Is Shakespeare the right man for the job?

[cropstonfox]

He will last and we will be a solid top eight or better.the players will be up for it when it matters and better still once huth returns to put confidence back in the defence and allow a little more freedom to the midfielders to become more attak minded.believe ffs

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

Yeah but I have seen no evidence of this.

 

I never ever get carried away with friendlies, however I expect the basics to be in place - improvement in ball retention, I agree is vital, yet we're playing the same shite that was churned out last season. The same old long ball to Vardy. It's boring. At least De Boer has gone to Palace with a clear aim of playing football and keeping the ball.

 

Shakespeare has changed very little. Keeping us up was the relatively "easy" task compared to this summer where I expected him to rebuild and change yet I've seen no evidence of that. And as for improvement of playing staff - where? Maguire, a good signing and we needed a centre half, Iborra I didn't expect that one, and Ihenacho will be a superb signing yet on the other hand he's given Ulloa a new contract. We should be looking to move certain players on to get better players in to push on for Europe.

 

We've got a long way to go yet and like I've said all summer I expect nothing this season. I don't even think Shakespeare will last the season.

I said 3/4 improvements a year. There they are. 

[Fox92]

8 minutes ago, toddybad said:

I said 3/4 improvements a year. There they are. 

Yeah but my whole point was we're not progressing or changing on the pitch in terms of style. Lumping it long still ain't an improvement.

[Foxes1]

I'm willing to give him a chance but how long do we give him. It's alright saying the squad are playing for him, but are they. The transfer window was looking promising with Maguire coming in early and also Iborra, but since then it's been disappointing we have been messing around with Kelechi for too long. I would also question as to why it took so long to appoint him were we looking at someone else who didn't want to come so we went for the cheap option, can Shaky attract the players we want only time will tell.

[Gerard]

19 minutes ago, Foxes1 said:

I'm willing to give him a chance but how long do we give him. It's alright saying the squad are playing for him, but are they. The transfer window was looking promising with Maguire coming in early and also Iborra, but since then it's been disappointing we have been messing around with Kelechi for too long. I would also question as to why it took so long to appoint him were we looking at someone else who didn't want to come so we went for the cheap option, can Shaky attract the players we want only time will tell.

 

Patience.

 

Would you rather sign Iheanacho after a bit of a saga or just sack it off and sign another striker instead?

 

Managers basically succeed or fail on the strength of their signings and you can't fault him on that so far.

 

Iheanacho seems like an absolute dream signing that ticks every box you would want in a signing.

Maguire appears good business as well.

Jakupovic seems ideal quality for a No2 keeper.

 

I'm not convinced that the Iborra signing will be positive for us myself but he does have pedigree despite my reservations.

Edited 30 July 2017 by Gerard

[chapero82]

I will admit if I'm wrong, but I never thought he would be, I truly hope I'm wrong! 

[chicagofox]

10 minutes ago, Gerard said:

I'm not convinced that the Iborra signing will be positive for us myself 

Why?

[TrentFox]

Ah! The bed-wetters thread. FFS !!!! 

[Gerard]

22 minutes ago, chicagofox said:

Why?

 

Not good enough for Sevilla and comes to an area we're pretty well stocked in. Not a good enough upgrade and I suspect he'll mainly be on the bench unless Shaky has a new formation lined up. 

[Cadno'r Cymoedd]

I think he should be sacked now. No points from no league games is a piss poor return on the investment to date this summer. 

[weller54]

2 minutes ago, Cadno'r Cymoedd said:

I think he should be sacked now. No points from no league games is a piss poor return on the investment to date this summer. 

Harsh! 

But if we don't win at The Arse he's a dead man walking! 

[Fox92]

39 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

Not good enough for Sevilla and comes to an area we're pretty well stocked in. Not a good enough upgrade and I suspect he'll mainly be on the bench unless Shaky has a new formation lined up. 

I thought he was captain? Played 30 odd times for them again last season.

 

I worry because Iborra looks like he can actually play football - comes short for the ball and asks for it to his feet from the goalkeeper - and our style is just long ball to Vardy.

[Gerard]

16 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

I thought he was captain? Played 30 odd times for them again last season.

 

I worry because Iborra looks like he can actually play football - comes short for the ball and asks for it to his feet from the goalkeeper - and our style is just long ball to Vardy.

 

The last three season he's played more or less in 50% of the total minutes in each season for Sevilla.

He was mainly one of their first reserve players.

He nearly joined Sunderland last season.

Sevilla actively tried to sell him this season and last season.

 

I think he'll be okay but IMO he'll end up being a squad player for us when we have no injury worries. I also see him coming on a lot as sub when we try to see a game out.

[NotTheMarketLeader]

9 hours ago, splinterdream said:

 

It was obvious our style of play changed as we stood off more, became more defensive going for the 1 nil win, it worked but it was observed the players didn't look comfortable with it, I wasn't calling for Ranieri to be sacked or anything, it just looked like he was trying to impose a style that wasn't going to work with the players we had which gives you that nagging doubt, commentators and pundits picked up on it and I'd rather have been wrong, football after all is great for differences of opinion. Ranieri's tactics may have been what we needed at that time to get us over the line, we'll never know but carrying it through to the 16/17 pre-season it became more obvious things weren't right but many saying then that it's only pre-season and is meaningless, I'm sure you have a different opinion though.

Take into account teams dropping back and trying to negate our counter attack and you have your answer.

[GaelicFox]

6 hours ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

No, but you were pointing out the fairly short odds.

They aren't short ..... I actually think that we might get off to a very slow start and those odds will tumble and fast 

 

the press will read too much into the length of time it took to make shaky the manager , the bookies will respond to the press hunting for shaky if we start slow 

 

I think 10/1 is probably over priced 

 

Hope Im wrong but it's a fairly thought start to season 

 

[Dan LCFC]

I wanted him permanently because I thought he knew how to get the best from this group of players AND build on it.

 

I gave him the benefit of the doubt towards the end of last season. Everton and Palace could be forgiven considering we were basically safe barring a disaster and he rotated the squad a lot due to two of our biggest ever games. Even Palace we were unlucky really to not win, their pair of goals were disgusting. Arsenal away was poor, even though we were unlucky with the goal we conceded, I thought we invited trouble too much that night against a very fragile side at the time. Tottenham was a disaster of a game but even that I could give him a slight benefit of the doubt seeing as we were missing both of our main centre halves. We had no chance in hindsight, although it did get very embarrassing in the end and we looked a bit of a mess.

 

But overall he got 23 points from 13 games. That's a pretty good return. Although only 8 from the last 8.

 

I'd be lying if I said I was encouraged this pre-season so far though. We need younger blood in that side. Maguire's a very good signing and exactly what we needed, but we need more. Iborra I think could be decent I'm worried he's more of what we already have - not bad, but limited and not that young. Simpson 30, Morgan 33, Huth 32 (and 33 in a couple of weeks), Fuchs 31, Okazaki 31, Vardy 30, Slimani 29, Ulloa 31, it's a bloody old squad and it needs a rebuild.

 

I have no issue with us playing the high pressing game as long as it gets us results. It isn't the prettiest but we've made it work exceptionally well at times. I just worry that we're going to end up being a bit found out and that we'll have nothing beyond it.

 

 

[Dan LCFC]

15 hours ago, RODNEY FERNIO said:

Yes we never win at Arsenal ... in our last 20 matches there ... we've lost 17 , drawn 3 and won none of them ... scored 11 and conceded 45.

Don't think there will be a meltdown if we lose there yet again.

Have you read this thread?  

[Dan LCFC]

13 hours ago, Kitchandro said:

I've never thought he was the right man since the Madrid games. They proved the sort of of mentality he has and everything since has reinforced this.

 

He is just way too negative and doesn't really have any sort of philosophy in terms of style of play. He has no tactical understanding of the game.

You're massively under-estimating Atletico Madrid. Look at their record in Europe under Simeone. Their defensive record at home is phenomenal.

[WigstonWanderer]

14 hours ago, Kitchandro said:

Oh right so that's ok, we played 3 negative halves and then he was so brave he had a go when we needed 3 goals in 45 minutes. Even then 2 of the 3 substitutes were defenders!

 

Unbelievable you can twist that into making out he was being positive. The tie was gone before we attacked them.

 

And who did we bring on with 5 10 minutes to go when we were desperate for 2 goals? AMARTEY

He went for it 2nd half against Spurs 

[volpeazzurro]

6 hours ago, Dan LCFC said:

I wanted him permanently because I thought he knew how to get the best from this group of players AND build on it.

 

I gave him the benefit of the doubt towards the end of last season. Everton and Palace could be forgiven considering we were basically safe barring a disaster and he rotated the squad a lot due to two of our biggest ever games. Even Palace we were unlucky really to not win, their pair of goals were disgusting. Arsenal away was poor, even though we were unlucky with the goal we conceded, I thought we invited trouble too much that night against a very fragile side at the time. Tottenham was a disaster of a game but even that I could give him a slight benefit of the doubt seeing as we were missing both of our main centre halves. We had no chance in hindsight, although it did get very embarrassing in the end and we looked a bit of a mess.

 

But overall he got 23 points from 13 games. That's a pretty good return. Although only 8 from the last 8.

 

I'd be lying if I said I was encouraged this pre-season so far though. We need younger blood in that side. Maguire's a very good signing and exactly what we needed, but we need more. Iborra I think could be decent I'm worried he's more of what we already have - not bad, but limited and not that young. Simpson 30, Morgan 33, Huth 32 (and 33 in a couple of weeks), Fuchs 31, Okazaki 31, Vardy 30, Slimani 29, Ulloa 31, it's a bloody old squad and it needs a rebuild.

 

I have no issue with us playing the high pressing game as long as it gets us results. It isn't the prettiest but we've made it work exceptionally well at times. I just worry that we're going to end up being a bit found out and that we'll have nothing beyond it.

 

 

'Everton and Palace could be forgiven considering we were basically safe barring a disaster'

 

It may be just me but I don't 'forgive' this sort of thing. In fact it's that sort of attitude that got us into a mess in the first place. It wreaks of players being able to turn it on or put a 100% shift in when they feel like it. A really good manager creates an atmosphere where everyone knows and more importantly believes that this is unacceptable. The players quite rightly were put under a lot of pressure to perform and put the season before's effort in when Ranieri was sacked and guess what,  they managed it! As soon as we were nearly safe the performances dropped off again. It takes maximum effort every game to win anything, we know this because we've seen it with our own eyes. This bunch of players are not talented enough to win without maximum effort.

 

If performances dropped off again it therefore for me suggested that the same problems were underlying. As Shakespeare, who as originally part of the winning team, but also part of the subsequent demise, was now in charge, this relapse was on his watch after some good effort and results. Therefore for me, although very popular with the players (possibly to much), Shakespeare was not the option to take us forward for me and a change was needed with or without him. The problem was who was likely to want to come, were we really a now an attractive enough a proposition under all the circumstances for a really top manager if one was available?  I think that is why the big delay in appointing Shakespeare occurred as I think our owners wanted better and couldn't get it. For me Shakespeare is merely a 'second choice Charlie' and success is at best hopeful and wing and a prayer. I hope I'm very wrong because he seems like a genuine nice bloke, but sometimes it just far to easy to walk over a nice boss! Also a new boss may have been reluctant to come if he believes that the team is being run by the dressing room.

[sylofox]

Pre season means feck all. No points for beating wolves and mk. All that matters is the players are getting a good run out.

 

If he was playing a full first team in every game I would be worried but mix and match in every game naahhhh.

 

Did we not have a shite pre season the year we won promotion.

[WigstonWanderer]

8 minutes ago, sylofox said:

Pre season means feck all. No points for beating wolves and mk. All that matters is the players are getting a good run out.

 

If he was playing a full first team in every game I would be worried but mix and match in every game naahhhh.

 

Did we not have a shite pre season the year we won promotion.

Not this shite

[HighPeakFox]

I'd be interested to know how good/bad the FT pre-season has been in comparison to previous pre-seasons....

[foxinsocks]

He is the right guy.... for now.  We have four big problems.  The ageing profile for the first team starters.  The lack of success at alternative modes of play.  A lack of creativity. A cautious streak (though this may keep us in the prem).  

 

The first two can be addressed by bringing in younger players who can offer alternative mode of play.  here I worry - Iborra and the return for james will stiffen up our mf competitiveness and offfer options...  but I am not sure they offer a different pattern of play.  Shakes and appleton need to think hard about this. I hope Tom Lawrence will make an impact in some games... iheancho wouldhelp - but is he enough?

 

The lack of creativity thing undermines even our "lcfc counter attacking mode of play".  To address this shakes needs to get personal mentors to work with the individual players to develop the skills and mindsets to enhance that side of their game (slimani, mahrez, grey, ndidi etc) - for an hour each day.

[mod hero]

Since Kante left our counter attacking option has not been as good obviously, 

 

The way he regained possession and carried the ball 30-40 yards before offloading was pivotal to our season.

 

He started moves for plenty of goals that season, off the top of my head... Swansea 2 goals, Newcastle away, West Ham home, Man City away for Mahrez ...

 

Apart from Mahrez there is no one who can run with the ball. That would be my main area of recruitment before the window shuts.