Do we need/want a whole new regime?

[HighPeakFox]

Change has to be slow and subtle - and it's already underway. They must realise the clock is ticking on Vardy to a certain extent (although I hope not for 2 more seasons at least), and they just have to make the 16 hungry en masse. I take the player meetings etc as a sign that they DO care, they do want to do well again, but (and I apologise for self-referencing here) I have said 2 or 3 times in the past that the title win might cause psychological difficulties - it would appear that one or two of you agree with this.

 

Good topic by the way @Ric Flair

[foxinsocks]

..

[sacreblueits442]

I am amazed 70% of Foxestalk believe in a rebuild as the direction for the club to take in order to achieve success!

  There is absolutely nothing wrong with the the system which we play, so long as high tempo and pressing. People allude to this as making us a "one trick pony". We seem to forget this to our detriment. I personally want to keep our style of play, if you look at Atletico Madrid they play the same only with better players. We need to aspire to that standard and with Iborra and Silva it now appears that we are going in the right direction. We are not going to get Simeone but getting Wagner would I believe allow us to continue what we started.

 Being different is not s bad thing, take a look at Saracens (Rugby Union) they play high tempo in there opponents half and feed off other teams mistakes, no other team plays this way, they have won 2 European Championship in the last 2 years and are favourite to win it again this year.

  We only play "hoof ball" when we forget what makes this club tick, Shakey and Ranieri made that mistake, changing our style would make us one of the "also rans", I believe we are better than that and 70% of us I feel need to understand this.

[Guest Col city fan]

2 hours ago, HighPeakFox said:

Change has to be slow and subtle - and it's already underway. They must realise the clock is ticking on Vardy to a certain extent (although I hope not for 2 more seasons at least), and they just have to make the 16 hungry en masse. I take the player meetings etc as a sign that they DO care, they do want to do well again, but (and I apologise for self-referencing here) I have said 2 or 3 times in the past that the title win might cause psychological difficulties - it would appear that one or two of you agree with this.

 

Good topic by the way @Ric Flair

No it's not! It's presented as a fait accompli...stop creeping...

 

[DJ Barry Hammond]

 

Regime change is a bit extreme? Are you part of the Trump administration?

[TrentFox]

5 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

So as we prepare for a new tenureship under Claude Puel it's got me considering what needs to happen for this regime to be a successful one? What needs to happen for Puel to be here for at least the duration of his likely 3 year contract? We all seem to yearn for a new dynasty to be built but are we prepared for what that entails and the dismantling of the most successful team and system of our history?

 

Can Puel really come in and make sweeping changes and be a success? I'm not so sure he'll be afforded the time to do that, he simply has to hit the ground running like Ranieri managed to do. Nigel Pearson built this club up because we were at our lowest ebb and were not in the spotlight that we are in now, it took him two bites at the cherry but it's no doubt he was afforded the time, money and environment to build the main foundations for what has led to this last few years of footballing utopia.

 

However, I think it's fair to say some of our senior players are massively influential on what happens at our club and this can be highlighted by the players meeting that took place prior to the great escape, the way Ranieri left them to it during the title winning season and allowed them to only train two days a week, the players demanding they stick with 4-4-2 during last seasons poor run, them instantly becoming as effective and devastating as the title winning season when Ranieri left and now instantly looking much more positive now Shakespeare has gone. Are these players so cock sure of how to get the best out of themselves as a team that any other way is unsuccessful due to a resistance whether deliberate or not. If so, how can our new manager change things? Is he to realise the beauty of this squad and the team spirit and togetherness that cannot be bought or taught and try to keep it as simple as possible and pad the team out in the best way possible or does he realise we can never move on whilst this power the players have is maintained, which will mean the likes of Vardy, Schmeichel, Morgan and Mahrez will be disposed of?

 

Puel is renown for having free reign to build the academy at his clubs to be a conveyor belt of talent through to the first team, which is something I think all of our fans would welcome and is the one thing we've been distinctly poor at. The problem I can see is Jon Rudkin still retains all the power and decision making of the academy hence the jobs for the boys culture with Beaglehole and Peake still being in charge since the League One days despite all the money we've invested and the level our first team now plays at. It's another obstacle he needs to tackle in his journey to building something here, he seems to start well at his clubs in France and before he gets to a level he's happy with a rocky period follows, he'll not get that much time here and that's a worry. Can he influence enough change for the long term very quickly because I believe we do need massive change because at some point this title winning squad will be obsolete, so why prolong the inevitable.

 

Thoughts please?

Good thread. Good fundamental question. I’m in the  ‘stick’ camp. We have a style - of sorts. Keep being the ugly bug. Who cares what the rest of the world think of us? We’ve had the most fabulous period being different. Why change and become mainstream? The others are better at it. We’ve already shown our unorthodox methods can work. Stick with it ! 

[Ric Flair]

38 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

No it's not! It's presented as a fait accompli...stop creeping...

 

I'm in no position to sway people to my desire to see Leicester change, I asked the questions and gave my answer to it in the same post, people are fed up Col!!!

[Guest Col city fan]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

I'm in no position to sway people to my desire to see Leicester change, I asked the questions and gave my answer to it in the same post, people are fed up Col!!!

Im only having you on Ric. I think we're all fed up tbh, especially those of us who have seen the club existing under really strong regimes in the past. I don't mean having lots of money...we've never been as rich as we are now, I mean the club being well managed from top to bottom. At the moment, it seems amateurish to say the least. The managerial merry go round we are having is a. Embarrassing...the club is losing its popularity to the footballing world at large and b. Usually indicative of a badly run club.

[Izzy]

A new Manager and a relatively new No 2 feels like enough of a regime change for the moment thanks.

 

And 'Rudkin Out' won't make the players try any more or less on the pitch.

 

I say we let things settle down a bit and let CP and MA get there heads together and help move us up the table first...

 

 

[Edthefox]

I logged in just to up vote the OP. I'm  usually just lurking and reading but this cuts right to the heart of where we're at right now and like it or not, where we are at means the only logical choice is to have a new approach from the ground up. 

 

Personally I'd rather someone other than Puel was leading that but hope he and the club prove me wrong. 

[shade]

17 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Yeah but it's hardly a poll mate! You've completely loaded it up in one direction with the comments thereafter!

 

not really, i never read the comment before i vote, why would anyone do that?

[mozartfox]

16 hours ago, jayfox26 said:

We won't be able to make massive changes a quarter of the way through the season, so for me it's a case of seeing this season out and finish as high as possible and look to re build next summer. If we can get anyone in as well as Silva that can make a difference, then great, but most changes won't start to happen till the summer. It could be a disaster to make wholesale changes at this stage of the season. Maybe slowly bring In new things to build on what we are good at (as we aren't as terrible as some make us out to be) and then start to make the big changes, if necessary, in the summer. 

He will learn very quickly that Rudkin is not that very good at recruitment and that our scouting network is piss poor. So we can wrote January off now and save opening a 200 pager Transfer thread.

[Bob Weasel Fox]

12 hours ago, Izzy Muzzett said:

A new Manager and a relatively new No 2 feels like enough of a regime change for the moment thanks.

 

And 'Rudkin Out' won't make the players try any more or less on the pitch.

 

I say we let things settle down a bit and let CP and MA get there heads together and help move us up the table first...

 

 

Fingers crossed bud

[Gerard]

17 hours ago, davieG said:

Maybe Vardy is capable of playing a different style.

 

He can for sure as he's proved with England.

 

It's a bit disrespectful to Vardy to assume he's a one trick pony just because he excels in that trick, Vardy can be highly effective without running onto long punts. Vardy can still be a top striker in a possession based team and having pace is always a good thing.

[Nick]

25 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

He can for sure as he's proved with England.

 

It's a bit disrespectful to Vardy to assume he's a one trick pony just because he excels in that trick, Vardy can be highly effective without running onto long punts. Vardy can still be a top striker in a possession based team and having pace is always a good thing.

 

Respectfully, I'm not sure he's proved anything with England as the 'style' is absolutely everything that doesn't suit Vardy's style of play hence him not getting hardly any game time.

[Kilworthfox]

I believe the vote, results are an indication of the fans frustrations of failing to build on the champions season.

 

I don't accept that the scouting is poor, it was one of the main reasons that we won the league, was due to our excellent scouting, combined with team spirit and effective tactical approach.

 

Why would a club have a clear-out of staff and players who demonstrated the ability's to succeed in the premier league?

 

I have supported this club since the late 80's, I also know our history before that, and trust me, we are riding the crest of a wave, this is the best time ever of being a LCFC fan.

 

I appreciate that there may be a frustration that our first team has lost a couple of highly influential players & staff, who have been extremely difficult to replace, but you have to consider the level of success that we achieved, and how difficult it is to maintain that level when players and staff choose to leave the club for the greener grass of another club who have traditionally been more successful in the past.

 

 

[Alf Bentley]

19 hours ago, davieG said:

As for a new regime I believe that with the signing of Maguire, Iborra, Dragovic and the intended signing of Silva we were already on our way to changing, albeit slowly to a more "football" style rather than the hoof /longball approach.

Having players better on the ball and at passing doesn't mean we have to abandon the counter attack approach. My own view is that we need to be able to play many ways but good passing and control will never go amiss.

 

This x 1000.

 

The poll question is too black and white. For me, we do need to change but we don't need to rip everything up and jettison every aspect of the style that won us the title. We need serious reform, not a violent revolution.

 

As Davie says, we have already signed most of the players capable of such reform and of playing a game with more passing and possession. But that doesn't make Vardy redundant. He's perfectly capable of playing on the shoulder and spotting through balls from possession, not just chasing long balls from fast counter-attacks.

 

I do think that, with current personnel, we need to change formation - and have the players to do so. We now have the defenders who'd be comfortable with 3 at the back and wing-backs. In contrast, we don't any longer have the players to make a success of 4-4-2 / 4-4-1-1. We need 3 in central midfield, whatever the precise formation - and have the central midfielders to make a success of that already, even more so once Silva is on board.

 

However, playing with more possession and passing doesn't mean that the likes of Vardy, Okazaki, Albrighton & Chilwell can't continue to close down opponents - and it doesn't preclude rapid counter-attacks with long balls into space for Vardy or to feet for Mahrez in advanced positions, for however long he stays. 

[Alf Bentley]

51 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

He can for sure as he's proved with England.

 

It's a bit disrespectful to Vardy to assume he's a one trick pony just because he excels in that trick, Vardy can be highly effective without running onto long punts. Vardy can still be a top striker in a possession based team and having pace is always a good thing.

 

I think Vardy's ability as a footballer tends to be under-estimated because of his scally persona. 

 

He may or may not be particularly bright intellectually (and his wit suggests that he's brighter than people think). In footballing terms, I think he's a very intelligent player. Not only does he read the game well to spot passes, he generally plays well for the team, having good awareness and anticipation of the movement of team-mates and good judgment as to when to shoot or retain possession and when to find a better-placed team-mate.

[CosbehFox]

18 hours ago, HighPeakFox said:

Change has to be slow and subtle - and it's already underway. They must realise the clock is ticking on Vardy to a certain extent (although I hope not for 2 more seasons at least), and they just have to make the 16 hungry en masse. I take the player meetings etc as a sign that they DO care, they do want to do well again, but (and I apologise for self-referencing here) I have said 2 or 3 times in the past that the title win might cause psychological difficulties - it would appear that one or two of you agree with this.

 

Good topic by the way @Ric Flair

Well summed up here - I wish however that whoever the manager is at the time is given the tools which allow the change (i.e. completing the signing of a footballer in a badly needed position).

 

The fans also need to accept that it's not always going to be easy this change; it's already seen off crudely one manager. It's good discussing formations but we don't see the data coaching staff do. They may have concerns over a players adaptability. 

[jayfox26]

6 hours ago, Swan Lesta said:

 

Respectfully, I'm not sure he's proved anything with England as the 'style' is absolutely everything that doesn't suit Vardy's style of play hence him not getting hardly any game time.

I think he doesn't get much game time as England only play one striker which is obviously going to be kane. I think it's more to do with having one of the best strikers in the world at the moment ahead of him rather than him not suiting England style 

[Wymsey]

What only needs changing is sorting the midfield out, which has been critisised here and there.

But also, need to carry on with the momentum of the past couple of games and enforce the offensive style that led the team to the PM trophy. That definitely has to be the team's DNA again, as it's proved the most-effectivrly way of getting decent results.

 

I think, should be still be here by then, that there's a big defensive re-building job to do to in the Summer or even in January to be honest; with Fuchs, Huth and Morgan starting to get towards the end of their careers.

Hopefully the recruitment side is at best very effective by then.

[volpeazzurro]

5 hours ago, Wymeswold fox said:

What only needs changing is sorting the midfield out, which has been critisised here and there.

But also, need to carry on with the momentum of the past couple of games and enforce the offensive style that led the team to the PM trophy. That definitely has to be the team's DNA again, as it's proved the most-effectivrly way of getting decent results.

 

I think, should be still be here by then, that there's a big defensive re-building job to do to in the Summer or even in January to be honest; with Fuchs, Huth and Morgan starting to get towards the end of their careers.

Hopefully the recruitment side is at best very effective by then.

Agreed. Feelings differ regarding recruitment though I don't think we can really fault the last few of Maguire, Ndidi , Silva and Iheanacho. Even some of the others if played in their correct positions and suitable formation may still suprise us. Puel sounds like his own man and he's inherited a decent squad of players. Like when Pearson arrived after Sven ,  any dissenters need showing the door. It's one thing senior players wanting to offer their opinion but quite another thinking they know best and wanting too much influence. There can be only one manager, toe the line or say goodbye. 

[st albans fox]

Changing of the guard.   Claudio managed for almost two seasons but the club remained essentially in Pearson's image  with shakey initially remaining  in the background and then very much forward and centre. 

 

with shakey's demise and puel's arrival, are we seeing our club embarking on a whole new era? I guess it all depends how the new management are able to change the ethos on and off the pitch. Never dull here!

[Ric Flair]

I think Vardy's game has changed massively even since we won the league and he's a more complete player. Look at the type of goals he scored under Shakespeare and very few of them were his trademark 1v1's from fast counter attacks. There's been more headers, shots from crosses and following up close range at set pieces which he never really did under previous regimes. 

 

Itll be interesting to to see how Puel fairs with him, he's 3 league games without a goal and this time last year he went on a bad run so I hope he can nip that in the bud quickly!! 

[vanity]

Lads, we all love this team, but Vardy, Simpson, Fuchs, Huff, Morgan, Okazaki are all 30 or older. We've brought in a manager who wants to do more than simply coach -- he wants to build a program from the ground up. He has very clear ideas about how to develop young talent, how to coach his talent, how to spend in transfer windows, how to create competitive advantages for smaller clubs that endure, not to mention how to win when on the field. If we give him time, we will be grateful that he is our manager, but it will undoubtedly take some time to get the club the way he wants it, as his first priority is staying up. So he will almost certainly focus on shoring up our leaky defense, and beginning to focus more on possession and building from the back. He will not expect wholesale changes immediately, but I guarantee you this guy has a clear idea of the changes he wants to make and when over the upcoming months, and what he thinks the team will be able to handle, and what he believes he will need to wait until the summer to implement. 

 

FFS, the guy coached Lyon to the CL every year he was there, even eliminating Real Madrid in a CL semi-finals run. He has the talent to coach Leicester.