Leader?

[themightyfin]

31 minutes ago, Cadno'r Cymoedd said:

Let me answer your question, if I may, by saying that without Grealish in the two semi final games, there is no way that Villa would have drawn or won. We'd have won both games easily. He might put noses out of joint amongst opposition fans as he does on here, but he gets those around him to get stuck in and does lead by example. I'd like to see that in our team, so when things are not going well or we feel we've not had the run of the ball - those great saves against last night for example - there's someone to hold the team together and bring them through outfield. Ideally everyone would be a fighter and a leader. That is not a criticism of the undoubtedly wonderful talents we have whatsoever but it is about having a dog in the fight when things get tough. I think we just lack that a bit at the moment. Maybe as I said, someone will emerge. 

So your saying we have nobody on the pitch who leads by example? 

That's the only skill your suggesting as I read your comments.

 

Do you not think....

Evans

Maddison 

Vardy

Youri

Ricky

 

To name a few do not lead by example? I would say they do. Just because it didnt happen for us last night does not mean those said players were not leading by example. It just was not our night.

If we had no leaders on the pitch then I'm confused as to how this young team is 3rd in the league. You dont do that with no leadership happening. 

[AKCJ]

5 of our front 6 last night were 22 years old. Perez is 26.

 

I'd love us to sign a winger that's been there and done it a bit.

[Cadno'r Cymoedd]

41 minutes ago, themightyfin said:

So your saying we have nobody on the pitch who leads by example? 

That's the only skill your suggesting as I read your comments.

 

Do you not think....

Evans

Maddison 

Vardy

Youri

Ricky

 

To name a few do not lead by example? I would say they do. Just because it didnt happen for us last night does not mean those said players were not leading by example. It just was not our night.

If we had no leaders on the pitch then I'm confused as to how this young team is 3rd in the league. You dont do that with no leadership happening. 

I've been in sporting teams that have very talented players who play really well and when things are going well they lead by example through what they do.

 

However, as I said, it's when things don't quite go your way or you're battling adversity that you need that special quality in a person or people. When we were on song getting us to 2nd in league, there was a confidence in nearly every player. So when we battered Southampton and Newcastle, that confidence was visible. 

 

Since the league dip in form started, we've lost leads in games (Burnley for example) and been well outplayed by the likes of Man City and Liverpool, and now lost to Villa in the League Cup. When that is happening is the time your leaders come to the fore to rally others. 

 

You seem to think I am criticising our young players or decrying us being 3rd. I am most certainly not, far from it. We've had and are having a great season. I agree we should be proud of where we are. I just think we could benefit from an outfield commander, which I personally don't see at the moment, which would take us even further 

. 

Edited 29 January 2020 by Cadno'r Cymoedd

[themightyfin]

24 minutes ago, Cadno'r Cymoedd said:

You clearly don't get it. I've been in sporting teams that have very talented players who play really well and when things are going well they are lead by example through what they do.

 

However, as I said, it's when things don't quite go your way or you're battling adversity that you need that special quality in a person or people. When we were on song getting us to 2nd in league, there was a confidence in nearly every player. So when we battered Southampton and Newcastle, that confidence was visible. 

 

Since the league dip in form started, we've lost leads in games (Burnley for example) and been well outplayed by the likes of Man City and Liverpool, and now lost to Villa in the League Cup. When that is happening is the time your leaders come to the fore to rally others. 

 

You seem to think I am criticising our young players or decrying us being 3rd. I am most certainly not, far from it. We've had and are having a great season. I agree we should be proud of where we are. I just think we could benefit from an outfield commander, which I personally don't see at the moment, which would take us even further 

. 

Do you not think the leaders cane to the fore as you put it to take us to second in the table?

Nothing has changed. The leaders are still there leading. Just the results are nit now coming. That's not through lack of leadership. It's just football. 

[Cadno'r Cymoedd]

34 minutes ago, themightyfin said:

Do you not think the leaders cane to the fore as you put it to take us to second in the table?

Nothing has changed. The leaders are still there leading. Just the results are nit now coming. That's not through lack of leadership. It's just football. 

Why do you think the results are now not coming? Not the only reason, but in my opinion a significant part of it is we lack that influence outfield as I said. No problem, we disagree. Debate is healthy. 

Edited 29 January 2020 by Cadno'r Cymoedd

[Clever Fox]

I agree we do need a new outfield leader. It's never a good idea to have a Goalkeeper as Captain. He's too far removed from the play at times to offer advice. He can't even take instruction from the Manager for the same reason. An outfield player can move to the sideline to take instructions from the Manager.

The Captain also has to lead by example and is usually a player who delivers a good performance every game. He becomes someone the younger players look up to because of his ability and rely on his experience. Personally I don't think Kasper is good enough to fill that role. Despite his strong personality.

 Evans is  a decent shout but again a short term solution. Of the current crop of players, The ones who for me seems to have leadership qualities are both NDiddi or Praet.

NDiddi I'm not sure how talkative he is in the squad. Praet is still finding his feet both in the league and the Club.

 

I'm sure it's something Brendan is aware of and may well bring in someone to do the job, Like Pearson brought in Morgan.

While it is a concern it's also something we can live with for the foreseeable future. While we continue to build the team. But it is something that does need to be addressed.

 

[Fox92]

Evans. He's the one that talks and shouts at everyone.

 

He doesn't have any opposition mates in tunnels either. Well if he does, he doesn't go around cuddling them. He's foccussed on going out there to play.

Edited 29 January 2020 by Fox92

[Izzy]

53 minutes ago, AKCJ said:

 

I'd love us to sign a winger that's been there and done it a bit.

 

[Guest SO1]

6 hours ago, henrik_62 said:

Although not an in your face, shouting at folk to gee them up type of leader I’d say Vardy is a leader in so much that he leads by example and with him in the side the other players will feel they have a chance against anyone.

 

I get your point though, I think centre back through to the middle of the park there’s a real general type personality missing in there. Soyuncu looks like he could develop into that sort of personality mind you. 
 

Take the above with a pinch of salt obviously given I don’t watch the team week in week out.

I know people will give me crap but Scott Brown and Steven Gerrard were the gold standard. Crazy how much Brown is underrated.

[Fox92]

14 minutes ago, Izzy said:

 

We need one that actually scores and creates consistently.

 

I think Barnes is in good form atm.

 

The right side is the issue. I like Perez but I feel for him out there and then dragged off every game.

Edited 29 January 2020 by Fox92

[foxinsocks]

25 minutes ago, Clever Fox said:

I agree we do need a new outfield leader. It's never a good idea to have a Goalkeeper as Captain. He's too far removed from the play at times to offer advice. He can't even take instruction from the Manager for the same reason. An outfield player can move to the sideline to take instructions from the Manager.

The Captain also has to lead by example and is usually a player who delivers a good performance every game. He becomes someone the younger players look up to because of his ability and rely on his experience. Personally I don't think Kasper is good enough to fill that role. Despite his strong personality.

 Evans is  a decent shout but again a short term solution. Of the current crop of players, The ones who for me seems to have leadership qualities are both NDiddi or Praet.

NDiddi I'm not sure how talkative he is in the squad. Praet is still finding his feet both in the league and the Club.

 

I'm sure it's something Brendan is aware of and may well bring in someone to do the job, Like Pearson brought in Morgan.

While it is a concern it's also something we can live with for the foreseeable future. While we continue to build the team. But it is something that does need to be addressed.

 

Kasper has a short fuse - and needs to be told to pull his socks up and get out and meet diagonal crosses in added time.  Evans

 

 

Edited 29 January 2020 by foxinsocks

[themightyfin]

31 minutes ago, Cadno'r Cymoedd said:

Why do you think the results are now not coming? Not the only reason, but in my opinion a significant part of it is we lack that influence outfield as I said. No problem, we disagree. 

At last you see it my way. It's no biggie 

[Cadno'r Cymoedd]

14 minutes ago, themightyfin said:

At last you see it my way. It's no biggie 

Do you do comprehension? I don't see it your way. 

[urban fox]

2 hours ago, Al-aLondon-Foxile said:

I said this last night to my two lads, we are a young side, lacking experience and in some instances probably language skills (cags?) to lead the team when under the cosh. We need a leader, an ‘orrible git’ who spreads confidence and intimidates the opposition. We were out muscled a bit last night, not that it was a physical encounter, but they just seemed to be more up for the fight than us. After a strong start when we didn’t score we just seemed to slowly wilt. I think this is something we’re lacking and have suffered from for some weeks now. We will grow though, if we keep the group together, and we will learn to win these games. 

Someone in the Roy Keane or Patrick Viera mould. They don't come much more 'orrible than that.

No matter how skillful every team needs an enforcer, someone who is not afraid to get stuck in and do the dirty work. Someone with the gravitas and confidence to tell their team mates how it is when things are not going to plan and motivate them, and to lead by example when it starts to get a bit tasty

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

1 hour ago, urban fox said:

Someone in the Roy Keane or Patrick Viera mould. They don't come much more 'orrible than that.

No matter how skillful every team needs an enforcer, someone who is not afraid to get stuck in and do the dirty work. Someone with the gravitas and confidence to tell their team mates how it is when things are not going to plan and motivate them, and to lead by example when it starts to get a bit tasty

I do like those type of players but if Keane were playing now he’d spend most of his time suspended, in this day and age he’d have to reign himself in and that would make him half the player he was.

Its a dilemma but we are too nice.

[Clever Fox]

Part of our problem is we're seen as a nice footballing team, Small in stature with no mr nasty. This gives the lesser teams a feeling that we can be got at easily.

 

When our performances drop off a little, then they feel like they have areal chance to beat us and raise their game against us. We cannot continue to play with just NDiddi in the midfield. He needs someone to play along side him who will do a similar job. Hamza isn't ready for that role yet. 

 

I'm sure Brendan will have a big shake up in the squad come Summer. I expect to see 5 or 6 new faces for next season.

[dylanlegend]

I think we have more ‘leaders’ in our ranks than most modern teams...

 

Kasper

Fuchs

Evans

Soyuncu 

Morgan

Youri 

Vardy

 

If you think we lack leaders take a look atother clubs... 

 

Manchester United appointed Harry Maguire as their ‘leader’. He’d be 5th on the list if he was still here.

 

The modern game doesn’t have the leaders like Keane, Maldini, Viera, Terry anymore. They are quite rare. 

Edited 29 January 2020 by dylanlegend

[Ian Nacho]

I see Fuchs more of a leader than Schmeichel myself.

[Lesta blue]

15 hours ago, Cadno'r Cymoedd said:

Hugely disappointing as it is, we have to move on on learn from the semi final defeat. 

 

I think we lack an outfield leader badly, vocally and by their own actions, especially in times of adversity in games. Kasper is too far removed in goal. We lacked that last night and in recent league games. 

 

It is still a young team on the whole, easy to overlook that. Hopefully someone will emerge from within. Usually midfield is the area that offers up that type of player. I thought Youri might but he is struggling with his own game at the moment. I can't see Wilf being vocal enough to don the leader's mantle.  None of the others spring to mind other than perhaps Hamza in the future if he develops.

 

Thoughts? 

At present there is only 1 candidate: Evans. He is regular starter, and experienced.

Yuri has not hit the heights he did last year, very inconsistent 

Hamza is not even in the squad most matches. 

[Fox of WA]

On 29/01/2020 at 07:30, SO1 said:

I know people will give me crap but Scott Brown and Steven Gerrard were the gold standard. Crazy how much Brown is underrated.

Somebody who gives everything for the club and isn’t afraid to get in anyone’s (Refs, teammates, opposition) face? That’s absolutely what we need. It’s rare anymore, getting harder and harder to find but nobody could seriously say we wouldn’t benefit from having that type of General in midfield. That’s no disrespect to what this team has accomplished already, but a player like that would turn some of these losses or draws around for us. 

[Guest SO1]

11 minutes ago, Fox of WA said:

Somebody who gives everything for the club and isn’t afraid to get in anyone’s (Refs, teammates, opposition) face? That’s absolutely what we need. It’s rare anymore, getting harder and harder to find but nobody could seriously say we wouldn’t benefit from having that type of General in midfield. That’s no disrespect to what this team has accomplished already, but a player like that would turn some of these losses or draws around for us. 

Never realized how good a footballer Scott Brown was until Rodgers went there. So good at getting the ball back and distribution. Just his work ethic alone would set the tempo and turn matches around.

Absolutely relentless even in the Champions League against some of the best in the world. So under rated. Ndidi is only 23 there's still time.

[Clever Fox]

Could BRs interest in this lad in the Summer be the outfield Leader we need. Pierre-Emile Hojbjerg's . He's currently Captain at Southampton and is a very good player.

He'd lead by example and would be perfect to play alongside NDiddi. He has a great engine and scores a few Goals also.

[l444ry]

You’d want 11 leaders in an ideal world. Seems to me that most players these days rely on the bench for every little thing. We’re not alone with this *problem*.

[Paninistickers]

This'll be unpopular, but I think Chilly is a natural leader. 

 

I can't quite quantify that comment. Just instinct. Though the instinct is honed by working with plenty of mid 20s lads and I can tell at work who has 'got it' and the potential to kick on 

[Realjimbo]

"Captain" is a bit misunderstood, does casper decide who takes a free kick on halfway? Tactics at a corner? Whether a player should change tactics on the next attack? Of course not, the leaders on the pitch do that, I would imagine Wes made lots of calls during matches but not because he was captain, because he is a natural leader.

You can make a captain easily but leaders of men are a much rarer beast.

This is why we need a seasoned and vocal midfielder to lead our talented youngsters.

Edited 31 January 2020 by Realjimbo