Iversen/Ward

[Viva]

1 hour ago, smudger63 said:

You say that, but what if there is a injury to Hermansen, who by the way, we still haven't seen play, and may also be shite, and need to be replaced at some point. 

Hopefully not, but we just don't know yet.

Ward is not good enough at any level in my opinion, and any length time he is playing in our first team, would put the kybosh on any chance of promotion.

He really is that bad!!

Even if we can't get rid of him, I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team squad, I'd rather have Smithies as number 2 keeper, if Iversen leaves.

 

The spell before the World Cup shows he has ability. It’s just wrong to suggest he is not good enough at any level. 

[Paninistickers]

48 minutes ago, Viva said:

The spell before the World Cup shows he has ability. It’s just wrong to suggest he is not good enough at any level. 

I've thought about this before. And tried to find a chink of light for him. But even that spell was inconclusive.

 

Wolves he pulled off a good - but unorthodox - save at 2-0 just before half time. Good stop. But unconvincing technique. Everton, he put in an excellent block, racing off his line, at 1-0 that proved to be game winning. But was that instinct? Fluke? Or simply even a broken clock is right twice a day? ....or maybe, as I suspect, we could pull a keeper out of the national League ( or Smithies or one of the U/23s) for 26 games  and they too would have - at worst - a similar ratio of big saves 

 

He did pull off occasional other good saves during the season. But those two examples apart, not when it mattered. Nothing that kept us in a game. But again, I stress, we could find a league 1,2 or national League keepers on 500 a week to bring similar results. 

[Nod.E]

6 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

I've thought about this before. And tried to find a chink of light for him. But even that spell was inconclusive.

 

Wolves he pulled off a good - but unorthodox - save at 2-0 just before half time. Good stop. But unconvincing technique. Everton, he put in an excellent block, racing off his line, at 1-0 that proved to be game winning. But was that instinct? Fluke? Or simply even a broken clock is right twice a day? ....or maybe, as I suspect, we could pull a keeper out of the national League ( or Smithies or one of the U/23s) for 26 games  and they too would have - at worst - a similar ratio of big saves 

 

He did pull off occasional other good saves during the season. But those two examples apart, not when it mattered. Nothing that kept us in a game. But again, I stress, we could find a league 1,2 or national League keepers on 500 a week to bring similar results. 

I'm a failed semi pro keeper who hasn't played for a few years and I'd back myself to make a handful of worldies. 

 

Unfortunately for Ward (and me), goalkeeping is about consistency and reliability. He doesn't have it. Neither did I!

 

The less said about his technique in 1v1s the better.

[Nod.E]

10 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

 

Edit: double post

Edited 27 July 2023 by Nod.E

[LCFCJohn]

1 hour ago, Mike1983 said:

It was also the first time a team gained promotion with a negative goal score - coincidence?

Maybe, maybe not. I know they got through the playoffs on penalties on the semis and final in a large part down to Ward. Those are facts. Whether he was poor in goal over the season I don’t know. You’d need a Huddersfield fan for that.
 

They scored 56 and conceded 58. Seems like you could equally say their attack was poor and contributed to the negative goal difference? 

Look I’m not defending him for last season. I said he needs to leave. I do question his mentality of having been happy to sit on the bench so much of his career. You could also see that his head had gone last season, that goal in March was it, at home to Chelsea, where he was lobbed. It looked like he’d given up. Clearly no confidence and whether that is poor mentality or not who knows. Rodgers should have taken him out of the firing line way earlier than he did. The guy was drowning.

But, before last season, was anyone unhappy with him being our second keeper? I don’t think so. Lots of hindsight going on. 
 

All I’m saying is look at what you put. You are saying the guy is not good enough for League 2, 3 levels lower than where he was atrocious this season gone. 

[FrankieADZ]

think the clear and obvious thing is, hes not good enough for us, plain and simple

Ward is not a good number 1 keeper;

Iversen yeah i think he is, he needs to improve his kicking/footwork

 

id be very surprised if one of them doesnt leave before the transfer window closes, rather it be Ward

[smudger63]

2 hours ago, Viva said:

The spell before the World Cup shows he has ability. It’s just wrong to suggest he is not good enough at any level. 

Well fair enough, if you rate him, different opinions are allowed, but personally I wouldn't want him as my goalkeeper in Coalvilles team.

[Lesta2014]

I’m guessing smithies hasn’t even travelled? Not seen him in any photos? 

[Viva]

2 hours ago, smudger63 said:

Well fair enough, if you rate him, different opinions are allowed, but personally I wouldn't want him as my goalkeeper in Coalvilles team.

You seriously don’t know much about football then. 
If we could sell him, I would. But we probably can’t. Therefore he is perfectly good as a back up Championship goalie instead of wasting more money on another player, while Ward twiddles his thumbs at home. 

[smudger63]

16 minutes ago, Viva said:

You seriously don’t know much about football then. 
If we could sell him, I would. But we probably can’t. Therefore he is perfectly good as a back up Championship goalie instead of wasting more money on another player, while Ward twiddles his thumbs at home. 

I think after over 50 years of going down the City, and watching football all my life, I think i may have gained a little bit of knowledge of football thanks!

Still you obviously know better!!   I've seriously seen better keepers than Ward on a Sunday morning down the Recky.

[Viva]

22 minutes ago, smudger63 said:

I think after over 50 years of going down the City, and watching football all my life, I think i may have gained a little bit of knowledge of football thanks!

Still you obviously know better!!   I've seriously seen better keepers than Ward on a Sunday morning down the Recky.

Yes I do know better if you think a Welsh international keeper that has played in the top division in Scotland, England and for Liverpool is no better than Sunday League! Have a word with yourself! 

[Death by Football]

I don't want to see Ward ever play for us again.  I'd rather give Vestergaard a go in nets.

Iversen, is a decent enough keeper at the basics but his distribution won't allow us to play the way Enzo seems to want.  If he can get a move it would be best for both parties.

[Gerard]

6 hours ago, LCFCJohn said:

Maybe, maybe not. I know they got through the playoffs on penalties on the semis and final in a large part down to Ward. Those are facts. Whether he was poor in goal over the season I don’t know. You’d need a Huddersfield fan for that.
 

They scored 56 and conceded 58. Seems like you could equally say their attack was poor and contributed to the negative goal difference? 

Look I’m not defending him for last season. I said he needs to leave. I do question his mentality of having been happy to sit on the bench so much of his career. You could also see that his head had gone last season, that goal in March was it, at home to Chelsea, where he was lobbed. It looked like he’d given up. Clearly no confidence and whether that is poor mentality or not who knows. Rodgers should have taken him out of the firing line way earlier than he did. The guy was drowning.

But, before last season, was anyone unhappy with him being our second keeper? I don’t think so. Lots of hindsight going on. 
 

All I’m saying is look at what you put. You are saying the guy is not good enough for League 2, 3 levels lower than where he was atrocious this season gone. 

 

I remember it well as I was the biggest critic of his signing but too many had judged him on his great displays in the play offs. He actually conceded nine more goals than expectation that season with Huddersfield. Just had a look on the Chris Mepham thread for the graph I posted back in the day. 

 

 

[LCFCJohn]

14 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

I remember it well as I was the biggest critic of his signing but too many had judged him on his great displays in the play offs. He actually conceded nine more goals than expectation that season with Huddersfield. Just had a look on the Chris Mepham thread for the graph I posted back in the day. 

 

 

Some useful insight and definitely more interesting than ‘he’s not good enough for League 2’ blah blah with no data around that.

 

I still think (as per my last post on this thread) that 56 goals is also very low for a promoted team in a 46 game season. It looks to me they they were probably a bit dodgy at both ends of the pitch but ultimately ground out the results over the season and in the playoffs is probably fair to say. 
 

I mean ultimately, the point I was challenging was whether he’s obviously not good enough for League 2 and I stand by that point that that is an over exaggerated view based on last season. Clearly not good enough for the Premier League or high end of the Championship. Where he falls inbetween that is unclear. As I say, it’d help if he showed a desire to play! 

[Paninistickers]

18 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

I remember it well as I was the biggest critic of his signing but too many had judged him on his great displays in the play offs. He actually conceded nine more goals than expectation that season with Huddersfield. Just had a look on the Chris Mepham thread for the graph I posted back in the day. 

 

 

Great call. As you prove, the evidence was there that Ward isn't fit to be a professional keeper 

 

Makes the other guy look a right Charlie describing him as a good young keeper. Shows that that we all see what we wanna see sometimes, me included 

[Foreverfox]

One thing nobody has thought of....

What happens if Hermansen is crap? 

Then what do we do? 

[Gerard]

3 minutes ago, Paninistickers said:

Great call. As you prove, the evidence was there that Ward isn't fit to be a professional keeper 

 

Makes the other guy look a right Charlie describing him as a good young keeper. Shows that that we all see what we wanna see sometimes, me included 

 

It makes you wonder how on earth we ever targeted Ward to buy at £12.5m. I'd bet money that the Liverpool board high fived each other when that deal went through. There was literally no evidence I could point to that had an upside, as far as I was concerned there was nothing to suggest he was anything more than an average Championship GK at best. 

 

We actually spent a world record fee on a GK that was preordained in to play as No2. I actually was still fuming at the signing and if you flick through this short thread I got everything bang on against a few "wait and see" happy clappers. 

 

 

[mozartfox]

May be Stowell will take Ward to Tel Aviv??

[Lesta Legend]

18 minutes ago, Foreverfox said:

One thing nobody has thought of....

What happens if Hermansen is crap? 

Then what do we do? 

Expect constant Foxestalk Meltdowns and wide spread toxicity all around the stadium, with Union FS starting fights with OAP happy clapping Rudkin supporters.

[gurru991]

3 hours ago, Foreverfox said:

One thing nobody has thought of....

What happens if Hermansen is crap? 

Then what do we do? 

I assume we will be carrying three first team goalkeepers this season . We just don't know who they will be yet .

[cropstonfox]

4 hours ago, Foreverfox said:

One thing nobody has thought of....

What happens if Hermansen is crap? 

Then what do we do? 

He will be crap.........on here!

[Vestan Pance]

7 hours ago, Viva said:

Yes I do know better if you think a Welsh international keeper that has played in the top division in Scotland, England and for Liverpool is no better than Sunday League! Have a word with yourself! 

I wouldn't go that far but I saw plenty of league 2 last season, and didn't see a keeper that was noticeably better or worse than Ward.

Edited 27 July 2023 by Vestan Pance

[Viva]

12 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

I've thought about this before. And tried to find a chink of light for him. But even that spell was inconclusive.

 

Wolves he pulled off a good - but unorthodox - save at 2-0 just before half time. Good stop. But unconvincing technique. Everton, he put in an excellent block, racing off his line, at 1-0 that proved to be game winning. But was that instinct? Fluke? Or simply even a broken clock is right twice a day? ....or maybe, as I suspect, we could pull a keeper out of the national League ( or Smithies or one of the U/23s) for 26 games  and they too would have - at worst - a similar ratio of big saves 

 

He did pull off occasional other good saves during the season. But those two examples apart, not when it mattered. Nothing that kept us in a game. But again, I stress, we could find a league 1,2 or national League keepers on 500 a week to bring similar results. 

He kept 5 clean sheets out of 6 in that spell and the only goal he let in was a worldie free kick from De Bruyne.

He has ability, but seemed to come back from the World Cup shot of confidence like everyone else in our team. 
Whats the point of bringing in another keeper for similar results? We still have to pay Ward! 

[It'sblueupnorth]

3 hours ago, Viva said:

He kept 5 clean sheets out of 6 in that spell and the only goal he let in was a worldie free kick from De Bruyne.

He has ability, but seemed to come back from the World Cup shot of confidence like everyone else in our team. 
Whats the point of bringing in another keeper for similar results? We still have to pay Ward! 

He came back low on confidence cause he’d ****ed Wales chances of progression by conceding 5 goals with about 0.3xg in about 100 mins of game time, something he was more than used to for us. I jest about the xg stats but he was horrid. Also worth mentioning he was 2nd choice behind Nottingham forests 3rd choice goalkeeper despite playing every minute for us in the league. 
Yes he was okay in that 6 game spell but he contributed to what? 1 decent save? I’m not sure what ability you have seen in him but I’ve not seen much, awful at shot stopping, awful at commanding his area and awful at kicking. I suppose you could say he’s got the full package in fairness. 
You mention nobody was bothered about him being 2nd choice before last season but there was a lot of people confused about why we’d paid 12.5m for a back up that oversaw a negative gd for a promoted team, especially considering he outdid his xG again by 9 goals as someone posted earlier. It’s also harder to get upset at him when he’s only got to play teams around his level in the 3rd and 4th rounds of the league and Fa cup, playing the likes of Fleetwood and Wigan, although a howler at Burton that wasn’t 12.5m standard or part of the side that bombed out at Newport or Zorya Luhansk raised eyebrows. Although I will admit it did seem a decent bit of business after his heroics at Wolves.
We don’t need to bring anyone else in, we’ve got Smithies who can play second choice, someone who’d probably equalled Wardens career apps by the time he was 21. Instead of retiring himself and happy to sit on a bench for the rest of his career at 25. 
He will for me go down as our pound for pound worst ever goalkeeper, and mention your Kevin Pressmans, Rab Douglas’ and Ron Robert Zielers all you like but at least they had a decent career before or after they left us, it’s a bit of a grandfather paradox but I’m convinced if you lined up the worst ever goalkeepers to play for Leicester be it Paul Henderson or Jimmy Nielsen they’d have done no worse than what Danny Ward did last season.

 

[MPH]

 

wonder if Ward will get an offer to Join the Saudi league…