Brexit!

[Carl the Llama]

Just now, Jon the Hat said:

I am fed up with reading never ending lists of potential problems with no attempt to suggest any solutions or mitigating opportunities.  People need to wake up and actually work on solutions - Brexit is happening, and pissing around arguing about it is why we are in the mess now.

If there are indeed solutions then you should have no problem detailing them and those in charge should be able to work on them regardless of what a few whiny remainers on an internet forum say.  Blame gamers voting for something they didn't understand and weren't willing to take responsibility for is why we are in this mess. 

[Donk]

11 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

I am fed up with reading never ending lists of potential problems with no attempt to suggest any solutions or mitigating opportunities.  People need to wake up and actually work on solutions - Brexit is happening, and pissing around arguing about it is why we are in the mess now.

I mean, there is one brilliant solution available to us, not sure anyones thought of it yet.

 

Would certainly cut down the never ending list of problems and the "pissing around" you describe.....

[Buce]

9 hours ago, Swan Lesta said:

Well I guess the question is...

 

Will the kids/youth of the UK register and vote? If they do we have a labour government and if they don’t we get Boris.

 

I don’t think labour will go for a GE prior to the 31st....

 

Looks like it:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/04/more-than-100000-people-apply-register-vote-youth-uk-general-election

[Nick]

36 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

I am fed up with reading never ending lists of potential problems with no attempt to suggest any solutions or mitigating opportunities.  People need to wake up and actually work on solutions - Brexit is happening, and pissing around arguing about it is why we are in the mess now.

Personally I accepted Brexit was happening a long time ago and with a deal and a lot more prep than has been done already it’ll likely be okay or at least will be what it will be. I don’t want it or agree with it but hey ho, I lost the vote.

 

I also accepted a long time ago that TM stupidly gave up her two greatest bargaining chips and Boris needs them both to have a hope of changing the deal.

 

I also accepted though that Boris wants a hard Brexit - he has no ideas to sort the backstop issue, just to get rid of it which the EU will never agree to and rightly so.

 

I therefore also accept that Boris and the hard right of the Torries will happily lead us into no deal. And that’s the bit that’s absolutely batshit stupid as they have no real ‘solutions’ which you speak of punting to be in place or any realistic time to put them in place to prevent risk of serious economic and welfare related harm being caused by a no deal.

 

[Buce]

Boris Johnson's Tory Government refuses to reveal estimated poverty levels under Brexit

'Not in public interest...' says DWP.

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/17873264.boris-johnson-39-s-tory-government-refuses-reveal-poverty-levels-brexit/

 

Maybe one of the Tories on here can expalin how it's not in the public interest for us to know?

[Jon the Hat]

47 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

If there are indeed solutions then you should have no problem detailing them and those in charge should be able to work on them regardless of what a few whiny remainers on an internet forum say.  Blame gamers voting for something they didn't understand and weren't willing to take responsibility for is why we are in this mess. 

Everything has a solution.  Such negativity!  I don't have them all, but we are nation of problem solvers!

[Buce]

No-deal Brexit will bring food shortages despite assurances, supermarkets warn

 

Retailers have warned that there will be shortages of fresh food coupled with potential price rises if there is a no-deal Brexit.

The body representing supermarkets and other chains told MPs that they could not understand why Michael Gove had claimed otherwise in a BBC interview over the weekend.

Fresh food travelling into the UK from the EU will not be subject to checks, but delays caused by checks on the French side could mean perishables such as tomatoes, lettuce, cabbage, cauliflower and cheese could all be hit by delays.

“It will affect fresh food in various ways, availability, shelf life and potentially cost,” said Andrew Opie, the director of food and sustainability of the British Retail Consortium.

 

“Our assessment is based on discussion with our members, who move fresh food every day, and the likely disruption [in Dover and Calais],” he told MPs on the Brexit select committee.

“We modelled that with our members who have told us there will be disruption to fresh food.”

He said the original March Brexit date was bad, but October was “probably the worst time to face a no-deal Brexit” with stockpiling capacity limited because warehouses would have long been booked up for Christmas stock.

“Logistics are already at full stretch, warehousing is at full premium,” he told MPs.

Opie said the consortium had warned the government and every MP of the risks as far back as January.

He also warned that there was a basic infrastructure problem, with a shortage of the heat-treated wooden pallets required by the EU to move fresh food across the border.

Asked if the government was stockpiling pallets, Opie said no, but they had been told that talks were under way with manufacturers to produce more.

The MPs said the French authorities had told them that truck drivers could be delayed for up to eight hours in Calais if they did not have the right paperwork.

The committee also heard that Calais and Eurotunnel ports would be “clogged up” in a no-deal Brexit, even in the best-case scenario.

Karen Wheeler, former head of Brexit border delivery at HMRC, said even if 80% of trucks got through the Dover and Folkestone to Calais routes by ferry or train, there would be an issue.

She said in June HMRC assessed that about 50% of trucks could turn up at the port without the correct paperwork for export.

She revealed that the French authorities had told HMRC that they “might hold those trucks for between two and eight hours” if they did not have the correct customs declarations documents.

Many small businesses “might still leave it to the wire to prepare” and would be caught out.

Applying for a special EORI number for exporting to the UK would take “two minutes” but the real issue was the customs declaration itself.

It was typically so complex that businesses hire a customs agent to help them deal with the thousands of commodity codes and rules of origin, Wheeler told MPs. “Not something that Joe Bloggs would normally be able to do.”

Even in the best case where there was no delay – with 70-80% of trucks getting through customs easily – “you would still get delays under those circumstances because 20% of the 10,000 trucks a day would still cause Calais and Eurotunnel to clog up,” she said.

[Buce]

MPs give bill to stop no-deal Brexit second reading by majority of 29

MPs have voted to give the bill to stop a no-deal Brexit on 31 October a second reading by 329 votes to 300 - a majority of 29.

That majority is two bigger than the one last night (when the SO24 motion was passed by 328 votes to 301).

[Guest Fktf]

54 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

I am fed up with reading never ending lists of potential problems with no attempt to suggest any solutions or mitigating opportunities.  People need to wake up and actually work on solutions - Brexit is happening, and pissing around arguing about it is why we are in the mess now.

This I blame on the EU (I think they were the ones that insisted on the divorce bill before the trade negotiations?). The uncertainty about what might happen to the country is scary, hence we're seeing another bill to delay. What we could have done is negotiated the divorce bill first, and then moved straight onto the numerous trade deals that need negotiating - taking the time to deal with the endless list of problems you mention. The Brexit vote in commons would then be based on the transition from where we are now to our new relationship with the EU, in its entirety. How good or bad Brexit would turn out would be much clearer to understand. 

 

Perhaps there's some reason why this isn't feasible. But it seems to me that it has been the uncertainty of what will happen to us in the future that has crippled any sort of progress.

[hackneyfox]

1 hour ago, Jon the Hat said:

I am fed up with reading never ending lists of potential problems with no attempt to suggest any solutions or mitigating opportunities.  People need to wake up and actually work on solutions - Brexit is happening, and pissing around arguing about it is why we are in the mess now.

So your solution is to say 'it doesn't exist'?

Are you an ostrich/unicorn?

 

That's on a par with Johnson's claim that if we ll believe it will happen.

[yorkie1999]

21 minutes ago, Buce said:

No-deal Brexit will bring food shortages despite assurances, supermarkets warn

 

Retailers have warned that there will be shortages of fresh food coupled with potential price rises if there is a no-deal Brexit.

The body representing supermarkets and other chains told MPs that they could not understand why Michael Gove had claimed otherwise in a BBC interview over the weekend.

Fresh food travelling into the UK from the EU will not be subject to checks, but delays caused by checks on the French side could mean perishables such as tomatoes, lettuce, cabbage, cauliflower and cheese could all be hit by delays.

“It will affect fresh food in various ways, availability, shelf life and potentially cost,” said Andrew Opie, the director of food and sustainability of the British Retail Consortium.

 

“Our assessment is based on discussion with our members, who move fresh food every day, and the likely disruption [in Dover and Calais],” he told MPs on the Brexit select committee.

“We modelled that with our members who have told us there will be disruption to fresh food.”

He said the original March Brexit date was bad, but October was “probably the worst time to face a no-deal Brexit” with stockpiling capacity limited because warehouses would have long been booked up for Christmas stock.

“Logistics are already at full stretch, warehousing is at full premium,” he told MPs.

Opie said the consortium had warned the government and every MP of the risks as far back as January.

He also warned that there was a basic infrastructure problem, with a shortage of the heat-treated wooden pallets required by the EU to move fresh food across the border.

Asked if the government was stockpiling pallets, Opie said no, but they had been told that talks were under way with manufacturers to produce more.

The MPs said the French authorities had told them that truck drivers could be delayed for up to eight hours in Calais if they did not have the right paperwork.

The committee also heard that Calais and Eurotunnel ports would be “clogged up” in a no-deal Brexit, even in the best-case scenario.

Karen Wheeler, former head of Brexit border delivery at HMRC, said even if 80% of trucks got through the Dover and Folkestone to Calais routes by ferry or train, there would be an issue.

She said in June HMRC assessed that about 50% of trucks could turn up at the port without the correct paperwork for export.

She revealed that the French authorities had told HMRC that they “might hold those trucks for between two and eight hours” if they did not have the correct customs declarations documents.

Many small businesses “might still leave it to the wire to prepare” and would be caught out.

Applying for a special EORI number for exporting to the UK would take “two minutes” but the real issue was the customs declaration itself.

It was typically so complex that businesses hire a customs agent to help them deal with the thousands of commodity codes and rules of origin, Wheeler told MPs. “Not something that Joe Bloggs would normally be able to do.”

Even in the best case where there was no delay – with 70-80% of trucks getting through customs easily – “you would still get delays under those circumstances because 20% of the 10,000 trucks a day would still cause Calais and Eurotunnel to clog up,” she said.

This is what i'd be more concerned about than anything else. If the French do one thing well then it's holding others to ransom to get their own way, You want those tomatoes? well you'd better open up all your waters so we can nick your fish or they can lie there rotting.

[Innovindil]

33 minutes ago, Buce said:

The body representing supermarkets and other chains told MPs that they could not understand why Michael Gove had claimed otherwise

Maybe because he's getting conflicting reports?

 

Christian Dufermont, who heads Eurotunnel’s freight operations, which sends up to 7,000 lorries a day under the Channel, is also an optimist — and predicts that the lorry drivers’ Halloween night experience will be more treat than trick.

“We are well prepared. We have worked very hard over the past 2½ years with HM Revenue & Customs and the douane [French customs],” he said. “We are as ready as can be.”

Dufermont believes that some without adequate documents could make it through and be stopped in Calais, leading to delays while more checks are made but expects such teething troubles to fade so that “after a couple of weeks or months it will be as it is today”.

Hundreds of extra parking places have nevertheless been added in the complex, allowing it to accommodate up to 900 lorries without affecting other traffic.

“The risk is limited,” Dufermont said. “There is a big fear of blockades and queue on motorways but when you understand how it works, you see it may never be the case.”

Officials at the nearby port, from which ferries carrying passengers and cargo head for Dover, are equally confident. Jean-Marc Puissesseau, president of Port Boulogne Calais, has dismissed talk of post-Brexit chaos on the border as “la bullshit”.

[Benguin]

No ifs, no buts. 31st October, come what may, we are leaving. Hallelujah

[Buce]

6 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

Maybe because he's getting conflicting reports?

 

Christian Dufermont, who heads Eurotunnel’s freight operations, which sends up to 7,000 lorries a day under the Channel, is also an optimist — and predicts that the lorry drivers’ Halloween night experience will be more treat than trick.

“We are well prepared. We have worked very hard over the past 2½ years with HM Revenue & Customs and the douane [French customs],” he said. “We are as ready as can be.”

Dufermont believes that some without adequate documents could make it through and be stopped in Calais, leading to delays while more checks are made but expects such teething troubles to fade so that “after a couple of weeks or months it will be as it is today”.

Hundreds of extra parking places have nevertheless been added in the complex, allowing it to accommodate up to 900 lorries without affecting other traffic.

“The risk is limited,” Dufermont said. “There is a big fear of blockades and queue on motorways but when you understand how it works, you see it may never be the case.”

Officials at the nearby port, from which ferries carrying passengers and cargo head for Dover, are equally confident. Jean-Marc Puissesseau, president of Port Boulogne Calais, has dismissed talk of post-Brexit chaos on the border as “la bullshit”.

 

"After a couple of weeks... or months"

 

Not really very reassuring, is it?

[yorkie1999]

The answer to all thee customs problems is to have big bar-codes on top of the lorries and massive scanners they drive through, then a few coppers up the road nicking any thing dodgy. That would also have got rid of the need for a hard border in Ireland as well. What do i know though, i'm just employed to come up with technological solutions!

[Innovindil]

3 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

"After a couple of weeks... or months"

 

Not really very reassuring, is it?

Dunno man, we're as ready as we can get seems a bit more reassuring than OMG THE ****ING SKY IS FALLING, ZEUS IS MAD AT US.

 

I could just be forever an optimist I guess.

[Wymsey]

https://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/news/local-news/cautious-dunelms-warning-over-brexit-3283560

 

Which type of business/industry would thrive during the Brexit era?

 

The 'b'-word might lead to an increase in small businesses, such as some traders and the like, which could help local economies.

Edited 4 September 2019 by Wymeswold fox

[Buce]

31 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

The answer to all thee customs problems is to have big bar-codes on top of the lorries and massive scanners they drive through, then a few coppers up the road nicking any thing dodgy. That would also have got rid of the need for a hard border in Ireland as well. What do i know though, i'm just employed to come up with technological solutions!

 

Disturbingly, that's probably a better idea than any of our politicians will ever come up with.

 

#voteyorkie

[UniFox21]

 

This has probably been posted already, but absolutely brilliant speech here. What he says is fully true.

 

But I can't be the only one to see the irony in Corbyn sharing this given his close association of antisemitism in the labour party?

[StanSP]

6 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

Disturbingly, that's probably a better idea than any of our politicians will ever come up with.

 

#voteyorkie

Can women vote for him ? 

[StanSP]

Just now, UniFox21 said:

 

This has probably been posted already, but absolutely brilliant speech here. What he says is fully true.

 

But I can't be the only one to see the irony in Corbyn sharing this given his close association of antisemitism in the labour party?

Irony or not, it was fantastically put and the right time to challenge Boris. Public platform, first questions to Boris put him under pressure. I wholeheartedly agree with what he questioned Boris on as well. My parents were treated the same as to what he alludes to when talking about his childhood. It still goes on now with kids these days. 

 

Boris' comments and insensitive remarks in no way help eradicate the prejudices that loads of ethnic minority children feel these days. Especially being in a position of power, Boris should know better. The Islamophobia isn't even the end of it. The comments about piccaninnies & watermelon smiles to name a couple of others. 

[UniFox21]

2 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Irony or not, it was fantastically put and the right time to challenge Boris. Public platform, first questions to Boris put him under pressure. I wholeheartedly agree with what he questioned Boris on as well. My parents were treated the same as to what he alludes to when talking about his childhood. It still goes on now with kids these days. 

 

Boris' comments and insensitive remarks in no way help eradicate the prejudices that loads of ethnic minority children feel these days. Especially being in a position of power, Boris should know better. The Islamophobia isn't even the end of it. The comments about piccaninnies & watermelon smiles to name a couple of others. 

I fully agree with you.

The spike we see in the current era is absolutely ridiculous, in 2019 we should not be seeing the amount of racism we do. Boris, as currently the political leader of the country, needs to come out hold his hands up and start to set some serious boundaries and punishments. 

 

 

[Buce]

7 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Can women vote for him ? 

 

 

2 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Irony or not, it was fantastically put and the right time to challenge Boris. Public platform, first questions to Boris put him under pressure. I wholeheartedly agree with what he questioned Boris on as well. My parents were treated the same as to what he alludes to when talking about his childhood. It still goes on now with kids these days. 

 

Boris' comments and insensitive remarks in no way help eradicate the prejudices that loads of ethnic minority children feel these days. Especially being in a position of power, Boris should know better. The Islamophobia isn't even the end of it. The comments about piccaninnies & watermelon smiles to name a couple of others. 

 

None of that should surprise you, Stan - you're talking about a man who wrote this (about Africa):

 

"The problem is not that we were once in charge, but that we are not in charge any more... Consider Uganda, pearl of Africa, as an example of the British record. … the British planted coffee and cotton and tobacco, and they were broadly right... If left to their own devices, the natives would rely on nothing but the instant carbohydrate gratification of the plantain. You never saw a place so abounding in bananas: great green barrel-sized bunches, off to be turned into matooke. Though this dish (basically fried banana) was greatly relished by Idi Amin, the colonists correctly saw that the export market was limited... The best fate for Africa would be if the old colonial powers, or their citizens, scrambled once again in her direction; on the understanding that this time they will not be asked to feel guilty."

[Lionator]

1 hour ago, Benguin said:

No ifs, no buts. 31st October, come what may, we are leaving. Hallelujah

Not now we're not. Hallelujah. 

 

Boris having to go back to the EU to ask for a further extension is going to be one of the sweetest things in British Political history. 

[Beechey]