Hodgson Out?

[The Doctor]

Accept that your churning out the same nonsense that was churned out immediately after the last failure at a World Cup. Trust in the youth, it's time for a change etc.

How old are you?

Have you not heard this same argument for the past 30/40 years?

Try to post something interesting. An alternative reason for why England have failed at major tournaments over and over and over again. We've had umpteen managers, both domestic and foreign. We've had the so-called 'golden generation' of young players (meant to be much better than the current crop), yet we've just crashed and burned... Again

Why? Don't simply post the same old turd, enlighten us...

Finally.. Wrong about Redknapp? Same as I was wrong about him taking QPR straight back up?

Show some humility and accept when somebody calls something correctly.

 

It is time for the younger lot to be given the reigns. It may be something that's called for so often, but it never actually happens - look at the U-21 world cup a few years ago where Germany won against England in the final. 6 of the team for Germany that day are out in Brazil. From the England team? 0. They never bring through the youth properly and give them a chance, they just flop time and time again, pile the pressure on a couple of young kids and are surprised when the kids struggle under the pressure.

 

The problem lies in the players and the domestic set up - far too many English players don't progress because they end up sat in a prem youth squad the moment they show any talent and then just fade away because they don't get the first team football to help them progress. If you want a successful national team you need to:

A) Have young players playing regular football.

B) Bring players through the youth sides and get them used to international tournaments.

 

As it is, you just sit back, watch a small handful of players come through and then heap the pressure on them and expect to be carried by 2 or 3 good players, rather than building a good squad.

 

Redknapp was a complete and utter failure - with the squad they had they should have waltzed it, as it was his form was awful, Mclaren got them 23 points in 9 games, Redknapp 57 in 37 - with Redknapp for the full season they wouldn't even have made the play-offs.

[Fox92]

You can't predict the team Redknapp would have picked because nobody knows/will ever know. Pointless really. 

 

Redknapp was never going to get the job, because he isn't a "yes" man. That's what the FA want, even backed up all those years ago when they chose Greenwood over Clough (and Clough should have got the job).

 

At the time, when it was between Redknapp and Hodgson, I wanted Redknapp to get the job and I admit that. The job he did at Spurs was excellent and nobody can deny that, regardless of how much you dislike him. 

[Corky]

You can't predict the team Redknapp would have picked because nobody knows/will ever know. Pointless really. 

 

Redknapp was never going to get the job, because he isn't a "yes" man. That's what the FA want, even backed up all those years ago when they chose Greenwood over Clough (and Clough should have got the job).

 

At the time, when it was between Redknapp and Hodgson, I wanted Redknapp to get the job and I admit that. The job he did at Spurs was excellent and nobody can deny that, regardless of how much you dislike him. 

 

I see this bandied about quite a lot but don't get it. Do you think Capello was a yes man who'd just do what everyone else wanted? Or Keegan, a superstar in his own right, would be dictated to by powers above when he was managing the team?

 

Throughout their careers, Redknapp and Hodgson are quite similar. Some success, some failures. Redknapp got Spurs to the Champions League quarter-finals, Hodgson got little Fulham to a Europa League final. I think Hodgson's previous tournament experience counted in his favour when looking short term for Euro 2012.

[Trav Le Bleu]

Only so much you can polish a turd. And to be fair to him, he at least tried to...

 

Actually, you can get decent results.

 

[Guest ttfn]

Redknapp was never going to get the job because when it came up he was on trial for tax evasion.

[Guest MattP]

It's starting to look a great achievement when you consider Spurs haven't got into the top 4 since they got rid of Harry.

 

Get Keegan back in the job.

 

Look at his job at Newcastle compared to Pardew.

[Corky]

Accept that your churning out the same nonsense that was churned out immediately after the last failure at a World Cup. Trust in the youth, it's time for a change etc.

How old are you?

Have you not heard this same argument for the past 30/40 years?

Try to post something interesting. An alternative reason for why England have failed at major tournaments over and over and over again. We've had umpteen managers, both domestic and foreign. We've had the so-called 'golden generation' of young players (meant to be much better than the current crop), yet we've just crashed and burned... Again

Why? Don't simply post the same old turd, enlighten us...

Finally.. Wrong about Redknapp? Same as I was wrong about him taking QPR straight back up?

Show some humility and accept when somebody calls something correctly.

 

You weren't wrong about Redknapp, you were wrong about Pearson though.

[Webbo]

Redknapp was never going to get the job because when it came up he was on trial for tax evasion.

Exactly. you just know if he'd had the job the papers would have dug up another scandal on the eve of the world cup.

[TheUltimateWinner]

Keep him.

 

Purely because of this:

 

 

I wanted to give him the biggest hug ever.

[StanSP]

lol it's like he's been struck down by a curse.

[Guest MattP]

Exactly. you just know if he'd had the job the papers would have dug up another scandal on the eve of the world cup.

And for once it would be fully deserved.

[AKCJ]

Keep him.

 

Purely because of this:

 

 

I wanted to give him the biggest hug ever.

 

 

Bless him. 

[Col city fan]

Bless him.

Bless him!..he looks like a broken man

[DANGEROUS TIGER]

Accept that your churning out the same nonsense that was churned out immediately after the last failure at a World Cup. Trust in the youth, it's time for a change etc.

How old are you?

Have you not heard this same argument for the past 30/40 years?

Try to post something interesting. An alternative reason for why England have failed at major tournaments over and over and over again. We've had umpteen managers, both domestic and foreign. We've had the so-called 'golden generation' of young players (meant to be much better than the current crop), yet we've just crashed and burned... Again

Why? Don't simply post the same old turd, enlighten us...

Finally.. Wrong about Redknapp? Same as I was wrong about him taking QPR straight back up?

Show some humility and accept when somebody calls something correctly.

100% in agreement.

 

For me, a major part of English football's problems, are caused by the influx of far too many foreign players in our game, which stagnates home grown footballers getting a fair opportunity to progress, instead of stagnate.

[Corky]

100% in agreement.

 

For me, a major part of English football's problems, are caused by the influx of far too many foreign players in our game, which stagnates home grown footballers getting a fair opportunity to progress, instead of stagnate.

 

Nope.

 

Were there too many foreigners in 1994 when we failed to qualify? Oh no, we had strikers like Wright, Shearer, Sutton, Cole, Beardsley, Sheringham and Ferdinand all banging in goals regularly in the top flight.

 

We failed to qualify on several occasions when we had a large percentage of English players. Consistency wise (three quarter finals in a row, our best for a long time) between 2002 and 2006 was achieved when we had a decent amount of foreign players.

[BoneDog]

Try to post something interesting. An alternative reason for why England have failed at major tournaments over and over and over again. We've had umpteen managers, both domestic and foreign. 

 

We've not been winning major tournaments because it's a big world and there are many more naturally talented/gifted footballers and teams out there than our nation is producing. We have finished in the top 4 of a World Cup just twice in it's history, so that tells me that the majority of naturally talented footballers at any one time don't happen to be English, which is understandable given the size of the world. We'll always be up against it at major tournaments.

 

We've underperformed slightly this time around, but to get past the quarters performing at our best would have been a long shot.

 

All this talk about training, facilities, and methods of approach makes not much difference to my eyes, some nations just keep on producing naturally world class players and when you have them, facilities etc. are just a bonus. As someone said yesterday, you can't 'coach' world class into someone.

[Fez of Mahrez]

Redknapp would have got top four in our group.

[The Doctor]

Redknapp would have got top four in our group.

 

He'd have got top 6 in the qualifiers as well. Why aren't we showcasing such a t'riffic wheeler-dealer manager on the world stage?

[Col city fan]

Nope.

Were there too many foreigners in 1994 when we failed to qualify? Oh no, we had strikers like Wright, Shearer, Sutton, Cole, Beardsley, Sheringham and Ferdinand all banging in goals regularly in the top flight.

We failed to qualify on several occasions when we had a large percentage of English players. Consistency wise (three quarter finals in a row, our best for a long time) between 2002 and 2006 was achieved when we had a decent amount of foreign players.

You are quite right of course.

We had many years, under many different managers where the Premier League (or the old Division 1) wasnt flooded with overseas players and we still didnt do any good at international level.

BUT that doesn't mean it might not be a factor now.

The Premier League is pretty flooded with overseas players and this has been to the deteriment of the playing time of quite a number of good, young English players.

Man City have not helped in this (just one example). Both Adam Johnson and Scott Sinclair went to City and had such little playing time that they went backwards as players. The only reason for this, clearly, was money. They went for lucrative contracts and effectively gave up their right to play.

Oxlade is another example. This kid is quality, yet must warm the bench for two thirds of a season because Arsenal went out and bought Ozil for 40 million.

There's just three examples. With Johnson, as soon as he got back into first team football, he started to play in the way he used to..and there was talk of him not being far off the England squad.

So I agree with you.. but what about NOW? Would some sort of cap enable the youngsters (not the really good ones who automatically get into the respective first teams, but those who COULD do, given time) to get more playing time and, maybe more importantly, not cause those with potential to stagnate?

Just a thought.

[Col city fan]

We've not been winning major tournaments because it's a big world and there are many more naturally talented/gifted footballers and teams out there than our nation is producing. We have finished in the top 4 of a World Cup just twice in it's history, so that tells me that the majority of naturally talented footballers at any one time don't happen to be English, which is understandable given the size of the world. We'll always be up against it at major tournaments.

We've underperformed slightly this time around, but to get past the quarters performing at our best would have been a long shot.

All this talk about training, facilities, and methods of approach makes not much difference to my eyes, some nations just keep on producing naturally world class players and when you have them, facilities etc. are just a bonus. As someone said yesterday, you can't 'coach' world class into someone.

Though I do agree, football is a team game. Costa Rica have no real world-class players. I defy you, on paper to argue that any of their players are, theoretically, any better than the England squad?

But look how they've played.. with a system, with energy, with enthusiasm and with style.

Iran, this evening, were fantastic. They fought for everything, they chased everything and if it wasnt for one moment of sheer brilliance from Messi, would have achieved one of their greatest ever results.

So YES, other countries have their own little gems of players who come round every so often. But we don't for some reason? Actually, the last World Cup that we had a player who everyone thought could win a game with one moment of magic was Bobby Robson's England with one Paul Gascoigne. Since then... basically nothing.

We also don't seem to have that thing showed by the Costa Ricans.. that endeavour and self belief that you can win if you play a certain way and as a team.

World Cup after World Cup after World Cup both our overall ability AND our belief that we can succeed have left me completely disappointed.

Our players play in, supposedly, the best league in the world. There must be some reason why we consistently fail.

So its not about why other nations can be so good. . Of course they can. But so could we too?

[MC Prussian]

You are quite right of course.

We had many years, under many different managers where the Premier League (or the old Division 1) wasnt flooded with overseas players and we still didnt do any good at international level.

BUT that doesn't mean it might not be a factor now.

The Premier League is pretty flooded with overseas players and this has been to the deteriment of the playing time of quite a number of good, young English players.

Man City have not helped in this (just one example). Both Adam Johnson and Scott Sinclair went to City and had such little playing time that they went backwards as players. The only reason for this, clearly, was money. They went for lucrative contracts and effectively gave up their right to play.

Oxlade is another example. This kid is quality, yet must warm the bench for two thirds of a season because Arsenal went out and bought Ozil for 40 million.

There's just three examples. With Johnson, as soon as he got back into first team football, he started to play in the way he used to..and there was talk of him not being far off the England squad.

So I agree with you.. but what about NOW? Would some sort of cap enable the youngsters (not the really good ones who automatically get into the respective first teams, but those who COULD do, given time) to get more playing time and, maybe more importantly, not cause those with potential to stagnate?

Just a thought.

Oxlade-Chamberlain and Özil play in completely different positions on the field and the latter isn't the reason for Oxlade-Chamberlain being on the bench.

 

Adam Johnson played a whopping 31 games for Manchester City in his second season with them, and another 26 in his third and last, scoring a total of ten league goals in those two seasons. That's not "going backwards" or "giving up their right to play".

Johnson evolved as a player at Manchester City and was one of the cornerstones for large spells during his stay there.

 

I may give you Sinclair, but even he had a blood clot to deal with and had fierce competition on his position.

[Col city fan]

Oxlade-Chamberlain and Özil play in completely different positions on the field and the latter isn't the reason for Oxlade-Chamberlain being on the bench.

Adam Johnson played a whopping 31 games for Manchester City in his second season with them, and another 26 in his third and last, scoring a total of ten league goals in those two seasons. That's not "going backwards" or "giving up their right to play".

Johnson evolved as a player at Manchester City and was one of the cornerstones for large spells during his stay there.

I may give you Sinclair, but even he had a blood clot to deal with and had fierce competition on his position.

Did Johnson start many games for City? As a regular first-teamer?

Genuine question? If my memory serves me right he went down their pecking order pretty quickly?

[MC Prussian]

Did Johnson start many games for City? As a regular first-teamer?

Genuine question? If my memory serves me right he went down their pecking order pretty quickly?

Yes, he did.

And given the fact that was when Manchester City were active in five different competitions in total (Premier League, Champions League, Europa League, FA Cup, League Cup), it's even more testament to his position within and importance to the team at the time.

Mancini had to rotate to some extent, so 57 league games in two seasons is pretty impressive still.

[Col city fan]

Yes, he did.

And given the fact that was when Manchester City were active in four different competitions in total (Premier League, Champions League, FA Cup, League Cup).

Mancini had to rotate to some extent, so 57 league games in two seasons is pretty impressive still.

Fair play and I stand corrected if that is the case.

I do remember Johnson, however, as a player who went to Man City amidst great hopes and plaudits and left amidst him having been pretty disappointing? Hence they sold him.. I don't recollect that being wrong? Then he joined Sunderland and regained some of his previous form?

[Manwell Pablo]

Fair play and I stand corrected if that is the case.

I do remember Johnson, however, as a player who went to Man City amidst great hopes and plaudits and left amidst him having been pretty disappointing? Hence they sold him.. I don't recollect that being wrong? Then he joined Sunderland and regained some of his previous form?

 

Because he's not good enough not because of the influx of foreigners.

 

Unless you want to lower the standard of the Premeir League by forcing every single side to play five English man, which as a Leicester fan I wouldn't have a problem with. But there's not a hope in hell it'd improve our national side, in fact I doubt it'd be long before people were piping up claiming that the deteriorating standard of the league isn't preparing our footballers for international football properly.