Coronavirus Thread

[I am Rod Hull]

2 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I didn't contradict myself.

 

A vaccinated person can still carry it, but if we are all vaccinated, we won't get ill from it. I wouldn't want to miss with an unvaccinated person incase I had the virus (but didn't get ill because I'm vaccinated) and made them ill, because they aren't.

How many times are we going to get vaccinated, fella?, It seems like it`s going to be ongoing with booster jabs in September projected. I`ve had covid, it did nothing, I knew it wouldn`t, because I do not suck on the medias tits, I look at facts.

 

50,000 excess Winter deaths in 2018 according to the BBC... https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-46399090

 

 

 

 

[Facecloth]

21 minutes ago, Soup said:

Yes i can safely say this is the only way out of this. According to AstraZeneca,Pfizer, J&J and Moderna anyway 

Well three of those are selling pretty much at cost price, only Moderna are selling to make much of a profit.

[UniFox21]

28 minutes ago, Harrydc said:

You've just contradicted yourself. 

 

"vaccinated people can still carry the virus" - therefore they can still spread it?

 

Exactly the same as an unvaccinated person. They can still spread it too. 

 

You either trust the vaccines or you don't. This is my argument about vaccine passports. If you have been vaccinated then why wouldn't you want to mix with the unvaccinated?

 

 

Harry mate, I sympathize with you and genuinely hope things pick up for you lad. 

 

But I don't think you fully understand this vaccine. Do you wear a seatbelt in the car when you drive? You can still die with it on, and you need to to go to places like the pub, so I assume you don't? 

 

This vaccine hugely reduces the chances of you being seriously ill from this virus. Making it safer to do everything you've been wanting to all year. Genuinely have a read up on the vaccine, from peer reviewed sources. 

You're free to make any decision you want, but it helps when you can defend your opinion with facts rather than just "I don't want to".

Edited 6 April 2021 by UniFox21

[SpacedX]

4 minutes ago, Harrydc said:

If you're naive enough to believe these vaccinations will get us out of anything then I feel for you. 

 

Just like 3 weeks to flatten the curve? 

 

Just like 5 days at Christmas? 

 

Just like sacrifice Christmas to save Easter?

 

Johnson said himself 2 vaccinated people still can't meet indoors? 

 

Vaccinated people can still 'transmit' the virus. 

 

They're purposely ripping the economy to shreds. I don't know why, but they are. If you're not even a little bit suspicious then there's no hope. 

Harry, the purpose of this vaccination programme is not to get to 'covid zero', but to tame this virus, to de-fang it, to remove its ability to cause serious disease, hospitalisation and death. Vaccines save millions of lives each year, but no vaccine offers 100% protection for all nor does it completely prevent transmission. It;s also highly likely that SARS-CoV-2 will become endemic. 

 

The objective is however, to reduce both infection and transmission in such a way that it can be managed - potentially leading to a complete lifting of restrictions and a restoration of the life that you once enjoyed...although in the short term, the continued adherence to masks and some degree of social distancing will be prudent.

 

Unfortunately, nature doesn't recognise that life, because nature is completely indifferent to mankind...which is why it is systematically "ripping the economy to shreds". For all that science and technology confers, we still remain at nature's whim...but I assure you, although it won't be eradicated, we will win this battle and prevail over this virus.

 

Not so long ago, previous generations here in the UK were decimated by smallpox and polio. You might wish to find out why that is no longer the case. 

 

 

[Buce]

2 minutes ago, Line-X said:

Harry, the purpose of this vaccination programme is not to get to 'covid zero', but to tame this virus, to de-fang it, to remove its ability to cause serious disease, hospitalisation and death. Vaccines save millions of lives each year, but no vaccine offers 100% protection for all nor does it completely prevent transmission. It;s also highly likely that SARS-CoV-2 will become endemic. 

 

The objective is however, to reduce both infection and transmission in such a way that it can be managed - potentially leading to a complete lifting of restrictions and a restoration of the life that you once enjoyed...although in the short term, the continued adherence to masks and some degree of social distancing will be prudent.

 

Unfortunately, nature doesn't recognise that life, because nature is completely indifferent to mankind...which is why it is systematically "ripping the economy to shreds". For all that science and technology confers, we still remain at nature's whim...but I assure you, although it won't be eradicated, we will win this battle and prevail over this virus.

 

Not so long ago, previous generations here in the UK were decimated by smallpox and polio. You might wish to find out why that is no longer the case. 

 

 

 

As you know, smallpox was eradicated. Why are you so sure this won't be?

[Soup]

9 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

Well three of those are selling pretty much at cost price, only Moderna are selling to make much of a profit.

Well Facebook don't charge users anything and they aren't doing too bad. Plenty of ways to make money 

 

And to say J&J are this caring bunch trying to do good thing is laughable. Say that to the thousands of lifes they have ruied in the US. Scandalous company 

Edited 6 April 2021 by Soup

[Paninistickers]

34 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

I didn't contradict myself.

 

A vaccinated person can still carry it, but if we are all vaccinated, we won't get ill from it. I wouldn't want to miss with an unvaccinated person incase I had the virus (but didn't get ill because I'm vaccinated) and made them ill, because they aren't.

And round and round we go. 

 

The people likely to get very ill.from.Covid will.have been vaccinated..so wont get very ill. 

 

So all that's left for you to infect are people who are v v unlikely to get v v unwell. Some fit healthy people will no doubt die thanks to bad luck and/or an unusual set of circumstances..just as fit healthy people sometimes die of cancer or strokes or meningitis or whatever 

[Innovindil]

Same arguments again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

 

Enough now please, for all our sanity. 

[st albans fox]

There is an elephant in the room somewhere. 
 

as many have said, it was assumed that once the vulnerable (inc over fifties) were vaccinated, we would be released from most restrictions if not all.  So what’s going on?  It can only be the fear of mutations that are resistant to the vaccines we have ......and if the experts say that the way to control mutations is to keep a heavy lid on cases then I can’t blame govt for taking notice of them.  People are fed up and already breaking lots of rules in their own social space. so govt have decided to exert as much control as they can over public space. 
 

Unless the narrative of the ‘experts’ changes (which is possible as more stats and data emerges) then I dont see the attitude of govt changing .....

[Costock_Fox]

11 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

There is an elephant in the room somewhere. 
 

as many have said, it was assumed that once the vulnerable (inc over fifties) were vaccinated, we would be released from most restrictions if not all.  So what’s going on?  It can only be the fear of mutations that are resistant to the vaccines we have ......and if the experts say that the way to control mutations is to keep a heavy lid on cases then I can’t blame govt for taking notice of them.  People are fed up and already breaking lots of rules in their own social space. so govt have decided to exert as much control as they can over public space. 
 

Unless the narrative of the ‘experts’ changes (which is possible as more stats and data emerges) then I dont see the attitude of govt changing .....

I hope it’s wearing a ****ing mask

[Spudulike]

The report on C4 News tonight was grim. If the Brazil variant spreads (and it seems that it most probably will) around the world and our vaccinations don't protect us then we are in big, big trouble (and not just those in middle age and beyond). 

 

https://www.channel4.com/news/brazils-covid-19-catastrophe-may-threaten-world-as-new-variant-spreads

 

[Costock_Fox]

3 minutes ago, Spudulike said:

The report on C4 News tonight was grim. If the Brazil variant spreads (and it seems that it most probably will) around the world and our vaccinations don't protect us then we are in big, big trouble (and not just those in middle age and beyond). 

 

https://www.channel4.com/news/brazils-covid-19-catastrophe-may-threaten-world-as-new-variant-spreads

 

I thought the vaccines have been confirmed as effective against all current variants.

[Buce]

12 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

I hope it’s wearing a ****ing mask

 

Of course it is - very responsible animals, elephants:

 

[SpacedX]

Just now, Buce said:

 

As you know, smallpox was eradicated. Why are you so sure this won't be?

SARS-CoV-2 will not be eradicated but will become endemic, albeit with reduced potency, enduring in pockets of the global population for years to come and causing outbreaks in regions where it had been eliminated. 

 

Remember, eradication means there are no longer any cases anywhere in the world and elimination refers to the reduction to zero of the incidence of a specified disease in a defined geographical area as a result of sustained continued intervention measures. Smallpox had a very effective vaccine, but significantly it did not have multiple hosts and animal reservoirs of the disease. It likely made the zoonotic leap many thousands of years ago, but in modern times, we were the only vector meaning that the vaccination programme could achieve total eradication, which it did. 

 

With elimination, we aim to get the rates as low as possible and if an outbreak occurs we stop it from spreading. Think a fire crew protecting a neighbourhood. The problem with SARS-CoV-2 is asymptomatic spread...that's its secret weapon. This is the fundamental difference between SARS-Cov-2 and the albeit more lethal SARS CoV in 2002 which was quickly tamed in comparison. 

 

Whilst elimination is highly optimistic, the aspiration is to get endemic covid, lower than endemic flu. The corona virus vaccines have much higher efficacy rates that the influenza vaccine, which simply doesn't need them, and are even more protective when it comes to disease and death. Plus, Influenza A has a dramatically higher mutation rate than SARS-CoV-2, thanks in part to a proof reading enzyme that is encoded in the genetic make up of the coronavirus. That said, even with a virus that is pretty stable on its own, mutations occur in infected cells. The more people infected, the more mutations. 

 

If we can quell the infection rate, then the virus won't be able to invade are defences as quickly meaning that we can keep it at bay to a far greater extent than we do with flu. Superspreading events tend to drive the transmission of the current coronavirus. The K number or dispersion parameter is 0.1 (compared to flu, which is much more uniform at 1). What this means is that a small number of cases are responsible for a large number of secondary cases. This is good news, because as vaccination brings the R number down, we are more likely to encounter isolated cases that can be quickly contained compared to the slow burn of flu. But this is why we need to guard against one big superspreading event such as a concert arena. 

 

If we do this right, five years from now, cases of SARS-CoV-2 could be comparatively rare - worthy of local news. 

 

[Costock_Fox]

3 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Of course it is - very responsible animals, elephants:

 

Poor thing

[Otis]

24 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

There is an elephant in the room somewhere. 
 

as many have said, it was assumed that once the vulnerable (inc over fifties) were vaccinated, we would be released from most restrictions if not all.  So what’s going on?  It can only be the fear of mutations that are resistant to the vaccines we have ......and if the experts say that the way to control mutations is to keep a heavy lid on cases then I can’t blame govt for taking notice of them.  People are fed up and already breaking lots of rules in their own social space. so govt have decided to exert as much control as they can over public space. 
 

Unless the narrative of the ‘experts’ changes (which is possible as more stats and data emerges) then I dont see the attitude of govt changing .....

Good post. IMO People are breaking the rules because they are becoming less scared. 30 deaths a day doesn't have the same impact as 1200 .

But we can't stay locked down forever just incase a mutation appears that is vaccine resistant. 

By Sage saying restrictions could be needed for 1-2 years they are acting like anti-vaxxers. 

We need to trust the vaccine and let it do it's job.

[Spudulike]

11 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

I thought the vaccines have been confirmed as effective against all current variants.

Not confirmed as far as I can see. Appears the Pfizer vaccine might protect to a certain extent and reduce serious illness. Don't know about OxAZ. 

 

Studies still ongoing. 

[foxile5]

The arts and culture sector have been ****ing shat on by the government during this. 

[Strokes]

26 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

I hope it’s wearing a ****ing mask

He is calling you fat. 

[DennisNedry]

5 minutes ago, Spudulike said:

Not confirmed as far as I can see. Appears the Pfizer vaccine might protect to a certain extent and reduce serious illness. Don't know about OxAZ. 

 

Studies still ongoing. 

The Brazil variant has been seeded numerous times in the UK but never got out of control, partly due to intensive testing and isolating those found to have it, but also because it has no advantage over the Kent variant in terms of transmissibility, therefore it will not displace the Kent variant as the dominant one in the UK.

 

I didn't see anything in that video to worry me. It's ran rampant in Brazil because they refuse to lockdown. It's hospitalising people with an average age of 10-20 years younger than the 1st wave because so many very elderly people died last year. 

 

Also I'm sure the preliminary findings were that the current vaccines were less effective against it, but still effective in greatly reducing hospitalisations and deaths?

Edited 6 April 2021 by DennisNedry

[UpTheLeagueFox]

43 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

There is an elephant in the room somewhere. 

 

31 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

I hope it’s wearing a ****ing mask

I hope it's wearing a mask CORRECTLY !

[Costock_Fox]

7 minutes ago, Strokes said:

He is calling you fat. 

He’s got a point.

[CosbehFox]

3 hours ago, st albans fox said:

Does anyone else have a feeling that we’re not being told everything ?  
 

or are they just planning for the absolute worst so they can’t be accused again of not being prepared .......

My gut is that they fear the vaccination programme is going to hit a grinding halt for a variety of reasons.
 

However the government need to keep the momentum on opening back up. So the vaccine passport is their way of dealing with the issue whilst a good chunk of the population are not going to be vaccinated.
 

Offer up the testing - people can test themselves and quickly find out if they can still visit things. Of course there’s a faulted problem there which is it’s required public to buy into self testing and not ignoring the results.  
 

At the very least by handing back the ball to the public, if another lockdown has to happen it can be perceived it’s the failure of the public rather than the government (which they have done repeatedly in the last year). The failures which have happened and may happen are of course a mixture of the two (public’s failure to abide and government’s poor messaging/infighting of self interest between factions). I highly suspect that the govt are quite aware that another lockdown will hurt their support within their own party and amongst the public 

[StanSP]

Why would you vociferously refuse to get the vaccine but at the same time realise its the vaccine that is needed to get us out of this shit? And also realise to get the 'freedoms', a vaccine is needed? 

 

So if you don't have the vaccine, not only do you deny yourself the freedoms, but you still risk being that carrier/sufferer of COVID, then you'll wonder why you got it and can't be enjoying the things you want to? 

 

And it's all under the guise of 'pro-choice'. Well done, you're choosing to live a restricted and selfish lifestyle because you think you're protesting by not having a vaccine out of spite. At least with a medical reason not to have the vaccine there's some legitimacy about it. 

 

I don't agree with the passport stuff but it's heading that way and there's fvck all anyone can do about it. I've accepted the reality and eventuality of it, despite not agreeing with it (as long as they wait until everyone is offered the vaccine otherwise it is grossly unfair). 

[st albans fox]

Despite the elephant jokes (which were on balance not great and quite frankly a disappointment ), the debate on here seems to be a little more constructive over the past few hours ....