Adrien Silva - Terms Agreed

[DelBoy73]

Just now, shiv said:

But we don't gather the documents, we receive them?

Well, not to sound like a obnoxious arse, but in any line of work, when a third party has to send you documents in order for you to receive and submit them in any given timeline, you have to take some mesures to get that job done in due time.

I am an international purchaser in the consumer electronics business; i often make procurements in overstock clearance deals that are regulated by a bidding system;

never missed to submit paper work, licensing certification and all before deadline, nor have i witnessed anyone failing to.

 

[katieakita]

8 hours ago, vanity said:

The Mercury writes that "Even though Leicester are adamant  they completed the paperwork before the deadline, it is the time that the FA received it that counts."

 

Does anyone know what part of the rules they get this from? That the time the FA receives the application is what FIFA goes by? Because if you read Annexe 3 to the rules, which lays out the registration procedure, it says that "All applications to register a professional must be submitted by the new club to the new association during one of the registration periods established by that association." (See Annexe 3a, rule 3.1, p. 63). Also: "[a]ll submissions must be entered in TMS by the deadline in the time zone of the association concerned," which also implies it is the time of submission, not receipt by the FA. (https://resources.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/administration/02/70/95/52/regulationsonthestatusandtransferofplayersjune2016_e_neutral.pdf).

 

There is a delay between any submission and receipt. We have no instantaneous communication, even electronically. We have all sent emails that are not immediately received, that are delayed for some reason for 10 seconds, 30 seconds, even a minute or more. That would likely be my first argument, subject to testing the TMS system.

 

In the alternative, I would look to argue that the uploading of the documents is a process that occurs after submission. So if, due to the size of what is being sent, there is a delay after submission, when the user is waiting while the system hangs while uploading a large sized set of files, I might examine the system to see whether it could reasonably argued that "submission" for the purposes of the FIFA rule occurs when the upload has been initiated.  If a large set of documents can delay things 15 seconds, then that might hold water. 

 

Of course, I'd also be looking for some sort of catch-all where the FIFA Appeals Board has some sort of equitable powers that allow discretion in such situations, best interest of the player, no competitive advantage, etc. My understanding is the DeGea rejection should have been sent to appeal, per FIFA, as Man U. would've been successful. I'd be interested to learn why, and see whether we can leverage something there.

 

SO we may still have some colorable arguments to make.

Thank you for more insight, just IMVVHO here, there is ample grounds to appeal it seems assuming the details that are coming out are correct. The player wants to come here, the selling club are happy with the fee and we as the buying club are happy with the fee the issue appears to be when paperwork was received not SUBMITTED however looking at the rules and guidelines it states submitted which we appear to have complied with and it can come down to simple interpretation and reasonableness which is cause for appeal. Also it seems to be given that a 2 hour extension was granted from 11pm but if for arguments sake the paperwork had to be submitted 1 minute before the deadline we were either not given a 2 hour extension from 11pm or a 2hr extension was granted from 10.59pm this can all be cited as reasons for a successful appeal just IMVHO and as it seems to be a business contract issue with the FA and not FIFA UK law favours the weaker party so would side with our interuptation of the rules and it does appear even though it was left late we acted in good faith and believed we had followed the rules and guidelines we shall see. 

[chapero82]

2 hours ago, nwl fox said:

So does that mean Iborra is 5th choice then?

1 hrs injured 2 we don't know if he will adapt plus he hasn't played many gabes so probably couldn't last a full 60 let alone 90 

[murphy]

Does anybody know whether Silva is actually injured in which case he would have missed some time anyway?

 

Or did I just dream that.

[Ted Maul]

13 minutes ago, harpendenfox said:

if he can't play until January I very much hope we are not going to argue that he is not our player, as the Mercury is suggesting. Surely any good will Silva has towards us will be lost if we refuse to take him.

This.

 

Why on earth would we want to back out of the deal and then have to try and sign him again in January, potentially for more money? 

 

Say he's on £80k per week- that's about £1.3m wasted until we can play him in January. Sod all in terms of transfer fees.

 

Get him integrated with the squad, keep him match fit in the U23s and have him ready to hit the ground running in the new year.

[Tuna]

'Matty James used to do it in the Championship and he's back now (from a loan at Barnsley). I'm sure he can take Drinky's place. It'll be fine.' - Jamie Vardy.


 

[STUHILL]

Just now, Ted Maul said:

This.

 

Why on earth would we want to back out of the deal and then have to try and sign him again in January, potentially for more money? 

 

Say he's on £80k per week- that's about £1.3m wasted until we can play him in January. Sod all in terms of transfer fees.

 

Get him integrated with the squad, keep him match fit in the U23s and have him ready to hit the ground running in the new year.

It's far from ideal, but January will soon be here and he will be fresh and ready to go no doubt. Still hope we can win an appeal though as Fifa will be laughed at for forcing a player to sit around for months just because of 14seconds and some confusion etc, I know they have to be strict on the rules, to stop multiple appeals in the future, but surely common sense can prevail on something as trivial as this! 

[Gerard]

6 minutes ago, chapero82 said:

1 hrs injured 2 we don't know if he will adapt plus he hasn't played many gabes so probably couldn't last a full 60 let alone 90 

 

I keep hearing we can't fully trust Iborra as he's never played in the PL but neither has Silva. Why is it accepted that one is a potential liability and the other will step up and be at least as good as Drinkwater?

[Gerard]

35 minutes ago, davieG said:

However, the Mercury understands that Leicester maintain that the £22million deal to bring Silva to the club will NOT go through if the decision stands.

 

I wonder if he trains with the squad today? If he does surely that's an admission that he will be a Leicester player regardless of the conclusion.

[somebum]

14 minutes ago, DelBoy73 said:

Well, not to sound like a obnoxious arse, but in any line of work, when a third party has to send you documents in order for you to receive and submit them in any given timeline, you have to take some mesures to get that job done in due time.

I am an international purchaser in the consumer electronics business; i often make procurements in overstock clearance deals that are regulated by a bidding system;

never missed to submit paper work, licensing certification and all before deadline, nor have i witnessed anyone failing to.

 

I'm with you. It's utterly ridiculous for anyone to assume that we are without fault here. There's no excuse at all. Rudkin should be sacked for gross negligence.

[Guest]

It's not over till there is an official statement

[mazarron fox]

24 minutes ago, DelBoy73 said:

Well, not to sound like a obnoxious arse, but in any line of work, when a third party has to send you documents in order for you to receive and submit them in any given timeline, you have to take some mesures to get that job done in due time.

I am an international purchaser in the consumer electronics business; i often make procurements in overstock clearance deals that are regulated by a bidding system;

never missed to submit paper work, licensing certification and all before deadline, nor have i witnessed anyone failing to.

 

See FT does have clever people on here!

[danny.]

39 minutes ago, Sublime_Coatsworth said:

It all depends what's in FIFA's wording. For companies I've worked for it talks about data received by "our routers".

 

ill be very surprised if it's not 100% clear in whatever commercial agreement FIFA has in place - and is why it was rejected.

There must be measures in place to account for technical errors/slowness. What if one of their routers crashed, there was a DDoS, high network traffic, fault cpu or HDD etc. etc. lots of things could cause a 15 second delay

[weller54]

24 minutes ago, Ted Maul said:

This.

 

Why on earth would we want to back out of the deal and then have to try and sign him again in January, potentially for more money? 

 

Say he's on £80k per week- that's about £1.3m wasted until we can play him in January. Sod all in terms of transfer fees.

 

Get him integrated with the squad, keep him match fit in the U23s and have him ready to hit the ground running in the new year.

.......just in time for the relegation battle! 

[SheppyFox]

Any news? 

[chapero82]

28 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

I keep hearing we can't fully trust Iborra as he's never played in the PL but neither has Silva. Why is it accepted that one is a potential liability and the other will step up and be at least as good as Drinkwater?

I've never once said Silva will make the step up nor will Iborra but Silva has played more games the past year than Iborra, I'm going on fitness etc 

[weller54]

3 minutes ago, SheppyFox said:

Any news? 

Just had shredded wheat for breakfast and I'm going to see a Cat Stevens tribute act tonight in Cambridge! 

[Gerard]

2 minutes ago, weller54 said:

Just had shredded wheat for breakfast and I'm going to see a Cat Stevens tribute act tonight in Cambridge! 

 

Living the life...................

[mod hero]

26 minutes ago, mazarron fox said:

See FT does have clever people on here!

Wait.. what?

[Ted Maul]

17 minutes ago, weller54 said:

.......just in time for the relegation battle! 

 I'd like to think not- we were so much better than Brighton that I was bored watching it, and we should have won away at Arsenal. United are a cut above this year, and we were always going to struggle there.

 

This is before our new CM signing has played a minute- we should be midtable all season really.

[Ted Maul]

41 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

It's far from ideal, but January will soon be here and he will be fresh and ready to go no doubt. Still hope we can win an appeal though as Fifa will be laughed at for forcing a player to sit around for months just because of 14seconds and some confusion etc, I know they have to be strict on the rules, to stop multiple appeals in the future, but surely common sense can prevail on something as trivial as this! 

It should really force them to change the rules- it can't be right that a player is left in limbo like that. They will surely tweak it so that international clearance has to be granted before the deal between the 2 clubs can be finalised.

[BigMicky]

54 minutes ago, DelBoy73 said:

Well, not to sound like a obnoxious arse, but in any line of work, when a third party has to send you documents in order for you to receive and submit them in any given timeline, you have to take some mesures to get that job done in due time.

I am an international purchaser in the consumer electronics business; i often make procurements in overstock clearance deals that are regulated by a bidding system;

never missed to submit paper work, licensing certification and all before deadline, nor have i witnessed anyone failing to.

 

You failed at the first attempt. I work in an industry where deadlines are missed all the time because suppliers send the relevant information in too late, guess what? Our bid isn't accepted due to missing the deadline. To compare your work to an international football transfer is also laughable, what inner knowledge do you have? I guess zero just like the rest of us. Period.......

[foxinsocks]

1 hour ago, funkyrobot said:

 

 

Great song but needs a chorus

 

Unlike rudkin i aways send messages early and in triplicate...leaving nothing to chance 

[HankMarvin]

8 minutes ago, BigMicky said:

You failed at the first attempt. I work in an industry where deadlines are missed all the time because suppliers send the relevant information in too late, guess what? Our bid isn't accepted due to missing the deadline. To compare your work to an international football transfer is also laughable, what inner knowledge do you have? I guess zero just like the rest of us. Period.......

Tampon or pad?

[Guest Col city fan]

23 minutes ago, weller54 said:

Just had shredded wheat for breakfast and I'm going to see a Cat Stevens tribute act tonight in Cambridge! 

Cat Stevens!