Leeds A Post Match Thread

[Dahnsouff]

Kante in full back form?

[Spudulike]

3 hours ago, Sol thewall Bamba said:

I had a look on one of their forums in their pre match prediction thread. 4 pages, not one prediction of a City win. Lovely to put them back in their box 

If t'aint Yorkshire it's shite. That's how it works up there. Gods own county and all that. 

[Spudulike]

2 hours ago, Blarmy said:

Just sat here watching that loop for  about 5 minutes 🤣
 

It really is a thing of beauty. Chengo's pace is incredible. 

[les-tah]

10 minutes ago, richardsfoxes said:

I don't want to discredit the work/job the lads have done while key players have been out but i honestly can't ****ing wait to see this team in action when all fit. 

 

                             Kasper

Ricardo     Fofana         Cagnar       Timothee

                               Ndidi

Cengiz           Youri          Maddison   Barnes

                               Vardy

 

 

Unreal. 

OR for the bus parking games

                     Kasper

        Fofana  Evans Soyuncu 

Ricardo  Tielemens Ndidi    Castagne 

         Cengiz Vardy  Barnes

 
Our team has some serious depth as I can’t choose between Praet/Madders/cengiz as all have different styles of play

 

 

 

[Muzzy_Larsson]

A huge thing that jumped out at me in Rodgers post match interview was this quote, "you can control the game without the ball". This is at absolute odds with everything he has said and believed previously. He has always been vocal in a belief in that the only way to control and dominate the game is via posession and winning the ball back as quickly as you can.

 

This is pretty significant for me in a promising sense. It's always been his main weak spot that he stuck to rigidly to his posession based philosophy but I think the signs are there this season he is evolving in this sense and becoming more flexible in his outlook.

[norwichfox]

Super performance last night, how lucky are we that Mendy didn't become the equivalent of Albrighton for Villa, it would have been crazy to have let him leave on a free...Mendy is consistently showing he's worth what we payed for him.

[Floridafox]

Started watching Leicester regularly late 70s, early 80s. The idea of beating Man City away, Arsenal away and Leeds away was the stuff of wild dreams. Thank BR

[talking_goldfish]

What about this pass from Cengo though? Pure sauce

 

[Bossman Blessed It]

The consistency in how well each player knows their role is something that really stands out to me. Pep got a lot of credit when City demonstrated it in the season they reached over 100 points, but it's clear that Brendan's philosophy has great buy-in, which he deserves immense credit for. He's releasing a refreshed potential for players like Albrighton, Morgan and Mendy too - they have proven to be worth their weight in gold recently. BR also seems to be using his substitutions much more wisely too - a clear identity of what they should be introduced to achieve. 

 

Our new signings look outstanding too. Under, Castagne and Fofana are serious additions to our squad and we look incredibly awkward to beat. When our full strength side returns, it gives me a lot of hope at our competitiveness in all competitions. 

[Sunbury Fox]

2 hours ago, davieG said:

A balanced report from Yorkshire - https://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/football/leeds-united/wily-leicester-city-show-beauty-eye-beholder-beat-leeds-united-graham-smyths-verdict-3023024

 

Wily Leicester City show beauty is in the eye of the beholder to beat Leeds United - Graham Smyth's Verdict
Beauty is one of Marcelo Bielsa’s self-imposed obligations as Leeds United manager and one of the reasons he is so revered in the city.

 

By Graham Smyth
Tuesday, 3rd November 2020, 7:47 am

ROUGH NIGHT - Leeds United were beaten 4-1 by a Leicester City side who showed their own form of footballing beauty on a rain-soaked Elland Road pitch. Pic: Bruce Rollinson

His first obligation is to win games, but he wants to win them in a way that enflames the passion of supporters, he wants to win beautifully.

“I believe we have an obligation regarding the beauty of the game,” he said during a presentation in Affligem, Belgium in May 2017.

“As managers of a football team we have two obligations, well actually one, we have to win. And the way you win is no longer important. And in my fantasy, just as there is financial fair play, there should be a punishment for those who ignore the beauty of the game to achieve victory.

“It is difficult for me to accept that the only thing we are going to offer these people is the results. Because if we do not offer them football as an aesthetic element, we are making them worse as human beings.”

Against Leicester City Bielsa and his players were unable to give Leeds fans a result or replicate much of the beauty that shone even in other defeats this season.

There were flickers in the second half, hints of the football everyone knows Leeds can play, but even the goal they scored in the 4-1 defeat didn’t particularly meet their usual aesthetically pleasing standards.

Instead, a wily, experienced and clinical Premier League veteran showed that beauty is very much in the eye of the beholder.

With Jamie Vardy up front, Brendan Rodgers knew his side could still pose problems if they allowed Leeds to have the ball, sat deep, defended stoutly and exploded forward on the break.

Aided by some sloppy play from a team reknowned for the crispness of their passing football, that is exactly how the Foxes won this game, showing quality on and off the ball.

Leeds could have been ahead inside the opening two minutes thanks to a lovely move, but instead found themselves behind and always chasing the game.

With Rodrigo self-isolating having come into close contact with someone who subsequently tested positive for Covid-19, Pablo Hernandez came into the starting line-up and some of his trademark trickery started Leeds’ first attack.

Helder Costa’s perfect cross was then headed back across goal by Jack Harrison and Patrick Bamford peeled off his marker but could only nod it into Kasper Schmeichel’s arms.

It was a sliding doors moment.

 

The goalkeeper rolled it out, Leicester sent it down the left channel and Robin Koch’s attempted back pass to Illan Meslier was poor enough for Vardy to intercept, round the stopper and give Harvey Barnes a tap-in.

A sequence of play so rapid that Sky were still showing a replay of Bamford’s miss as Vardy went past Meslier summed up the way the first half went. Leeds looked to create and score a beautiful goal, Leicester got it downfield as quickly as they could. It was no-nonsense but it was still impressive stuff all the same and beautiful in its own way.

That early goal allowed Leicester to play the game exactly as they wanted, sitting deep out of possession, keeping bodies between Leeds and the goal, picking off passes across the middle that that too often went astray and then haring into space. Mateusz Klich and Hernandez were struggling to find men and at the other end, both Leeds centre-halves kept losing Vardy. His pace and movement have been nightmarish for defenders since he broke into the Stocksbridge Park Steels senior side 13 years ago and he's no less thrilling to watch in the Premier League as he was tearing up defences for Halifax or Fleetwood on his rise to the top.

It was his near-post dart that allowed him to escape Robin Koch and dive to head the ball at goal, Meslier’s save brilliant but ultimately futile as Youri Tielemans followed up, alone, to make it 2-0.

Most of the rest of the half followed a familiar pattern, Leeds taking the ball up the field, meeting a blue wall and struggling to break it down, all the while conscious of the danger possessed by the visitors on the counter attack.

When going round the wall didn’t bring dividends, Leeds tried to go through it, first through Hernandez, then Harrison and finally Luke Ayling, whose clever dinked pass put Bamford in on goal, the striker’s poor first touch allowed Schmeichel to make the save.

Bielsa replaced Shackleton with Ian Poveda at half-time and changed the shape, Harrison playing inside Costa who was now on the left wing. Leicester, all of a sudden, did not look anywhere near as comfortable. And when Leeds pulled a goal back it heightened the discomfort.

A short corner routine saw the ball pushed back to Stuart Dallas, 30-plus yards from goal on the left and his swinging cross was not only allowed to bounce but to creep inside the far post.

Another corner from the same side was half-cleared as far as Hernandez and he took it down, beat a man and curled the ball out of Schmeichel’s reach and onto the woodwork. That was about as beautiful as it got.

Bielsa elected to make another change with 23 minutes left, sending on Tyler Roberts for Hernandez who showed his displeasure with the decision, having finally started to enjoy the contest.

Leeds, having had the blue wall wobbling for a spell, couldn’t knock it down. Roberts never really got into the game, the Whites got down the flanks but couldn’t find a final ball and even when Poveda played an incisive pass to put Ayling into the box, the right-back tried to win a penalty with an all-too-obvious dive.

Brendan Rodgers made second-half changes too and they had a definitive impact.

The first time the Foxes really created danger after the break, James Maddison’s through ball put Cengiz Under in behind the Leeds defence and he simply cushioned it past Meslier with the deftest of touches to give Vardy an empty net to score in.

His threat might have been dormant for a while but it was still there and had he not clipped the ball wide of Meslier’s goal after running in behind Cooper, Leicester would have been out of sight with seven minutes remaining.

The late minutes brought nothing but more frustration for Leeds, Klich’s challenge on Maddison was ignored by Andre Marriner until a VAR check prompted him to watch it back on the monitor, a penalty the only likely outcome.

He pointed to the spot, Tielemans stroked it home and Leicester were home and hosed.

Don't mean to be over sensitive but this is damning our performance with faint praise. With our full team on the field, we would not have set up the way we did, I'm sure of that. We're more than capable of playing beautiful football when at full strength and I don't think the media has made enough of the sheer scale of our injury crisis. It's the equivalent of Liverpool not only having VVD and Fabinho out (not sure whether you've heard about that?!) but TAA, Robertson and Gomez too. Any team has to change its approach with so many key defensive players missing. 

Edited 3 November 2020 by Sunbury Fox

[Mike Oxlong]

Great display last night which reminded me of many of our 15/16 performances 

 

We attacked like a band of rampaging ferrets 

[LCCFox96]

28 minutes ago, Muzzy_Larsson said:

A huge thing that jumped out at me in Rodgers post match interview was this quote, "you can control the game without the ball". This is at absolute odds with everything he has said and believed previously. He has always been vocal in a belief in that the only way to control and dominate the game is via posession and winning the ball back as quickly as you can.

 

This is pretty significant for me in a promising sense. It's always been his main weak spot that he stuck to rigidly to his posession based philosophy but I think the signs are there this season he is evolving in this sense and becoming more flexible in his outlook.

 

Completely agree - for me this is a huge switch in mentality. I said the same last night around more readily adapting his approach to the opposition and making us a much more dangerous opponent for a broader spectrum of teams. For a manager who maintains such a strong focus on his favoured style, to adapt successfully can be a challenge and I find it hugely encouraging he's doing that.

 

We've stuck to our normal game against the likes of Burnley and West Brom and beaten them and adapted in tricky away fixtures at Man City, Arsenal and Leeds and come away with 9 points from 9. I don't care that we've had less possession in those games and I don't care that Arteta and half of Yorkshire now think we are 'Park the Bus Merchants'. I care that Rodgers has looked at the weaknesses in our set-up when facing certain opponents and addressed it, so far, to good effect.

 

He's brought in more of the players we need to do that - a top quality full back who can play in a back 4 or 5 on either side in Castagne, an elite young ball playing CB to give us more depth across a back 4 or 5 in Fofana, and another creative and pacey attacking threat in Under. He's also made subtle changes to the system per opponent and had to do so with a crippling defensive injury list and nursing Vardy and Maddison back to full fitness. The way he's managed the introduction of newer, younger players and kept members of the 'Old Guard' like Albrighton, Fuchs and Morgan actively involved is superb management. For me, Rodgers has upped his game this year and bar being tactically done by West Ham and a blip vs Villa, I think he's doing an exemplary job. There's a long way to go this season, players to come back into the team and still areas we can improve but it is certainly encouraging. 

[escape2victory]

I do like this 3-4-3 system and will be even better when we have Ricardo and Castagne as the wing backs. Think it will eventually suit Maddison too being on the left or right of Vardy. Hasnt worked before sticking him on the left but in a 4-3-3 he has to then keep the width but in this system the wing backs do that so he can operate more as a number 10.

 

hopefully Rodgers has learnt though playing this system at home to West Ham, you need the wing backs to be more advanced and not play Praet as one of the 3 attacking players

[fuchsntf]

44 minutes ago, les-tah said:

OR for the bus parking games

                     Kasper

        Fofana  Evans Soyuncu 

Ricardo  Tielemens Ndidi    Castagne 

         Cengiz Vardy  Barnes

 
Our team has some serious depth as I can’t choose between Praet/Madders/cengiz as all have different styles of play

 

 

 

At present,I Dont see how you can push Mendy to the side.....

Ndidi or A..N.Other has to earn their Way back..

Isnt it what you & others demand for England selection..!!

[Gamble92]

9 hours ago, knitro said:

Let's get that additional year extension out to Fuchs now. 

 

Also for some laughs, here's a Leeds fan post-game thread: 

 

Incredible how biased and naive some can be but tbf alot of them are level headed and say we deserved it.

 

Quotes like "this is leicester we are talking about" as if to remind Leeds fans how great we are is quite an example of how far we have come as a club. 

[les-tah]

6 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

At present,I Dont see how you can push Mendy to the side.....

Ndidi or A..N.Other has to earn their Way back..

Isnt it what you & others demand for England selection..!!

No i agree 100% I wouldn’t change Mendy right now that would kill the teams morale when changing players when they are in excellent form.. it was only in reply to a previous team.

 

Edited 3 November 2020 by les-tah

[Woof]

Pre game manager interviews are usually pretty bland, but Rogers before this game oozed confidence and said " Leeds play one on one which leaves lots of space...." Boy did we exploit it!

Systems are interesting but of themselves don't win games.  In the Premier league quality of players and depth of squad (when well managed) usually come out on top in the long run.

Bamford is not bad but to me looks more like this season's Pukki than a contender for the golden boot. Vardy however...........

Even with our long list of injuries we were able to bring on Maddison and Under to see off the game.  What a squad we have this season!

[MonmoreStef]

This season watching how Brendan is able to get our players to play to game plans and how he’s improved certain players it hammers home how poor a manager Ole is at United.  I just hope they keep winning in Europe and he keeps his job. This season we ain’t losing to the big clubs now that Brendan has realised he needed to adapt. 

[fuchsntf]

5 hours ago, Danny Clender said:

I've gone full circle on this notion and I thrive on these style of posts now, can't get enough of them. 

I would not want it any other way, it keeps the forum interesting and shows the full spectrum of emotion and intelligence. 

 

People like to gamble upon their own emotions and credibility, the potential buzz of getting it right in the future by saying things like; 

"See, I called it, 38 minutes and 11 seconds before the kick off, "INSERT NAME" wasn't good enough"

"As I said 26 minutes and 33 seconds before kick off, this line up wasn't going to work" 

"If you look at my post in the pre-match thread, 2 days, 12 hours and 29 seconds ago, I did say that we needed to have 3 at the back"

"I've been saying it ALL THE TIME, "Chilwell's mental health looks off to me, he needs to open up and seek professional help" 

 

It's a self gratification trigger and if their statement/predictions come true, then there's a big payout to their self-esteem. 

 

There's also plenty of truth in that people use reverse psychology practices so as to postpone any potential disappointment.

I.e

"I can't see us getting a win tonight"

"There's no way we're beating these"

"3-0 loss incoming"

"I hope Chilwell's counselling went well this week and brings back his love for the game, other wise I could see the opposition attacking his flank thus resulting in our loss"

 

If the person is set up and semi convinced that Leicester won't win before kick off, then if the result doesn't favour Leicester, they've already done most of the mental preparation to deal with the upset. 

 

As annoying as it is to read such self defeatism, on the whole, it's harmless, "it's just my opinion" and "I'll happily admit I was wrong....but I wasn't" are more than enough excuses to pass it all by. 

 

DISCLAIMER: I also believe in the "load of old bollox" theory too. 

Sometimes one can crap the psychology out of the shit...!!!

Say what you mean & Front up..or buffoon ones Way through life....

 

Salesmen are experts at it..!!

 

 

 

 

[Blarmy]

1 hour ago, Spudulike said:

It really is a thing of beauty. Chengo's pace is incredible. 

Not that, I have a thing about frogs cranking one out. 

[fuchsntf]

34 minutes ago, les-tah said:

No i agree 100% I wouldn’t change Mendy right now that would kill the teams morale when changing players when they are in excellent form.. it was only in reply to a previous team.

 

👍

[shen]

2 hours ago, LCCFox96 said:

 

Completely agree - for me this is a huge switch in mentality. I said the same last night around more readily adapting his approach to the opposition and making us a much more dangerous opponent for a broader spectrum of teams. For a manager who maintains such a strong focus on his favoured style, to adapt successfully can be a challenge and I find it hugely encouraging he's doing that.

 

We've stuck to our normal game against the likes of Burnley and West Brom and beaten them and adapted in tricky away fixtures at Man City, Arsenal and Leeds and come away with 9 points from 9. I don't care that we've had less possession in those games and I don't care that Arteta and half of Yorkshire now think we are 'Park the Bus Merchants'. I care that Rodgers has looked at the weaknesses in our set-up when facing certain opponents and addressed it, so far, to good effect.

 

He's brought in more of the players we need to do that - a top quality full back who can play in a back 4 or 5 on either side in Castagne, an elite young ball playing CB to give us more depth across a back 4 or 5 in Fofana, and another creative and pacey attacking threat in Under. He's also made subtle changes to the system per opponent and had to do so with a crippling defensive injury list and nursing Vardy and Maddison back to full fitness. The way he's managed the introduction of newer, younger players and kept members of the 'Old Guard' like Albrighton, Fuchs and Morgan actively involved is superb management. For me, Rodgers has upped his game this year and bar being tactically done by West Ham and a blip vs Villa, I think he's doing an exemplary job. There's a long way to go this season, players to come back into the team and still areas we can improve but it is certainly encouraging. 

I love how Rodgers has basically admitted that our counter-attacking tactics are the best way for us to get a result against more technical sides, rather than going toe to toe with them. We might not always succeed - there are days where heads will drop after conceding early against Man City; where VAR will not contentiously rule out goals in our favour or where teams will take their chances during our weaker periods - but these results will have given players and coaches alike the belief that if they stick to the plan, they always have a chance.

 

He still needs to figure out how cope with teams playing the exact same way against us however. I still maintain we weren't as bad against West Ham as the score suggested and we should obviously hold out for a point against Villa in those situations, but when better technical teams than us fail to break down teams doing this, maybe it's inevitable to run into disappointments such as those. 
If we play the same way against Villa and West Ham as we did against Leeds, Arsenal and Man City, we'd be moaning at the lack of ambition against teams we consider inferior to ours.

[shen]

38 minutes ago, pmcla26 said:

Think our best team long term might be 

 

Kasper 

 

Ndidi 

Fofana/Evans

Soy 

 

Ricardo 

Mendy 

Tielemans

Castagne

 

Maddison 

Barnes

 

Vardy 

 

Under, Kel, Perez and Praet all very good back ups in midfield and attack, and JJ, Thomas, Fuchs and Albrighton defensively. We seem to say it with every year that passes, but this is the strongest squad we've ever had.

I think our results so far this season give concrete proof that this is indeed our strongest squad since our title win. Getting the results with so many injuries to key players is solid testament. We'll never know how we would've coped had any of our key players suffered long term injuries during the 15/16 season - we were very fortunate that our depth wasn't tested that often - but we had players like Schlupp, Ulloa, King and Wasilewski step up when we needed them most.

[HighPeakFox]

The West Ham game looks anomalous now.... I wonder much of it was down to wrong tactics (I do not discount this being the primary reason necessarily) and how much of it was the players just not being switched on/attentive/carrying out their plan. 

 

I suspect this game, and the Villa game to an extent, may prove to have been a watershed for all concerned.

[shen]

3 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

The West Ham game looks anomalous now.... I wonder much of it was down to wrong tactics (I do not discount this being the primary reason necessarily) and how much of it was the players just not being switched on/attentive/carrying out their plan. 

 

I suspect this game, and the Villa game to an extent, may prove to have been a watershed for all concerned.

It is maybe telling that both games were at home. Psychologically, that places the onus on our players to be the team with the attacking intent.
You could argue that football in 2020 is anomalous in it's entirety. We've seen a frankly weird amount of crazy scorelines, unlikely results and upsets.  

Does it have something to do with fans not being there? With the 'home advantage' affecting players adversely?