Top

[Babylon]

52 minutes ago, Shane said:

Also the sustainable, comply with ffp, sell 1 player to build the squad model was a load of bullsh*t to hide the fact our owners cant financially compete at the highest level.
 

Bournemouth, Villa, Brighton & Brentford currently have a net spend of 40m+ and will probably spend more.

Ha ha what on earth are you talking about. They’ve never hidden the fact they wanted to compete, but in a sustainable way. Which means spending money on infrastructure and trying to build the club up in size, it was never hidden.

 

It’s also incredibly difficult to do. But they’ve still put more money in personally than most owners who just load clubs with debt.

 

The notion that there are billionaires just waiting to spend their own money on Leicester is beyond laughable. What you’ll get is more debt, no infrastructure and money taken out to service the debts that it took to buy the club. 

 

 

[Albert]

1 hour ago, Shane said:

Also the sustainable, comply with ffp, sell 1 player to build the squad model was a load of bullsh*t to hide the fact our owners cant financially compete at the highest level.
 

Bournemouth, Villa, Brighton & Brentford currently have a net spend of 40m+ and will probably spend more.

U reckon they’ll spend £120m on a new training ground, £80m a yr on player salaries & £10m a yr on their managers? 

[Ric Flair]

Top's under real scrutiny now. The debacle of us losing our PL status in such a fast and aggressive decline has been shocking. How him and the directors navigate us from here is key.

 

On the face of it so far, it doesn't appear much has drastically changed and that really concerns me. I don't think they truly grasp the gravity of our situation nor take accountability for their failures. So, without another huge slice of good fortune the deterioration of Leicester City may continue.

 

I'm starting to lose trust in the ownership, the blind loyalty of Jon Rudkin and the arrogance of him being appointed in about 4 different jobs across the King Power corporation, all of which ought to be full time to do them justice is galling. At the very least we should have appointed a Sporting Director alongside him who can focus fully on Leicester City.

 

I hope the vision of Vichai and Top had all those years ago gets back on course for us to be a long term sustainable and innovative PL club but we're a far cry from that now and Top needs some divine inspiration. 

[Babylon]

9 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Top's under real scrutiny now. The debacle of us losing our PL status in such a fast and aggressive decline has been shocking. How him and the directors navigate us from here is key.

 

On the face of it so far, it doesn't appear much has drastically changed and that really concerns me. I don't think they truly grasp the gravity of our situation nor take accountability for their failures. So, without another huge slice of good fortune the deterioration of Leicester City may continue.

 

I'm starting to lose trust in the ownership, the blind loyalty of Jon Rudkin and the arrogance of him being appointed in about 4 different jobs across the King Power corporation, all of which ought to be full time to do them justice is galling. At the very least we should have appointed a Sporting Director alongside him who can focus fully on Leicester City.

 

I hope the vision of Vichai and Top had all those years ago gets back on course for us to be a long term sustainable and innovative PL club but we're a far cry from that now and Top needs some divine inspiration. 

You and I don’t know who made what decisions, so we don’t know who is to blame, we don’t know who has taken accountability for any poor decisions, if any.

 

We simply have no idea.
 

It would be nice if someone sat down and answers questions so that we could have answers. But that very rarely happens unless a company is publicly accountable. 

People are so quick to bash anything and everything without facts. Does anyone here know how much time is taken up with KP horse racing for instance? Whether other staff have been brought in to allow him to do that work? Etc

[Daggers]

If Babs isn’t actually Rudkin, I’m prepared to pop money on him being related.

[Babylon]

1 hour ago, Daggers said:

If Babs isn’t actually Rudkin, I’m prepared to pop money on him being related.

Is what I say wrong?

[Shane]

3 hours ago, Babylon said:

Ha ha what on earth are you talking about. They’ve never hidden the fact they wanted to compete, but in a sustainable way. Which means spending money on infrastructure and trying to build the club up in size, it was never hidden.

 

It’s also incredibly difficult to do. But they’ve still put more money in personally than most owners who just load clubs with debt.

 

The notion that there are billionaires just waiting to spend their own money on Leicester is beyond laughable. What you’ll get is more debt, no infrastructure and money taken out to service the debts that it took to buy the club. 

 

 

ok fair enough !! to be fair we are certainly lucky to have our owners when you think of some of the alternatives 

[Daggers]

47 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Is what I say wrong?

You seem to be a bit too angry these days, well irritable at least, so I’m giving this a wide pass

[Chrysalis]

16 hours ago, Albert said:

U reckon they’ll spend £120m on a new training ground, £80m a yr on player salaries & £10m a yr on their managers? 

Are those good points?

 

We broke our wage structure which eventually led us down a unsustainable path.

The training ground has yet to show any benefit, and is some evidence of regressing the mentality of our players.

Are Celtic managing to employ Rodgers on a lower salary than we did?

[SafewayFox]

I love how any comment without 100% evidence on here gets shot down.

 

If only newspapers worked in the same way, we would never have anything to read about.

 

It’s quite simple, we have previously been successful under the KP ownership, how much of that was down to luck/investment is a topic for a different day.

 

However, on face value, right now and for the past couple of seasons, the direction/leadership appears to be lacking with this evidenced with our avoidable relegation, losing “x amount” on players winding down their contract and allowing OUR manager (at the time) to publicly throw shade at said owners and gaslighting our players to believe they’re worthless.

 

 

 

[Babylon]

5 hours ago, SafewayFox said:

I love how any comment without 100% evidence on here gets shot down.

 

If only newspapers worked in the same way, we would never have anything to read about.

 

It’s quite simple, we have previously been successful under the KP ownership, how much of that was down to luck/investment is a topic for a different day.

 

However, on face value, right now and for the past couple of seasons, the direction/leadership appears to be lacking with this evidenced with our avoidable relegation, losing “x amount” on players winding down their contract and allowing OUR manager (at the time) to publicly throw shade at said owners and gaslighting our players to believe they’re worthless.

 

 

 

No, you confuse people posting like what they are saying is fact getting shot down via valid opinion / questioning.

 

I'll make this simple:

1) Rudkin spends too much time working on KP Racing, it means he's doing a poor job.

2) I'm not sure Rudkin working across several arms of Kingpower is the best use of a sporting directors time. If it's detracting from his work at LCFC, then I'd prefer he wasn't doing that as well. 

 

You can still comment on things we don't know as 100% fact, both posts are expressing a very similar point, but they read entirely differently. 

 

Funny that you mention newspapers, good newspapers, that are trusted and respected use facts to report and not opinion pieces 

[Babylon]

23 hours ago, Daggers said:

You seem to be a bit too angry these days, well irritable at least, so I’m giving this a wide pass

I was born irritable. 

[mozartfox]

On 31/07/2023 at 08:01, Babylon said:

You and I don’t know who made what decisions, so we don’t know who is to blame, we don’t know who has taken accountability for any poor decisions, if any.

 

We simply have no idea.
 

It would be nice if someone sat down and answers questions so that we could have answers. But that very rarely happens unless a company is publicly accountable. 

People are so quick to bash anything and everything without facts. Does anyone here know how much time is taken up with KP horse racing for instance? Whether other staff have been brought in to allow him to do that work? Etc

There are others quick to defend without facts too.  You simply cannot be a DoF and not be seriously to blame for the failures that have hit our Club.

[Babylon]

14 minutes ago, mozartfox said:

There are others quick to defend without facts too. 

You simply cannot be a DoF and not be seriously to blame for the failures that have hit our Club.

Quick to defend without facts? Burden of proof is on the accuser, if they have no proof then it's perhaps best to rephrase what people are saying. 

 

And if the people who out rank you gave the instructions? Of Course he's likely to be to blame for some stuff, nobody is absolving him of everything and anything. 

 

As I've said before, you either believe that the man at the top is ultimately responsible, which is either Top or the KP board and its Chairman (Vichais widow). Or you believe in collective responsibility, in which case Rudkin isn't the boogie man to blame for anything and everything. 

[mozartfox]

You have been watching to many re-runs of Rombold of the Bailey - burden of proof?? This is not a criminal Court. It’s a forum where people have different opinions and where yours is not always the correct one! 

[Daggers]

1 minute ago, mozartfox said:

You have been watching to many re-runs of Rombold of the Bailey - burden of proof?? This is not a criminal Court. It’s a forum where people have different opinions and where yours is not always the correct one! 

This is FT, home of the pedant.

 

Its Rumpole. 

[Dames]

30 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Quick to defend without facts? Burden of proof is on the accuser, if they have no proof then it's perhaps best to rephrase what people are saying. 

 

And if the people who out rank you gave the instructions? Of Course he's likely to be to blame for some stuff, nobody is absolving him of everything and anything. 

 

As I've said before, you either believe that the man at the top is ultimately responsible, which is either Top or the KP board and its Chairman (Vichais widow). Or you believe in collective responsibility, in which case Rudkin isn't the boogie man to blame for anything and everything. 

Its not as black and white as that though and you know it. There are elements of the person being in charge being ultimately responsible as well as collective responsibility within the remits they cover. Look at the Farage scandal for example, the CTO didn't resign because the CEO messed up in their remit because it is not their remit. The same applies here, Rudkin bears responsibility for the sporting successes and failure so the recent failures are 100% within his remit. If they are not then you have to question exactly what is going on at the club and things are a lot worse than they appear. 

 

Ultimately what i'm getting at is that Top/Board and Rudkin both bear responsibility for this. 

[Babylon]

24 minutes ago, Dames said:

Its not as black and white as that though and you know it. There are elements of the person being in charge being ultimately responsible as well as collective responsibility within the remits they cover. Look at the Farage scandal for example, the CTO didn't resign because the CEO messed up in their remit because it is not their remit. The same applies here, Rudkin bears responsibility for the sporting successes and failure so the recent failures are 100% within his remit. If they are not then you have to question exactly what is going on at the club and things are a lot worse than they appear. 

 

Ultimately what i'm getting at is that Top/Board and Rudkin both bear responsibility for this. 

So collective responsibility then, there are four or five people on the board, one of which isn’t Rudkin and they also answer to the KP board and it’s chairman.

 

So the reality is, KP, Top, The board, Whelan, the manager, his head of recruitment etc all share an element of responsibility. 
 

The reality is, we don’t know the facts of any situation. For all we know, Rudkin advised the board and they overruled him. Alternatively he could have badly advised them. This is exactly why I’m not interested in pointing fingers at individuals. 

[Tommy G]

5 hours ago, Babylon said:

So collective responsibility then, there are four or five people on the board, one of which isn’t Rudkin and they also answer to the KP board and it’s chairman.

 

So the reality is, KP, Top, The board, Whelan, the manager, his head of recruitment etc all share an element of responsibility. 
 

The reality is, we don’t know the facts of any situation. For all we know, Rudkin advised the board and they overruled him. Alternatively he could have badly advised them. This is exactly why I’m not interested in pointing fingers at individuals. 

No-one knows what happens at board level unless you are on the board, which is the whole point of it. You are absolutely right and anyone can only speculate. The auditors will know what has been minuted as they will be privy to it. I;m not sure if Rudkin was on the board or not, I think he probably was. Top, SW, JR and Simon Capper I suspect - maybe a cpl of Non execs. 

[Gamble92]

7 hours ago, Babylon said:

Quick to defend without facts? Burden of proof is on the accuser, if they have no proof then it's perhaps best to rephrase what people are saying. 

 

And if the people who out rank you gave the instructions? Of Course he's likely to be to blame for some stuff, nobody is absolving him of everything and anything. 

 

As I've said before, you either believe that the man at the top is ultimately responsible, which is either Top or the KP board and its Chairman (Vichais widow). Or you believe in collective responsibility, in which case Rudkin isn't the boogie man to blame for anything and everything. 

Put it this way if they're prepared to come on and parade the Premier League trophy then they're accepting responsibility for everything in my book.

 

Works both ways.

[richard123]

Same board won us the premiership and fa cup. Something we could have only dreamed off a century ago. 

 

There has been major **** ups somewhere across the top tier management. But relegation can happen to anyone. Toon were down not so long ago. These mistakes were a combination over a few seasons. And I largely blame Bodgers who will have had an influence in a lot of it. 

 

I think reading many threads recently there is still an air of some unreasonable negativity. Top is investing in a complete 1st team management set up (manager and coaches). I am reasonably happy with the calabre of players brought it. Winks, Coady are class signings for a championship team. Plus the new winger is a step above what most teams in this league can produce. We have players that are easily in the top 5 for the position in this league. Most our defence, dewsbury Hall, winks. Vards, nacho. 

 

Let's not forget, didn't he recently write off another large debt the club had to KP? He's still committed.

 

Lets get positive and get the **** out of this league. If not this season, certainly next. 

 

We arent throwing money around unreasonably, which prob means the books are being balanced and / or we are reserving for when we do go back up. 

 

I still have trust in Top.

[HitchinFox]

Humans are pattern-seeking mammals. It means we have an in-built need to find answers - which has driven our development as a species. 

 

While it's one of our greatest strengths, it's also one of our weaknesses, as we are often prepared to accept a bad explanation, not based on reality, over no explanation. Hence the popularity of conspiracy theories, horoscopes, thousands of different religions and Nigel Farage. 

 

That in mind, it's easy to see why there is a drive to find a culprit for what has been a highly frustrating and even emotional period - our relegation.

 

But, as we don't know all the facts about the club's inner workings  - which@Babylon rightly points out - all we can do is guess. 

 

So, I blame Rudkin. 

[Babylon]

3 hours ago, HitchinFox said:

Humans are pattern-seeking mammals. It means we have an in-built need to find answers - which has driven our development as a species. 

 

While it's one of our greatest strengths, it's also one of our weaknesses, as we are often prepared to accept a bad explanation, not based on reality, over no explanation. Hence the popularity of conspiracy theories, horoscopes, thousands of different religions and Nigel Farage. 

 

That in mind, it's easy to see why there is a drive to find a culprit for what has been a highly frustrating and even emotional period - our relegation.

 

But, as we don't know all the facts about the club's inner workings  - which@Babylon rightly points out - all we can do is guess. 

 

So, I blame Rudkin. 

Made me laugh more than it probably should have. 

[FoxFossil]

3 hours ago, HitchinFox said:

Humans are pattern-seeking mammals. It means we have an in-built need to find answers - which has driven our development as a species. 

 

While it's one of our greatest strengths, it's also one of our weaknesses, as we are often prepared to accept a bad explanation, not based on reality, over no explanation. Hence the popularity of conspiracy theories, horoscopes, thousands of different religions and Nigel Farage. 

 

That in mind, it's easy to see why there is a drive to find a culprit for what has been a highly frustrating and even emotional period - our relegation.

 

But, as we don't know all the facts about the club's inner workings  - which@Babylon rightly points out - all we can do is guess. 

 

So, I blame Rudkin. 

Post works best if you read it a David Attenborough voice.

[Happy Fox]

New ownership pretty please not a lot has changed..