Trouble in Madrid

[yorkie1999]

4 hours ago, Russell sprout said:

Good post,

theres a stigma with English fans abroad,

but there's bigger fish out there,

didnt see anything reported on the Seville fans kicking off when over here,

seems to me that us English are marked men

I think it's more to do with those pesky phones. Every video I've seen of trouble from our fans is mobile phone footage posted online. Those lads nicking beer, who would have known if they hadn't videoed it

[Dan LCFC]

The more I hear about it the more it's astounding anyone can defend this lot. Anyone defending the police is no Leicester fan to me. Where was this trouble in Belgium, Denmark, or most comparably, Portugal?

 

The common denominator is Spanish police. They are animals. Vile, vile animals. I genuinely would celebrate any death of theirs.

[Aus Fox]

17 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

The more I hear about it the more it's astounding anyone can defend this lot. Anyone defending the police is no Leicester fan to me. Where was this trouble in Belgium, Denmark, or most comparably, Portugal?

 

The common denominator is Spanish police. They are animals. Vile, vile animals. I genuinely would celebrate any death of theirs.

There's a few videos of United fans I have seen last night and they back up your point.

They were in Belgium, in large numbers mainly in English/Irish bars, singing all day and letting off flares and smoke bombs.

Yet they were left to it, no riot police no fighting, no trouble.

It does seem here as though the Spanish police have gone over the top and caused way more problems than they have solved.

[Col city fan]

10 hours ago, Swan Lesta said:

 

I'm the child that's lost the argument in all this who's apparently sulking though and now he's insinuating that I'm stupid. He picks his battles badly.

 

He does this every time he's challenged - last time it was Gaston Ramirez and when challenged he spat his dummy so far out he threatened to leave FT, played the abused ITK card then spent hours hovering over a thread looking for attention threatening another dramatic exit.

 

Whatever  

 

 

Don't forget the infamous 'there's no way Kante is leaving' (or similar) comment... a modern day classic that one.

[Out Foxed]

12 hours ago, stripeyfox said:

This sort of behaviour should be severely punished in the courts. It is reckless and dangerous. If, as you say, it was an employee of the club then he should be dismissed immediately and hopefully receive punishment via the legal system in Spain.

 

Give it a rest

[stripeyfox]

Just now, Out Foxed said:

Give it a rest

Thanks. I'll ask for your permission before giving my opinion in future. That ok? 

[CockneyFox]

3 hours ago, Dan LCFC said:

The more I hear about it the more it's astounding anyone can defend this lot. Anyone defending the police is no Leicester fan to me. Where was this trouble in Belgium, Denmark, or most comparably, Portugal?

 

The common denominator is Spanish police. They are animals. Vile, vile animals. I genuinely would celebrate any death of theirs.

We visited a foreign country which has its own laws and values - what gives these moronic "fans" the right to throw cans, bottles, flares, smoke grenades etc and expect to get away with it? The vast majority respected this, and guess what, the vast majority had a great time.

 

it really isn't difficult.

[Livid]

9 hours ago, Monsell1976 said:

People go on about the English behaviour, but in recent history the Turks are worse in the extreme violence, killing Leeds fans, and the level of violence at their games.

Seville fans stabbing juve fans recently, the extreme violence in Italian football, Russian attack anybody with extreme violence.

Not condoning the behaviour of our small minority of our fans, or the small minority of idiots that follow England, but English fans travel in numbers, and incidents of fighting, bottle throwing and mindless vandalism is a far as it goes.

Where as the above fans are by far worse than any of ours, as the English  don't go out to murder, seriously hurt anybody not English, like the Russians hitting people over the head with hammers and putting them in coma's, attacking innocent fans in packs, shootings and stabbings like in Italian football, so when calling in those in madrid, and English fans in general, as much as the behaviour is anti social, a bit of perspective of the English fan is needed.

All four countries where due to those levels of violence policing of football is more 'full on' and 'direct'. They go in hard, fast and early.

 

We have a more PC approach. We had an officer in Leicester sacked  for spraying a guy in handcuffs who was giving him racial abuse. You think any of those who lashed out on Wednesday are even contemplating facing any form of disciplinary action ? Not a chance. A video of our police doing that and the PCC would be all over it.

 

I'm not condoning their tactics but it should be expected. Different rules and different standards, we need to wise up and get wary.

[Harry - LCFC]

55 minutes ago, CockneyFox said:

We visited a foreign country which has its own laws and values - what gives these moronic "fans" the right to throw cans, bottles, flares, smoke grenades etc and expect to get away with it? The vast majority respected this, and guess what, the vast majority had a great time.

 

it really isn't difficult.

None of that justifies the response from the police.

 

Targeted arrests and perhaps the limited use of the baton would have been appropriate for those who threw missiles at the police. Repeatedly hitting anyone in blue in a general attack was certainly not what was needed to maintain law and order.

Edited 14 April 2017 by Harry - LCFC

[Dan LCFC]

5 hours ago, Aus Fox said:

There's a few videos of United fans I have seen last night and they back up your point.

They were in Belgium, in large numbers mainly in English/Irish bars, singing all day and letting off flares and smoke bombs.

Yet they were left to it, no riot police no fighting, no trouble.

It does seem here as though the Spanish police have gone over the top and caused way more problems than they have solved.

The Belgian police were absolutely fine with us. Flares and smoke bombs were let off and they let us all get on with it.

 

1 hour ago, CockneyFox said:

We visited a foreign country which has its own laws and values - what gives these moronic "fans" the right to throw cans, bottles, flares, smoke grenades etc and expect to get away with it? The vast majority respected this, and guess what, the vast majority had a great time.

 

it really isn't difficult.

It's double standards. The police started on our fans for letting off a smoke bomb. Clearly can't be that big a culture for them to be anti smoke bombs when the Atletico fans were allowed to do it with no issue.

 

Lets just ignore those who got attacked and arrested for nothing then. I've been talking to someone at the airport this morning about what happened to them, batoned, arrested and locked up for 47 hours, no food or drink other than some crackers, for absolutely nothing.

 

Nothing our fans did (which I concede some were idiots) was anywhere near as bad as this. If our police had done it to Atletico's fans people would be defending their fans. Convinced some people are just inclined to be anti-English.

[Ian S]

10 hours ago, Wookie said:

There was plenty of twattish behaviour from our fans yet the same twatty fans went to Bruges, Porto and Copenhagen without trouble (afaik). However in Seville and Madrid there's been trouble, the common denominator being Spanish policing.

The behaviour of our fans in Bruges ,Copenhagen and Seville was very different as I would suggest was the make up of the fan base,if you can call some of them fans.I did not witness the Seville trouble but gather it was a handful of idiots followed by an overreaction.Madrid was different in atmosphere and unlike Copenhagen and Seville there was one area where very large numbers could congregate, yes the police waded in,can't have been rocket science to work out they would at the first sign of trouble,I think the riot vans permanently in the square were a clue.And yes feel very sorry for those innocent fans who got hurt but the vast majority would have had a chance to move out of the area where the trouble was going to start well before it happened.

Howver I do hope some of those I witnessed got a good smacking as its what they deserved and if not I hope they are tracked down through the various footage that is online and banned from following our club in future.Its a minority but let's not kid ourselves it is just down to Spanish police.There is no doubt they were actually more tolerant on Wednesday than previous days but some of our p***** up and coked up morons pushed their luck.

 

 

 

[Spudulike]

7 hours ago, MCFC DAN said:

As a City (Man) fan I thought I'd leave this here, my opinions on Spanish Police and their 'heavy handedness' hasn't changed.

 

 

 

Very strange considering none of the three clubs have caused much bother elsewhere

Thanks for the '(Man)' to acknowledge that we are also City. So incredibly annoying all this 'City' and ' United' stuff when referring to Manchester clubs.

[Monsell1976]

9 hours ago, Swan Lesta said:

I think you have a point here in some ways but I can't get on board with a 'Our antisocial behaviour is better than your antisocial behaviour' argument!

 

I do get what you are saying but we still have 5% of our away support who are right now watching a pitifully weak assed Elijah Wood be a football hooligan and masturbating furiously on the sofa at thought of being a part of something so exciting and yet utterly moronic.

 

And I just can't defend the idiocy. There's no doubt that others are far worse in the world but I don't find comfort in that really.

I'm not justifying it, but trying to get a bit of perspective, it's not our anti social behaviour v yours, I'm getting the point over that other foreign fans go to cause serious harm to other supporters, where our clowns get drunk and throw things, big difference between hooligans, and what you could class as organised crime by the others.

As the English don't organise anymore, they get drunk and things get out of hand, but using the Russians as an example, they train all year, don't drink, plan attacks in groups of hundreds, and go to cause people serious harm, so all this I hate being English, yes they embarrass us, but our followers could be a lot worse, like the 80's and 90's

[Monsell1976]

1 hour ago, Livid said:

All four countries where due to those levels of violence policing of football is more 'full on' and 'direct'. They go in hard, fast and early.

 

We have a more PC approach. We had an officer in Leicester sacked  for spraying a guy in handcuffs who was giving him racial abuse. You think any of those who lashed out on Wednesday are even contemplating facing any form of disciplinary action ? Not a chance. A video of our police doing that and the PCC would be all over it.

 

I'm not condoning their tactics but it should be expected. Different rules and different standards, we need to wise up and get wary.

Agree, different country different rules, but in my experience, and I have had the experience of unlawful force by leicester police, our police our as bad, unless you catch them on camera, the will use force illegally and lie to cover it up, and the system is on their side.

See Derby away, when the police hit women and children, and were like a wild pack of dogs, looking for and causing trouble.

Doesnt sit well when anyone supposed to be protecting the law, use their power to break it.

Sadly power corrupts, and they get a bit of power, and abuse it, like politicians etc

[Nick]

11 minutes ago, Monsell1976 said:

I'm not justifying it, but trying to get a bit of perspective, it's not our anti social behaviour v yours, I'm getting the point over that other foreign fans go to cause serious harm to other supporters, where our clowns get drunk and throw things, big difference between hooligans, and what you could class as organised crime by the others.

As the English don't organise anymore, they get drunk and things get out of hand, but using the Russians as an example, they train all year, don't drink, plan attacks in groups of hundreds, and go to cause people serious harm, so all this I hate being English, yes they embarrass us, but our followers could be a lot worse, like the 80's and 90's

True.

 

I was not having a go either buddy. 

 

English fans are are not as bad comparatively, agreed.

[Spudulike]

Four months banged up

[Col city fan]

1 hour ago, Livid said:

All four countries where due to those levels of violence policing of football is more 'full on' and 'direct'. They go in hard, fast and early.

 

We have a more PC approach. We had an officer in Leicester sacked  for spraying a guy in handcuffs who was giving him racial abuse. You think any of those who lashed out on Wednesday are even contemplating facing any form of disciplinary action ? Not a chance. A video of our police doing that and the PCC would be all over it.

 

I'm not condoning their tactics but it should be expected. Different rules and different standards, we need to wise up and get wary.

I think this is a really good point. We are SO PC in this country that even the coppers have to account for just about every one of their actions. On the continent, this isn't always the case e.g. In Italy and Spain where there is zero tolerance.

This makes me think two things. Firstly, any football 'fan' (I use this term very loosely) should know where they are going....to give the Spanish Police even an excuse to get heavy, ain't wise. Secondly, it's probably the reason why the EU have never been able to implement a European Police Force (which was a central tenet to forming the EU in the first place). Nations look at their policing styles so differently, it wouldn't be possible.

Which style is right and which is wrong is open to debate. Sometimes I think our police are too restricted, but at other times I think thank God we don't have a police state.

Great point Livid.

[Bluetintedspecs]

On 12/04/2017 at 10:57, maddog said:

One issue here is the gap between what the Spanish police see as you doing something wrong and what the English Leicester fans perceive as doing something wrong.

 

Where the Leicester fans might see a 7/10 to warrant a bit of baton, the Spanish police may be at 4/10 or 5/10.

 

So you'll get a tiny minority of fans being 7/10 naughty and they know they're asking for some baton. You'll get more fans at 5-6/10 who won't feel like they've done anything wrong but the police will.

 

And inevitably a tiny minority of fans on 0/10-3/10 will be caught in the baton crossfire for literally no reason.

 

Its deep and psychological and cultural why these things happen and far too complex, so I like to use the trouble numbers above to try explain as best I can. 

I'm struggling to decide if this is a 8/10 post or I need to track you down and baton you 

[Monsell1976]

19 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

True.

 

I was not having a go either buddy. 

 

English fans are are not as bad comparatively, agreed.

Wasn't saying you was mate, but just using the example of some of the over reactions on here, by many who haven't been away, and don't see how it works abroad.

I had lots of friends out in madrid, and went seville, and English are treated differently by foreign police, yes we are loud and drunk, but the police abroad know our rep of the past, and expect trouble, but if there isn't, they aim to get a reaction, in my opinion, and when drink is involved, they get it from those inclined that way, or just beat those who try and get away, as we have seen.

Its a shame on both counts really, as the away days abroad are, and should be a great experience for young and old, without fear of thugs, or police thugs, and should be able to drink anywhere without fear, but sadly the rep of the English past will never allow that to happen 

[Ecdysiast]

People here seriously arguing if one form of retarded, offensive obnoxious behaviour deserved a beating more than another? Every time twats behave like twats for the sake of "notches on their hardman bedposts" football suffers. It's not complicated....

 

Watch the game! Enjoy the game! Argue about the ref! call the lino a cvnt!  Whatever...its football

 

Don't "invade another's turf",

Don't chant offensive, intimedating bullshit,

Don't get drunk and shout obscenities at the locals.

Don't do drugs

Don't throw flares in major tourist sites

Don't trash the city by chucking all your litter shit wherever

Don't steal

Don't vandalise

Don't puke

Don't get into an argument with the local law - especially if you know they're not fussy about banging a few heads, maybe even your friend's head that just happened to be passing by.

Don't give the impression that everyone who supports your club is a potentially violent, uneducated, anti-social, yob

Don't make the rest of us ashamed to be associated with you

 

that's not football.. That's behaving like scum.

 

Support your team! Behave in a civilised fashion, just in case some fellow fan might want to go back to that city in the future.

 

There are no "grey areas". Someone gets beaten...Someone in our crowd caused it. Don't blame the locals, blame our own.

 

Lets win the 2nd leg for all those that made the trip and came off worse because they happened to be near a bunch cvnts that have the balls to call themselves Leicester fans 

[HybridFox]

http://m.leicestermercury.co.uk/leicester-city-fans-jailed-after-madrid-violence-reports-spanish-press/story-30271033-detail/story.html

 

This is madness

[Foxes1]

See the Madrid fans let flares off to welcome their team before the match. What do the Spanish police do nothing two faced b******s.

 

[stripeyfox]

19 minutes ago, TK95 said:

http://m.leicestermercury.co.uk/leicester-city-fans-jailed-after-madrid-violence-reports-spanish-press/story-30271033-detail/story.html

 

This is madness

Not sure how it can be dismissed as "madness" when the article doesn't state what they have been jailed for?

 

[Foxes1]

The Russian embassy hopes British fans behave at the next world cup in Russia. They hyave a bloody cheek.

http://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/russian-embassy-weighs-into-row-over-leicester-city-fans-in-madrid-with-bizarre-massacre-tweet/story-30270942-detail/story.html

[los dedos]

3 minutes ago, stripeyfox said:

Not sure how it can be dismissed as "madness" when the article doesn't state what they have been jailed for?

 

Fair trial in 2 to 3 days?