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[jammie82uk]

6 hours ago, Legend_in_blue said:

So here comes the long delay.

 

Cut the BS and bring it back to the people.  

 

Where's Rees-Mogg now?  Where is he?    This was our legally binding day to leave according to him but we're all still here.  Hahahahaha!  No doubt he'll be telling us we're out on a No Deal in May now this has happened because it's legally binding.

Im not even going to pretend I understand it but I keep seeing about this “people’s vote” what I don’t get is so the “deal” couldn’t be heard for a third time as it was badgering the house but as far as I’m aware there has been 3 votes on having a second referendum so far with them all losing with plans for another vote on it next week 

how can that keep being put up for the vote as surely that’s doing the same thing 

[Alf Bentley]

6 hours ago, MattP said:

Let's be honest it's absurd to even have these things claiming the EU did it when we are a net contributor to the project.

 

Imagine me taking 50 quid out your wallet, buying you a bottle of whisky and then asking for thanks. 

 

If certain areas are underfunded that should be a critique of the British government. 

 

Here's an equivalent to your case. It's from the perspective of someone who doesn't accept the validity of the nation state, particularly redistribution between rich and poor regions within a nation state:

"It's absurd to claim that the UK Exchequer pays for public works in the SE, when the SE is a net contributor to the UK Exchequer.

If certain areas of the SE are underfunded, that should be a critique of SE Govt/councils" (by implication, the SE can and should sort itself out - and other regions, rich or poor, should do likewise).

 

It's only absurd to claim the EU is funding projects in poorer regions of the UK if you don't accept that some money should be pooled above national level, with contributions made according to income and expenditure made according to need.

As you believe strongly in the nation state but want a minimum of transnational powers, particularly transnational redistribution (fair analysis?), I understand that it seems absurd to you.....just as, 1000+ years ago, the Kings and warlords of Wessex, Mercia, East Anglia & Northumbria would have thought it absurd to pool sovereignty and funds or engage in redistribution at a UK level.

 

 

 

[deep blue]

7 hours ago, MattP said:

Let's be honest it's absurd to even have these things claiming the EU did it when we are a net contributor to the project.

 

Imagine me taking 50 quid out your wallet, buying you a bottle of whisky and then asking for thanks. 

 

If certain areas are underfunded that should be a critique of the British government. 

You have a point, but the EU have a policy of the richer members helping out the poorer ones so it's hardly surprising uneven allocation of funds on projects happens.

 

For what it's worth, and you can believe it or not, about 3 years ago I heard from a believable source that the UK also received help for fewer projects than its quota because it was inadequately represented by its MEPs in this way: projects were more likely to be assigned funding when they received strong lobbying from the nation's MEPs, but participation at meetings and promotion of projects was patchy among the EU-sceptical MEPs of which the UK had a large proportion, UKIP being particularly singled out. 

[deep blue]

As an aside, I visited Madeira a few years ago. The EU had helped to fund the series of tunnels that have enabled the island to develop a successful, and vital, tourist industry. I couldn't help but admire and approve it.

[ozleicester]

[Foxxed]

A general election then...

[urban.spaceman]

 

[Buce]

40 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

A general election then...

 

I don't understand the widely held assumption that May will 'call an election' if MV4 fails. Did the Tories not introduce the Fixed Term Act?

[Foxxed]

4 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

I don't understand the widely held assumption that May will 'call an election' if MV4 fails. Did the Tories not introduce the Fixed Term Act?

I just read a headline claiming she would.

 

I'm not sure what it will solve tbh.

[Buce]

14 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

I just read a headline claiming she would.

 

I'm not sure what it will solve tbh.

 

Yeah, me too, but it seems to be ignoring the obvious, doesn't it?

 

[Lionator]

51 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

I just read a headline claiming she would.

 

I'm not sure what it will solve tbh.

It would just end up with another minority government. Which would leave us back where we started.

[Grebfromgrebland]

 

 

[Guest]

Can I say thanks to all of you who contribute on here to the Brexit talks. It's been one of the best and most intelligent reads on the board.

 

Couple of things that annoy me - politicians saying that they are going to have brexit (despite lack of effort) because it's what the people want. It's what the majority who voted in the referendum wanted but by saying that they are actually ignoring what a hell of a lot of people wanted. Can't they just say it's because of the referendum vote. Politicians are there to make decisions not only for the winning voters but also the losing voters and those who can't or didn't vote. Surely they understand that.

 

Another GE! Why bother ? It isn't going to solve the problem unless the only reference is what to do for BREXIT. Which is really another referendum. It may seem to be the entire UK politics at the moment but it isn't.

 

I don't see a problem with another referendum - one where the vote and actions are clear. One with transferable votes. I do think that should only happen if the people were duped with the first referendum.

 

Can you lot get your arses in gear and at least decide something so that those of us living abroad happily for over 25 years can continue to live and pay taxes without the grief. I have no intention of returning to live in England - do you really want another near pensioner back - simply because I was born there. I'd always hoped I'd end up retired in Portugal, that seems less likely now but I should at least be able to live without complications in France having paid taxes for most of my life here.  

[Foxxed]

2 hours ago, Buce said:

 

Yeah, me too, but it seems to be ignoring the obvious, doesn't it?

 

A GE seems to be delaying in inevitable.

 

Party manifestos could clarify (I know, I know...) the party position on Brexit. But then we're voting for MPs who won't necessarily vote with their party.

 

And you'll have people who want to vote for their party out of loyalty but not agree with their party on Brexit.

 

A GE would only work if a party promised a deal-or-no-Brexit referendum. New GE, new negotiations, new referendum, an end to it all.

[Guest MattP]

2 hours ago, Buce said:

I don't understand the widely held assumption that May will 'call an election' if MV4 fails. Did the Tories not introduce the Fixed Term Act?

Nick Clegg's bill from what I remember. Don't know what the numbers were on the vote.

[Foxxed]

3 hours ago, Buce said:

 

I don't understand the widely held assumption that May will 'call an election' if MV4 fails. Did the Tories not introduce the Fixed Term Act?

 

21 minutes ago, MattP said:

Nick Clegg's bill from what I remember. Don't know what the numbers were on the vote.

Two thirds or a vote of no confidence triggers an election outside the fixed term of the parliament. Both of those are quite possible.

 

I'm thinking a GE then referendum is the best solution now.

 

Ask the people who they want to lead the government and new negotiations. Ask them if they like the new deal. Then either go through with it or cancel it.

Edited 30 March 2019 by Foxxed

[Buce]

34 minutes ago, Foxxed said:

 

Two thirds or a vote of no confidence triggers an election outside the fixed term of the parliament. Both of those are quite possible.

 

I'm thinking a GE then referendum is the best solution now.

 

Ask the people who they want to lead the government and new negotiations. Ask them if they like the new deal. Then either go through with it or cancel it.

 

Either eventuality would require Tories voting for it, though.

 

I don't see the likelihood of a vote of no confidence in their own government and I have doubts that they'd want an election either, which would presumably take place with May still leader. I think it's more brinkmanship from May, tbh.

[Legend_in_blue]

Hopefully on Monday this ridiculously long list of options can be cut down to just two - the single market option and the confirmatory vote of the people.  All the current options discussed scatter opinion far too widely.  It's time to concentrate on just a couple to focus people's minds.

 

All of this should've happened on day 1 of course.  

 

As for yesterday's Brexit demonstration - it was a little thin on the ground.  

[Buce]

The unlikely similarities between the far right and IS

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47746271

[Izzy]

Fvcks me right off does this.

 

BBC catches rogue traders selling black-market receipts

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-47756250/bbc-catches-rogue-traders-selling-black-market-receipts

[Buce]

Channel 4 apologises for Jon Snow’s ‘white people’ remark

 

Channel 4 News has apologised after its presenter Jon Snow said he had “never seen so many white people in one place”, referring to the pro-Brexit protesters who flooded the centre of London on Friday.

The 71-year-old frontman was broadcasting live from outside the Houses of Parliament when he made the unscripted remarks while wrapping up the programme.

Snow said: “It’s been the most extraordinary day. A day which has seen … I have never seen so many white people in one place, it’s an extraordinary story. There are people everywhere, there are crowds everywhere.”

The remarks drew criticism online from some viewers who described Snow’s comments as unnecessary.

In a statement, Channel 4 said: “This was an unscripted observation at the very end of a long week of fast-moving Brexit developments.

 

“Jon has covered major events such as this over a long career and this was a spontaneous comment reflecting his observation that in a London demonstration of that size, ethnic minorities seemed to be significantly under-represented. We regret any offence caused by his comment.”

The broadcasting regulator Ofcom said that it would not know until Monday how many complaints had been made about the incident. A spokesman said: “We will assess any complaints we do receive before deciding whether or not to investigate.”

[Milo]

[ealingfox]

8 hours ago, Izzy said:

Fvcks me right off does this.

 

BBC catches rogue traders selling black-market receipts

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-47756250/bbc-catches-rogue-traders-selling-black-market-receipts

 

We've had the folk on here that are self-employed etc openly admitting to cheating their taxes.

 

Tell the whole truth and nothing else.

[Izzy]

7 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

We've had the folk on here that are self-employed etc openly admitting to cheating their taxes.

 

Tell the whole truth and nothing else.

I'm self employed and wouldn't dream of cheating the system like this.

 

I guess you've either got morals and a conscience or you haven't.

[ealingfox]

6 minutes ago, Izzy said:

I'm self employed and wouldn't dream of cheating the system like this.

 

I guess you've either got morals and a conscience or you haven't.

 

Like this? Have you done it in other ways then?