matty98 Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 9 minutes ago, Col city fan said: I was answering the question. I think it's a bit sad (though not unexpected) that people STILL refuse to see what is right in front of their noses. James is an intelligent player. He's not the quickest, but he reads the game well. So does King. We were holding out with James in the team because he was covering runs. When he had to go off, the intelligence in the central area went. We went from relatively composed to a state of amateurish panic. If you can't see how this happens ever since we lost Kante actually, you ain't looking. Players at this level don't make errors without some factor involved. The factor last night was pressure and loss of shape. We lost shape, we invited pressure and our players who had looked relatively composed, suddenly looked very different. This is no coincidence and last night was the difference between success and failure. I suggest you watch the game again, for Arsenal's third Amartey was defending the near post, what do you want him to do magically teleport over to the other side to stop them?
coolhandfox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Sick of hearing the subs were the issue..... Same as it's been since the start of last season, we aren't doing the basics well enough, all 4 goals were down to poor decision making and individual errors. I can accept being cut apart by Arsenal playing great football, but not 3 goals from crosses! Goal 1 is once again Morgan leave his man unmarked, if he can't stay man and a head a ball away, what does he bring to the side! Goal 2, Mahrez poor decision making, rather the putting the ball into the channel for Vardy to chase in the 2nd minute of first half injury time, he tried to be clever and give the ball away in a dangerous error! Goal 3, 4 players unmarked at the back post, school boy stuff! Goal 4, once again Morgan, out muscle, if he's not going to win headers what does he bring to the side! Bloody amateur hour!!!!
Guest Col city fan Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 13 minutes ago, matty98 said: I suggest you watch the game again, for Arsenal's third Amartey was defending the near post, what do you want him to do magically teleport over to the other side to stop them? You're not getting the point so I'll give up. It's not about the why's and wherefore's of the individual player in a given situation. It's about the general level of calmness, composure, structure, and organisation of the team unit. As i said just...errors are made more often when a player is put under pressure. James went off and we changed. You could see it, you could feel it. I'm afraid bringing in Iheanacho just added to it. If anyone genuinely believes that bringing on Daniel Amartey and changing the shape when we are looking to hold out at the Emirates with 20 mins to go, was the right way to go, then I give in. Hell, some of us even said it last night when he came on. We need a better squad and I'm not only talking about Amartey. Wes is spent, Fuchs makes errors that people seem to ignore and Mahrez is a defensive liability.
ramadaone Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 1 hour ago, Bert said: Poor substitutes cost us the game, maybe not all three but certainly at least 1. Not buying what people are saying regarding James and that he wasn't fully fit. He has played a third of last season at Barnsley, had a full pre season with us too. He shouldn't have come off. Frustrating to go away to a place where we never do well and score 3 yet still come away with nothing. I don't know what it is with Arsenal but they always seems to get jammy against us. How Dean missed that Ozil handball is beyond me. We need to learn from our mistakes and quick, this is a brutal league and with our run of fixtures we could already be playing catchup by October. Thoughts on Maguire ?
Bert Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 4 minutes ago, ramadaone said: Thoughts on Maguire ? Impressed.
dynamark Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Didn't see it until footy focus but Giroud has Maguire at arms length shirt straight arm by the throat as he made the fourth and Morgan is blocked by Maguire. I would think Huth and Maguire will be a better option but we may be getting a bit over excited about Maguire due to his forays.It all about defence hull were relegated and we gave away four goals yesterday 3 from crosses remember. The shot Mahrez had after about 70 mins when he got onto his right side straight at the keeper yard either side and it was 4 2 . Brighton should be good don't forget to be nice to Knocky pre start..
ramadaone Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 3 minutes ago, Bert said: Impressed. Think we were about the only ones in the non believers camp when we signed him so nearly ready to admit defeat
st albans fox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Had we lost 4-3 at the emirates in a ding dong game then I could have coped quite essily to lose from 3-2 after 82 minutes with the games we have upcoming is a struggle for me.
st albans fox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 1 minute ago, ramadaone said: Think we were about the only ones in the non believers camp when we signed him so nearly ready to admit defeat I would be excited to see him in a three and I think it would suit our players - Spurs or atleti couldn't cope with our intensity three-five-two. We should try it again
foxfanazer Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Albrighton was superb last night. Nonsense when people say Mahrez is our only creative player. The quality of Albrighton's deliveries are a massive weapon for us
Bert Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 8 minutes ago, ramadaone said: Think we were about the only ones in the non believers camp when we signed him so nearly ready to admit defeat One swallow doesn't make a summer but he's surprised me so far and if he continues the way he's started I will happily admit I was wrong.
yorkie1999 Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 30 minutes ago, coolhandfox said: Sick of hearing the subs were the issue..... Same as it's been since the start of last season, we aren't doing the basics well enough, all 4 goals were down to poor decision making and individual errors. I can accept being cut apart by Arsenal playing great football, but not 3 goals from crosses! Goal 1 is once again Morgan leave his man unmarked, if he can't stay man and a head a ball away, what does he bring to the side! Goal 2, Mahrez poor decision making, rather the putting the ball into the channel for Vardy to chase in the 2nd minute of first half injury time, he tried to be clever and give the ball away in a dangerous error! Goal 3, 4 players unmarked at the back post, school boy stuff! Goal 4, once again Morgan, out muscle, if he's not going to win headers what does he bring to the side! Bloody amateur hour!!!! Morgan does appear to be a bit of a problem with what he actually offers now. I know he's the captain and all that, but if he can't head it, be comfortable on the ball, pick a pass or offer the slightest glimmer of being able to read the game, he's not really good enough for the prem. seems to be turning into a bit of a chump who's out of his depth now.
Fox92 Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Just got back actually. Thought we looked dangerous going forward but same old at the back - inviting crosses and not strong enough. The Iheancho sub fvcked it really. We needed to retain the ball at the very least. That sub lost our shape and everything.
coolhandfox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 38 minutes ago, Fox92 said: Just got back actually. Thought we looked dangerous going forward but same old at the back - inviting crosses and not strong enough. The Iheancho sub fvcked it really. We needed to retain the ball at the very least. That sub lost our shape and everything. We weren't retaining the ball the whole game, nothing to do with the sub! We lack the discipline and mental toughness to see the job though and do the basics.
Fox92 Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 2 minutes ago, coolhandfox said: We weren't retaining the ball the whole game, nothing to do with the sub! We lack the discipline and mental toughness to see the job though and do the basics. Yeah I know, we needed too. Okazaki was having a good game and sat in well. Iheancho came on and didn't look like what he was supposed to be doing.
turtmcfly Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 1 hour ago, Col city fan said: You're not getting the point so I'll give up. It's not about the why's and wherefore's of the individual player in a given situation. It's about the general level of calmness, composure, structure, and organisation of the team unit. As i said just...errors are made more often when a player is put under pressure. James went off and we changed. You could see it, you could feel it. I'm afraid bringing in Iheanacho just added to it. If anyone genuinely believes that bringing on Daniel Amartey and changing the shape when we are looking to hold out at the Emirates with 20 mins to go, was the right way to go, then I give in. Hell, some of us even said it last night when he came on. We need a better squad and I'm not only talking about Amartey. Wes is spent, Fuchs makes errors that people seem to ignore and Mahrez is a defensive liability. Could you try to give up just a little bit harder?
coolhandfox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 9 minutes ago, Fox92 said: Yeah I know, we needed too. Okazaki was having a good game and sat in well. Iheancho came on and didn't look like what he was supposed to be doing. Problem was that Oki runs himself out, coupled with James not being full fit, we lost the engine room when they both came off.
inckley fox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 1 hour ago, Col city fan said: I was answering the question. I think it's a bit sad (though not unexpected) that people STILL refuse to see what is right in front of their noses. James is an intelligent player. He's not the quickest, but he reads the game well. So does King. We were holding out with James in the team because he was covering runs. When he had to go off, the intelligence in the central area went. We went from relatively composed to a state of amateurish panic. If you can't see how this happens ever since we lost Kante actually, you ain't looking. Players at this level don't make errors without some factor involved. The factor last night was pressure and loss of shape. We lost shape, we invited pressure and our players who had looked relatively composed, suddenly looked very different. This is no coincidence and last night was the difference between success and failure. Your suggestion last night (and for the entire first half of last season!) was that our problems pretty much boil down to Amartey. On one occasion last season I asked you straight up if you thought our post-title collapse in form was, put simply, down to Amartey and you insisted that, yes, it was. Too often you've fallen into the trap of pinning an outrageous number of issues on him and then scrambling for a more sophisticated argument to back this up. I don't want to come across as being one of Amartey's standard-bearers, because I don't think he should be in the side, not in midfield, and I didn't think he was the right sub last night. Plus, no, he's not Kante. Nobody is, and we have to get used to that. But it's very disappointing to see a fan appearing to revel in our misfortune when they feel it can be blamed on an individual that they don't like. There were lots of reasons for our loss, some of which you've begun to touch on: Not making earlier subs led to Arsenal taking the initiative. We didn't deal with Xhaka and he had too much influence late on. Subs weren't like-for-like and this provoked a change in shape to which, for a 10 minute period, we didn't adjust. Defenders, specifically Morgan and the otherwise-impressive Fuchs, repeatedly failed to deal with balls into the box. Set piece defending was dreadful. Mahrez was on the periphery of the game and we didn't look at alternatives. A key decision went against us etc. I could go on, but finding a way of making this Amartey's fault, when the guy's individual contribution was fine, is wrong. As you say yourself, there were issues with our wider shape, just like there were issues with other individuals, and we'll learn more about how to advance as a team if we focus on these issues, rather than resorting to the usual 'Amartey is useless, he's the source of all our problems... See? I told you so!'
foxinsocks Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 1 hour ago, Col city fan said: You're not getting the point so I'll give up. It's not about the why's and wherefore's of the individual player in a given situation. It's about the general level of calmness, composure, structure, and organisation of the team unit. As i said just...errors are made more often when a player is put under pressure. James went off and we changed. You could see it, you could feel it. I'm afraid bringing in Iheanacho just added to it. If anyone genuinely believes that bringing on Daniel Amartey and changing the shape when we are looking to hold out at the Emirates with 20 mins to go, was the right way to go, then I give in. Hell, some of us even said it last night when he came on. We need a better squad and I'm not only talking about Amartey. Wes is spent, Fuchs makes errors that people seem to ignore and Mahrez is a defensive liability. I am not against amarty. Defensive mids are hard to find and he could become ours.. and be worth more than a defender. But i agee there's a time and place and last night we were doing fine and may have got goals as they were forced to chase the game. Agree. ...There's a time and place to sit back.... i dont want to see shakes make tgat mistake again
foxinsocks Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Ps. Sky paid millions for the games... but wrf was the post match golf cart with interactive screen all about?
pazzerfox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 3 hours ago, Col city fan said: I posted this last night. I'd never play Amartey anyway. For me, if I'd have done it Shakey's way....King and Slimani. I'd have definitely brought Slimani on.
Countryfox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Really really hope Shakey learns from this .... Not worried too much about it just yet as long as he doesn't keep making the same mistakes. I wonder what influence his number 2 has and whether they will gel together ? 12 of us sat there watching the game and we all agreed 'he could have done better' ... Considering we had no DD and no Huth (who could both make a difference) and that the new boys are still very new, I'm overall quite optimistic .... And of course the transfer window is still open ..
HighPeakFox Posted 12 August 2017 Posted 12 August 2017 Personally, I blame Iborra for being unavailable.
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