negated by people who wanted to stay doing their upmost to ensure leaving is as difficult as possible. Our negotiations have been hampered by the near treasonous actions of remainers.in short the leave project has never been embraced or given a chance. As for families being split thats life ,if people are more concerned at the price of a loaf of bread than blood ties ,what can you say. Most of the problems are simple, a vote was taken and a large percentage on the losing side couldn't and will not except it. This is my last coment on the subject because frankly I'm sick of it.good luck to you all the best. 

 

[Lionator]

3 minutes ago, Markyblue said:

Sorry things haven't worked out for you. But how is everything you were told been bullshit. First for me the benefits of leaving have been negated by people who wanted to stay doing their upmost to ensure leaving is as difficult as possible. Our negotiations have been hampered by the near treasonous actions of remainers.in short the leave project has never been embraced or given a chance. As for families being split thats life ,if people are more concerned at the price of a loaf of bread than blood ties ,what can you say. Most of the problems are simple, a vote was taken and a large percentage on the losing side couldn't and will not except it. This is my last coment on the subject because frankly I'm sick of it.good luck to you all the best. 

 

They won't accept it because they believe in the EU and the benefits that it's given us. Put down the Daily Mail/Express and try living in the real world. 

Edited 31 August 2018 by Lionator

[Guest Markyblue]

1 minute ago, Lionator said:

They won't accept it because they believe in the EU and the benefits that it's given us. Put down the Daily Mail/Express and try living in the real world. 

And more people believed we were better of outside .so you put down the mirror and try living in the real world. 

[Carl the Llama]

6 minutes ago, Markyblue said:

Sorry things haven't worked out for you. But how is everything you were told been bullshit. First for me the benefits of leaving have been negated by people who wanted to stay doing their upmost to ensure leaving is as difficult as possible. Our negotiations have been hampered by the near treasonous actions of remainers.in short the leave project has never been embraced or given a chance. As for families being split thats life ,if people are more concerned at the price of a loaf of bread than blood ties ,what can you say. Most of the problems are simple, a vote was taken and a large percentage on the losing side couldn't and will not except it. This is my last coment on the subject because frankly I'm sick of it.good luck to you all the best. 

 

I voted remain and I won't stop breathing until I've made sure that every last outcome of the decision to leave severely damages my welfare and that of others.

[Fox Ulike]

15 minutes ago, Markyblue said:

Sorry things haven't worked out for you. But how is everything you were told been bullshit. First for me the benefits of leaving have been negated by people who wanted to stay doing their upmost to ensure leaving is as difficult as possible. Our negotiations have been hampered by the near treasonous actions of remainers.in short the leave project has never been embraced or given a chance. As for families being split thats life ,if people are more concerned at the price of a loaf of bread than blood ties ,what can you say. Most of the problems are simple, a vote was taken and a large percentage on the losing side couldn't and will not except it. This is my last coment on the subject because frankly I'm sick of it.good luck to you all the best. 

 

"The benefits of leaving have been negated".

Your words, mate. Your words. 

[Fox Ulike]

8 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

I voted remain and I won't stop breathing until I've made sure that every last outcome of the decision to leave severely damages my welfare and that of others.

Me neither.

My "near treasonous" activities so far include:

• Asking how UK will access the Single Market post-Brexit
• Questioning the veracity of the "£350m to the NHS" claim
• Tutting when I saw the reduced Euro exchange rate when I went on holiday.

I'm single-handedly negating the benefits of Brexit. 

[Voll Blau]

2 hours ago, Markyblue said:

Sorry things haven't worked out for you. But how is everything you were told been bullshit. First for me the benefits of leaving have been negated by people who wanted to stay doing their upmost to ensure leaving is as difficult as possible. Our negotiations have been hampered by the near treasonous actions of remainers.in short the leave project has never been embraced or given a chance. As for families being split thats life ,if people are more concerned at the price of a loaf of bread than blood ties ,what can you say. Most of the problems are simple, a vote was taken and a large percentage on the losing side couldn't and will not except it. This is my last coment on the subject because frankly I'm sick of it.good luck to you all the best. 

 

Ace. It's Remainers' fault if it doesn't work out, and always will be. Handy that...

[Carl the Llama]

1 hour ago, Fox Ulike said:

Me neither.

My "near treasonous" activities so far include:

• Asking how UK will access the Single Market post-Brexit
• Questioning the veracity of the "£350m to the NHS" claim
• Tutting when I saw the reduced Euro exchange rate when I went on holiday.

I'm single-handedly negating the benefits of Brexit. 

You're a monster.  You're as bad as that politician who went live on air during the vote count to declare that a 52-48 split wouldn't be conclusive enough evidence of the people's will and suggest we should fight against it if that's the outcome.  What was that guy's name?  Oh yeah it was that Nigel Farage guy, he must be the biggest, most undemocratic remoaner of the lot.

[Footballwipe]

It'll never, ever be their fault. Look at the amazing, honest post above by Realist Guy. He apologises for his situation then spouts the same incredible rubbish we see. No stats, no figures, no facts. Just "remianers, treason," like he's swallowed the Mail and Express dictionary.

Even when someone tells him his business is on his knees he doesn't give a shit. It seems for some they're quite happy to trample over those adversely affected by this horror show to get what they want, just to be principled.

Anything negative is "project fear" and, like quoted above, when these predictions come to fruition it'll be the "remainers" fault because we rallied against something going so wrong, so quickly. I'd like to say when the Mogg and Johnson cult wake up we might have hope, but they're so embedded in their idols to care. Follow the elite millionaires as they take you for a mug.

Let's not leave the Corbyn cult out of this. His damage to the opposition means we're sleepwalking to disaster because A) he's pro-brexit and B) he and his cronies love a bit of antisemitism. There's no crying out at what's going on, and the Corbyn cult followers (oh will they please wake up) are blindly following him.

Other then being vehemently opposed to Brexit and my country being hijacked by those desperate to stroke their own ego than do the best thing for the country, I have no political identity at the moment.

We're a political mess. What has happened to this country, to scrutiny, to caring about facts, to challenging politicians and people to get things right and do what's best.

[Sharpe's Fox]

Tony Benn masterclass. Sorry Liberals but the Left wins again.

 

[Fox Ulike]

22 minutes ago, Footballwipe said:

It'll never, ever be their fault. Look at the amazing, honest post above by Realist Guy. He apologises for his situation then spouts the same incredible rubbish we see. No stats, no figures, no facts. Just "remianers, treason," like he's swallowed the Mail and Express dictionary.

Even when someone tells him his business is on his knees he doesn't give a shit. It seems for some they're quite happy to trample over those adversely affected by this horror show to get what they want, just to be principled.

Anything negative is "project fear" and, like quoted above, when these predictions come to fruition it'll be the "remainers" fault because we rallied against something going so wrong, so quickly. I'd like to say when the Mogg and Johnson cult wake up we might have hope, but they're so embedded in their idols to care. Follow the elite millionaires as they take you for a mug.

Let's not leave the Corbyn cult out of this. His damage to the opposition means we're sleepwalking to disaster because A) he's pro-brexit and B) he and his cronies love a bit of antisemitism. There's no crying out at what's going on, and the Corbyn cult followers (oh will they please wake up) are blindly following him.

Other then being vehemently opposed to Brexit and my country being hijacked by those desperate to stroke their own ego than do the best thing for the country, I have no political identity at the moment.

We're a political mess. What has happened to this country, to scrutiny, to caring about facts, to challenging politicians and people to get things right and do what's best.

To be fair to @Markyblue, at least he had the decency to respond.

It's a shame that the posters on here telling us to "Get over it" don't have the balls to face up to someone who has actually been affected by Brexit.

[The Doctor]

22 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

Giant Sadiq Khan bikini-clad balloon to fly over London

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Image copyrightYANNY BRUERE Image captionAn anti-Khan campaign was launched in response to the 'baby Trump' balloon flown last month

"If people want to spend their Saturday looking at me in a yellow bikini they're welcome to do so - I don't think yellow is really my colour though"

Now that's how you respond to this sort of thing. Fantastic own goal by the sort of weird wankstains that moan the left doesn't have a sense of humour.

[Realist Guy In The Room]

2 hours ago, Markyblue said:

Sorry things haven't worked out for you. But how is everything you were told been bullshit. First for me the benefits of leaving have been negated by people who wanted to stay doing their upmost to ensure leaving is as difficult as possible. Our negotiations have been hampered by the near treasonous actions of remainers.in short the leave project has never been embraced or given a chance. As for families being split thats life ,if people are more concerned at the price of a loaf of bread than blood ties ,what can you say. Most of the problems are simple, a vote was taken and a large percentage on the losing side couldn't and will not except it. This is my last coment on the subject because frankly I'm sick of it.good luck to you all the best. 

 

You were kind enough to reply so i’ll pay you the same courtesy.

How was everything I was told bullshit you ask?  Well because what I was told was a lie.

Two examples:-

1 - Regional Growth Fund 

I was told the funding provided by the EU would be continued indefinitely.  The exact words were, ‘its our money anyway so why wouldn’t we?’

Lie.  

2 - The community hospital is staffed by a majority of EU nationals.  Are their futures and residency to be gauranteed immediately?  ‘Of course’. I was told.  We welcome everyone and if Brexit won the vote, all of their rights would be gauranteed immediately.

Lie.  Most of the staff went home (much to the delight of some bloodthirsty leavers in the town) because they were told their status couldn’t be gauranteed.  Now because of this, 2 wings of the hospital are closed and its likely the whole place will be shut down by Easter.

Regards the benefits of leaving, there quite simply aren’t any.  I was a proud leaver so set about after the vote of actually looking in to the EU and its workings in order to prove Project Fear was bollocks but also to justify my position.  I found nothing apart from the opposite.  All the shite Farage and co spouted was a spin.  Just short of absolute fabrication so they could still say it, but the implications they used to dupe people are a disgrace.

On to the leave project not being given a chance.  There was no project.  Which is why everyone distanced themselves (Farage resigning immediately etc).  May is a remainer.  Johnson, Gove, Fox etc all know it and if they truly believed in Leave, they wouldn’t have dropped out of the race for leadership.  They did because they know the truth.  They know that the picture they painted couldn’t be delivered.  There is no EU boogeyman holding us up.  Ask yourself something, why does not a single Leave politican, have an plan.  Why do none of them having spent their entire political lives, wanting this, have a complete chapter and verse solution to things like the Irish Border rather than just saying, ‘well the Good Friday agreement isnt that important’?  It’s bizarre.  When I first started my business, I couldn’t even get a bank account without providing a complete chapter and verse on every single nuance that I may or may not come up against.  This is decades of trade arrangements and development and they’re trying to wing it.

That is a disgrace.

Families being split isn’t life.  It certainly isn’t a price worth paying for what we’re being served.  My aunty and grandmother exposed racist views that were shocking to say the least.  Literally I couldnt believe what I was hearing with some of it and all based on shit they’d been fed about 70m muslim Turks, literally poised at their ports like 100m sprinters waiting for the gun to come here and get a council house.  

The vote was simple.  You’re 100% correct on that.  The problem was it shouldn’t have been and now we know that and can see it.  We can see that politicians are hiding behind the ‘will of the people’ and the hope that pride will conquer reason.  When it falls to shit (and it unfortunately will), they’ll say, ‘the people wanted it so we have to make it work’.  They’ll blame us.  Not each other.  Not the complete lies we’ve all been fed but us.  You, me, your brother, sister, remainer or brexiteer.  We’ll get the blame and we’ll have to live through it if we make it that far.

I’m sorry you’re sick of it.  So am I.  I dont know if i’ll make it as far as to hear it, but I pray to God that some day very soon, i’ll hear you and any other leaver say, ‘I told you so’ because i’ve never wanted to be more wrong about anything.

 

[Kopfkino]

2 hours ago, Markyblue said:

Sorry things haven't worked out for you. But how is everything you were told been bullshit. First for me the benefits of leaving have been negated by people who wanted to stay doing their upmost to ensure leaving is as difficult as possible. Our negotiations have been hampered by the near treasonous actions of remainers.in short the leave project has never been embraced or given a chance. As for families being split thats life ,if people are more concerned at the price of a loaf of bread than blood ties ,what can you say. Most of the problems are simple, a vote was taken and a large percentage on the losing side couldn't and will not except it. This is my last coment on the subject because frankly I'm sick of it.good luck to you all the best. 

 

Look, I didn't vote either way but had I voted I'd probably have voted to leave and ever since the leave vote won I have been supportive of us leaving the EU. But please give me an example of where those that wanted us to remain (the EU itself aside) have had a detrimental impact on the process that has made it any more difficult or could even be described as "treasonous". Even something that is discernible and has actually blocked the path to leaving rather than just threatening to. Let us ignore the infantile comments that respond as if you're accusing individual members of the public as blocking it, and we can certainly ignore prats that are desperate for it to fail so they can do some willy waving (I hope my faith that you didn't mean random Joe Soap remainer as opposed to remainers with influence/as a cohort is not misplaced). So where are these near treasonous acts and where have the benefits been negated by those that want to stay?

I'll tell who the main culprits are for the malaise we currently find ourselves in and who are providing the biggest obstacle to a successful Brexit - it's JRM, Steve Baker, Andrew Brigden and their band of vacuous, vapid disciples. Their pursuit of an ideologically pure, must-have-everything-now version of Brexit that is not grounded in any kind of reality is the single biggest hampering of the government's position. They offer no plan of their own, just rhetoric. Canada+++ they say - yet it's seemingly predicated on mutual recognition which the EU won't do. WTO they say - thinking this is in any way an actual option requires you to only have a superficial understanding of the WTO, any further understanding and you realise it's not an option for one of the world's largest economies. 

Their position relies solely on making democracy tyranny by the majority. Actually (and many remainers could also learn something from this), a 52-48 result requires a lot of compromise to come up with something feasible and actually offers the best route to making Brexit a success. Norway have held two referenda on it's relationship with the rest of Europe and on both occasions delivered a result near identical to 2016 and brought up almost identical arguments and discourse. Norway did not take this to mean their relationship with Europe has to be either non-existent or similar to a relationship you have with a country 2000 miles away across a ****ing big bit of water. No they committed themselves to partnership through the EEA and EFTA and committed to evolving that partnership as time went on. I personally favour that exact approach but I'm not saying it has to be that, but it can be similar in intent. 48% didn't vote for any change, they voted for none of this. Not all of the 52% that voted to leave want exactly the same so it makes absolutely no sense to have any concrete interpretation of that vote. But this is exactly what that group, their disciples in the media, and some leave voters believe. It's plain daft. 

If positions don't mellow, if influential people that have the power to hamstring the government continue on their current path of absolute dissidence to any kind of significant compromise, and if there is no dose of realism injected then the benefits of leaving will actually be negated rather than your false idea that they already have. And the culprits for that will be those who were most vocal about leaving in the first place. 

[Stadt]

I’ve elaborated as to why in the past but I voted leave but massively regret it now. The whole process has been shambolic, even if ideologically anybody voted to leave surely you can admit the Government’s actions haven’t been coherent or competent in anyway? 

I’m still not overly fond of the EU but the positives outweigh the negatives.

[urban.spaceman]

What I don't understand is why there is not more anger directed at David Cameron and more of an appetite to hold him to account. People laughed at Danny Dyer the other week and yet there's not one person taking that idea seriously.

I have quite a unique experience on Brexit as I was out of the country for practically the whole of the campaign. I moved to Cape Town in January 2016, a full month before Cameron announced the referendum. I was sick enough of UK politics then that I purposely avoided the UK news channels and websites, basically any mention of the campaigns I would switch off - the Scottish indyref was bad enough and I wanted to enjoy my life in the sun, while Leicester City were winning the league.

Anyway, after a prolonged trip around Southern Africa, I flew back to the UK on the night of June 22nd. On that day I lamented on social media that I couldn't vote because the government had announced it while I was abroad and I couldn't do postal vote. Back home though my dad had managed to vote for me by proxy with my blessing. The plane landed at Heathrow at 8am, and there was this hilarious wave of dismay going through the plane as people turned on their phones.

I asked my dad what would happen now when he picked me up, and he said "not a ****ing clue. Nobody knows". That's the crux of the problem. The SNP had a plan for independence. They had a timetable and criteria of things to achieve in order to leave the UK. It wasn't a good plan, but at least they ****ing had one. Cameron didn't have a plan for Brexit. When he won the election in 2015 he said he would seek reform of the EU. He never ****ing did. The SNP had a full 3 years to prepare for their referendum, and we spent a full year having the debate on national television. Again, Cameron offered nothing to Scotland in the case of a 'No', until the very last week when one poll in one newspaper suggested they'd vote 'Yes' and then Westminster just ****ing panicked.

Instead, he created a situation where absolutely anyone could 'promise' anything for either side when they were not in a position to offer it, and were completely unaccountable for anything they said. And even worse, Cameron gave us a referendum with only FOUR MONTHS notice. That's no time to have a proper and fair debate, especially when neither side had anything to actually offer. Everyone bangs on about the bus - Boris Johnson and Michael Gove had no power to ensure that happened. Whatever Farage said - he's never been elected to the British parliament. He's never been in a position to carry out on any promise to the public.

And then Cameron ****s off. He created this mess, and he made sure that he wouldn't be there to carry it out. So then Maybot comes in - someone who campaigned for Remain - with the promise of making a success of something she voted against and had not a single shred of a plan to implement. And we've spent the last two years with her just ****ing about and achieving nothing.

----------------------------------------------

What worries me is the further fragmentation of politics since. Labour have crumbled into an absolute joke, the Lib Dems hired an illiberal and undemocratic Christian twat as leader until he couldn't cope with gay sex any longer, and the Tories are infighting over when Boris will displace May as if it's inevitable. And we still don't have a plan as to what's actually going to happen.

I am still quite troubled over the idea of stopping Brexit altogether. I voted Remain but I understand why people voted Leave. Immigration, sovereignty are valid concerns people still have. For the most part though people are just sick of the political class at best refusing to listen, at worst smearing people as racist or stupid. I seem to be the only one who noticed that 4million people voted UKIP in 2015 and ended up with only 1 MP. I'm not a UKIP voter by any stretch but that should have screamed volumes to people that 4 million voters having zero representation in Parliament is an issue to be concerned about. 13 months later and Britain votes leave - how the **** was that a surprise? I have no doubt that one of the biggest reasons a lot of people voted leave was as a big **** YOU to the politicians for ignoring and smearing them. 

Preventing Brexit from happening would send us on a very dark path IMO. The relationship between voters and politicians is bad enough, and overturning the biggest democratic vote in British history would be catastrophic. This "People's Vote" will only make this side of things worse.

--------------------------------------------

TL;DR

Everything's ****ed, David Cameron should be charged with gross negligence & dereliction of duty, and I am desperate to leave this country.

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, urban.spaceman said:

What I don't understand is why there is not more anger directed at David Cameron and more of an appetite to hold him to account. People laughed at Danny Dyer the other week and yet there's not one person taking that idea seriously.

People have been calling for him to be more accountable for his role in this since the morning of the result, Sadly that was the precise moment he decided to fvck off out of politics. Dyer just manage to amplify quite a widely held view in very simple and public terms.

History won't be kind to Cameron, but he's avoided any real scrutiny by getting out of the picture as soon as he could so he can swan off without any real consequence. He's hardly ever going to be hard up whatever happens, is he? What more can an electorate do when someone takes the easy way out?

[Webbo]

3 hours ago, Realist Guy In The Room said:

You were kind enough to reply so i’ll pay you the same courtesy.

How was everything I was told bullshit you ask?  Well because what I was told was a lie.

Two examples:-

1 - Regional Growth Fund 

I was told the funding provided by the EU would be continued indefinitely.  The exact words were, ‘its our money anyway so why wouldn’t we?’

Lie.  

2 - The community hospital is staffed by a majority of EU nationals.  Are their futures and residency to be gauranteed immediately?  ‘Of course’. I was told.  We welcome everyone and if Brexit won the vote, all of their rights would be gauranteed immediately.

Lie.  Most of the staff went home (much to the delight of some bloodthirsty leavers in the town) because they were told their status couldn’t be gauranteed.  Now because of this, 2 wings of the hospital are closed and its likely the whole place will be shut down by Easter.

Regards the benefits of leaving, there quite simply aren’t any.  I was a proud leaver so set about after the vote of actually looking in to the EU and its workings in order to prove Project Fear was bollocks but also to justify my position.  I found nothing apart from the opposite.  All the shite Farage and co spouted was a spin.  Just short of absolute fabrication so they could still say it, but the implications they used to dupe people are a disgrace.

On to the leave project not being given a chance.  There was no project.  Which is why everyone distanced themselves (Farage resigning immediately etc).  May is a remainer.  Johnson, Gove, Fox etc all know it and if they truly believed in Leave, they wouldn’t have dropped out of the race for leadership.  They did because they know the truth.  They know that the picture they painted couldn’t be delivered.  There is no EU boogeyman holding us up.  Ask yourself something, why does not a single Leave politican, have an plan.  Why do none of them having spent their entire political lives, wanting this, have a complete chapter and verse solution to things like the Irish Border rather than just saying, ‘well the Good Friday agreement isnt that important’?  It’s bizarre.  When I first started my business, I couldn’t even get a bank account without providing a complete chapter and verse on every single nuance that I may or may not come up against.  This is decades of trade arrangements and development and they’re trying to wing it.

That is a disgrace.

Families being split isn’t life.  It certainly isn’t a price worth paying for what we’re being served.  My aunty and grandmother exposed racist views that were shocking to say the least.  Literally I couldnt believe what I was hearing with some of it and all based on shit they’d been fed about 70m muslim Turks, literally poised at their ports like 100m sprinters waiting for the gun to come here and get a council house.  

The vote was simple.  You’re 100% correct on that.  The problem was it shouldn’t have been and now we know that and can see it.  We can see that politicians are hiding behind the ‘will of the people’ and the hope that pride will conquer reason.  When it falls to shit (and it unfortunately will), they’ll say, ‘the people wanted it so we have to make it work’.  They’ll blame us.  Not each other.  Not the complete lies we’ve all been fed but us.  You, me, your brother, sister, remainer or brexiteer.  We’ll get the blame and we’ll have to live through it if we make it that far.

I’m sorry you’re sick of it.  So am I.  I dont know if i’ll make it as far as to hear it, but I pray to God that some day very soon, i’ll hear you and any other leaver say, ‘I told you so’ because i’ve never wanted to be more wrong about anything.

 

We haven't left yet, nothing has changed so I don't see how it has ruined your business. Some staff may have left the NHS but there are still more EU citizens entering the country than leaving so I'm sure your hospital isn't staff free. 

 

If people are upset because of the way some other people voted then they need to grow up. I'm not responsible for the mardy arsed attitude of some the remainers on here. If they can't accept they lost it's their problem.