Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
cruzFOX

Rogers tactics

Recommended Posts

7 hours ago, Adster said:

Football experts out in force armed with hindsight again in this thread lol

 

He had a mistake, admitted it, and that's it. We didn't lose and still have a good chance to go through in the second leg. Some people need to remember where we once were, the negativity in the ground was unbelievable at times.

Football experts post match of course.

 

I like debating and talking tactics, even saying where we think things were wrong. But the comments and opinions stated post match like facts are so naive.

 

I was impressed in the post match he owned up to his error. Explained it in a way that did not criticise Praet and showed a bit of honesty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He's got to take the blame for yesterday. Yes he's been amazing for us but yesterday there were far too many mistakes. First of all the formation was wrong. Should have done a straight swap for ndidi with hamza.

 

Secondly bringing off praet for hamza. He should have changed the formation then and taken off Chilly and changed to a back 4, Praet was actually one of our best players before he went off. 

 

Third was the straight swap for nacho with perez. Again he should have taken chilly off and put perez wide. 

 

Lastly Albrighton for tielemens. OK Tilly was pretty awful throughout so this wasn't a terrible call. 

 

All in all we can go back and destroy them at Villa Park with the right team and formation I believe. Just got to learn from yesterday. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we are going to play a back four and one DM then Chilwell ,in his current form , will have to step down , we would be far to vulnerable on the left hand side.

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We need more players in the team that will take players on. Only Ricardo, Barnes and Gray will try dribble past a player. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Issues Rodgers currently has to try and solve:

 

1) Our inconsistent or non-existent wingers

2) Perez in home games has been anonymous for the majority of the season (zero goals and 1 assist)

3) Chilwell has had a crisis of confidence and it's like playing with 10 men if there's zero other outlets on the left with him

4) Tielemans form is a big worry

5) Iheanacho is proving to be undroppable, he somehow has to shoehorn him in without it hindering the flow of the team

6) Our home performances and results have started to slip

 

I still think 4-1-4-1 is the best system for us to deploy at home against teams that come and park the bus, last night Villa had zero interest in attacking us but they quickly realised that by having a load of defenders and midfielders the middle of the park was very congested and therefore we'd work it out wide and then across to the other side and not a lot would come of it. Chilwell's performance last night was appalling and essentially we had no threat from the left of the pitch, why he didn't go 4-1-4-1 2nd half with a winger out there is beyond me. On what planet do you need 3 centre halves when the opposition aren't playing a forward? It was bonkers.

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Shane said:

We need more players in the team that will take players on. Only Ricardo, Barnes and Gray will try dribble past a player. 

Agreed, there's very little pace elsewhere. Need a direct winger with end product, hard to find but not impossible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Agreed, there's very little pace elsewhere. Need a direct winger with end product, hard to find but not impossible.

Also centrally too. Need an alternative to Tielemans/Maddison/Praet who are all quite similar imo. A direct dribbler like Eze or Grealish would be fantastic.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Roger is a great manager but like all great managers they make some mistakes IMO, The Man City game I thought his tactics were poor indeed and last night with Nidi injured should have started Hamza as a like for like!

Tielemans has been so poor recently and DF midfielder he is not, Chilwell is another that has had a drop in confidence maybe they should have gone off instead of Preat and Perez who were having far better games.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Issues Rodgers currently has to try and solve:

 

1) Our inconsistent or non-existent wingers

2) Perez in home games has been anonymous for the majority of the season (zero goals and 1 assist)

3) Chilwell has had a crisis of confidence and it's like playing with 10 men if there's zero other outlets on the left with him

4) Tielemans form is a big worry

5) Iheanacho is proving to be undroppable, he somehow has to shoehorn him in without it hindering the flow of the team

6) Our home performances and results have started to slip

 

I still think 4-1-4-1 is the best system for us to deploy at home against teams that come and park the bus, last night Villa had zero interest in attacking us but they quickly realised that by having a load of defenders and midfielders the middle of the park was very congested and therefore we'd work it out wide and then across to the other side and not a lot would come of it. Chilwell's performance last night was appalling and essentially we had no threat from the left of the pitch, why he didn't go 4-1-4-1 2nd half with a winger out there is beyond me. On what planet do you need 3 centre halves when the opposition aren't playing a forward? It was bonkers.

I have to say, there's not much there to argue with but, with the amount of games coming up necessitating squad rotation, whether through fatigue or injury, these are not easy problems to solve.

1. Couldn't agree more.

2. I have been one of Perez's biggest critics on here and thought that he wasn't worth a place in the team for weeks now. However, that was when played out wide. In the middle I would willingly concede that he's been better and last night thought he had a very good game.

3. Chilwell is having problems,  undoubtedly but I don't get all the hate. I was there at Man City and  witnessed at times for example that he would have an impossible choice of picking up either Marhez or DeBreyne, an impossible task. He's asked to get forward whilst knowing that if it does go wrong there's little or no cover and then we point the finger of blame. Barnes covering is as much use as a chocolate teapot but ... he is also one of our few players that will run directly at the opposition (we could have done with that last night). Easy to criticise Chilwell but sometimes he's being asked to do too much because of Rodgers team selection (Choudhury at Man City may have been a more prudent move for example). Funny how he managed to do a lot better going forward for England recently,  what can we learn from that?

4. Tielemans a worry and if all were fit needs dropping. Pick on form not price tag. He'll come back. 

5. Iheanacho, though his first touch can look a bit clumsy, is growing in confidence and looking good. The problem is, who do we play behind Vardy, Iheanacho, Maddison or Perez or if he could gain shooting confidence, dare I say even Barnes. To play Maddison on the left we all now should be aware just nullifies his talent. Are we turning into Everton,  loads of 10s and no 9s? Not really,  we have Vardy and I think if injury strikes,  Iheanacho or Perez could deputies, but what do we do with them all in the meantime? Shoehorning people into uncomfortable positions is causing a problem. 

 

Not easy for Rodgers but a proper winger would help as we know but, they have to be significantly better than what we already have or don't bother, no room for more squad players.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes he got the system/players wrong but he identified it and corrected it. The Hamza for one of Praet and Tielmanns was obvious. We were effectively playing with seven men behind the ball first half with the two sitting keeping our full backs penned it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, An Sionnach said:

If we are going to play a back four and one DM then Chilwell ,in his current form , will have to step down , we would be far to vulnerable on the left hand side.

Honestly I’m so sure you’re a wind up merchant or an agent sent by Nottingham Forest to get under the skin of city fans. You come out with some absolute drivel.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Issues Rodgers currently has to try and solve:

 

1) Our inconsistent or non-existent wingers

2) Perez in home games has been anonymous for the majority of the season (zero goals and 1 assist)

3) Chilwell has had a crisis of confidence and it's like playing with 10 men if there's zero other outlets on the left with him

4) Tielemans form is a big worry

5) Iheanacho is proving to be undroppable, he somehow has to shoehorn him in without it hindering the flow of the team

6) Our home performances and results have started to slip

 

I still think 4-1-4-1 is the best system for us to deploy at home against teams that come and park the bus, last night Villa had zero interest in attacking us but they quickly realised that by having a load of defenders and midfielders the middle of the park was very congested and therefore we'd work it out wide and then across to the other side and not a lot would come of it. Chilwell's performance last night was appalling and essentially we had no threat from the left of the pitch, why he didn't go 4-1-4-1 2nd half with a winger out there is beyond me. On what planet do you need 3 centre halves when the opposition aren't playing a forward? It was bonkers.

I agree we most of you points;

 

1) Wingers are general inconsistent by nature, however if you going to be a top side I'm not sure ours are good enough, if we recruited one player in the window it would be an attacking wide player for me. 

 

2) I think he's actually getting better but I think he benefits from having more space in away games as the home team can't just sit back.

 

3) I think he just need to play himself back into form, I'm not sure Fuchs is much better Chilwell has as many career assist and goal as Fuchs in 13 less PL games. 

 

4) I think this is linked to you first point, teams aren't afraid of our wide options, so sit deep and fill the middle and funnel us wide, leaving less space for YT and JM to operate in. If we had a quality wide man it would free up space in the middle.

 

5) I think Rogers has tried to find a system that can accommodate both Iheanacho and Vardy, with the diamond and 3 CB, which has worked for certain games but not others, I'd like him to find a way to play nacho at number 10. 

 

6) For me we need a higher tempo and to take our chances, Liverpool aside, against Everton we had 16 shots, Norwich 18, Villa 20, 54 shots but only 5 goals, we have also developed a habit of conceding the first goal, which gives the away side a boost and allows them to sit in even deeper, if we score first they have to come out and play.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Adster said:

Football experts out in force armed with hindsight again in this thread lol

 

He had a mistake, admitted it, and that's it. We didn't lose and still have a good chance to go through in the second leg. Some people need to remember where we once were, the negativity in the ground was unbelievable at times.

Nice to have an expert opinion and appraisal of our current situation and supporters comments 

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the back 5 is being used to make up for the loss of Ndidi. I'm not sure we look quite right with this system, I would prefer to see Choudhury as a straight replacement for Ndidi within the system we had a lot of success with.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, fox in the sox said:

I think the back 5 is being used to make up for the loss of Ndidi. I'm not sure we look quite right with this system, I would prefer to see Choudhury as a straight replacement for Ndidi within the system we had a lot of success with.

Exactly, think about how many times in the first half that Johnny Evans stepped into midfield to win a header. In fact, it was the lack of a central defender stepping into midfield that lead to the first goal. 

 

Ricardo got caught up field on Aston Villa's counterattack. Under normal circumstances, Ndidi would have stepped forward to win back the ball. Instead, none of the central defenders stepped forward, and there was a scramble for the ball in the box. The ball settled where Ricardo should have been. The defense held a decent offside line, and Soyuncu was one on one with El Ghazi. Unfortunately for Leicester, Soyuncu was beaten for pace and El Ghazi put in a perfect cross that Schmeichel and Evans had no chance to claim. Chilwell gets beaten to the inside where he thought he had support, and it's 1-nil against the run of play.

 

In classic Foxest Talk fashion, all the blame gets lumped on Chilwell, but in fairness, a decent amount of blame needs to be shared by Evans for not stepping in to break up the counter attack, Soyuncu for letting the cross in, and Ricardo for not getting back to his defensive position. Everyone is clamoring for Fuchs to replace Chilwell, but he was just as poor, getting beaten on a set piece. Luckily for him, the free header hit the woodwork rather than finding the back of the net. 

 

In theory the 5-3-2 should have worked, but I think the players did not execute the system. At the end of the day, Brendan needs to pick the system that best suits his players, and I do not think our centerbacks are best in a 5 man back line. If Choudhury can be a like-for-like swap for Ndidi, I think we should go back to the 4-1-4-1.

Edited by Detroit Blues

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Giving up almost a decade of lurking to say I thought the shape looked suspect yesterday a couple of minutes in and I was astonished it didn't change. You could see that they had the men in the right areas to cut off the passing options from the CBs to the wingbacks and DM. Going to 4 at the back might have risked giving them more space to get forward but it might also have helped us get forward and stopped the midfield being overrun, and I'd back us over them.

 

Pressing and cutting off passing options, letting the game get tight and scrappy, tempting us into trying to do too much with the ball, - it was clearly their gameplan, it worked quite well for them, and we decided to try to play through it and let it happen.

 

It may be that Rodgers felt that the plan was to get us to change the formation and hurt us worse. I'm definitely not a tactical expert. But I did think 5 minutes in 'this setup isn't going to work'. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, fleckneymike said:

Yes he got the system/players wrong but he identified it and corrected it. The Hamza for one of Praet and Tielmanns was obvious. We were effectively playing with seven men behind the ball first half with the two sitting keeping our full backs penned it. 

Should have been Tielemans though 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, volpeazzurro said:

Funny how he managed to do a lot better going forward for England recently,  what can we learn from that?

International football is mostly rubbish.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Generally I think Rodgers gets it right but last night wasn't one of them.....

3 centre backs against a team with no out and out striker..... bizarre. Soyuncu and Fuchs (who were 2 of the 3 centre backs) were getting forward loads, that shouldn't be happening with centre backs.

Ricardo was skinning Taylor quite regularly so I cant help but feel had we of had a winger in front of him, then Villa would of been rinsed down that side and would of had to of changed it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, An Sionnach said:

International football is mostly rubbish.

🤣 I can't disagree, it frustrates the hell out of me, gets in the way of club football. I always wish England well but quite often can't be bothered to watch. My point with Chilwell though was that certainly in the last England game I watched when some of the pundits were giving him motm, his ability to get forward and produce some really good crosses seemed to have come on in leaps and bounds. It was no coincidence however i think, that there usually seemed to be somebody willing to cover his back on his forays forward. This I feel would have given him the confidence to do so.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know it really shouldn't bother me and it is trivial but it really annoys me that the thread title is "Rogers".

  • Like 3
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Been up and down since Norwich, remember the buck stops with him . He has 20 odd players to choose from and he has a big back-up team. The concern is more performance levels than results at the moment. You play well, you lose , it happens and its disappointing but you remain optimistic. You play badly though and draw and concern creeps in. No manager in recent times has left Celtic and succeeded long term in the premiership hopefully he will break that trend. A defeat against a struggling team like Burnley would indeed be a defining moment for him.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We never have any width, Ricardo takes up narrow positions for an attacking full back, Chilwell is often too deep and the wife players move too centrally too early. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...