Brexit Discussion Thread.

[Buce]

7 minutes ago, surrifox said:

They don't need to make it up just get selective quotes from individuals and a lot of coulda woulda shoulda - isn't that how fake news works ?

 

The report is available for all to read.

 

Perhaps your copy of the Sun might mention it.

 

If not, you can read it here:

https://www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/lords-select/eu-energy-environment-subcommittee/news-parliament-2015/brexit-agr-rpt/

 

[Guest MattP]

7 hours ago, ajthefox said:

 

I realise you're trying to point out the hypocrisy Carl but I don't agree and I think the first part of Si's response is pretty much spot on.

 

I never wanted this but since the vote a significant part of me has actually warmed to the idea precisely because of the attitude the EU has projected publicly.

You aren't the first person I have heard this from in the last few days.

 

As I've said a few times, the Brits will never be a nation who can be bullied into thinking something, if anyone in the EU is so daft they think a campaign of smear, leaks and intimidation through the press during the negotiation is going to warm to the project they are in for another big surprise. Marine Le Pen has also closed slightly in the polls (nowhere near enough to win still) since they stuck their nose into that election.

 

1 hour ago, Buce said:

 

What an idiotic thing to say. It is a report from the EU Energy and Environment Subcommittee of the House of Lords, reported in the Guardian.

 

Or are you accusing them of making that up?

Not about the article stated, but overall I would like to see a bit more balance in the press over this upcoming negotiation, the Express etc are going heavy and not giving any criticism of our own government and the Guardian seems to be taking every bit of Brussels spin/propaganda at total face value without question, context, sceptical analysis is needed more than ever.  Although if you think either of those are bad have a read of "The New European" - it wouldn't be out of place in North Korea in terms of it's one sided propaganda.

 

I'm delighted they are trying to get David Davis unsettled and sacked though, that's a compliment in reality, it shows they rate him.

[Innovindil]

Anyone else have this pop into their head when hearing the hundred billion euro "fee" plucked out of thin air? 

 

 

 

[Voll Blau]

2 hours ago, surrifox said:

They don't need to make it up just get selective quotes from individuals and a lot of coulda woulda shoulda - isn't that how fake news works ?

No. No it isn't.

 

Nothing's getting my goat these days more than the misuse of that fvcking phrase. It's not an overarching term for something you, I, anyone else may disagree with or perceive to be biased. It's news that is literally fake, made up.

[davieG]

The Liberal Democrat manifesto will include a commitment to another EU referendum where the party would campaign for Remain, Nick Clegg says.

The former deputy prime minister said that once talks are complete, voters should get two choices - accept the Brexit deal or stay in the EU.

Setting out his party's Brexit position, he claimed leaving the EU would damage the UK economy by £59bn.

Theresa May says she is determined to make a success of Brexit.

 

She says a separation deal can be reached that is good for both the UK and the EU.

But Mr Clegg, who is the Lib Dems' Brexit spokesman, said voters should be able to "judge for themselves whether it is the right future for the country" once talks are complete, which is expected to be in 2019.

"That referendum will offer two choices; accept the deal, or remain in the EU. Liberal Democrats will campaign for a Remain vote," he said.

Mr Clegg said the PM had chosen to "pursue the most extreme and damaging form of Brexit", adding that the fall in the value of sterling would be sharply felt by holidaymakers travelling abroad.

'Specious excuses'

Despite many gloomy pre-referendum economic forecasts having not materialised, Mr Clegg said the "long-term impacts won't start to be felt until 2019 at the earliest".

He claimed a "triple whammy of higher inflation, lower business investment and lower net migration" means that GDP is likely to be 2.4% lower in 2021 than it would have been without the EU referendum.

As a result of extra borrowing, Brexit will have "dented the public finances by £59bn over a five-year period", he predicted.

Mr Clegg also launched an attack on his former partners in government, saying the economic damage from Brexit was "already being felt by the people who the Conservatives have always cared about least: the poor, the insecure and the vulnerable", and that Mrs May had "specious excuses" for calling next month's general election.

A Conservative spokesman said: "Every vote for Theresa May gives her a better hand in Brexit negotiations, helping to get a deal which strengthens our economy and helps UK consumers."

[Strokes]

14 minutes ago, Voll Blau said:

No. No it isn't.

 

Nothing's getting my goat these days more than the misuse of that fvcking phrase. It's not an overarching term for something you, I, anyone else may disagree with or perceive to be biased. It's news that is literally fake, made up.

You are saying Teresa May didn't give Claude Junkman a Rusty Trombone then?

[Alf Bentley]

On 5/1/2017 at 10:52, MattP said:

Long term that is the aim, our trade with Europe was only getting smaller and with the wider World only getting bigger as the graph I have posted shows, one of the reasons the Remain side lost was because they couldn't counter this point.  http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11700443/The-EUs-dwindling-importance-to-UK-trade-in-three-charts.html

 

 

British exports to the EU still grew over this period (see below). They just grew more slowly than exports to non-EU countries, hence the decline as a %. That's to be expected as the EU is mainly a mature developed economy, whereas countries like China and India are at an earlier stage of development, so their economies and trade have grown much more quickly. The US has probably grown slightly quicker than the EU due to particular factors (economies of scale, low labour costs, high immigration). 

 

 

That certainly provides new export opportunities for the UK, but also for the EU, US, China etc.

 

It still isn't a good idea to lose a significant proportion of the export market (EU) that takes 45% of your exports. Who know what percentage of our EU exports we'd lose through a Hard Brexit? Certainly not all of them, probably not most of them - and probably gradually over 2-5 years+. But if British exporters face extra red tape, customs checks, rules of origin and tariffs, they will be less competitive, so it's reasonable to assume significant loss of EU trade. Likewise, if trading conditions with the EU are poorer, there is likely to be less investment by both foreign and British firms impacting on future trade, growth and employment......unless those lost EU exports are replaced very quickly by new markets, we'll be big losers in the short to medium-term.

 

So, can you or another Brexiteer tell us which sectors of the British economy will see an export boom? And to which countries will they be exporting?

 

In another post you mentioned NZ lamb, Chilean wine and Israeli produce, but they're all IMPORTS. No bad thing if we have some cheaper imported food/wine, but what about EXPORTS?

 

Here are some of our leading exports now: http://realbusiness.co.uk/any-other-business/2016/03/28/the-top-ten-uk-exports-in-2016/

...and here's a chart showing net exports by sector:

 

 

So, which sectors are set for an export boom? And which non-EU countries will be receiving all those extra goods and services on generous new trading terms after new trade deals are signed straight after Brexit?

- Finance & Insurance will be at more risk of shrinking, surely, if City institutions move some of their operations to other EU cities? Even an optimist would see limited prospects when the UK is already strong in this sector & will face stronger competition from other EU financial centres

- Chemicals? There might be some growth potential for non-EU exports here....but on what terms?

- Cars? No chance beyond niche markets, surely? Shipping costs rule out distant developed nations, who'll be able to manufacture their own cars cheaper. Purchasing power and/or labour costs will rule out distant developing nations. There might be some scope for exporting high-tech parts....but we'd be competing with the Germans, Americans, Japanese, Chinese, Koreans etc.... and would international car makers losing sales in the EU want to invest in the UK to export outside Europe?!

- Aerospace? There might be some potential here with engines/high-tech, but a lot of our big ventures in the past have involved joint projects with the French, haven't they? 

- Medical devices? If (big IF) trading terms were more favourable post-Brexit, this might be a runner....but surely it's heavily dependent on international research work, often centred on Europe, from which we may be excluded?

- Tourism? Well, the crash in the pound has helped in the short-term (though making holidays more expensive for Brits). So maybe the UK has a future as a cut-price holiday location? Benidorm-on-Trent? But it certainly won't help boost tourism if we trash our national brand as a friendly, tolerant, humorous, quirky nation by turning into a land of snarling xenophobes inhabiting a nation plagued by social problems.

- Computers/I.T? Only likely to surge if we invest more long-term in research, business clusters and education, surely? Even then, there are some powerfully good competitors in the international market.

- Video games? Already doing well here. I've no idea how much growth potential there is.

- Scotch & Salmon? These are included in the list of major exports....well, Sturgeon will certainly see this as a great argument for a referendum.

- Wind turbines? We were ahead of the curve in this growth industry, but the Govt withdrew its financial backing, didn't it?

 

Seriously, though, Brexiteers.... Which are going to be our big growth sectors?

 

As for which non-EU nations will supposedly sign generous new trade deals generating a big rise in profitable exports....

- USA: First we were at the back of the queue for a trade deal, then at the front, now we're back behind the EU, apparently. Let's face it, Trump will be looking to promote US interests. The EU is a much bigger market than an economically isolated post-Brexit UK, so the EU is likely to be the priority for a deal. That could depend on the terms of a deal, though. The Yanks are keen on their private health corporations expanding internationally. They'd also like to export more food and other products....but apply lower food standards, environmental standards etc. So, if we are prepared to flog off the NHS and accept lower food standards, we might be back at the front of the queue.....would we want that?!?

- China & Japan have basically said "let's wait and see what your post-Brexit deal with the EU is". With Hard Brexit, outside the single market, we'll be a much less attractive export/investment destination to them, so we'll be offered much poorer terms, which they'll be able to insist on, as bigger economies. We'd have more to gain from any deal, so we'd have to accept terms inferior to those on offer to a larger entity,,,,such as the US...or the EU

- India sounds willing rhetorically to sign up, but has just cancelled a major bilateral investment deal. It also knows that it is a rising power. It has made clear that it wants looser data protection & copyright control - and a much more generous allocation of student visas. How would that go down with certain Brexit voters - replacing all those Poles/Romanians with hundreds of thousands Indians? Also, despite our connections of history, language and migrant populations, our exports to India are pitifully low. British exports to India are well below those of Germany, Switzerland & even Belgium (amazing that last one - mainly gold & jewels, apparently). We export more to Sweden than to India. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_largest_trading_partners_of_India#Largest_trading_House

 

Let's have some answers from you Brexiteers. What will we be exporting on a much larger scale and where to?

Cars to New Zealand? Surgical trusses to Chile? Scotch to Israel?  

[Izzy]

19 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

Here are some of our leading exports now: http://realbusiness.co.uk/any-other-business/2016/03/28/the-top-ten-uk-exports-in-2016/

...and here's a chart showing net exports by sector:

 

 

 

I like a good pie chart as much as the next man, but when over a quarter of it just states 'other business' that's a bit too vague for me.

[Alf Bentley]

On 5/1/2017 at 12:17, MattP said:

 

"Remainers are now actually saying "We told you Brexit idiots that the EU negotiations would be severe and that the EU27 would set out to punish Britain", not realising that this proves we were right to vote Brexit, the cynicism and meanness of the Brussels oligarchy right now -- their badmouthing of Britain, their leaking of high-level talks with Theresa May, their threats to make an example of us Brits so that other EU nations won't be tempted to follow us is precisely why we voted Leave: because we recognise this is a ruthless, opaque institution that treats democratic nations with utter contempt. The harsher they are to Britain, the happier we are that we voted out.

 

The MattP Guide to Creating a "Straw Man" Argument (example above)

 

1) Quote a ridiculous travesty or extreme version of your opponent's argument

2) Misrepresent this ridiculous statement as somehow representing the opinions of everyone on the other side

3) Claim that this proves you were right to reject the opposing view

4) Optional extra: chuck in a few "joky" references to modern Germans being like Hitler to stir up "defensive nationalism" (previously having ridiculed Ken Livingstone for making similar comparisons need not represent an obstacle)

 

Here is an equivalent example of how to deploy the "Straw Man" technique from a Remainer perspective:

1) Quote a racist saying something about Brexit keeping all the filthy foreigners out.

2) Misrepresent this statement as representing the opinions of everyone who voted Leave

3) Claim that this proves you were right to vote Remain

4) Optional extra: get on Facebook and send a "joky" meme showing a leading Brexit Tory hurting a helpless, photogenic immigrant child so as to polarise the debate and fuel hatred of Brexit supporters 

 

I know that others have expressed similar views about the REAL reasons why the EU will take a hard line, but can only find my own quickly, so apologies for self-quoting....

 

On 1/5/2017 at 15:25, Alf Bentley said:

 

Unless there's a dramatic change in European politics in the next 1-2 years (e.g. the election of Le Pen), it seems clear to me that it will be in the interests of the main EU states and of the EU as a whole, to cut a tough Brexit deal with the UK. Purely in terms of their national politics, the likes of Merkel, Fillon (if elected), the Dutch and the Italians won't want to give succour to rising nationalist / anti-establishment forces in their own countries. If they allowed the UK a good Brexit deal, they would do just that as the likes of the Front National and AfD would be emboldened to demand similar deals. Likewise, EU-wide, a generous Brexit deal would make life much harder for the EU as it tries to maintain unity and the ability to deal with the crises on the continent. I'm not suggesting that there'll be no compromise - I'm sure there will be compromise, in the interests of both sides. But it seems to be of existential importance to the EU27 and to its main nations that the UK should be seen by the European public NOT to have benefited from Brexit....that's pure self-interest, which they're as entitled to pursue as the UK is. Particularly if it is under pressure for not negotiating a better deal and for economic problems, I can imagine the UK Govt (& media) blaming the EU for the lack of a good deal. That could easily generate xenophobia among Brits bitter that their lives aren't as good as they'd been led to expect - including hostility towards foreigners in this country. I seriously hope that I'm wrong about that, but it's a justifiable fear.

 

I don't believe for a minute that the EU is "setting out to punish Britain", as your straw man argument goes, Matt. But I do stand by that comment above.

 

Unfortunately, it looks as if you're going to be one of the people described in the second to last sentence: blaming the EU for standing up for its own interests and for Brexit not yielding the great trade deals and great new future for Britain that was promised by the Leave campaign. I hope you don't also become one of the people described in the last sentence, those promoting xenophobia....your references to Hitler and banks v. tanks isn't a good start, even if meant in humour.

 

As you sometimes say to others, Matt: "Come on, mate, you're better than this!" 

[Nick]

11 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

The MattP Guide to Creating a "Straw Man" Argument (example above)

 

1) Quote a ridiculous travesty or extreme version of your opponent's argument

2) Misrepresent this ridiculous statement as somehow representing the opinions of everyone on the other side

3) Claim that this proves you were right to reject the opposing view

4) Optional extra: chuck in a few "joky" references to modern Germans being like Hitler to stir up "defensive nationalism" (previously having ridiculed Ken Livingstone for making similar comparisons need not represent an obstacle)

 

Here is an equivalent example of how to deploy the "Straw Man" technique from a Remainer perspective:

1) Quote a racist saying something about Brexit keeping all the filthy foreigners out.

2) Misrepresent this statement as representing the opinions of everyone who voted Leave

3) Claim that this proves you were right to vote Remain

4) Optional extra: get on Facebook and send a "joky" meme showing a leading Brexit Tory hurting a helpless, photogenic immigrant child so as to polarise the debate and fuel hatred of Brexit supporters 

 

I know that others have expressed similar views about the REAL reasons why the EU will take a hard line, but can only find my own quickly, so apologies for self-quoting....

 

 

I don't believe for a minute that the EU is "setting out to punish Britain", as your straw man argument goes, Matt. But I do stand by that comment above.

 

Unfortunately, it looks as if you're going to be one of the people described in the second to last sentence: blaming the EU for standing up for its own interests and for Brexit not yielding the great trade deals and great new future for Britain that was promised by the Leave campaign. I hope you don't also become one of the people described in the last sentence, those promoting xenophobia....your references to Hitler and banks v. tanks isn't a good start, even if meant in humour.

 

As you sometimes say to others, Matt: "Come on, mate, you're better than this!" 

 

 

A fvcking men to that.

 

+1000

[Alf Bentley]

42 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

I like a good pie chart as much as the next man, but when over a quarter of it just states 'other business' that's a bit too vague for me.

 

Fair comment. Maybe someone else could find a better graphic of UK exports by sector?

 

If Hard Brexit happens, it is reasonable to assume that we'll lose a chunk of our EU exports within a few years (big or small chunk, I don't know).

Most pro-Brexit folk assume that this will be offset by a significant increase in UK exports to non-EU countries.

 

So, it would be good to hear from Brexiteers as to which sectors they think will experience an export boom - and which countries those exports will be going to.

[Buce]

45 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

The MattP Guide to Creating a "Straw Man" Argument (example above)

 

1) Quote a ridiculous travesty or extreme version of your opponent's argument

2) Misrepresent this ridiculous statement as somehow representing the opinions of everyone on the other side

3) Claim that this proves you were right to reject the opposing view

4) Optional extra: chuck in a few "joky" references to modern Germans being like Hitler to stir up "defensive nationalism" (previously having ridiculed Ken Livingstone for making similar comparisons need not represent an obstacle)

 

Here is an equivalent example of how to deploy the "Straw Man" technique from a Remainer perspective:

1) Quote a racist saying something about Brexit keeping all the filthy foreigners out.

2) Misrepresent this statement as representing the opinions of everyone who voted Leave

3) Claim that this proves you were right to vote Remain

4) Optional extra: get on Facebook and send a "joky" meme showing a leading Brexit Tory hurting a helpless, photogenic immigrant child so as to polarise the debate and fuel hatred of Brexit supporters 

 

I know that others have expressed similar views about the REAL reasons why the EU will take a hard line, but can only find my own quickly, so apologies for self-quoting....

 

 

I don't believe for a minute that the EU is "setting out to punish Britain", as your straw man argument goes, Matt. But I do stand by that comment above.

 

Unfortunately, it looks as if you're going to be one of the people described in the second to last sentence: blaming the EU for standing up for its own interests and for Brexit not yielding the great trade deals and great new future for Britain that was promised by the Leave campaign. I hope you don't also become one of the people described in the last sentence, those promoting xenophobia....your references to Hitler and banks v. tanks isn't a good start, even if meant in humour.

 

As you sometimes say to others, Matt: "Come on, mate, you're better than this!" 

 

 

[leicsmac]

3 hours ago, Voll Blau said:

No. No it isn't.

 

Nothing's getting my goat these days more than the misuse of that fvcking phrase. It's not an overarching term for something you, I, anyone else may disagree with or perceive to be biased. It's news that is literally fake, made up.

 

You can thank Mr Trump and his band of merry men/assorted other turkeys voting for Christmas for that, with a particular mention for Mr Bannon and his sterling "alternative" media work. It's quite remarkable just how successful that's been - in the way that watching a slow-motion car crash to understand the physics of it all is remarkable.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

Fair comment. Maybe someone else could find a better graphic of UK exports by sector?

 

If Hard Brexit happens, it is reasonable to assume that we'll lose a chunk of our EU exports within a few years (big or small chunk, I don't know).

Most pro-Brexit folk assume that this will be offset by a significant increase in UK exports to non-EU countries.

 

So, it would be good to hear from Brexiteers as to which sectors they think will experience an export boom - and which countries those exports will be going to.

I've asked a number of open questions of brexiteers recently and they won't answer any of them. They're only tactic appears to be repeating soundbites and pointing the finger at anybody that didn't vote their way. 

[Sharpe's Fox]

Good interview with Yanis Varoufakis on the nature of the negotiation strategy of the EU

 

 

[Nick]

2 minutes ago, Sharpe's Fox said:

Good interview with Yanis Varoufakis on the nature of the negotiation strategy of the EU

 

 

 

 

Sure but let's not allow the thread to become too distracted with Brexit politics from MattP getting owned.

[Sharpe's Fox]

4 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

 

 

Sure but let's not allow the thread to become too distracted with Brexit politics from MattP getting owned.

Oh this was a front to doing just that. I was anticipating Matt giving me the rep because Varoufakis agreed with him on the nature of the EU then BAM I'd chastise him for agreeing with a self confessed Marxist who goes round riding motorcycles in leather trousers.

[Izzy]

 

7 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

 

Sure but let's not allow the thread to become too distracted with Brexit politics from MattP getting owned.

I'm reliably informed that Matt is busy preparing his response as we speak.

There's every evidence that he will indeed put Alf right back in his box and come out swinging once again. 

I think he's called a press conference for 3pm and the world's media are busy gathering.

We wait with baited breath 

[sphericalfox]

35 minutes ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

 

I'm reliably informed that Matt is busy preparing his response as we speak.

There's every evidence that he will indeed put Alf right back in his box and come out swinging once again. 

I think he's called a press conference for 3pm and the world's media are busy gathering.

We wait with baited breath 

Sean Spicer has competition?

[Guest MattP]

3 hours ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

The MattP Guide to Creating a "Straw Man" Argument (example above)

 

1) Quote a ridiculous travesty or extreme version of your opponent's argument

2) Misrepresent this ridiculous statement as somehow representing the opinions of everyone on the other side

3) Claim that this proves you were right to reject the opposing view

4) Optional extra: chuck in a few "joky" references to modern Germans being like Hitler to stir up "defensive nationalism" (previously having ridiculed Ken Livingstone for making similar comparisons need not represent an obstacle)

 

Here is an equivalent example of how to deploy the "Straw Man" technique from a Remainer perspective:

1) Quote a racist saying something about Brexit keeping all the filthy foreigners out.

2) Misrepresent this statement as representing the opinions of everyone who voted Leave

3) Claim that this proves you were right to vote Remain

4) Optional extra: get on Facebook and send a "joky" meme showing a leading Brexit Tory hurting a helpless, photogenic immigrant child so as to polarise the debate and fuel hatred of Brexit supporters 

 

I know that others have expressed similar views about the REAL reasons why the EU will take a hard line, but can only find my own quickly, so apologies for self-quoting....

 

 

I don't believe for a minute that the EU is "setting out to punish Britain", as your straw man argument goes, Matt. But I do stand by that comment above.

 

Unfortunately, it looks as if you're going to be one of the people described in the second to last sentence: blaming the EU for standing up for its own interests and for Brexit not yielding the great trade deals and great new future for Britain that was promised by the Leave campaign. I hope you don't also become one of the people described in the last sentence, those promoting xenophobia....your references to Hitler and banks v. tanks isn't a good start, even if meant in humour.

 

As you sometimes say to others, Matt: "Come on, mate, you're better than this!" 

Hi Alf, you someone managed to miss the top part of my post when you quoted me as the example for your comeback. (I've bolded it for you below)

 

On 5/1/2017 at 12:17, MattP said:

 I'm due one. 

 

Stolen this from a mates Facebook page as it pretty much sums up how I feel regarding what is currently happening.....

 

"Remainers are now actually saying "We told you Brexit idiots that the EU negotiations would be severe and that the EU27 would set out to punish Britain", not realising that this proves we were right to vote Brexit, the cynicism and meanness of the Brussels oligarchy right now -- their badmouthing of Britain, their leaking of high-level talks with Theresa May, their threats to make an example of us Brits so that other EU nations won't be tempted to follow us is precisely why we voted Leave: because we recognise this is a ruthless, opaque institution that treats democratic nations with utter contempt. The harsher they are to Britain, the happier we are that we voted out.

So unfortunately not the "The MattP Guide to Creating a "Straw Man" Argument " but rather the "Brendan O'Neill" one or  "The MattP guide to lifting someone elses work to express how he feels". (he has an open Facebook page so feel free to take a look)

 

No need to tell me I'm better than this as I wouldn't even want to be even if I was, he's one of my favourite columnists, writes for the Spectator and is also a cracking guy to boot. If I achieve half as much I'll be delighted.

 

 

51 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

Sure but let's not allow the thread to become too distracted with Brexit politics from MattP getting owned.

You really need a hobby Nick, it's not healthy for a grown man to be sat on the internet in the middle of the afternoon getting giddy and excited at someone they don't like getting owned by someone they do. It's actually quite tragic.

 

[Strokes]

Shots fired?  

[Nick]

2 minutes ago, MattP said:

 

You really need a hobby Nick, it's not healthy for a grown man to be sat on the internet in the middle of the afternoon getting giddy and excited at someone they don't like getting owned by someone they do. It's actually quite tragic.

 

 

 

Wow  my comment was made in good spirit but obviously has touched a nerve...

 

I need a hobby?

 

Really?

 

You are a one man political FT spin doctor, who's entire life appears dedicated to ensuring you shape these threads of your own making with your repetitive right wing rhetoric, passed off as some kind of knowledge-based balanced view that involves taking a crap article or a perceived weakness of a left wing person or policy and harping on about it page after page. I don't dislike you or like Alf as I've never met either of you. I agree with Alf a whole lot more and respect the integrity of his posts whereas I have the opposite opinion toward yourself.

 

Theres nothing tragic about me finding amusement in you being found out at any point in the day. I'm off to find something to help you rinse the sand out... its hard to walk though as I'm just so giddy....

 

[Nick]

39 minutes ago, sphericalfox said:

Sean Spicer has competition?

 

Ha!

[Carl the Llama]

3 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

 

 

Wow  my comment was made in good spirit but obviously has touched a nerve...

 

I need a hobby?

 

Really?

 

You are a one man political FT spin doctor, who's entire life appears dedicated to ensuring you shape these threads of your own making with your repetitive right wing rhetoric, passed off as some kind of knowledge-based balanced view that involves taking a crap article or a perceived weakness of a left wing person or policy and harping on about it page after page. I don't dislike you or like Alf as I've never met either of you. I agree with Alf a whole lot more and respect the integrity of his posts whereas I have the opposite opinion toward yourself.

 

Theres nothing tragic about me finding amusement in you being found out at any point in the day. I'm off to find something to help you rinse the sand out... its hard to walk though as I'm just so giddy....

 

Chill Winston  

[The Guvnor]

11 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

 

 

Wow  my comment was made in good spirit but obviously has touched a nerve...

 

I need a hobby?

 

Really?

 

You are a one man political FT spin doctor, who's entire life appears dedicated to ensuring you shape these threads of your own making with your repetitive right wing rhetoric, passed off as some kind of knowledge-based balanced view that involves taking a crap article or a perceived weakness of a left wing person or policy and harping on about it page after page. I don't dislike you or like Alf as I've never met either of you. I agree with Alf a whole lot more and respect the integrity of his posts whereas I have the opposite opinion toward yourself.

 

Theres nothing tragic about me finding amusement in you being found out at any point in the day. I'm off to find something to help you rinse the sand out... its hard to walk though as I'm just so giddy....

 

Hasn't touched a nerve with you then.