Cancel Culture

[Corky]

10 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

That Hitler comment was unbelievable but I think (and I am arguably guilty of this, I'll let anyone who follows me decide) that people try and be more and more outlandish to become the centre of attention. That's what social media effectively is. It's like a fight for the attention and people get more and more daft in their methods of trying to win that fight.

 

Ant & Dec have just done a tweet apologising for something they did years ago. The fact they feel the need to do that is absolutely ridiculous to me. Why are people so obsessed with looking backwards? Nobody was bothered then. Nobody is really bothered now. It's a revolting culture and I really can't see what good actually comes from it.

Surely, rather than apologising years later, actually learning from mistakes and educating yourself is the bigger statement?

 

We've all done things we regret, I know I have, but I've grown out of them, realised they were wrong and not done them since.

 

Anyone can just say sorry and not really mean it, not repeating it again and again is far more significant.

[Trav Le Bleu]

I was in mind of the film Boyz n the Hood.

 

At one point one of the main charcter's girlfriend laments, "why do you keep calling us bitches?" to which the answer is, "cos that what you are." In fact the film is full of misogyny... because that's how it was and largely is.

 

So should Boys N The Hood, which is an absolutely fantastic film by the way, be shelved because of it's representation of how men should* treat women?

 

Which incidentally, should be just as much a concern regarding Gone With The Wind. In many older films the "hero" forcefully takes the leading lady in a way that could be constituted as rape these days.

 

So, James Bond? Iconic fictional hero? Or serial rapist?

 

 

*Edit: of course the film isn't saying that it's right, but it does kind of portray it as the norm, which as I said it was/often is.

Edited 10 June 2020 by Trav Le Bleu

[Bert]

18 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

That Hitler comment was unbelievable but I think (and I am arguably guilty of this, I'll let anyone who follows me decide) that people try and be more and more outlandish to become the centre of attention. That's what social media effectively is. It's like a fight for the attention and people get more and more daft in their methods of trying to win that fight.

 

Ant & Dec have just done a tweet apologising for something they did years ago. The fact they feel the need to do that is absolutely ridiculous to me. Why are people so obsessed with looking backwards? Nobody was bothered then. Nobody is really bothered now. It's a revolting culture and I really can't see what good actually comes from it.

It’s absolutely vile. I have no idea what the obsession with being offended is. 

[Captain...]

22 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

One of the biggest stains on society nowadays. I hope we generally look back in future at this phase as the absolute madness that it is.

What? Cancel culture? Really?

 

Not systemic racism? The increase of far right activism? Fundamentalist terrorism? Cyber bullying? Normal bullying? Revenge porn? The institutionalised abuse of women in the film and music industry?

 

Cancel culture is about calling out people/organisations for current and past comments that are not acceptable, it arguably goes too far, but everything on Twitter goes too far, but it's not a bad thing, calling out racism and bigotry even if you don't agree with it being held to account for your actions is all that is happening.

 

 

[Corky]

3 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

I was in mind of the film Boyz n the Hood.

 

At one point one of the main charcter's girlfriend laments, "why do you keep calling us bitches?" to which the answer is, "cos that what you are." In fact the film is full of misogyny... because that's how it was and largely is.

 

So should Boys N The Hood, which is an absolutely fantastic film by the way, be shelved because of it's representation of how men should treat women?

 

Which incidentally, should be just as much a concern regarding Gone With The Wind. In many older films the "hero" forcefully takes the leading lady in a way that could be constituted as rape these days.

 

So, James Bond? Iconic fictional hero? Or serial rapist?

 

They might be looking at rap music next. Probably only I Wish by Skee-Lo that will be allowed to air.

[Trav Le Bleu]

Just now, Corky said:

They might be looking at rap music next. Probably only I Wish by Skee-Lo that will be allowed to air.

The rabbit in a hat brigade beg to differ.

[Izzy]

3 minutes ago, Captain... said:

Not systemic racism? The increase of far right activism? Fundamentalist terrorism? Cyber bullying? Normal bullying? Revenge porn? The institutionalised abuse of women in the film and music industry?

 

What else is on the list? I get paranoid these days in case I’ve missed something 

[Captain...]

2 minutes ago, Izzy said:

What else is on the list? I get paranoid these days in case I’ve missed something 

It's a long list there's a lot of stuff out there worse than being called out for saying something wrong.

[Bert]

8 minutes ago, Corky said:

They might be looking at rap music next. Probably only I Wish by Skee-Lo that will be allowed to air.

But that’s offensive to people that can’t grow anymore, or people that can’t have rabbits in their hats. 

[fuchsntf]

6 hours ago, RowlattsFox said:

There will be a lot of tv programmes looking over their shoulders, thinking will they be next? Particularly programmes from the 70/80s onwards. I love Only Fools but there are lines and comments in that when I think, jesus you'd never be able to say that now. TV shows, films and stand-up comedians have used stereotyping for ever, using various different subjects, in my opinion there is a line where stereotyping is ok until it becomes overly offensive, but the line is getting shorter and shorter.

The true freedom,from all types of discrimination will be the day,we can View all those older TV programs & films,look at the Humor & just laugh it off..!!

 

Even in those days ( 60s-80s),many Mates-groups who were of Mixed cultures,but still majority Local whites,were not racists.

I used to be Proud of my own Broad W.Class family,who never discriminated between any types of people,my group of friends,Cliques,& aquaintances,welcomed

all and embraced all into our lives...

I came across with friends more racial-discrimination,in organisations ,Business and govt.institutions  ( Hence institutionalised).more so  at Management levels..!!

Than on the streets...Though After the 70s racism and cowardly attacks apparently ( I had Left UK)  became more prevelant.....

 

[Izzy]

6 minutes ago, Bert said:

But that’s offensive to people that can’t grow anymore, or people that can’t have rabbits in their hats. 

PMSL 

 

..or people who can't play basketball or get a girlfriend..

 

Brilliant  

[Parafox]

What I don't get is this; society has known about slavery for years and been, quite rightly, ashamed of the legacy it has left and disgusted by those who made fortunes from it. But back in those times it was kind of "accepted". Thank God we've moved on. I get why statues of slave traders are being pulled down but surely that should have happened years ago if society found it so offensive for so many years? Why were they put up in the first place? Because many of those traders were also benefactors of the places they lived in, generating wealth and income and providing cultural benefits for their populace. That's by no way a justification of slave trading btw.

Maybe all monuments to those who are now seen to be exploiters of the weak, poor and disenfranchised from history should be removed?

[Dahnsouff]

George Floyd, the movement against racism has come to encompass earlier connotations I assume.

[yorkie1999]

12 minutes ago, Parafox said:

What I don't get is this; society has known about slavery for years and been, quite rightly, ashamed of the legacy it has left and disgusted by those who made fortunes from it. But back in those times it was kind of "accepted". Thank God we've moved on. I get why statues of slave traders are being pulled down but surely that should have happened years ago if society found it so offensive for so many years? Why were they put up in the first place? Because many of those traders were also benefactors of the places they lived in, generating wealth and income and providing cultural benefits for their populace. That's by no way a justification of slave trading btw.

Maybe all monuments to those who are now seen to be exploiters of the weak, poor and disenfranchised from history should be removed?

What i don't get is why is everyone down on one knee in honour of George Floyd. I mean if the copper in America hadn't done that, he wouldn't have died, or am i missing something. It's a bit like twisting your finger against your head to say someones a nut job.

[Parafox]

2 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

What i don't get is why is everyone down on one knee in honour of George Floyd. I mean if the copper in America hadn't done that, he wouldn't have died, or am i missing something. It's a bit like twisting your finger against your head to say someones a nut job.

Sorry, I don't get your point. No offence but I don't quite understand what you're getting at.

[Parafox]

36 minutes ago, Izzy said:

What else is on the list? I get paranoid these days in case I’ve missed something 

Just chill and assume it's everything and it's always someone else's fault

[Captain...]

5 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

What i don't get is why is everyone down on one knee in honour of George Floyd. I mean if the copper in America hadn't done that, he wouldn't have died, or am i missing something. It's a bit like twisting your finger against your head to say someones a nut job.

Not sure if serious or making a bad taste joke but...

 

Taking a knee is a reference to Colin Kapernick who took a knee instead of standing for the national anthem and became a symbol of BLM and is in no way associated with knee the police officer took on Floyd's neck.

[casablancas]

43 minutes ago, Parafox said:

What I don't get is this; society has known about slavery for years and been, quite rightly, ashamed of the legacy it has left and disgusted by those who made fortunes from it. But back in those times it was kind of "accepted". Thank God we've moved on. I get why statues of slave traders are being pulled down but surely that should have happened years ago if society found it so offensive for so many years? Why were they put up in the first place? Because many of those traders were also benefactors of the places they lived in, generating wealth and income and providing cultural benefits for their populace. That's by no way a justification of slave trading btw.

Maybe all monuments to those who are now seen to be exploiters of the weak, poor and disenfranchised from history should be removed?

That’s an interesting point you raise. Just how far do we go. But a city / town flourishing on the back of human blood and misery should not be celebrated today. I know it’s not by society at large, but monuments etc. that still exist today are rightly challenged. Whilst it woulda benefited those of the right class and colour back in the day I do see the logic in modern day society viewing them with consternation. 

Edited 10 June 2020 by casablancas

[Pliskin]

1 hour ago, Parafox said:

What I don't get is this; society has known about slavery for years and been, quite rightly, ashamed of the legacy it has left and disgusted by those who made fortunes from it. But back in those times it was kind of "accepted". Thank God we've moved on. I get why statues of slave traders are being pulled down but surely that should have happened years ago if society found it so offensive for so many years? Why were they put up in the first place? Because many of those traders were also benefactors of the places they lived in, generating wealth and income and providing cultural benefits for their populace. That's by no way a justification of slave trading btw.

Maybe all monuments to those who are now seen to be exploiters of the weak, poor and disenfranchised from history should be removed?

Good post. In regards to everything that’s unfolding, there has been a tsunami of emotion swept throughout the world, It started with George Floyd’s murder and has since resonated. Personally I think one of the main factors has been lockdown... frankly everyone is ****ed off,  and I think this period has really given people a chance to brood and mull things over, a significant thing happens and whereas Before where people think “I’ll respond later I’m working at the moment” it’s “I’m not working, this is a great chance to get out there and raise my point”. Would we have seen such an overwhelming response in this country had things been more normal? 
 

My opinion on the statues situation is that it has been a domino effect starting in America, George’s murder wasn’t a routine cop shooting, no gun, It was like Scene of domination, a white man kneeling on a black mans neck whilst he has his hands in his pockets with a look of “I don’t give a ****” on his face. This was the atomic bomb that kick started the vigorous protests. Since then I think things that have been at the back of people’s minds that came out over conversations with friends over dinner, has suddenly been thrown out into the open and the reaction has been “yea you’re right, and another thing....” etc. 
 

People are starting to realise that there are a number of things about Britain which are rather uncomfortable in the modern setting, and contradict the human rights we profess to live by. 
 

But you have to ask the question where is the line? And when you’re talking justifying actions to can’t really place yourself on the shoes of an 18th century Tory? Most of London was built by men like Carlston this Isn’t like looking at the world wars which happened in more modern times, within our immediate ancestors lives. But we obviously know what they did was completely inhuman, but the folk who lived on these centuries were ****ing nuts. This is why it is important to recognise these past tyrants and what they did, and use it to shape a future free of racism and free of repression against none indigenous peoples, but then again, are any people’s truly indigenous apart from the likes of the indigenous people of Australia who are repressed.... and again so blatantly so. 
 

I think the sentiment is, statues of people like Carlston are scars, and nothing can heal unless the scar is treated, treat the scar (remove the statue) and allow things to heal? 
 

Everything I have just said is probably bollocks, I’ve had a few mid week beers.

[casablancas]

1 minute ago, Pliskin said:

Good post. In regards to everything that’s unfolding, there has been a tsunami of emotion swept throughout the world, It started with George Floyd’s murder and has since resonated. Personally I think one of the main factors has been lockdown... frankly everyone is ****ed off,  and I think this period has really given people a chance to brood and mull things over, a significant thing happens and whereas Before where people think “I’ll respond later I’m working at the moment” it’s “I’m not working, this is a great chance to get out there and raise my point”. Would we have seen such an overwhelming response in this country had things been more normal? 
 

My opinion on the statues situation is that it has been a domino effect starting in America, George’s murder wasn’t a routine cop shooting, no gun, It was like Scene of domination, a white man kneeling on a black mans neck whilst he has his hands in his pockets with a look of “I don’t give a ****” on his face. This was the atomic bomb that kick started the vigorous protests. Since then I think things that have been at the back of people’s minds that came out over conversations with friends over dinner, has suddenly been thrown out into the open and the reaction has been “yea you’re right, and another thing....” etc. 
 

People are starting to realise that there are a number of things about Britain which are rather uncomfortable in the modern setting, and contradict the human rights we profess to live by. 
 

But you have to ask the question where is the line? And when you’re talking justifying actions to can’t really place yourself on the shoes of an 18th century Tory? Most of London was built by men like Carlston this Isn’t like looking at the world wars which happened in more modern times, within our immediate ancestors lives. But we obviously know what they did was completely inhuman, but the folk who lived on these centuries were ****ing nuts. This is why it is important to recognise these past tyrants and what they did, and use it to shape a future free of racism and free of repression against none indigenous peoples, but then again, are any people’s truly indigenous apart from the likes of the indigenous people of Australia who are repressed.... and again so blatantly so. 
 

I think the sentiment is, statues of people like Carlston are scars, and nothing can heal unless the scar is treated, treat the scar (remove the statue) and allow things to heal? 
 

Everything I have just said is probably bollocks, I’ve had a few mid week beers.

It’s not bollocks. Not at all mate. 

[yorkie1999]

1 hour ago, Captain... said:

Not sure if serious or making a bad taste joke but...

 

Taking a knee is a reference to Colin Kapernick who took a knee instead of standing for the national anthem and became a symbol of BLM and is in no way associated with knee the police officer took on Floyd's neck.

Oh right, i didn't know that, hence why i couldn't work it out and thought it was protesting about the way he died.

[CosbehFox]

34 minutes ago, Pliskin said:

Good post. In regards to everything that’s unfolding, there has been a tsunami of emotion swept throughout the world, It started with George Floyd’s murder and has since resonated. Personally I think one of the main factors has been lockdown... frankly everyone is ****ed off,  and I think this period has really given people a chance to brood and mull things over, a significant thing happens and whereas Before where people think “I’ll respond later I’m working at the moment” it’s “I’m not working, this is a great chance to get out there and raise my point”. Would we have seen such an overwhelming response in this country had things been more normal? 
 

My opinion on the statues situation is that it has been a domino effect starting in America, George’s murder wasn’t a routine cop shooting, no gun, It was like Scene of domination, a white man kneeling on a black mans neck whilst he has his hands in his pockets with a look of “I don’t give a ****” on his face. This was the atomic bomb that kick started the vigorous protests. Since then I think things that have been at the back of people’s minds that came out over conversations with friends over dinner, has suddenly been thrown out into the open and the reaction has been “yea you’re right, and another thing....” etc. 
 

People are starting to realise that there are a number of things about Britain which are rather uncomfortable in the modern setting, and contradict the human rights we profess to live by. 
 

But you have to ask the question where is the line? And when you’re talking justifying actions to can’t really place yourself on the shoes of an 18th century Tory? Most of London was built by men like Carlston this Isn’t like looking at the world wars which happened in more modern times, within our immediate ancestors lives. But we obviously know what they did was completely inhuman, but the folk who lived on these centuries were ****ing nuts. This is why it is important to recognise these past tyrants and what they did, and use it to shape a future free of racism and free of repression against none indigenous peoples, but then again, are any people’s truly indigenous apart from the likes of the indigenous people of Australia who are repressed.... and again so blatantly so. 
 

I think the sentiment is, statues of people like Carlston are scars, and nothing can heal unless the scar is treated, treat the scar (remove the statue) and allow things to heal? 
 

Everything I have just said is probably bollocks, I’ve had a few mid week beers.

One of the most rounded posts on the matter 

[Guest TamworthFoxes]

5 hours ago, nnfox said:

Thank you.  I don't think you have read this wrong, the figures seem pretty straightforward.  The bit I'm not sure about though is whether these figures show that the police are systematic racists (which I don't believe they are) or it highlights broader inequality issues.  Either way, it is a surprise.

Another theory which would fit the statistics are that black people commit more crime?

Im pretty sure police make arrests and solve the crimes which they are presented with? Surely no one is suggesting they go out and ignore crime by white offenders in order to concentrate on black offenders?

[leicsmac]

3 hours ago, TamworthFoxes said:

Another theory which would fit the statistics are that black people commit more crime?

Im pretty sure police make arrests and solve the crimes which they are presented with? Surely no one is suggesting they go out and ignore crime by white offenders in order to concentrate on black offenders?

I'll preface the following sentence by saying post-Macpherson Report some really massive steps have been made...

 

In an ideal world the above would be true - but it is isn't and it's not, in probably a few cases in the UK and in vastly more in the US.

Edited 11 June 2020 by leicsmac

[WigstonWanderer]

Washington, Jefferson, Mount Rushmore?

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-40978515