Ukraine

[FoxesDeb]

The BBC are reporting that the Russians have used thermobaric weapons, is that the horrific looking thing that was posted in a video in the war thread? 

[Strokes]

2 minutes ago, FoxesDeb said:

The BBC are reporting that the Russians have used thermobaric weapons, is that the horrific looking thing that was posted in a video in the war thread? 

Yeah the 30 rockets in a minute thing 

[whoareyaaa]

1 hour ago, UniFox21 said:

The news China has evacuated it's first wave of citizens worries me. 

It's either China giving the indication this is wrong, or more worryingly, they know it's about to kick up another level

I thought this was a bit odd from NATO countries telling there citizens to get out but for China to do that something must be in the works.

 

Maybe they are going after putin after all.

[SpacedX]

29 minutes ago, FoxesDeb said:

The BBC are reporting that the Russians have used thermobaric weapons, is that the horrific looking thing that was posted in a video in the war thread? 

This was coming. We knew that they were being deployed and they have previously used them on civilians in Syria. Vacuum bombs are banned by the Geneva Convention.  

[Zear0]

36 minutes ago, FoxesDeb said:

The BBC are reporting that the Russians have used thermobaric weapons, is that the horrific looking thing that was posted in a video in the war thread? 

The thermobaric weapons are the missiles that explode a spray of combustabke vapour which ignites creating a vacuum and a horrific shock waves. This combined with videos of cluster munitions are two verified and documented examples of warcrimes. It's utterly despicable. 

[Thefox81]

59 minutes ago, Mike Oxlong said:

And you’ll see from my earlier post that I recognise and appreciate the contribution of those who manage the forum 

 

However, on this occasion I believe that the better approach would be to delete offending posts or even pages without removing the whole thread. There was a lot of good material and discussion and information and opinions that should have remained accessible. I can’t believe that the work to remove offending posts or relevant pages was so much more onerous to merit losing the entirety of the thread’s content. Normally I’d take no issue with the broad brush approach but not in this case. 

I agree. I was learning a lot from that thread regarding the equipment, vechiles, weaponary and rules regarding war.

[whoareyaaa]

If that TOS attack is considered a war crime then surely NATO get involved.

[Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot]

And anyone talking about validity of British nukes and the likes, this thread is about the Ukraine and that thread was simply titled war so technically nuclear weapons very much on topic in that thread. 

[yorkie1999]

I know it’s a daft idea, but do all these russian troops know that they are killing civilians? Do they know they’re a actually in a war or do they think they’re still on manoeuvres? Seems whenever they get captured they look bemused, or is that just Ukrainian propaganda. They don’t actually see the enemy until it’s too late, you don’t see someone then fire a missile at them, you’re given coordinates where to aim at, that might be 50 miles away. Stupid thought.

[Jon the Hat]

1 minute ago, whoareyaaa said:

If that TOS attack is considered a war crime then surely NATO get involved.

NATO are not going to get involved in a direct war with Russia unless Russia attacks a NATO member directly and deliberately.

[whoareyaaa]

Have Ukraine got no planes or helicopters? surely you would be carpet bombing that Russian convoy

[st albans fox]

6 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

NATO are not going to get involved in a direct war with Russia unless Russia attacks a NATO member directly and deliberately.

At the moment this is true but the actions of the Russian army over the next few days will dictate if it remains the same 
 

2 minutes ago, whoareyaaa said:

Have Ukraine got no planes or helicopters? surely you would be carpet bombing that Russian convoy

I believe the Ukraine Air Force isn’t much of a thing - both sides have plenty of anti aircraft missiles - hence there isn’t much currently going on in the skies 

[Trumpet]

5 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

At the moment this is true but the actions of the Russian army over the next few days will dictate if it remains the same 
 

I believe the Ukraine Air Force isn’t much of a thing - both sides have plenty of anti aircraft missiles - hence there isn’t much currently going on in the skies 

Are they planning to attack a NATO member in the next few days?

[SpacedX]

1 hour ago, The Year Of The Fox said:

I think the longer this drags on, the less the likelihood of some internal coup or assassination is too. 

Vladimir Putin presides over a hand picked tight cabal of like minded staff that he exercises complete control over. The Politburo no longer exists. He has complete control. 

 

Nonetheless, despite what it may have become, Russia isn't about one man, it's about centuries of Imperialism - ironically precisely the root of Vlad's personal crusade, but if it backfires on Russia - then, perhaps, he should be thinking 'beware the ides of March'. 

[Fazzer 7]

9 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

At the moment this is true but the actions of the Russian army over the next few days will dictate if it remains the same 
 

I believe the Ukraine Air Force isn’t much of a thing - both sides have plenty of anti aircraft missiles - hence there isn’t much currently going on in the skies 

I have seen tv footage showing at least 6 Ukrainian jets destroyed where they stood on the ground. 

[ARTY_FOX]

39 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

I know it’s a daft idea, but do all these russian troops know that they are killing civilians? Do they know they’re a actually in a war or do they think they’re still on manoeuvres? Seems whenever they get captured they look bemused, or is that just Ukrainian propaganda. They don’t actually see the enemy until it’s too late, you don’t see someone then fire a missile at them, you’re given coordinates where to aim at, that might be 50 miles away. Stupid thought.

You still have someone who can see the target telling the missiles where to go, that's boots on the ground. I do beleive some don't know what they're doing there until they're in the thick of it though. 

[st albans fox]

26 minutes ago, Trumpet said:

Are they planning to attack a NATO member in the next few days?

Nope

 

but if they start indiscriminately bombing the hell out of Kiev, day after day, then public opinion in the west won’t stand for it without an intervention of some kind ….

[Trumpet]

3 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Nope

 

but if they start indiscriminately bombing the hell out of Kiev, day after day, then public opinion in the west won’t stand for it without an intervention of some kind ….

I don’t think an intervention in terms of direct conflict can happen, it’d be catastrophic. Not to say what’s happening in Ukraine isn’t catastrophic, mind.

[casablancas]

51 minutes ago, whoareyaaa said:

Have Ukraine got no planes or helicopters? surely you would be carpet bombing that Russian convoy

They’ll pick them off piece meal as the enter the city. It depends on how much damage the Ukrainian government are willing to take. Which atm sounds like total. It’s horribly fascinating to see how it plays. But I pray for the Ukrainian people and an end. I think I may be a sad one. 

[Spiritwalker]

16 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Nope

 

but if they start indiscriminately bombing the hell out of Kiev, day after day, then public opinion in the west won’t stand for it without an intervention of some kind ….

From what we’ve seen over the last few days it’s fair to say that government positions are being changed by 

public opinions.

[NasPb]

when the precedent is set that some can invade other soviergn nations without consequences, dictators like Putin are bound to try it out themselves. just like what saddam did. no invasion or attack on any foreign nation can be justified, im sorry. and i dont believe for one bit that even if there is a majority pro russian majority in the east that invasion is justifiable. never in a million years. we all know whos truly suffeirng, not western govs, not eastern govs, rather the people who are in ukraine right now. hopefully peace is with them sooner rather than later. 

 

the best hope in my eyes is the russian masses rising up against the war. without popular support it wont last. lets hope for the best

Edited 1 March 2022 by NasPb

[SpacedX]

1 minute ago, NasPb said:

im sorry. and i dont believe for one bit that even if there is a majority pro russian majority in the east that invasion is justifiable. 

Each province voted for independence from Russia - even the Crimea. Also, the linguistic differences and discrimination towards Russian speakers is largely disinformation since most Ukrainians are bilingual. 

[weller54]

47 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Nope

 

but if they start indiscriminately bombing the hell out of Kiev, day after day, then public opinion in the west won’t stand for it without an intervention of some kind ….

....but that's the dilemma. What kind of intervention ?..

Nato won't get directly involved in the fighting as that will start a nuclear war!

Personally I think Ukraine will fall and there will be a huge humanitarian disaster in trying to relocate tens of millions of refugees. Nato will then put a massive defensive force across Eastern Europe.

Sanctions will take affect on the Russian people in a couple of years and hopefully that will lead to the fall of Putin's regime.

Hopefully the people of Ukraine can be repatriated at some point in the future.

Edited 1 March 2022 by weller54

[Sampson]

48 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Nope

 

but if they start indiscriminately bombing the hell out of Kiev, day after day, then public opinion in the west won’t stand for it without an intervention of some kind ….

The West/NATO won't intervene militarily as as soon as it does that's essentially WW3 and potentially nuclear war.

Edited 1 March 2022 by Sampson

[LiberalFox]

Unless something really kicked off last night I just assume the mods felt "Ukraine" was a more appropriate topic title to represent what we are discussing since a whole bunch of the opening posts of this one were in the "war" topic last night. 

 

As for the topic in hand, starting yesterday it seems Russia is resorting to what people feared and using its artillery and rockets to bombard population centres. Using these weapons it that way is almost certainly a war crime. Saw some truly awful images of the aftermath yesterday.