Is Shakespeare the right man for the job?

[Ric Flair]

11 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

The football brain of our club is absolutely non existent. 

 

Our owners make a lot of great "people" decisions, they're good for fans, they've got a sensible spending policy, they keep us stable, compliant, healthy. 

 

But the football side of the business is dreadful. Player recruitment is questionable, manager recruitment is scattergun and haphazard and we've got a director of football with no prior experience other than being an average glorified PE teacher. 

 

It's lead us to having a manager who's biggest qualification for the job was being mates with Riyad and Vardy. It's absurd. 

 

Our owners almost need to be more ruthless, less likeable, sack Rudkin, sack Shakespeare, sack Whelan if they have to -  get your wallets out and instead of spending a couple hundred million on substitutes for our bench, go headhunting the people that make the decisions at Southampton or Huddersfield or Hoffenheim or Leipzig or Sevilla or Sassuolo or any club that consistently gets it right. 

Well said Finners

[Countryfox]

15 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

The football brain of our club is absolutely non existent. 

 

Our owners make a lot of great "people" decisions, they're good for fans, they've got a sensible spending policy, they keep us stable, compliant, healthy. 

 

But the football side of the business is dreadful. Player recruitment is questionable, manager recruitment is scattergun and haphazard and we've got a director of football with no prior experience other than being an average glorified PE teacher. 

 

It's lead us to having a manager who's biggest qualification for the job was being mates with Riyad and Vardy. It's absurd. 

 

Our owners almost need to be more ruthless, less likeable, sack Rudkin, sack Shakespeare, sack Whelan if they have to -  get your wallets out and instead of spending a couple hundred million on substitutes for our bench, go headhunting the people that make the decisions at Southampton or Huddersfield or Hoffenheim or Leipzig or Sevilla or Sassuolo or any club that consistently gets it right. 

 

Bit harsh ..  Shakespeare got the job cus he came in after the Don fvcked things up and instantly turned it round ..  he deserves his chance.  Our backroom staff and set up was in fine shape when Pearson was here but has suffered from departures ..   a couple on the recruitment side and obviously several key players for example ..  maybe recruitment has been poor to put it mildly and that is something that really needs looking at ....    at the moment that is costing us more than anything else as it possibly allows our established players to have far too much influence in what happens.

[Finnegan]

8 minutes ago, Countryfox said:

 

Bit harsh ..  Shakespeare got the job cus he came in after the Don fvcked things up and instantly turned it round ..  he deserves his chance.  Our backroom staff and set up was in fine shape when Pearson was here but has suffered from departures ..   a couple on the recruitment side and obviously several key players for example ..  maybe recruitment has been poor to put it mildly and that is something that really needs looking at ....    at the moment that is costing us more than anything else as it possibly allows our established players to have far too much influence in what happens.

 

Giving the assistant manager the job after the inevitable honey moon period is the oldest kop out in the book. 

 

We started floundering before last season even ended to be honest, we all just ignored it and pretended it was because our games were dead rubbers even though we knew there were millions riding on every league place. 

[Arriba Los Zorros]

15 hours ago, WigstonWanderer said:

I'll hold my hand up as someone who thought that appointing Shakespeare would provide continuity and be a less risky option than getting an outsider who might upset the applecart.

 

Clearly we now need a completely fresh start by appointing a new manager strong enough to take a fresh look at the players we have and get them organised into a proper team.

Make that 2 of us.

 

Although I would also welcome Pearson back with open arms!

[Great Boos Up]

24 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

Giving the assistant manager the job after the inevitable honey moon period is the oldest kop out in the book. 

 

We started floundering before last season even ended to be honest, we all just ignored it and pretended it was because our games were dead rubbers even though we knew there were millions riding on every league place. 

But we did take an age to announce him full time manager. I think other options were seriously being looked into. I still wonder what they were and if we missed some opportunities.

[Countryfox]

26 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

Giving the assistant manager the job after the inevitable honey moon period is the oldest kop out in the book. 

 

We started floundering before last season even ended to be honest, we all just ignored it and pretended it was because our games were dead rubbers even though we knew there were millions riding on every league place. 

 

Maybe you are right and maybe the 'power' of the players influenced that as well ....    If things still go awry over the next month or so then major surgery will probably be required ...    But ! ..   I'm pinning all my hopes on Iborra, Silva and James totally bossing the midfield and turning our season round !   ..      yes I know, straws clutching and all that ..   

[Guest TheBear]

For the Andy King lovers and defenders.... We haven't won a league game he has started since we beat Man City at home last season..... In fact the only other league win in the last 12 months where he has started was Crystal Palace at home last season too!

 

Shakespeare is the architect of his own downfall if he carries on selecting such an ineffective player in a system which leaves our defence so exposed.  We need fresh injection of class and tactical nouse and this squad which on paper is easily top-10 and capable of upsetting bigger teams and that will only come when the Shakey experiment comes to an end!

[Col city fan]

1 hour ago, Finnegan said:

 

The football brain of our club is absolutely non existent. 

 

Our owners make a lot of great "people" decisions, they're good for fans, they've got a sensible spending policy, they keep us stable, compliant, healthy. 

 

But the football side of the business is dreadful. Player recruitment is questionable, manager recruitment is scattergun and haphazard and we've got a director of football with no prior experience other than being an average glorified PE teacher. 

 

It's lead us to having a manager who's biggest qualification for the job was being mates with Riyad and Vardy. It's absurd. 

 

Our owners almost need to be more ruthless, less likeable, sack Rudkin, sack Shakespeare, sack Whelan if they have to -  get your wallets out and instead of spending a couple hundred million on substitutes for our bench, go headhunting the people that make the decisions at Southampton or Huddersfield or Hoffenheim or Leipzig or Sevilla or Sassuolo or any club that consistently gets it right. 

Great post 

[lifted*fox]

1 hour ago, Finnegan said:

 

The football brain of our club is absolutely non existent. 

 

Our owners make a lot of great "people" decisions, they're good for fans, they've got a sensible spending policy, they keep us stable, compliant, healthy. 

 

But the football side of the business is dreadful. Player recruitment is questionable, manager recruitment is scattergun and haphazard and we've got a director of football with no prior experience other than being an average glorified PE teacher. 

 

It's lead us to having a manager who's biggest qualification for the job was being mates with Riyad and Vardy. It's absurd. 

 

Our owners almost need to be more ruthless, less likeable, sack Rudkin, sack Shakespeare, sack Whelan if they have to -  get your wallets out and instead of spending a couple hundred million on substitutes for our bench, go headhunting the people that make the decisions at Southampton or Huddersfield or Hoffenheim or Leipzig or Sevilla or Sassuolo or any club that consistently gets it right. 

 

Yes, props for this post - it's spot on. 

 

We've been very amateur behind the scenes since the PL title win. 

 

Everything Pearson worked so hard to build has slowly been dismantled and we've lost our identity completely. 

 

I'm not sure how we've managed to go so far backwards when we had the perfect mix only a few years ago. 

 

This club is about to go through a serious period of regression, especially if they get the next appointment after Shakespeare wrong - someone needs to come in and stop the rot, and fast. 

[Mike Oxlong]

When he does leave he won't leave much of a footprint.

 

His feet are too diddy. 

[foxfanazer]

I think it’s safe to say he’s out of his depth as manager here but let’s not bury our heads and think the problem is merely the manager. It appears some people at the club are not being made accountable for their failings and a big shake up is needed. I don’t mind us struggling on the pitch while we transition but we can’t carry on with the way things are

[ian_marshall]

On 02/10/2017 at 10:14, Finnegan said:

 

The football brain of our club is absolutely non existent. 

 

Our owners make a lot of great "people" decisions, they're good for fans, they've got a sensible spending policy, they keep us stable, compliant, healthy. 

 

But the football side of the business is dreadful. Player recruitment is questionable, manager recruitment is scattergun and haphazard and we've got a director of football with no prior experience other than being an average glorified PE teacher. 

 

It's lead us to having a manager who's biggest qualification for the job was being mates with Riyad and Vardy. It's absurd. 

 

Our owners almost need to be more ruthless, less likeable, sack Rudkin, sack Shakespeare, sack Whelan if they have to -  get your wallets out and instead of spending a couple hundred million on substitutes for our bench, go headhunting the people that make the decisions at Southampton or Huddersfield or Hoffenheim or Leipzig or Sevilla or Sassuolo or any club that consistently gets it right. 

Great post Finners, completely agree that investment in the off field management team has been poor, and is an area that we could greatly improve. 

 

Unfortunately, I think we have a situation whereby relationships are ruling the roost. There is absolutely no chance that the owners will consider Susan Whelan's position let alone replace her as I think she has too much 'cash in the bank' with them from her previous work prior to LCFC. Likewise, I suspect Rudkin has invested all of his time getting on the right side of her and developing their relationship which also puts him in a very strong position. 

 

I think it's clear as day where the issues lie however I just cannot see things changing. 

 

Interestingly, I carried out a quick bit of research the other day to try and find out where Terry Robinson ended up and stumbled across this article on the BBC:

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/30471366

 

It got me thinking, if TR was dismissed for his dealings in a single transfer window that saw us bring in Cambiasso, Albrighton, Simpson, Ulloa, Schwarzer, and Hamer for a total of circa £10m, how can they possibly deem our recruitment over the past 3 transfer windows as being acceptable and turn a blind eye. He wasn't everyone's cup of tea but in hindsight TR was effective in the job he was employed to do and got things done one way or another. 

 

Sadly I think we're in for a turbulent few seasons ahead, although I really do hope that I'm wrong. 

[Bob Hazels shorts]

On 10/2/2017 at 10:14, Finnegan said:

 

The football brain of our club is absolutely non existent. 

 

Our owners make a lot of great "people" decisions, they're good for fans, they've got a sensible spending policy, they keep us stable, compliant, healthy. 

 

But the football side of the business is dreadful. Player recruitment is questionable, manager recruitment is scattergun and haphazard and we've got a director of football with no prior experience other than being an average glorified PE teacher. 

 

It's lead us to having a manager who's biggest qualification for the job was being mates with Riyad and Vardy. It's absurd. 

 

Our owners almost need to be more ruthless, less likeable, sack Rudkin, sack Shakespeare, sack Whelan if they have to -  get your wallets out and instead of spending a couple hundred million on substitutes for our bench, go headhunting the people that make the decisions at Southampton or Huddersfield or Hoffenheim or Leipzig or Sevilla or Sassuolo or any club that consistently gets it right. 

 

Totally agree,

 

We already had Shakey, we should of added a knowledgeable, experienced and respected football person to the set up.

 

Shaky head coach and a proper football operations director, not Andrew Neville.....who?

 

 

[deep blue]

30 minutes ago, Bob Hazels shorts said:

 

Totally agree,

 

We already had Shakey, we should of added a knowledgeable, experienced and respected football person to the set up.

 

Shaky head coach and a proper football operations director, not Andrew Neville.....who?

 

 

Re Finnegan's excellent post, I think Pearson in as DOF would be a good start - enabling us to rebuild the infrastructure that he originally put in place without having to endure him managing the team (a prospect many on here would abhor, though for me the jury's out on his managerial ability at Prem level). But as Finnegan infers, even this step wouldn't be enough and more root & branch changes may be necessary.

[Mymanalan]

I'm afraid I can't see us getting any better any time soon if we don't change something. If Shakespeare doesn't make that change in his tactics and team selection, then it will be him who is the one being changed. 

 

Shakey has worked with two of the best managers we've had but doesn't seem to have learnt much about the tactical side of the game. Given that he's had this experience, I'm not confident that he will suddenly develop and learn this over the season. Seems well respected and liked by the lads but that does not translate to good performances when it matters if he can't choose the right team/tactics to play or choose the right substitutes to come on. 

 

He he did a great job last year in keeping us up but we were being figured out come the end of the season yet nothing has changed or been adapted. Seems like a great coach and a lovely chap but we need someone who will instill that identity back into us (not just blaming Shakey for that as the whole structure seems to be clueless in this regard) because at the moment we don't seem to know what the next step is for our football club. 

[MPH]

Honestly, it feels to me like we have gone back to a similar style of football that we had when Pearson took over the first time. It feels like ' avoid defeat' is the name of the game.. of course several years later it came good But Shakey doesnt have several seasons ( or a choke hold) or the charisma to instill some confidence like Pearson did to  make it work.

 

 

This season's chance of success  almost feels like my chubby bald uncle in his 60s telling me he is going to go beat up the karate champion 25 year old next door.

 

 

 

 

Im totally unconvinced until i see it happening.

[Sionnach gorm]

4 hours ago, deep blue said:

Re Finnegan's excellent post, I think Pearson in as DOF would be a good start - enabling us to rebuild the infrastructure that he originally put in place without having to endure him managing the team (a prospect many on here would abhor, though for me the jury's out on his managerial ability at Prem level). But as Finnegan infers, even this step wouldn't be enough and more root & branch changes may be necessary.

I could see that.  You need an abrasive, no nunsense person as the Director of Football.  I think that would be better than having him as a manager.  The only problem is he may be unable to keep his fingers out of the managing pie...making managers hate to work with LCFC.

[midland_red]

On 02/10/2017 at 11:18, Great Boos Up said:

But we did take an age to announce him full time manager. I think other options were seriously being looked into. I still wonder what they were and if we missed some opportunities.

Ive argued this all along - that Shakey wasn't the first choice -  and I'm worried that other options looked at the general set up (to whom do I report? do I get full control over transfers and recruitment?) and decided to leave it well alone

[Stadt]

6 minutes ago, midland_red said:

Ive argued this all along - that Shakey wasn't the first choice -  and I'm worried that other options looked at the general set up (to whom do I report? do I get full control over transfers and recruitment?) and decided to leave it well alone

If that was the case managers wouldn't take jobs with most continental European clubs as they don't have full autonomy of transfers. It's more likely that mid table premier league clubs just aren't that attractive  

[winteriscoming]

No completely out of his depth. You only have to look at him during matches arms folded not doing a lot. What I'd like to know is would any other premiership team in our position at the end of last season hired him. I mean an assistant does well for 10+ games then not only get the job permanently but gets a 3 year contract. Look at his reaction when ullua was injured against Liverpool him Appleton and Stowell had no idea what to do. 

[Ric Flair]

1 hour ago, Wookie said:

If that was the case managers wouldn't take jobs with most continental European clubs as they don't have full autonomy of transfers. It's more likely that mid table premier league clubs just aren't that attractive  

Given the obscene money PL clubs pay as and how quick we are to sack and pay off managers, it's a very attractive short term gig for many. 

[Stadt]

1 minute ago, Ric Flair said:

Given the obscene money PL clubs pay as and how quick we are to sack and pay off managers, it's a very attractive short term gig for many. 

How many highly rated managers have taken up mid table jobs? You could argue De Boer but his stock wasn't particularly high after he bodged the Inter job. It's why the same list of names are always cycled round like Hodgson, Pardew, Allardyce, Pulis, Hughes etc

[Ric Flair]

2 minutes ago, Wookie said:

How many highly rated managers have taken up mid table jobs? You could argue De Boer but his stock wasn't particularly high after he bodged the Inter job. It's why the same list of names are always cycled round like Hodgson, Pardew, Allardyce, Pulis, Hughes etc

I know what you're saying but managers will come for the money, especially if out of work. 

[NotTheMarketLeader]

1 hour ago, Wookie said:

How many highly rated managers have taken up mid table jobs? You could argue De Boer but his stock wasn't particularly high after he bodged the Inter job. It's why the same list of names are always cycled round like Hodgson, Pardew, Allardyce, Pulis, Hughes etc

This is the biggest problem;

I would not touch any of these with a barge pole.

 

Shit football or failures.

[Col city fan]

10 hours ago, NotTheMarketLeader said:

This is the biggest problem;

I would not touch any of these with a barge pole.

 

Shit football or failures.

Some of them I wouldn't.

To be fair, Hughes always does a solid job at Stoke  (Stoke aren't a big club but never look like going down) and Pulis manages West Brom pretty well.

That said, I'd like someone new at LCFC. Someone with fresh ideas for the club.

We are in stagnation at the mo