Entitled fans or realistic fans?

[Frank Large's Black Book]

43 minutes ago, UpTheLeagueFox said:

There is having an opinion and then there is some of the extreme nonsense we often see when teams are announced. Like today.

Clearly nerves have been touched.

 

I have a suggestion.

 

Is it possible to have a pre - match team thread?

No comments, no slagging off -

Let's just see what team people would honestly select. Injuries notwithstanding -

(SFE would obviously be barred from entering)

 

Edit - I mean extra to the existing pre match thread

Edited 6 December 2020 by Frank Large's Black Book

[Fox85]

This is how I see it.

 

The Leicester today is far different from the Leicester from 20+ years ago.

 

The Squad we have and options we have gives the fans confidence when formations are right to beat most teams in the league.

 

However when the manager sets up defensive against teams that are struggling and we get beaten then fans get pissed off.

 

There is to many fans on here that live in the past way to many who are happy with mediocre results and piss poor performances and still see us as a side fighting against relegation or being a mid table team.

 

These are the old crustys who have no ambition for the club. 

 

So I think the LCFC fans of today know we can beat anyone but feel let down by tactics and playing the wrong players and formations against certain teams and show there entitled frustrations.

 

Anyone who sticks up for piss poor performances are those who genuinely don't give a shit about the club.

 

Edited 6 December 2020 by Fox85

[H.a.r.r.y]

expecting to beat fulham and Sheffield united is not entitled

[ThomasM]

To be honest I think it was easier to pick up points with a worse overall squad. Now we have better players; we dominate the games and struggle to make it count.

 

So the last few years watching us score so easily; makes you think we have gone backwards, but I think the reality is the game is just harder the better your team; people don't come to attack you if they think you are better than them.

 

I thought the performance against Shef United was good; but we can't rely on the ball over the top in every game anymore.

Edited 6 December 2020 by ThomasM

[lcfc_forever]

Was thinking of starting a thread like this.

 

It's whether you can take a step back and look at things in the absolute, or the relative.

 

We're geared as people to look at the latter. When you see we've scored five past Man City, won all but one of our away games, it's obviously disappointing when we don't win at home against Fulham, West Ham or Villa. And that feeling is made worse by end of the previous season. 

 

Yet, if you look at everything together, we've made a strong start to the season overall and have already qualified for the next round of the Europa league, while having to deal with arguably the most challenging set of injuries. And we had our second highest Premier League finish in the previous season, with a world class new training facility in place. 

 

We can all see the potential of this team and I get frustrated as well. But there's lots to be excited about as well. 

Edited 6 December 2020 by lcfc_forever

[Vazman]

Enthusiastic and excited about the future absolutely! Entitled No.

[Le Renard]

I don't think most of us fans are entitled, but we can see the quality of the squad, which make us as fans frustrated, when we play so poorly.  No offence to WBA/Sheff Utd/Fulham & Burnley, but if we had teams of their quality, I think fans(most) would be more realistic.

[jayfox26]

I dont think its necessarily being entitled, we all accept losing as it's part of the game. The issue is that every time we lose under Rodgers we are absolutely atrocious. I cant remember the last time we lost and I thought fair enough we played well but were unlucky. Fans can accept losing when we at least have a go and play decent but this season alone, West Ham, Villa, Liverpool, Fulham, Zorya have all been absolutely dreadful to watch. We are realistic and not expecting us to play peak Barce every week but at times, our lack of ideas, poor teams selections, poor tactics amongst other things really starts to annoy fans. A bit of balance is needed at times as we have had terrible luck with injuries. I dont think I've known a manager that can make me love football one minute and make me dread watching us the next like Rodgers does. There is not often middle ground (apart from today maybe), we are either fantastic or horrible to watch  

[Aus Fox]

This place has always had its more positive and upbeat fans and its negative fans, no matter how we are doing and usually it’s great, lots of different opinions  - who wants a forum where we all think the same.

However, I felt yesterday reached peak entitlement - some fans moaning because we didn’t win 4-0, not celebrating because their performance wasn’t good enough, complaining about personal and the set up before a ball had been kicked. And completely ignoring the fact-

Sheff Utd have lost 8 of their games by a single goal this season, although they are bottom no one is spanking them.

We have just come back from a game away in the Ukraine.

This was our third game in 7 days - we have been playing 3 games per week all season.

We still have 4 definite first team starters out injured and a few other fringe players.

We have no idea who had a niggle and needed resting.

Sometimes in football you need to grind out results. Many spoke yesterday about being lucky, ignoring we hit the post twice and they should have had a man sent off. With luck they would have both gone in and we might have also had a penalty.

I really think we need to take stock of where we are as a club. In terms of playing staff budget we are about 8th or 9th in the league - in the area of wages and transfer fees we can’t compete with the Big 6, or Everton and Wolves and West ham are on a similar level with many others not too far behind.

 

Lets look at the whole picture, not just I wasn’t entertained.

[majaco]

There are some really entitled views expressed on this forum.

 

We have our best squad in at least four and a half decades.  Some of the negativity is astounding.  The player scapegoating is at times disgusting.  

 

It would be great if we were better but the stage we are at is unbelievable.

 

The Fulham result was so disappointing.  This is partly because Ethel level we have reached gives us high expectations.

 

Sometimes, I disagree with decisions made by Rodgers bit I accept he is probably the premier home nations coach currently where I would probably only make the top two million.

 

How many times have we qualified for Europe.  How many golden boot winners have we had?  How many members of our squad have been to major international championships?  I could go on.  These things are happening as much recently as they ever have done.  Following a bad result, I avoid Foxes talk because of the entitled views.

[Stinkenzo]

3 hours ago, Sharpe's Fox said:

We didn't play well today. We didn't play well in the two preceding games, either. Whether you're top end of the Premiership or bottom of the Championship you're not a bad supporter for saying it.

Its one thing to say we didn't play well, but literally every goal conceded creates this wild meltdown, that half a dozen players on the pitch at the time aren't good enough and should be sold. It is SO over the top and pathetic.

[HighPeakFox]

48 minutes ago, Aus Fox said:

we have been playing 3 games per week all season.

I hate to point this out, but this is a falsehood. We average 2 games per week.

[Koke]

The frustration comes from the fact we are so talented yet so inconsistent of late. Our form since January have not been good enough, and outside of this forum, Rodgers has gone unscathed from any media criticism. In fact, quite the opposite, he seems to get praised despite our horrendous results.

 

Our players have shown they are good enough to be top 4/6 challengers and we should support them even when they're going through bad times (see Maddison, Perez etc) and I feel Rodgers get a hard time on here because he's evidently completely immune from criticism by the national press. 

[StanSP]

3 minutes ago, Koke said:

The frustration comes from the fact we are so talented yet so inconsistent of late. Our form since January have not been good enough, and outside of this forum, Rodgers has gone unscathed from any media criticism. In fact, quite the opposite, he seems to get praised despite our horrendous results.

 

Our players have shown they are good enough to be top 4/6 challengers and we should support them even when they're going through bad times (see Maddison, Perez etc) and I feel Rodgers get a hard time on here because he's evidently completely immune from criticism by the national press. 

I think it's great he escapes media criticism. I'd rather not have any more negative view on us (which is arguably unwarranted in some respects) than what we see on here. 

 

The media wouldn't exactly be best placed to criticise either. On the surface, we're 3rd and in the EL knockouts. Having gone in to our season with a depleted squad and not having a full one since. We get critiqued by pundits on Sky/MOTD/BT Sport when our games are on there but looking at the bigger picture, we've come through some tough challenges and in a good position for it. 

 

Rodgers doesn't fully escape criticism, mind. It's just far less than you see on here and that's not a bad thing.

[Babylon]

I think people have lost touch with how difficult the league is. Budget usually dictates the league and ours is about the 8th biggest, we are doing very well considering.

 

And whilst I’m not thrilled with some of his decisions or some of our performances. A team in that 6th - 8th bracket is usually pretty inconsistent and loses a lot of games. Anything above that is exceptional.

 

Factor in the number of big players we’ve had missing since January and the disturbed seasons we’ve had, I think everyone need to cut him some slack. 

[Corky]

Matchday threads are no different to the ground really. I've been part of crowds that have been giving the players and managers grief then exploding with noise at a late winner.

[Mythyaar]

It's not about being entitled or realistic. We just have to accept that this season we're going to be predictably unpredictable. 

 

Probably best to go into each match with fairly low expectations and be pleasantly surprised like today. 

 

Btw, the expectations are lower when we're at home. 

[SpacedX]

2 hours ago, Fox85 said:

 

There is to many fans on here that live in the past way to many who are happy with mediocre results and piss poor performances and still see us as a side fighting against relegation or being a mid table team.

 

These are the old crustys who have no ambition for the club. 

 

 

There's so much wrong with this aside from the appalling written English.

 

Many of the "old crusties" that you refer to are the most measured in their responses on match day threads, appreciative of our assets - in particular the owners, grateful to be supporting the club during this era and thankful to be rid of the past - albeit nostalgic about the days we were shit. They don't tend to be the ones that brand Maddison and Chilwell as "useless" call for Brendan Rodgers to "get out of our club" and every match thread without ****ing fail when we perform badly ridiculously, melodramatically and emotionally declare "this is the worst Leicester City performance in history". Amusing, when you discover that some that do have very often only been watching the club for a decade at most and need to be educated about McLintock, Hamilton and Pleat. 

 

You can't generalise though, this forum, young and old, vacillates wildly between absurd levels of euphoria and appalling negativity - with little in between barring some wise and sage like comments from, funnily enough some "old crusties" in among there. I can tell you who they are. 

 

There are just as many younger supporters who have legitimate concerns about a mid table finish...this is the Premier League for Christ's sake, there are no guarantees, and near every match is a bastard to win - perhaps peruse the 'entitlement' thread when you have time? A touch of realism is not lacking ambition and I'm not actually aware of any members that are happy with "mediocre results and piss poor performances" - last Monday against Fulham being a case in point.

[fuchsntf]

4 hours ago, Hollyfox said:

In this league, you stand still, you go backwards. 

After winning the league, I didn't want our club to crawl back under the rock we came from. 

And we haven't. 

It's brilliant what's happened but we have to keep striving forward or we'll end up like a few others that have done well for a bit, then faded. 

 

Fans have to be realistic though👍

I Dont believe we was under Any rock...

That might be the Problem  on this forum, all 94 clubs are Mountains for their True fans, for our fans we are a target..!!

Edited 6 December 2020 by fuchsntf

[foxaholic]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

ide I think people have lost touch with how difficult the league is. Budget usually dictates the league and ours is about the 8th biggest, we are doing very well considering.

 

And whilst I’m not thrilled with some of his decisions or some of our performances. A team in that 6th - 8th bracket is usually pretty inconsistent and loses a lot of games. Anything above that is exceptional.

 

Factor in the number of big players we’ve had missing since January and the disturbed seasons we’ve had, I think everyone need to cut him some slack. 

The league is nowhere as difficult as when half the league could win it  People say we have a good squad  but if they are not available  they cant be included . In view of the injuries I wonder how they would have goton in the days of terrible  pitches  and folks like chopper Harris playing for every side . Star players like Best Charlton Ronaldo Messi Pele never seemed injured. Liverpool wonthe league playing 63 matches using 15 players  I wonder if Klopp knows. Another point  when  calling Vardy who I love to bits Leicesters best ever player is how he is cosseted and look at the scoring records of Chandler and Rowley Up to the 90s  the best team would be picked for  every game  although the medicalfacilities are nowhere near as good as now

[Aus Fox]

2 hours ago, HighPeakFox said:

I hate to point this out, but this is a falsehood. We average 2 games per week.

Sorry that was an error from me, fat fingers. I did mean 2 games per week.

[Genesis1]

I think people would agree when I say fans would take a loss if we played our strongest side with players in their strongest position, set up with the right tactics and the right subs when necessary.

For example today, I don't ever remember any threat from a Maddison corner, Albrighton at right back kicking a ball out of play and bringing on Kelichi for our biggest spark.

If for example we played Justin as the right wing back, try somebody else taking corners and bringing on Barnes for Maddison I would imagine people wouldn't be as pissed if it was a draw in the end.

Again, playing a back five against Fulham and also having two of our best players coming back from injury just to get reinjured.

Fans are entitled to be frustrated but one final example, Perez scored a load of goals for Newcastle playing behind a striker then Rodgers plays him on the right wing. People are going to be annoyed.

[gurru991]

I feel we are becoming Arsenal mk 2. We have a bunch of plastics who have jumped on the band wagon who are not happy with top six & final 32. The pre -game predictions for this game were horrendous.

[NeilLCFC]

7 hours ago, UpTheLeagueFox said:

Indeed @nettle!

Sitting in the double decker as a kid under Pleat's reign.

Trying to be neutral on the radio when Kelly, Levein and Holloway were stinking the place out.

Perhaps the almost 40 years of watching them has given me a more measured view.

And through my job, I focus on other teams in other leagues and people think I'm mad when I tell them how some of our fans are having frequent meltdowns.

Look at Forest, Derby, Sunderland, Ipswich and many others etc.

During some of these times our entire squad probably cost less than our current manager is being paid. It’s quite ridiculous to have the same expectations now as you have over the 40 years you’ve supported the club. 
 

Forest, Derby etc aren’t spending £30m+ on a player. Again, a pointless comparison.

 

I’m not expecting us to win the league but I am often left frustrated by our manager over thinking things and setting us up negatively rather than playing to the strengths of the team. I don’t think this makes me unrealistic in my expectation.

[The whole world smiles]

5 hours ago, Fox85 said:

This is how I see it.

 

The Leicester today is far different from the Leicester from 20+ years ago.

 

The Squad we have and options we have gives the fans confidence when formations are right to beat most teams in the league.

 

However when the manager sets up defensive against teams that are struggling and we get beaten then fans get pissed off.

 

There is to many fans on here that live in the past way to many who are happy with mediocre results and piss poor performances and still see us as a side fighting against relegation or being a mid table team.

 

These are the old crustys who have no ambition for the club. 

 

So I think the LCFC fans of today know we can beat anyone but feel let down by tactics and playing the wrong players and formations against certain teams and show there entitled frustrations.

 

Anyone who sticks up for piss poor performances are those who genuinely don't give a shit about the club.

 

As an old crusty please allow me to school you a little. 

 

Yes your right as a supporter for 30 years we are massively over achieving based on our historical standing. So maybe the years following my team on the terraces at Peterborough, Yeovil, Southend etc has given me a sense of perspective that enables me to keep a level head when this young team stutters in form from time to time. 

 

But forget the history as a younger more entitled fan I would urge you and others to look at the cold hard reality of our situation.

 

The bare facts are. We have the 8th highest wage bill in the league and the 11th highest 5 year net spend. The facts are we finished 5th last season and currently sit in 4th. So not only are we over performing historically we are also just out and out over performing full stop, against rivals that have vastly superior spending power. Man United for instance have a wage bill that's around 6 times higher than ours and Man City have a net spend approximately 5 times more than ours. 

 

But guess what? We are beating these sides regularly. Not just in one of games but over the course of a season in the table.

 

How are doing this? We sign promising young players who aren't developed enough for the big boys and we develop them and sell them on at a huge profit.

 

What do young players struggle with? Consistency, hence why they are signing for Leicester City and not Man United etc and hence why are form can sometimes be up and down. 

 

So in conclusion yes I do try to have a bit more patience with the odd poor performance as we are over achieving both historically and financially and also our recent sucess which has enabled you to devolp such an entitled attitude is based on signing young player who struggle with consistency.