Musa - Opinions so far

[Max Wall]

2 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

He played as a winger in Russia as well and if his control and inability to withstand any sort of a challenge is bad as a winger it be at least as bad as a forward.

Another interesting note is that some of the blame is going on Ranieris shoulders a very small amount maybe true , whereas Walsh is always revered on these pages but:

 

Good signings: Kante, Marhez, Huth,  Ndiddi.

Bad signings: Krameric , Inler ,  Mendy , Hernandez , Musa , Slimani (at price, we'll see), Amarty (potential) , Zeiler.

 

Walsh has to be much more culpable as he was supposedly  the main man for scouting. I wonder how much actual going out and physically watching players was employed compared to the mere use of some statistical software programme that we hear about?

Whether that is correct or not, I don't know. However, that wouldn't suit many agendas on here.

[volpeazzurro]

1 minute ago, Max Wall said:

Whether that is correct or not, I don't know. However, that wouldn't suit many agendas on here.

I agree entirely. In some quarters there almost seemed to be a vendetta against the reign of Ranieri yet, what he alone achieved last season, with what was seen by many as a bunch of 'rag tags' was something of a miracle! Yet, there was a big wailing when Walsh left and an attainment of almost mythical status.  He was possibly not that special.

[waylander]

Give the lad a pre season and see him and the others improve . 

[Max Wall]

8 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

I agree entirely. In some quarters there almost seemed to be a vendetta against the reign of Ranieri yet, what he alone achieved last season, with what was seen by many as a bunch of 'rag tags' was something of a miracle! Yet, there was a big wailing when Walsh left and an attainment of almost mythical status.  He was possibly not that special.

We agree on some points, not on others.

I wanted Ranieri to go, not because of any vendetta but because we were a total mess and getting worse rather than improving. It's way too simplistic to say Ranieri only won the league with us because of what was in place though that did help significantly. His laissez-faire attitude worked wonders for us last season but it also has to be accepted that his substitutions, almost in totality, always seemed to be the correct call. Opinions are what they are and no one will ever be able to call it 100% but I don't accept he did nothing towards the triumph.

Walsh does seem to be lionised on here. His undoubted influence was there for all to see but he certainly didn't get every decision correct as some would have us believe. Neither did Pearson.

Edited 5 March 2017 by Max Wall

[volpeazzurro]

2 minutes ago, waylander said:

Give the lad a pre season and see him and the others improve . 

Can't remember whether is was Fergie or Clough but one of them said that by a certain age  (younger than Musa), if a player can't control a ball, it's too late, you can't teach that.

[TheMightySystem]

Im not saying he hasn't been poor this season because he has, but he has had some good moments as well. Arsenal at home should have had a penalty, Tottenham equaliser, Everton in the Cup 2 goals.

Needs to improve on his decision making and first touch, I think being low on confidence doesn't help and he feels the need to attack in every move, hence him always trying to turn with his back to goal and losing it, and recently him shooting all the time outside the box and not getting close. I would still say keep him but I can understand others frustration and im glad Shaky has dropped him, take him out the firing line and make him develop first before he gets in the first team, much like Kapustka who I would rather give an opportunity to at this point in time then Musa.

[volpeazzurro]

3 minutes ago, Max Wall said:

We agree on some points, not on others.

I wanted Ranieri to go, not because of any vendetta but because we were a total mess and getting worse rather than improving. It's way too simplistic to say Ranieri only won the league with us because of what was in place though that did help significantly. His laissez-faire attitude worked wonders for us last season but it also has to be accepted that his substitutions, almost in totality, always seemed to be the correct call. Opinions are what they are and no one will ever be able to call it 100% but I don't accept he did nothing towards the triumph.

Walsh does seem to be lionised on here. His undoubted influence was there for all to see but he certainly didn't get every decision correct as some would have us believe. Neither did Pearson.

I think we agree mostly,  I just meant that whilst Ranieri may have had to go for the reasons you state, no one can get off scott free and in terms of transfers only, he wasn't the only one to blame.

[Max Wall]

Just now, volpeazzurro said:

I think we agree mostly,  I just meant that whilst Ranieri may have had to go for the reasons you state, no one can get off scott free and in terms of transfers only, he wasn't the only one to blame.

My apologies. Yes, on that point we do agree.

[Bob Weasel Fox]

Musa and Mendy can be decent players on their day

 

sadly this season they have had too many off days already (mixture of injury and general shitty play)

[waylander]

3 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Can't remember whether is was Fergie or Clough but one of them said that by a certain age  (younger than Musa), if a player can't control a ball, it's too late, you can't teach that.

Most of the squad couldn't control the ball this season till the last two game. These are the champions been poor in a very poor team . Just watched Everton very poor control today from good players who have played well together . Oh and clough and fergie both used players who couldn't play a ball.

[FoxyPalace.com]

1 hour ago, ZeGuy said:

Well you didn't see him much then. He runs all the time and tracks back. He doesn't do it well maybe, doesn't have a football brain, sure, but labeling him as lazy is ridiculous. The guy is not a great footballer but you can't question his work rate.

I have seen every match this season.

 

He is Lazy in my opinion it was only a few games ago he could not be arsed to chase back and close down a player that scored.

 

Do the basics at least!

 

 

 

 

Edited 5 March 2017 by FoxyPalace.com

[fuchsntf]

I just believe, that both Musa, and Mendy, need a chance to play in a team that is showing form as a group.

So far they havent had that luxury. 

Before the EOS, I see a couple of injuries that will give at least one of them that chance.

During the summer, there will be various changes, and whether it be with Shakey or a new man at

the helm, their wants and considered needs, will give us a totally new perspective.

Unless we we remain  dumb on investment requirements..

[Koke]

Mendy against Millwall was diabolical. He looked like a League One player. Couldn't pass the ball 5 yards. Kept giving the ball away. I honestly think Matty James might come back next season and be ahead of him in the pecking order. 

 

Musa = Schlupp. Both have the technique of a Championship player and the brain of an U17 academyplayer.

[Detroit Blues]

I think it's a bit premature to write off Musa already. That said, I don't see what he offers you that vardy does not. He might have a future in the premier league as a striker or wide man, but I don't think it will be for us.

[the fox]

I Still believe in him. Come on, musa!

[ZeGuy]

1 hour ago, Detroit Blues said:

I think it's a bit premature to write off Musa already. That said, I don't see what he offers you that vardy does not. He might have a future in the premier league as a striker or wide man, but I don't think it will be for us.

He has none in the PL. None. No one in the PL is crazy enough to put a bid on him. If he doesn't make it with us, which is more than a probability, he'll go for another league. China, Russia, Greece, Turkey's first divisions are the only possible destinations. Not even France.

[sm1]

10 hours ago, volpeazzurro said:

He played as a winger in Russia as well and if his control and inability to withstand any sort of a challenge is bad as a winger it be at least as bad as a forward. He also appears to lack a footballing brain at this level.

Another interesting note is that some of the blame is going on Ranieris shoulders a very small amount maybe true , whereas Walsh is always revered on these pages but:

 

Good signings: Kante, Marhez, Huth,  Ndiddi.

Bad signings: Krameric , Inler ,  Mendy , Hernandez , Musa , Slimani (at price, we'll see), Amarty (potential) , Zeiler.

 

Walsh has to be much more culpable as he was supposedly  the main man for scouting. I wonder how much actual going out and physically watching players was employed compared to the mere use of some statistical software programme that we hear about?

He may have played as a winger in Russia but we recruited him as a striker, hence why we wanted him in Jan when we were short of strikers. It was Ranieri who decided to play him at left wing, because he wanted to play Vardy & Musa, which just doesn't work. Neither does playing them upfront together, its either or. Now his confidence is shot, it doesn't matter where you play him, he looks useless. He's a prime candidate to see a sports psychologist. Vardy looked ordinary playing on the wing but has shown he's a good player, hopefully Musa can produce something similar.

On your other point, Walsh is held in high regard because he has literally put all our title winning squad together. I wouldn't regard Slim (involved in more Leicester goals then any other player, even though he's played a fraction of the season) and Amartey bad signings. I'm not sure Inler was a Walsh signing because Walsh wanted Kante in midfield at all costs and pleaded for him. Is it coincidence our two worst Italian signings, Inler & Benny came a few weeks after Claudio? Who knows. Also Walsh wanted Gueye, not Mendy. Unfortunately Claudio didn't listen, Walsh left and signed him for Everton instead. He's made more tackles then any other player in the top 5 European leagues. 

Despite what the media would like you to believe, Claudio was a piece of a 4-5 year puzzle, not more or lesser important then any of the other pieces.

Edited 6 March 2017 by sm1

[ozleicester]

imo he was bought when we thought we were losing Vards.

 

At first look, Musa's touch was equivalent to Vardy and he was a little faster and younger.

 

In the end we held Vards and the english league and pitches are more difficult than he or we expected. May be the future

[HoustonFox]

Interesting watching this again, but now he's one of our players... Seems a lot more rubbish than good, whereas when we were signing him it was all "raw" and "potential"

 

 

[volpeazzurro]

7 hours ago, sm1 said:

He may have played as a winger in Russia but we recruited him as a striker, hence why we wanted him in Jan when we were short of strikers. It was Ranieri who decided to play him at left wing, because he wanted to play Vardy & Musa, which just doesn't work. Neither does playing them upfront together, its either or. Now his confidence is shot, it doesn't matter where you play him, he looks useless. He's a prime candidate to see a sports psychologist. Vardy looked ordinary playing on the wing but has shown he's a good player, hopefully Musa can produce something similar.

On your other point, Walsh is held in high regard because he has literally put all our title winning squad together. I wouldn't regard Slim (involved in more Leicester goals then any other player, even though he's played a fraction of the season) and Amartey bad signings. I'm not sure Inler was a Walsh signing because Walsh wanted Kante in midfield at all costs and pleaded for him. Is it coincidence our two worst Italian signings, Inler & Benny came a few weeks after Claudio? Who knows. Also Walsh wanted Gueye, not Mendy. Unfortunately Claudio didn't listen, Walsh left and signed him for Everton instead. He's made more tackles then any other player in the top 5 European leagues. 

Despite what the media would like you to believe, Claudio was a piece of a 4-5 year puzzle, not more or lesser important then any of the other pieces.

I  think like many others you fall into certain traps because you think some of what you read on here is reality, examples ars:

1. Musa was bought as a striker but Ranieri decided to play him on the wing. You just don't know that do you?  Do you work as right hand man for the management team and are directly privy to such information. Actually,  Musa has played as both a winger and a forward at both Moscow and Leicester. 

2. You also assume that if a signing is a success then Walsh chose him, if it's a failure, it's down to Ranieri? It helps to fit your conclusions but you can't possibly know with the exception of Kante which Ranieri acknowledged. We don't even know whether Ranieri had much input though he did have experience of working with Mendy.

3. I didn't say,  if you read carefully that Slimani and Armarty were bad signings person. 

 

Rumour, gossip, intrigue, newspapers and football forums do not equal fact. Just as we really don't know how and why Ranieri came to leave the club, neither do we know the inner workings of all of the transfers. But, when mistakes were made I don't think we can make Ranieri solely responsible,  Walsh has to take some blame as well.

[Livid]

If you could wipe your memory and focus on just this season, would you say he has been worse than the rest of them ? and if so, I wouldn't say it was by much.

 

The problem is those we had last year proved they could do it.

 

I'm not writing off £15 Million just yet.

 

 

[AlloverthefloorYesNdidi]

16 hours ago, TheMightySystem said:

Im not saying he hasn't been poor this season because he has, but he has had some good moments as well. Arsenal at home should have had a penalty, Tottenham equaliser, Everton in the Cup 2 goals.

Needs to improve on his decision making and first touch, I think being low on confidence doesn't help and he feels the need to attack in every move, hence him always trying to turn with his back to goal and losing it, and recently him shooting all the time outside the box and not getting close. I would still say keep him but I can understand others frustration and im glad Shaky has dropped him, take him out the firing line and make him develop first before he gets in the first team, much like Kapustka who I would rather give an opportunity to at this point in time then Musa.

I still feel a bit optimistic about him also, for some reason.

Also, remember his goal against Palace.  Opening goal of that game if I remember right

Plus, nobody has been playing great throughout the entire season.  When a team is clicking and he gets a chance at the right time.... Mahrez is a good example of playing better individually just because the team is playing and feeling better

[seenitall]

Coupla nice goals against Everton - crackers against Barcelona. Amazing that after watching the utter garbage that is Vardy and Drinkwater, Fuchs, Okazaki et al for all of this season until a week ago we can find enough hate to pour on one lad in his first season for us or possibly another lad who got injured in his first game. Stop hating - you never know, the worst that can happen is he doesn't quite make it - the best is he becomes another star - remember how crap Vardy was when we got him, and Drinky, and Mahrez most of the time, and Morgan, and come to think of it, outside of Kante when has a player ever come here and been brilliant from the off?

[Babylon]

7 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

I  think like many others you fall into certain traps because you think some of what you read on here is reality, examples ars:

1. Musa was bought as a striker but Ranieri decided to play him on the wing. You just don't know that do you?  Do you work as right hand man for the management team and are directly privy to such information. Actually,  Musa has played as both a winger and a forward at both Moscow and Leicester. 

2. You also assume that if a signing is a success then Walsh chose him, if it's a failure, it's down to Ranieri? It helps to fit your conclusions but you can't possibly know with the exception of Kante which Ranieri acknowledged. We don't even know whether Ranieri had much input though he did have experience of working with Mendy.

3. I didn't say,  if you read carefully that Slimani and Armarty were bad signings person. 

 

Rumour, gossip, intrigue, newspapers and football forums do not equal fact. Just as we really don't know how and why Ranieri came to leave the club, neither do we know the inner workings of all of the transfers. But, when mistakes were made I don't think we can make Ranieri solely responsible,  Walsh has to take some blame as well.

There is enough information out there over time that you can piece together and give yourself a very good picture of who was and who wasn't a Walsh or Ranieri pick. Whether that a signing pattern, comments from here or abroad etc. Unless someone comes out of the club and gives a list we'll never know 100%, but it doesn't mean you can't gain an educated opinion from what we do know.

That's not to say Walsh is perfect by any stretch, there are plenty that are safe to assume he scouted that so far haven't been very good, or we've got rid of before they've ever really had a chance. But there are plenty that seem to fit Ranieri's MO also that have been stinkers.

 

[Babylon]

8 minutes ago, Livid said:

If you could wipe your memory and focus on just this season, would you say he has been worse than the rest of them ? and if so, I wouldn't say it was by much.

 

The problem is those we had last year proved they could do it.

 

I'm not writing off £15 Million just yet.

 

 

Exactly, if he gets a chance now's the time to really judge him. If he doesn't start performing when the rest are, then I think it's a fair call to say he won't make it.

 

We've been so different the last two games, actually attempting to play a bit of football, but also when we go direct they haven't just been aimless pumps. Hull looked vulnerable to pace and I wouldn't haven minded him on the bench to come on in that game.