Do we need to get rid of some "big players" in the dressing room?

[NorthfieldsFox]

8 hours ago, Rob1742 said:

You have two options. You either bring in a strong enough manager to handle the big players (Dyche or Rafa), or you get rid (Taylor style) and hope he can create a new team.

 

A middle of the road manager like Shakespeare or Puel aren’t strong enough to deal with a strong group that won the Premier League 

This 

[Bob Hazels shorts]

The problem seems to be that we don't have enough big players in the dressing room.

 

Under MON the players were a 'team' that had banter and motivated each other, many are still mates now.

 

We won the league due to the players relationship with each other, all playing for each other and out of their skin.

 

The changing room now (trust me) is full of individuals or pockets of players who share the same language.

 

Travelling to and from games players wear headphones and fuuck about with their phones, there is virtually no chat. The U23 buck this trend to a degree and still have banter, recent results and application seem to show this.

 

Can't necessarily blame Puel for this but he's hardly going to get a party going.

 

 

[cityfanlee23]

Might be controversial but I've always thought vardy is probably one of those with a particularly poor off pitch attitude. He's always struck me as the kind of player that holds a lot of cards in the dressing room and isn't afraid to work behind someone's back. 

 

I know you aren't allowed to say that about our saviour though. 

[les-tah]

If you look at the people who are made captains in Morgans absence.. Kasper, Vardy.. hate saying it might be vardy but i think it might well be.

 

winning the premier league jackpot is just the same as an average person winning the jackpot in the lottery. They just cant handle it and it goes to their heads.

 

Edited 30 April 2018 by les-tah

[Kitchandro]

10 minutes ago, cityfanlee23 said:

Might be controversial but I've always thought vardy is probably one of those with a particularly poor off pitch attitude. He's always struck me as the kind of player that holds a lot of cards in the dressing room and isn't afraid to work behind someone's back. 

 

I know you aren't allowed to say that about our saviour though. 

I know you’re trying to be funny but he is our saviour, time and time again.

 

Look, let’s not beat around the bush here, we all know Mahrez and Gray are the two with the worst attitude. On the pitch and off it. I’d be happy to see the back of both of them.

[Redouane]

2 hours ago, MC Prussian said:

There is absolutely no proof that we'd be worse off without Puel than with him, let alone involved in a relegation battle.

 

Claims of this sort are ludicrous. The logic of some people...

 

We had gotten results under Shakespeare before and after the heavy start to this season, with losses against Arsenal, Manchester United, Chelsea and Liverpool (three of those by only one goal), we may as well have turned it around under the same manager.

 

 

That's a different argument. I'm saying that Puel got is to 7th whereas Shakespeare was on the verge of relegation. Whether he would've turned things around is neither here nor there. 

 

Puel also reignited Mahrez, made Chillwell and Gray regulars, and increased the possession stats.

 

Sure, he's been having bad results lately, but can we really blame him and not the players? There's clearly an ego problem in the team, and the solution is to bring an even more egotiscal manager like Mourinho 

[MC Prussian]

11 minutes ago, Redouane said:

That's a different argument. I'm saying that Puel got is to 7th whereas Shakespeare was on the verge of relegation. Whether he would've turned things around is neither here nor there. 

 

Puel also reignited Mahrez, made Chillwell and Gray regulars, and increased the possession stats.

 

Sure, he's been having bad results lately, but can we really blame him and not the players? There's clearly an ego problem in the team, and the solution is to bring an even more egotiscal manager like Mourinho 

After eight matches! And that after four losses against four of this season's Top Six teams.

 

Puel "reignited Mahrez"? Well, where has that Mahrez guy been in the past nine matches or so?

There's an ego problem in the team? Really? The players aren't confused by a manager who can neither motivate them nor put through his strategy in an understandable manner?

And how exactly has more possession won us football games?

Deary me.

Edited 30 April 2018 by MC Prussian

[Grebfromgrebland]

We look a shambles at the minute and the palace game really bought it into focus. Their midfield and wingers all looked a league ahead of ours.

 

I think some players have simply given up knowing that they'll be gone in the summer.

 

Morgan

Simpson

Fuchs

James

Ulloa

Slimani

Musa

King

Benaluane

Okazaki

Mahrez

And probably a few more.

 

The more I think about it the more I think the club is in crisis. 

Edited 30 April 2018 by Grebfromgrebland

[Redouane]

41 minutes ago, MC Prussian said:

After eight matches! And that after four losses against four of this season's Top Six teams.

 

Puel "reignited Mahrez"? Well, where has that Mahrez guy been in the past nine matches or so?

There's an ego problem in the team? Really? The players aren't confused by a manager who can neither motivate them nor put through his strategy in an understandable manner?

And how exactly has more possession won us football games?

Deary me.

Those 8 matches were crucial, and could've defined the season. Shakey did not have enough experience to get the players out of that losing mentality. 

 

Yes, Puel reignited Mahrez who achieved over 11 goals and 8 assists this season, not to mention his involvement in other goals. Sure, he's been slumping in the past couple of games, but I don't see anyone else playing as-well as they did in the first half of the season. Believe it or not, but football is a team game, one guy cannot carry his entire team.

 

How do you know what Puel is like in training? He motivated enough to get them to 7th place, so you are arugment is null. And I didn't see anyone complaining about the possession 6 months ago, everyone was praising Puel and now everyone switches their agenda? 

[indierich06]

On 28/04/2018 at 20:29, cityfanlee23 said:

I'm not sure they "lost the plot" sure they've all made poor decisions, but take claudio as an example. He slightly changed what Pearson had built to massive success, but we knew things needed to change long term because our style of play was being nullified. He tried to change things and the players stopped bothering. Claudio and Claude have both been doing the right thing (albeit probably the wrong way) but the players seem to have too much control. 

How can you say that without any evidence whatsoever? Towards the end of Ranieri's time at Leicester, I saw a team missing a key component in Kante, being asked to play a style of football which nullified much of what made them the team which won the league, all while losing confidence with each defeat. Meanwhile, Ranieri signed off on the sacking of the sports psychologist who had worked with the team so successfully the season before, right at the point when they probably needed him the most.

 

I'd say the worst you can accuse these players off is mental fragility. When things are going well, they're fine - when things aren't going their way, they fold. And that's very worrying.

 

I'd say that re-appointing a dedicated sports psychologists for the first team is just as important as getting the next managerial appointment right.

[indierich06]

40 minutes ago, Grebfromgrebland said:

We look a shambles at the minute and the palace game really bought it into focus. Their midfield and wingers all looked a league ahead of ours.

 

I think some players have simply given up knowing that they'll be gone in the summer.

 

Morgan

Simpson

Fuchs

James

Ulloa

Slimani

Musa

King

Benaluane

Okazaki

Mahrez

And probably a few more.

 

The more I think about it the more I think the club is in crisis. 

The good thing is, there's still a solid spine at the club to build on - if Schmeichel, Maguire, Ndidi and Vardy all stay then we can build around that. There's definitely some dead wood to clear out this summer though.

[MC Prussian]

3 hours ago, Redouane said:

Those 8 matches were crucial, and could've defined the season. Shakey did not have enough experience to get the players out of that losing mentality. 

 

Yes, Puel reignited Mahrez who achieved over 11 goals and 8 assists this season, not to mention his involvement in other goals. Sure, he's been slumping in the past couple of games, but I don't see anyone else playing as-well as they did in the first half of the season. Believe it or not, but football is a team game, one guy cannot carry his entire team.

 

How do you know what Puel is like in training? He motivated enough to get them to 7th place, so you are arugment is null. And I didn't see anyone complaining about the possession 6 months ago, everyone was praising Puel and now everyone switches their agenda? 

Again, blaming the former manager for our heavy start to the season, completely ignoring the fact that Shakespeare's total league record as manager is pretty even with eight wins, five draws and eight losses. In his last sixteen matches as a manager, we lost against Everton, Arsenal (twice), Manchester City, Tottenham, Manchester United, Chelsea and Liverpool. Which manager would've done better under those circumstances?

And again, there's no proof we would've done much worse under Shakespeare than we have now under Puel for the past 18 matches.

 

Puel didn't reignite Mahrez, not really. The boost only happened at the start of Puel's tenure, when Mahrez was already on a goal and five assists. So, that's nine goals and six assists left under Puel, most of those before Mahrez threw his tantrums in January. In the past nine matches, it's two goals and one assist, which is rather shocking. If Puel was allegedly so good at dealing with "difficult characters" (as proven with Ben Arfa at Nice), how come he couldn't do the same with Mahrez? Language can't be an issue.

And how much motivation does Mahrez need to come from the manager? How about showing some self-motivation also? Mahrez doesn't want to be here anymore and it's all clearly visible week in, week out.

The problem is that he doesn't realize how much that's going to hurt his future prospects.

 

There is at least one player who is still living up to his regular standard, and that's Vardy. To score this many goals this season with a sloppy and lacklustre midfield like ours verges on a miracle. Albrighton has also been an unsung hero for us so far.

 

So, Puel can motivate his players to four wins in eighteen league matches? That's great. Regular performances during the first half that resemble sleepwalking exercises, and that with the possession-based football he forces our players to play? 

 

Six months ago, we did NOT play possession-based football. The reason for Puel's initial success was that he played to our players' strengths, much like Ranieri in his first season. He didn't change much, we relied on counter-attacking football and were much more direct in our approach. Hence five wins and two draws in the first eight matches under Puel. He changed or tried to change the style afterwards and look in what mess we are right now...

 

Edited 30 April 2018 by MC Prussian

[CosbehFox]

Some huge comparisons in that 6-1 loss at Portsmouth under Sousa and the 5-0 on Saturday. 

[daddylonglegs]

Simpson & Morgan should go for obvious reasons.

 

Fuchs is more focused on his cool bantz challenges on instagram so he can be binned as well.

 

Vardy can stay and have the freedom of the city as far as I'm concerned. The more he's been paid & criticised the better he's played. As for the others... 

[Dan LCFC]

1 hour ago, MC Prussian said:

Again, blaming the former manager for our heavy start to the season, completely ignoring the fact that Shakespeare's total league record as manager is pretty even with eight wins, five draws and eight losses. In his last sixteen matches as a manager, we lost against Everton, Arsenal (twice), Manchester City, Tottenham, Manchester United, Chelsea and Liverpool. Which manager would've done better under those circumstances?

And again, there's no proof we would've done much worse under Shakespeare than we have now under Puel for the past 18 matches.

 

Puel didn't reignite Mahrez, not really. The boost only happened at the start of Puel's tenure, when Mahrez was already on a goal and five assists. So, that's nine goals and six assists left under Puel, most of those before Mahrez threw his tantrums in January. In the past nine matches, it's two goals and one assist, which is rather shocking. If Puel was allegedly so good at dealing with "different characters" (as proven with Ben Arfa at Nice), how come he couldn't do the same with Mahrez? Language can't be an issue.

And how much motivation does Mahrez need to come from the manager? How about showing some self-motivation also? Mahrez doesn't want to be here anymore and it's all clearly visible week in, week out.

The problem is is that he doesn't realize how much that's going to hurt his future prospects.

 

There is at least one player who is still living up to his regular standard, and that's Vardy. To score this many goals this season with a sloppy and lacklustre midfield like ours verges on a miracle. Albrighton has also been an unsung hero for us so far.

 

So, Puel can motivate his players to four wins in eighteen league matches? That's great. Regular performances during the first half that resemble sleepwalking exercises, and that with the possession-based football he forces our players to play? 

 

Six months ago, we did NOT play possession-based football. The reason for Puel's initial success was that he played to our players' strengths, much like Ranieri in his first season. He didn't change much, we relied on counter-attacking football and were much more direct in our approach. Hence five wins and two draws in the first eight matches under Puel. He changed or tried to change the style afterwards and look in what mess we are right now...

 

To be fair to Puel I think this Mahrez situation is almost unmanageable. It's tougher than re-igniting Ben Arfa.

[moseeds]

The dressing room bears all the hallmarks of Sunderland circa 2015. If we aren't careful we could very easily and quickly end up in the same predicament. Players and managers are replaceable - processes and structures not so much.

 

Since the incredible 2016 season there hasn't been a concerted effort to turn off-the-pitch activities into a world-class outfit. Throwing money at the first team is not sustainable. Puel is trying to instil a 'vision' but is neglecting results and as a result morale. The guy needs help.

[Mike Oxlong]

As far as I’m concerned some of the players are cheating the fans 

 

I still have to pay full price even when their effort is 50% if that ! 

[Captain...]

I don't fully follow the criticism of the players, every game I see I can see the players trying (I missed the game on Saturday) and I can see them following instruction.

 

I can't blame Simpson, he has been instructed to get forwards and attack, he does get forwards, he does attack, he is just shit at it.

I can't blame Albrighton, he is being asked to play as a full back in a back 4, it's not his fault he is not a full back.

I can't  blame Morgan, he isn't very good with the ball at his feet, stop asking him to play it out from the back.

I can't blame Ndidi, he is an excellent ball winner best in the league, but he is erratic with his passing and asking him to pass it around in your own half is asking for trouble.

I can't blame Vardy, somehow he is still scoring despite the fact we are sending in cross after cross as Puel wants our overlapping full backs to create space out wide to deliver a pointless cross to a couple of short arses.

I can't blame Mahrez, he had his strop he came back, played well, but I see him tracking back more than ever, why is our most creative player covering our full back who gets a nose bleed every time he crosses the halfway line.

I can't blame Okazaki, a player who does his best work off the ball and in quick transitions.

I can't blame Chilwell he is good going forwards and is putting plenty of crosses in, but with nobody to attack them and the inevitable break down leaves him out of position.

I can't blame Gray, to be honest I don't know what he is being told to do, or if he is doing it, but he looks completely confused by the whole situation.

I can't blame Silva the way we completely fvcked up his career and refuse to give him a run in the side in a position that suits him, I think he would have been great in a Ranieri or Shakespeare side, plenty of running and ability to think and react quickly not so good when he has time on the ball to unpick a set defence with a static front line.

 

I don't blame the players, they are clearly trying to follow instruction and we are achieving what Claude wants, apparently he described the first half against Southampton as perfect, despite the absolute shit show that was the Palace game we still had 49% possession. I will not turn on the players, but Puel has to do something incredible in the next few games to convince me we shouldn't get rid.

Edited 30 April 2018 by Captain...

[Finn Claw II]

Next season a lot of players will be new and a lot will have left.  We are clearly a side with nothing to play for and a lot of players knowing that their time is up.  

 

i am quite looking forward to a clear out.  The title winning side has aged.  It is easy to have a great mentality when you are winning, less so when you are not,

 

It is hard to blame Puel for this as none of the players are ‘his’ and he hasn’t had a preseason.

 

 

 

 

[FOXYTALK]

I think is the making of both the players and manager.

 

Puel- Stop chopping the line up most weeks. Players are not confident knowing where their colleagues are and where they should be. Communication between the players awful look at the marking against Palace. He is trying to adopt a new formation/system my question is why try and implement when we had something to play for a month ago? :/

i get he wants to be a possession based team with wing backs, but we have no player personnel to execute this. 

 

Players- They have given up on the season, they gave up 3x weeks ago. They can't adapt to Puel system and tactics, that they have been indoctrined (counter)  for most of the season against teams that are well drilled and consistent in their approach. 

 

Unfortunately Puel has signed his own resignation with frustrating period. 

  

[SheppyFox]

Puel should be given the absolute maximum he’s legally allowed to spend under FFP and the complete control of who he replaces within the squad.

[foxfanazer]

Suggesting we get rid of Vardy!

 

The mind really does boggle on here sometimes

[ZeGuy]

7 hours ago, Kitchandro said:

I know you’re trying to be funny but he is our saviour, time and time again.

 

Look, let’s not beat around the bush here, we all know Mahrez and Gray are the two with the worst attitude. On the pitch and off it. I’d be happy to see the back of both of them.

Of course, it's a well known fact that an introverted, unsecure mercurial player and and a 21 years old kid are bossing the dressing room and leading the likes of Morgan or Vardy by the nose.

 

There is an expression about this... Something with faces and fit.

[cityfanlee23]

3 hours ago, foxfanazer said:

Suggesting we get rid of Vardy!

 

The mind really does boggle on here sometimes

Would you like to read the post again before making such a smug and frankly stupid statement? 

I suggested he comes across as being one of those who hold a lot of control in the dressing room and he comes across to me as the sort of player that wouldn't think much about going behind a managers back. 

 

[UpTheLeagueFox]

18 hours ago, Rob1742 said:

A middle of the road manager ... isn't strong enough to deal with a strong group that won the Premier League 

A middle of the road manager who causes no major issues would be a godsend for any Director of Football looking to protect his well paid position.

A Director of Football looking to protect his well paid position would also reject ex players from the club trying to get coaching / scouting jobs etc.