leicsmac Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 9 minutes ago, stripeyfox said: Amongst all the tragedy and wall to wall media coverage and closet facebook racists, it is very important to remember how many good people there are. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripeyfox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 6 minutes ago, Wymeswold fox said: Apparently plenty are still missing. It must be desperate if you are waiting for news. You'd think they'd know by now who'd been killed but who knows how difficult identification may be? I suppose you would just be hoping that they'd be wondering around in a daze or something but all these hours later you've got to be fearing the worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxxed Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 So I guess the point of terrorism is cause division and fear. The news should emphasize the heroic acts of the people at the gig, homeless people helping the victims, the people donating blood, the residents offering the houses to the victims and the police work. Focusing on the terror seems to do nothing but sell papers and help the whole point of terrorism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grewks Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 Whilst i often disagree with the approach taken by the U.S....i'm not proposing the old 'To beat a bad guy with a gun, you need a good guy with a gun', but you do certainly have to find some way of removing the gun from the bad guys hands. The guy who the news are reporting is responsible, was 22, a year younger than me. Now of course, I can't speak for everyone, but there was nothing during my education which led me to believe killing kids, of any religion, was acceptable or would lead to any kind of achievement or positive recognition. We need to remove the problem at source. You can't lecture terrorist ideologies, if you have no lecturers..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 I'd hold the family, friends and associates of these cvnts responsible, they'd soon start identifying them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 26 minutes ago, Foxxed said: I know what you mean for what it's worth. I'm not a fan. I just worry people are looking at one of the symptoms rather than the cause. I loved playing soldiers, cops and robbers, cowboys and indians and various war space games - all without any real relation to their implications. There's probably something evolutionarily beneficial of having this tendency when your life is generally being attacked by other animals, yet less so in societies where protection is outsourced to a relatively small group. And there were undoubtedly those who played those games but were a little /too/ enthusiastic and who use them to imagine real life versions and wish for them to happen including the death involved. But I would guess the reason for the second group lies elsewhere than the games themselves. I think you could argue that some of these games are beneficial. While a person is playing them it is only fantasy and has no need for the reality.Same with top shelf mags the urge for whatever has to come from somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trav Le Bleu Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 2 hours ago, Jon the Hat said: I don't think it matters what they think to be honest. We should do exactly what we like, **** them. Almost as nice as me my arse The almost as nice as Jon the Hat is from a year or so ago when there was one of those "how nice are you?" online quiz things and I got slightly less then you and is of course meant to be ironic. I'm much nicer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell sprout Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 39 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said: I'd hold the family, friends and associates of these cvnts responsible, they'd soon start identifying them. Part of the problem in the first place is that the so called good muslims do nothing in condemning these scumbags,there quick to say there not real muslims,but I see nothing from the real muskims in helping to eradicate the scum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AoWW Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 My heart aches, such a tragic loss of young lives. I've spent most of my day comforting, and talking openly and frankly, with primary-school-age children who had heard enough of the news to be frightened and shocked but didn't fully understand what had happened in Manchester last night, and knew very few facts. Kids who, as young fans themselves of Ariana Grande and similar artists, could relate to those involved... kids who would have given anything to be at that gig themselves. Kids who could imagine the horror of being separated from friends and family, whilst witnessing scenes no one should have to see. Kids who simply could not comprehend why one human being would do that to other innocent people. Really, what can you say? There are so many stories of people openly helping in the aftermath, of offering support and practical help, of the emergency services and medical staff doing over-and-above... the message that there are so many more good people than bad in this world was all I could offer them. RIP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buce Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 9 minutes ago, Russell sprout said: Part of the problem in the first place is that the so called good muslims do nothing in condemning these scumbags,there quick to say there not real muslims,but I see nothing from the real muskims in helping to eradicate the scum Are you privy to the information supplied to the security services? We are constantly being told about foiled terror plots: how do you know that the information doesn't come from the Muslim community? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripeyfox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 3 minutes ago, AoWW said: My heart aches, such a tragic loss of young lives. I've spent most of my day comforting, and talking openly and frankly, with primary-school-age children who had heard enough of the news to be frightened and shocked but didn't fully understand what had happened in Manchester last night, and knew very few facts. Kids who, as young fans themselves of Ariana Grande and similar artists, could relate to those involved... kids who would have given anything to be at that gig themselves. Kids who could imagine the horror of being separated from friends and family, whilst witnessing scenes no one should have to see. Kids who simply could not comprehend why one human being would do that to other innocent people. Really, what can you say? There are so many stories of people openly helping in the aftermath, of offering support and practical help, of the emergency services and medical staff doing over-and-above... the message that there are so many more good people than bad in this world was all I could offer them. RIP. This is all we have, but it is the most important fact of all. Most people are good. Most people are good. That is the mantra Yet you only need to witness what happens when an old lady falls over in the street, or at the scene of a road collision. People run to help. We do what we can. When towns get flooded, volunteers hand out food and drinks. We have compassion. We care. Even though it might not seem like it when we are rushing around our daily lives, when we need one another, we are there. I believe that more than ever. The homeless man rushing in to help and having to see god knows what. The emergency services unflinching in racing to assist the dying and injured, even though more danger may lurk there. And then people donating money out of their own pockets to help the victims and the homeless man shows the goodness in most of us. "They" can never take that away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 19 minutes ago, Buce said: Are you privy to the information supplied to the security services? We are constantly being told about foiled terror plots: how do you know that the information doesn't come from the Muslim community? I doubt it would be good for police to go public and reveal their information sources for any crime. As in previous incidents I expect the Muslim as well as the other faiths to be active in arranging support and donations. I'm not religious but there are far more good Muslims than bad and all will condemn this act of murder. We should not give these people the News that they want to see but not call them terrorists which puts the killings on a political level but call them child killers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripeyfox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 44 minutes ago, Russell sprout said: Part of the problem in the first place is that the so called good muslims do nothing in condemning these scumbags,there quick to say there not real muslims,but I see nothing from the real muskims in helping to eradicate the scum if you believe the rhetoric of the Daily Mail, yes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 34 minutes ago, Buce said: Are you privy to the information supplied to the security services? We are constantly being told about foiled terror plots: how do you know that the information doesn't come from the Muslim community? Actually I heard an ex bomb disposal guy on the radio say just this. Most information that leads to foiled plots, comes from family members or fellow worshippers noticing a concerning change in behaviour. I must admit I was quite surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad the Fox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 55 minutes ago, stripeyfox said: This is all we have, but it is the most important fact of all. Most people are good. Most people are good. That is the mantra Yet you only need to witness what happens when an old lady falls over in the street, or at the scene of a road collision. People run to help. We do what we can. When towns get flooded, volunteers hand out food and drinks. We have compassion. We care. Even though it might not seem like it when we are rushing around our daily lives, when we need one another, we are there. I believe that more than ever. The homeless man rushing in to help and having to see god knows what. The emergency services unflinching in racing to assist the dying and injured, even though more danger may lurk there. And then people donating money out of their own pockets to help the victims and the homeless man shows the goodness in most of us. "They" can never take that away. This is why they will never win. The more they try the more we will pull together, joining different faiths and communities against these abhorrent people and actions. The voice of disgust will become louder, the support and friendships will become stronger and our freedoms and liberties will be more starkly defined and will shine even more brightly. Our society has been built on centuries of civilised progression, pushing bounderies and embracing new directions and cultures in an ever changing world. This is why the beliefs and actions of a few backwards looking mongrels scratching around with their medieval ideology will never win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripeyfox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 8 minutes ago, Vlad the Fox said: This is why they will never win. The more they try the more we will pull together, joining different faiths and communities against these abhorrent people and actions. The voice of disgust will become louder, the support and friendships will become stronger and our freedoms and liberties will be more starkly defined and will shine even more brightly. Our society has been built on centuries of civilised progression, pushing bounderies and embracing new directions and cultures in an ever changing world. This is why the beliefs and actions of a few backwards looking mongrels scratching around with their medieval ideology will never win. I know you are right. It will be a tough road and many many more are going to die on the way there. These scumbags will get lucky again and more of our children will die. More tears will be shed, but they will never win. I was trying to explain all this to my son tonight and he'd heard stuff at school which had frightened him but he has gone to bed (I think) with the thought that good will always defeat evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 16 minutes ago, Vlad the Fox said: This is why they will never win. The more they try the more we will pull together, joining different faiths and communities against these abhorrent people and actions. The voice of disgust will become louder, the support and friendships will become stronger and our freedoms and liberties will be more starkly defined and will shine even more brightly. Our society has been built on centuries of civilised progression, pushing bounderies and embracing new directions and cultures in an ever changing world. This is why the beliefs and actions of a few backwards looking mongrels scratching around with their medieval ideology will never win. I get what you're saying and agree but this 'win' phrase people keep mentioning, it isn't a game, people die, do these cunts really care about 'winning', they kill themselves at the end of the day, they don't get to see or 'enjoy' (Is that the right word, of course it isn't, but in their sick mythology it probably is, forgive me if it isn't) the terror they cause, they just do it, cause terror and kill innocent people. We certainly aren't winning, we go about our lives and continue as normal in defiance of them but unfortunately if you're in the wrong place and the wrong time next time and there will be many next times then it's over i'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russell sprout Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 1 hour ago, Buce said: Are you privy to the information supplied to the security services? We are constantly being told about foiled terror plots: how do you know that the information doesn't come from the Muslim community? And how do you know it does come from the Muslim community Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripeyfox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 2 minutes ago, Matt said: I get what you're saying and agree but this 'win' phrase people keep mentioning, it isn't a game, people die, do these cunts really care about 'winning', they kill themselves at the end of the day, they don't get to see or 'enjoy' (Is that the right word, forgive me it isn't) the terror they cause, they just do it, cause terror and kill innocent people. We certainly aren't winning, we go about our lives and continue as normal in defiance of them but unfortunately if you're in the wrong place and the wrong time next time and there will be many next times then it's over i'm afraid. Yeah, I get that mate. It's a sobering thought. It could be you airplane, or train. Or some guy detonating a bomb outside our football ground. Have you ever seen the crowds walking down Aylestone Road, Saffron Lane after a game? A truck driven through that (like in Nice) would be a soft target, impossible to predict or prevent. Whether it is London, Leeds or Leicester it will be somewhere. And as you say, there is nothing you or I can do really to avoid it - if we're in the "wrong" place then yes, it is all over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad the Fox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 4 minutes ago, stripeyfox said: I know you are right. It will be a tough road and many many more are going to die on the way there. These scumbags will get lucky again and more of our children will die. More tears will be shed, but they will never win. I was trying to explain all this to my son tonight and he'd heard stuff at school which had frightened him but he has gone to bed (I think) with the thought that good will always defeat evil. This is it. The force of good is a far far stronger cause than evil and will always rise up in a crisis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 My daughter was telling me her friend was there and the concert started 10 minutes late, the people who were injured and killed were people who were leaving early. 10 minutes later and there would have been a hell of a lot more people exiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 12 minutes ago, Matt said: I get what you're saying and agree but this 'win' phrase people keep mentioning, it isn't a game, people die, do these cunts really care about 'winning', they kill themselves at the end of the day, they don't get to see or 'enjoy' (Is that the right word, of course it isn't, but in their sick mythology it probably is, forgive me if it isn't) the terror they cause, they just do it, cause terror and kill innocent people. We certainly aren't winning, we go about our lives and continue as normal in defiance of them but unfortunately if you're in the wrong place and the wrong time next time and there will be many next times then it's over i'm afraid. 4 minutes ago, stripeyfox said: Yeah, I get that mate. It's a sobering thought. It could be you airplane, or train. Or some guy detonating a bomb outside our football ground. Have you ever seen the crowds walking down Aylestone Road, Saffron Lane after a game? A truck driven through that (like in Nice) would be a soft target, impossible to predict or prevent. Whether it is London, Leeds or Leicester it will be somewhere. And as you say, there is nothing you or I can do really to avoid it - if we're in the "wrong" place then yes, it is all over. Interesting discussion. The way I see it, as long as we go about our lives and are not forced to change them by those who do this, to make us more like them, then that is winning in of itself. Though it isn't a game, it is a struggle; a struggle for humanity itself and how it goes to the future, a struggle which is critical. And that - though those deaths are unspeakably tragic - goes deeper than the death of one person, or even a few. I personally take some very small comfort in the idea that if they do "win" themselves - make it so everyone else is like them - then their victory will be shortlived as the way they would win - causing worldwide fighting - would mean they and those that think like them would simply be the last to die anyway. Hollow victory, especially when they realise there really isn't an afterlife for them to enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad the Fox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 12 minutes ago, Matt said: I get what you're saying and agree but this 'win' phrase people keep mentioning, it isn't a game, people die, do these cunts really care about 'winning', they kill themselves at the end of the day, they don't get to see or 'enjoy' (Is that the right word, forgive me it isn't) the terror they cause, they just do it, cause terror and kill innocent people. We certainly aren't winning, we go about our lives and continue as normal in defiance of them but unfortunately if you're in the wrong place and the wrong time next time and there will be many next times then it's over i'm afraid. Yes, maybe 'win' isn't quite the right word but their actions are fruitless, it won't change us as a people, we will continue as normal. It will however make us stronger and more determined to protect our freedoms and beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripeyfox Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 https://www.gofundme.com/3dgkuj-help-chris-parker Over 11K now for the homeless guy who "pulled nails out of a young girls face" Let us hope that some small good comes from it. Hopefully this guy can get off the streets and get his life back on track... EDIT: hopefully this is all verifiable as there may be more than one "homeless guy" who helped! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wymsey Posted 23 May 2017 Share Posted 23 May 2017 Just now, stripeyfox said: https://www.gofundme.com/3dgkuj-help-chris-parker Over 11K now for the homeless guy who "pulled nails out of a young girls face" Let us hope that some small good comes from it. Hopefully this guy can get off the streets and get his life back on track... If there isn't one already, there should be a fundraising page etc for the victims' families imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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