LCFC Announce Partnership With Stonewall

[majaco]

2 hours ago, mazarron fox said:

I am going to say this. Firstly I am a white Englishman retired in Spain and I consider everyone color or creed or whatever the same. I judge the person not the background or sexuality. I work in a charity shop where it is run by British to help local Moroccan, South American , along with Spanish to get good deals on clothes and furniture etc and the money we make gets plowed into local schools for computers etc. 

Recently a very nice man came in who is a regular customer and I said the colored man came in and got berated for not saying black man which I personally find offensive but apparently that’s the correct term for a black African. My South American customers call me gringo an Australian friend calls me pomme so can someone please explain what is correct when I just shake everyone’s hand and treat everyone with the same respect? Mr confused from Spain the gringo

 

The term coloured was used in a derogatory way in America.  Because of its history it is offensive.  It was also used in an offensive way in South Africa.  The term 'a person  of colour ' is totally acceptable.  'Aussie' is an acceptable , friendly term; however a similar shortening of the word 'Pakistani is not.  Again  it is historical, the term was used as a catch-all insulting term for people of Asian origin.

Much to my regret, growing up in  Hinckley, some racist terms were part of my vocabulary at a time where there was less awareness.  People at the time did not mean to offend, we just were not educated in using language respectfully.

You sound  very respectful.  Respect to you for your charity work.  The term 'black' is generally inoffensive unlike the word 'coloured. '

[majaco]

I am a parent of a trans child.  There are huge rates of suicide attempts amongst trans teenagers.

 

It is easy to be an accepting parent of a trans child.  I choose to love my daughter and keep her safe.

 

In her first match at the KP, she saw Mahrez score with his thirteenth consecutive touch.

[shade]

we know what it looks like when the right goes too far, what does it look like when the left goes too far?

[HighPeakFox]

1 minute ago, shade said:

we know what it looks like when the right goes too far, what does it look like when the left goes too far?

How is this even relevant?

[Nickfosse]

3 minutes ago, shade said:

we know what it looks like when the right goes too far, what does it look like when the left goes too far?

Err Stalin and Cuba I guess. I’m not sure what your point is in the context of a thread about standing up against homophobia?

Edited 10 July 2019 by Nickfosse

[shade]

Just now, Nickfosse said:

Err Stalin and Cuba I guess. I’m not sure what your point is in the context in a thread about standing up against homophobia?

I suppose i’m saying, where do you stop, we’ve already added tq+ on to the list, there’s an infinite number of letters that we can add if we keep drilling down. it essentially means you’re making a value judgement on who deserves to not be discriminated against, when in reality all discrimination is wrong. 

[Nickfosse]

Just now, shade said:

I suppose i’m saying, where do you stop, we’ve already added tq+ on to the list, there’s an infinite number of letters that we can add if we keep drilling down. it essentially means you’re making a value judgement on who deserves to not be discriminated against, when in reality all discrimination is wrong. 

Totally agree. 

[ian_marshall]

Really positive step by the club. I hope that this acts as a catalyst for those employees of the club who may be in the public spotlight to feel comfortable openly expressing their sexuality so that they can act as role models and help to dismiss any prejudices that may still remain amongst certain sections of our supporter base.

[MC Prussian]

5 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

We have the bizarre situation here where schools in Birmingham are having parents protesting and removing their children from classes because their kids are being taught that a) gay people exist and b) that's ok. Their protests have included hilarious placards stating "Education Not Indoctrination" and people telling reporters that homosexuality might be legal but that doesn't make it moral. Bizarre times. 

Digressing from the main topic, but I think this needs to be said.

 

Those parents protesting are predominantly... Muslim. They do tend to live by themselves and excluding themselves from integrating into society in general. Little interaction with Christians, Jews or other people other than their own. This is a parallel society. This is one issue.

 

The other issue here is that one can question the decision to already teach four-year olds on LGBTQ+andwhatnot, when they don't even truly understand the concept. This is a fringe topic and should be treated as such. They're better off learning the basics instead. Tolerance and acceptance is ok, but that's for everybody, regardless of their sexual notions. I can't recall my generation being taught about sexuality at age 4. Do you?

[09bballer]

100% support this initiative.

[majaco]

6 minutes ago, MC Prussian said:

Digressing from the main topic, but I think this needs to be said.

 

Those parents protesting are predominantly... Muslim. They do tend to live by themselves and excluding themselves from integrating into society in general. Little interaction with Christians, Jews or other people other than their own. This is a parallel society. This is one issue.

 

The other issue here is that one can question the decision to already teach four-year olds on LGBTQ+andwhatnot, when they don't even truly understand the concept. This is a fringe topic and should be treated as such. They're better off learning the basics instead. Tolerance and acceptance is ok, but that's for everybody, regardless of their sexual notions. I can't recall my generation being taught about sexuality at age 4. Do you?

Retrospectively, I knew I was straight at about 5.  That's easy.  You don't need to come out, or question  yourself,  as straight.  There are loads of images  of straight people projected in so many ways.  However, there are diverse ways pf being normal.  Children, and everyone, should be given the message:  it's okay to be you.

[An Away Move]

I was proudly wearing our new pink away kit today, walking tall, down Oxford Street when someone asked me if I was wearing a gay top!!!

Suffice to say that is good and probably necessary partnership to have!

I wonder if the pink kit was a coincidence? Or perhaps planned with the Stonewall partnership in mind - if that’s not a homophobic thing in itself to suggest! 

[majaco]

It's not homophobic.  Pink is , in part, a symbol of support.  Ironically, pink used to be colour associated with boys.

[wardyfox86]

It's sad that, in 2019, we have to announce to the uneducated, ignorant, intolerant few out there that we stand against discrimination. 

 

It should be a given. 

[urban.spaceman]

1 hour ago, MC Prussian said:

Digressing from the main topic, but I think this needs to be said.

 

Those parents protesting are predominantly... Muslim. They do tend to live by themselves and excluding themselves from integrating into society in general. Little interaction with Christians, Jews or other people other than their own. This is a parallel society. This is one issue.

 

The other issue here is that one can question the decision to already teach four-year olds on LGBTQ+andwhatnot, when they don't even truly understand the concept. This is a fringe topic and should be treated as such. They're better off learning the basics instead. Tolerance and acceptance is ok, but that's for everybody, regardless of their sexual notions. I can't recall my generation being taught about sexuality at age 4. Do you?

I grew up with Section 28 still in effect, so I suppose my generation's experience is only relevant in a "look how far we've come" sense. I agree that it should be a "fringe topic" for this age range, but that's what the "no outsiders" program is. It's not an in depth instructional program about what happens in the bedroom, it's literally just teaching the kids on a very basic level that some kids have two mums or two dads, and that's ok. The level of contempt for even a basic understanding of homosexuality, of difference, from parents who ironically could have done with this education themselves, is truly shocking for this country in this day and age. 

[Aus Fox]

As a supporter who used to go regularly in the 90s early 2000s, before moving to the other side of the world.

How bad is it at grounds now?

I know when I first started going a lot of individual comments were heard regularly,  and I know whenever we played Brighton “we can see you holding hands” and “does your boyfriend know your here?” Were regularly aimed at their supporters.

 How bad is it now?

When you visit the KP do you still get homophobic abuse shouted from the stands?

I think, within our supporters racist abuse was never really tolerated, although it did happen.

Can anyone give me an insight into the games now?

Do we have any LGBTQ posters on here who regularly attend games? Would be great to have an insight into how safe you feel when attending the games.

[ozleicester]

6 hours ago, mazarron fox said:

I am going to say this. Firstly I am a white Englishman retired in Spain and I consider everyone color or creed or whatever the same. I judge the person not the background or sexuality. I work in a charity shop where it is run by British to help local Moroccan, South American , along with Spanish to get good deals on clothes and furniture etc and the money we make gets plowed into local schools for computers etc. 

Recently a very nice man came in who is a regular customer and I said the colored man came in and got berated for not saying black man which I personally find offensive but apparently that’s the correct term for a black African. My South American customers call me gringo an Australian friend calls me pomme so can someone please explain what is correct when I just shake everyone’s hand and treat everyone with the same respect? Mr confused from Spain the gringo

 

If you were berated, it sounds an overreaction and the person concerned has some issues

 

However, i spent my youth being called a Pom or Pommy Bastard by the aussies... the DIFFERENCE is that it is NOT a derogatory term because my past and throughout history i was never considered LESS as a pom, i was part of the ruling class.

 

There were not signs banning me from certain establishments because of my colour

There were not places i was not allowed to walk because of my race

There were not times that i was not allowed out because of my colour

There were not places i was not allowed to work because of my sexuality.

My family were not stolen by the government because of my colour

 

 

 

[volpeazzurro]

6 hours ago, majaco said:

Retrospectively, I knew I was straight at about 5.  That's easy.  You don't need to come out, or question  yourself,  as straight.  There are loads of images  of straight people projected in so many ways.  However, there are diverse ways pf being normal.  Children, and everyone, should be given the message:  it's okay to be you.

It must be a personal thing or perhaps generational, acceptence of all is paramount of course, but I certainly wouldn't have had any notion at all at the age of 5 regarding whether I was straight or otherwise personally. A 5 year old, I don't think would even consider many of these things unless an adult puts them into his/her head. For example, a 5 yr old may sit in a classroom or other situation and notice that the child next to them may be black, white or Asian etc and whilst the observance of difference may occur it  perhaps takes the intervention of an adult to add the elements of hatred or predudice. I don't remember what age I was when I started having feelings or notions of a sexual nature but it certainly wasn't at 5, then again I may well have been slow!

Edited 11 July 2019 by volpeazzurro

[Nicolo Barella]

I'd just like to thank boots60 for his inane comment providing us with a lot of excellent reaction posts.

[worth_the_wait]

5 hours ago, ozleicester said:

If you were berated, it sounds an overreaction and the person concerned has some issues

 

However, i spent my youth being called a Pom or Pommy Bastard by the aussies... the DIFFERENCE is that it is NOT a derogatory term because my past and throughout history i was never considered LESS as a pom, i was part of the ruling class.

 

There were not signs banning me from certain establishments because of my colour

There were not places i was not allowed to walk because of my race

There were not times that i was not allowed out because of my colour

There were not places i was not allowed to work because of my sexuality.

My family were not stolen by the government because of my colour

 

 

 

Absolute irrelevant drivel.

 

There are many places in the world where having a white face and/or English accent will do you no favours whatsoever.  Discrimination is a universal trait of many people across the world.

 

And what's that got to do with anything anyway?  We're dealing with the here and now, not living in the past.  Remember, it's 2019.  Under modern protocols, insults/abuse are defined by how it makes the recipient feel,   It's nothing to do with whether you think it's alright or not.

 

If someone calls me a pom/sassenach/honkey/brit in a derogatory way, then it's abuse.

 

Britons were enslaved by the Romans, but it doesn't mean we can go on blaming the Italians for any perceived sleight.

 

It's really not very difficult.  Just be nice to everyone, and treat everyone how you would like to be treated yourself.   Then we all get along just fine.

[HighPeakFox]

1 minute ago, worth_the_wait said:

Absolute irrelevant drivel.

 

There are many places in the world where having a white face and/or English accent will do you no favours whatsoever.  Discrimination is a universal trait of many people across the world.

 

And what's that got to do with anything anyway?  We're dealing with the here and now, not living in the past.  Remember, it's 2019.  Under modern protocols, insults/abuse are defined by how it makes the recipient feel,   It's nothing to do with whether you think it's alright or not.

 

If someone calls me a pom/sassenach/honkey/brit in a derogatory way, then it's abuse.

 

Britons were enslaved by the Romans, but it doesn't mean we can go on blaming the Italians for any perceived sleight.

 

It's really not very difficult.  Just be nice to everyone, and treat everyone how you would like to be treated yourself.   Then we all get along just fine.

Oddly, it isn't drivel at all, but you make some good points too. I think most of us are essentially on the same page - hatred is hatred, and needs dealing with.

[worth_the_wait]

30 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

Oddly, it isn't drivel at all, but you make some good points too. I think most of us are essentially on the same page - hatred is hatred, and needs dealing with.

"Absolute irrelevant drivel " was just the attention grabber!

 

Of course, it's not totally irrelevant.   But the bottom line for me, is I don't like it when people pick and choose which "abuse" is ok and which is not.   Personally, I'm fairly laid back if terms are used accidentally and/or that are genuinely not meant to offend.     

 

Probably the best example was a few years back when an old lady phoned up a supermarket to compliment a delivery man.   She didn't know his name, but he said he was a "lovely coloured gentleman".  The word was slighly unfortunate, but the context was crystal clear.   For her troubles, she got a severe telling off and had the phone put down on her.   Maybe a bit of tolerance (and gentle education) might not have gone amiss?

[ozleicester]

57 minutes ago, worth_the_wait said:

Absolute irrelevant drivel.

 

There are many places in the world where having a white face and/or English accent will do you no favours whatsoever.  Discrimination is a universal trait of many people across the world.

 

And what's that got to do with anything anyway?  We're dealing with the here and now, not living in the past.  Remember, it's 2019.  Under modern protocols, insults/abuse are defined by how it makes the recipient feel,   It's nothing to do with whether you think it's alright or not.

 

If someone calls me a pom/sassenach/honkey/brit in a derogatory way, then it's abuse.

 

Britons were enslaved by the Romans, but it doesn't mean we can go on blaming the Italians for any perceived sleight.

 

It's really not very difficult.  Just be nice to everyone, and treat everyone how you would like to be treated yourself.   Then we all get along just fine.

Obviously i have not made myself clear.

 

Abuse is never OK

 

But just treating people equally often isnt enough, some people need assistance to overcome the entrenched bias

Edited 11 July 2019 by ozleicester

[HighPeakFox]

22 minutes ago, worth_the_wait said:

"Absolute irrelevant drivel " was just the attention grabber!

If you didn't mean it, don't say it. 

 

Oz was making the point that whatever abuse white people might receive, we still largely don't have a clue how bad it is for non-whites, and I suspect that's largely the case. 

 

I agree with you that all abuse is bad, however. The problem is when we have abusers in positions of power, as we increasingly do now. 

[RumbleFox]

I think this thread illustrates why it's a good move. When supporting the efforts to reduce  abuse of homosexuals is compared to Stalin and akin to "the left going too far" we've still a way to go. And before anyone starts or tries to strawman my point, as a full on lefty I agre there are dangers with identity politics and I see many things on the  left that do deserve challenge and discussion but an initiative like this isn't some kind of leftish, slippery slope to Marxism, it's showing support to a group of people that sometimes face abuse at football matches for literally just being the way they were born to be. X 

Edited 11 July 2019 by RumbleFox