Shooting in Las Vegas

[Jon the Hat]

This is precisely why I will never move to the US.  It is a great country, and I will no doubt visit for work and for holidays, but I could never live there.

[Rincewind]

Sometimes I get annoyed at things gun supporters say.

Criminals will get hold of guns anyway

People kill not guns

There are more knife attacks

 

OK. That is 3 examples. First, criminals usually obtain guns to kill other criminals or carry out robberies. As far as I know no hardened criminal has walked into a school or a public venue randomly killing people'

Second. Yes people kill but you can kill a lot more people in a short time with a semi automatic than a normal hand gun before having to reload.

Third a knife wielding lunatic will be taken down down by the authorities or members of the public withing a few minutes.

I understand that the laws on guns has gone too far to ban them all together but why would a normal law abiding citizen want a semi automatic for everyday use?

Someone was saying last night if they had an amnesty to hand over guns then bing in tough laws for owning them it would be a start. Someone else said he goes shooting every weekend and the safety ules for handling them are very strict. If anyone points a loade gun towards anyone else they are warned right away by the others. He has to apply for a license every year

In the US there are also a high number of accidental gun related deaths. How many of the murders have been spouse shooting spouse in domestic arguments? The worst  that happens in the UK is a frying pan over the head or isty cuffs down the pub. Imagine what it would be like here if we all had guns? Spilling a pint over somebody may be the last thing you do.

 

[Simi]

With a Republican house and Trump in the White House, sadly any legislation on Gun Control will be laughed out the room I'd have thought.

 

They can't even pass new Health Care between them.

[Finnegan]

Obamacare out, guns in. 

 

****ing mental country. 

[lgfualol]

Even more reason not to move to the US, a lot of the injured have health insurance but they are not covered in other states other than the one they live in. So people are raising money for the victims so they're not charged $1,000,000 for surviving.

[urban.spaceman]

Was having a pint with one of my oldest friends last night who lives in New York but is back home to sort out his visa (which he has to renew every time he comes home and they always, always screw it up). Apparently as of 18th of October all immigrants have to hand over social media accounts so that they can be scrutinised by law enforcement.

 

I used to dream of living in the USA as a kid but it's now just cementing itself as one of the most backwards countries on the planet.

[Guest MattP]

1 minute ago, urban.spaceman said:

Was having a pint with one of my oldest friends last night who lives in New York but is back home to sort out his visa (which he has to renew every time he comes home and they always, always screw it up). Apparently as of 18th of October all immigrants have to hand over social media accounts so that they can be scrutinised by law enforcement.

 

I used to dream of living in the USA as a kid but it's now just cementing itself as one of the most backwards countries on the planet.

It really isn't, let's get some perspective here.

[Finnegan]

6 minutes ago, MattP said:

It really isn't, let's get some perspective here.

 

Makes you appreciate how lucky we have it here really. 

 

As much as we bitch and moan, there aren't stacks of places I'd rather live in the world than the UK. 

 

The Scandis might have it a pinch better perhaps but their cost of living is a tad high. 

 

But our politics are moderate, our weather is moderate, we've crazy personal freedoms, press freedoms, no scary animals, no tectonic plates, no food shortages and corruption. 

 

I mean it's not perfect, we've got problems, but you look at Asia, Africa, the Americas, bits of Eastern Europe - even some of the barmy shit that cracks off in Italy, France and Spain. 

 

We don't know how good we've got it sometimes. 

[David Guiza]

1 minute ago, MattP said:

It really isn't, let's get some perspective here.

Obviously not when you compare it to the the third world, North Korea, parts of South America etc; the comparison is redundant.

 

However, some of their beliefs and laws are way behind other developed nations. Asia aside the USA is practically the only notable nation still advocating the death penalty - and being on a par with Asia for Human Rights issues is hardly a morally strong yardstick. 

 

They are still heavily influenced by religion - ironic given their stance on other global religions. 

 

Yes, criticisms can be made of UK culture, law making, morals etc and I am clearly heavily biased, but I can't help but scoff when the US is regularly declared as the land of the free and the most developed nation on earth. Of course it's difficult to maintain a level of consistency when the size of the nation isn't remotely comparable to the UK, but there are certain uncomfortable views, ethics and beliefs that seemingly run right through. 

[Guest MattP]

5 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

Makes you appreciate how lucky we have it here really. 

 

As much as we bitch and moan, there aren't stacks of places I'd rather live in the world than the UK. 

 

The Scandis might have it a pinch better perhaps but their cost of living is a tad high. 

 

But our politics are moderate, our weather is moderate, we've crazy personal freedoms, press freedoms, no scary animals, no tectonic plates, no food shortages and corruption. 

 

I mean it's not perfect, we've got problems, but you look at Asia, Africa, the Americas, bits of Eastern Europe - even some of the barmy shit that cracks off in Italy, France and Spain. 

 

We don't know how good we've got it sometimes. 

Yep, can't disagree with that and even in this country we still have people who want to completely tear our system down, warped. It really is bizarre when you think about it.

 

It's not as bad as many of us make it out to be.

[Jaspa]

9 minutes ago, MattP said:

Yep, can't disagree with that and even in this country we still have people who want to completely tear our system down, warped. It really is bizarre when you think about it.

 

It's not as bad as many of us make it out to be.

Not looking to put myself across as on any politically related side but when did anyone ever suggest we should have more free gun laws in the UK?

[Finnegan]

2 minutes ago, SpazticChicken said:

Not looking to put myself across as on any politically related side but when did anyone ever suggest we should have more free gun laws in the UK?

 

? 

[Guest MattP]

Just now, SpazticChicken said:

Not looking to put myself across as on any politically related side but when did anyone ever suggest we should have more free gun laws in the UK?

No, I was talking more about the climate where a large portion of the population now want to vote for people who are pretty extreme in terms of changing a country significantly, nothing to go with gun control. But I'm not turning this into another politics thread and I'm a busy man today so that's me logging off.

[Jaspa]

4 minutes ago, MattP said:

No, I was talking more about the climate where a large portion of the population now want to vote for people who are pretty extreme in terms of changing a country significantly, nothing to go with gun control. But I'm not turning this into another politics thread and I'm a busy man today so that's me logging off.

 

Alright, I usually see politics in the main as at either ends of spectrum honestly; what one group wants the others doesnt and visa versa, theyre all insane really. Agree we could be doing alot worse most definitely, I'm very proud of these little islands and the way we go about things.

 

To Finners, reading through I interpreted MattP's post as putting spin on what you'd said one way or the other, relating what had happened in LV to the political climate here with the Reds vs Blues ect ect.

[yorkie1999]

19 hours ago, Detroit Blues said:

I'm pretty surprised too. Las Vegas has such a heavy security presence, especially within the casinos. You would think as soon as that guy checked in with weapons/ammo, they would be running a background check on him, keeping security guards with an eye on him within the premises, etc.

 

The las vegas sheriff said that hotel staff had been in the room prior to the shootings and hadn't seen anything unusual. 

[CollinsLCFC]

The sad thing is, the gun law will never change in the US. So many American citizens will be in uproar should any political party remove their 'rights'. The said party would never be voted in again I can imagine. It would also be a big hit on the economy.

 

Shooting regrettably have always been and will continue to be an ongoing problem and be dressed up as a 'lone wolf' scenario. Completely avoiding the real problem.

 

As someone previously mentioned, the fact this person did not break a law until a trigger was pulled is a complete joke.

 

 

 

[Rincewind]

can you fit a machine gun in hand luggage? They say taking a gun off a person is going against their rights yet think its ok to go though private social media accounts. Free county my arse.

[Guest MattP]

9 minutes ago, CollinsLCFC said:

The sad thing is, the gun law will never change in the US. So many American citizens will be in uproar should any political party remove their 'rights'. The said party would never be voted in again I can imagine. It would also be a big hit on the economy.

 

Shooting regrettably have always been and will continue to be an ongoing problem and be dressed up as a 'lone wolf' scenario. Completely avoiding the real problem.

 

As someone previously mentioned, the fact this person did not break a law until a trigger was pulled is a complete joke.

We still don't know that, many believe the weapon acquired and the upgrades were illegal.

 

https://www.wired.com/story/las-vegas-shooting-automatic-rifle/

[Rincewind]

It shows how easy it is to get illegal stuff there. In this country if you asked in a pub fo gun you most likely would be reported. Thee you would be given a list of contacts.

I was told last night of a case in London where a bloke wanted to hire a hit man to kill his wife. The bloke he spoke to reported him as did the second. The third was an undercover policeman.

[Koke]

Everything is politicised in USA so it's hard to get things done. Even something we view as benign and common sense like universal healthcare is a polarizing and emotional topic.

 

NRA is super powerful and have many politicians in their pockets. If something as horrific as killing 20 school children isn't gonna have laws changed nothing will. So yeah, lets hust just sit tight and patiently wait for the next massacre. 

[Finnaldo]

22 minutes ago, Koke said:

Everything is politicised in USA so it's hard to get things done. Even something we view as benign and common sense like universal healthcare is a polarizing and emotional topic.

 

NRA is super powerful and have many politicians in their pockets. If something as horrific as killing 20 school children isn't gonna have laws changed nothing will. So yeah, lets hust just sit tight and patiently wait for the next massacre. 

 

Gauging current statistics, there's probably already been another small scale one in the US.

[Captain...]

It is just utter madness, so many lives needlessly lost to guns in one of the most developed nations in the world.

 

I really don't care about the arguments any more. Whatever the real reason (and it has been repeated many times that other countries have lax gun laws but not the same level of crime) the lax gun laws are a contributing factor and until the real reason has been found and dealt with, much stricter gun laws must be put in place, even if only temporarily. Really the whole gun culture must change, it is a responsibility not a right to own a gun,  and anyone who disagrees with that, and disagrees with having background checks and waiting periods and restrictions on types of guns and ammo doesn't deserve one.

[Innovindil]

I think if you could offer a button to Americans that removed all guns from civilian hands, the majority would push it. 

 

Unfortunately, it's not that easy. Even after removing the astranomical costs of buying all the guns from their owners, there are still plenty of problems to address. Problems that could potentially cause more deaths than what happens now. 

 

Saying "they should be like the UK, we have low gun crime" is great, and it would be awesome if they could aim for that, but we didn't have to remove millions of guns from the populace to get to what we have now. 

[GaelicFox]

3 hours ago, MattP said:

It really isn't, let's get some perspective here.

It really is in places ... and those places are widening 

 

wonderfully safe in many places 

 

but mad as feck in many others 

[Trav Le Bleu]

10 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

Was having a pint with one of my oldest friends last night who lives in New York but is back home to sort out his visa (which he has to renew every time he comes home and they always, always screw it up). Apparently as of 18th of October all immigrants have to hand over social media accounts so that they can be scrutinised by law enforcement.

 

I used to dream of living in the USA as a kid but it's now just cementing itself as one of the most backwards countries on the planet.

Land of the Free!