Coronavirus Thread

[Jon the Hat]

12 minutes ago, dsr-burnley said:

As long as it's only temporary I can accept, if not agree, the point.  When you said "the world has changed" I assumed you meant permanently.

 

Of course, the obvious next question was how long we wait for the vaccine.  Back in April, they were hoping for October.  Now it's October, they're hoping for spring.  We don't seem to be getting closer.

How about people who are worried about the virus stay at home, and everyone else gets on with their life?  

[Col city fan]

Those willy pullers last night in Scouse land deserve everything that’s coming imo

The problem is it’ll affect us all

Lock down looms because, in part, people are fookin idiots

[SpacedX]

1 minute ago, dsr-burnley said:

As long as it's only temporary I can accept, if not agree, the point.  When you said "the world has changed" I assume you meant permanently.

 

Of course, the obvious next question was how long we wait for the vaccine.  Back in April, they were hoping for October.  Now it's October, they're hoping for spring.  We don't seem to be getting closer.

Sorry, I should have clarified. But in many respects, perhaps the world has changed permanently in a positive way - for example recognition that the curtailment of the burning fossil fuels has resulted in the improvement in air quality worldwide and that thousands of premature deaths can be avoided. For the horrendous toll that this has taken on mental health and individual livelihoods, globally, we have certainly been afforded the opportunity to revaluate our perspectives on life, our priorities, and the usher in new possibilities for how our society can function engendering greater awareness of social and community responsibility. Crisis moments also present opportunity: more sophisticated and flexible use of technology, less polarisation, a renewed appreciation for the outdoors and our vulnerability as a species. 

 

Also - although borderline panglossian on my part - contrary to some of the absurd posts on this thread, the global pandemic has already forced many people back to accepting that expertise actually matters. My wildest hope is that mainstream America will orient back toward the notion that politics is a serious business - having elevated a reality TV star to the presidency as a populist attack on the bureaucracy and expertise that enables the government function on a day to day basis. The colossal failure of the Trump administration both to keep Americans healthy and to slow the pandemic-driven implosion of the economy, and the sheer arrogant, complacent idiocy surrounding the circumstances of the recent outbreak in the Whitehouse might shock the public enough back to insisting on something from government other than emotional satisfaction. 

[filbertway]

3 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

Those willy pullers last night in Scouse land deserve everything that’s coming imo

The problem is it’ll affect us all

Lock down looms because, in part, people are fookin idiots

And mainly because it's a virus that doesn't even register with 80% of people it touches

[SpacedX]

12 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

How about people who are worried about the virus stay at home, and everyone else gets on with their life?  

Genius!!! Let the British Public decide for themselves - or rather, social media to tell them what to do...what on earth could go wrong with that?

 

Which reminds me, I haven't visited the Brexit thread for a while. 

[ealingfox]

10 minutes ago, Line-X said:

Sorry, I should have clarified. But in many respects, perhaps the world has changed permanently in a positive way - for example recognition that the curtailment of the burning fossil fuels has resulted in the improvement in air quality worldwide and that thousands of premature deaths can be avoided. For the horrendous toll that this has taken on mental health and individual livelihoods, globally, we have certainly been afforded the opportunity to revaluate our perspectives on life, our priorities, and the usher in new possibilities for how our society can function engendering greater awareness of social and community responsibility. Crisis moments also present opportunity: more sophisticated and flexible use of technology, less polarisation, a renewed appreciation for the outdoors and our vulnerability as a species. 

 

Also - although borderline panglossian on my part - contrary to some of the absurd posts on this thread, the global pandemic has already forced many people back to accepting that expertise actually matters. My wildest hope is that mainstream America will orient back toward the notion that politics is a serious business - having elevated a reality TV star to the presidency as a populist attack on the bureaucracy and expertise that enables the government function on a day to day basis. The colossal failure of the Trump administration both to keep Americans healthy and to slow the pandemic-driven implosion of the economy, and the sheer arrogant, complacent idiocy surrounding the circumstances of the recent outbreak in the Whitehouse might shock the public enough back to insisting on something from government other than emotional satisfaction. 

 

Looking at the way our own country has gone and is still going, I wouldn't hold your breath.

[SpacedX]

3 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

Looking at the way our own country has gone and is still going, I wouldn't hold your breath.

I'm sorry to say that I'm inclined to agree. 

[Jon the Hat]

14 minutes ago, Line-X said:

Genius!!! Let the British Public decide for themselves - or rather, social media to tell them what to do...what on earth could go wrong with that?

 

Which reminds me, I haven't visited the Brexit thread for a while. 

Well letting the government decide has apparently led to us being pretty much the worst country in the world for Covid impact, so anything is worth a try.  Personally I tend to trust in people when they are asked to take responsibility for themselves, but I know a lot of people like to think everyone else is too stupid to make decisions.

[SpacedX]

2 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

Well letting the government decide has apparently led to us being pretty much the worst country in the world for Covid impact, so anything is worth a try.  Personally I tend to trust in people when they are asked to take responsibility for themselves, but I know a lot of people like to think everyone else is too stupid to make decisions.

Do you think that if asked to "take responsibility for themselves" people invariably know what's best for them? Do you think that upon the removal of restrictions people were necessarily behaving responsibly?  

 

The government has handled communication during this crisis very poorly - no doubt. However, all evidence suggests that the current crisis is a result of a premature relaxation of restrictions. In response to the rising rates of infection and a death rate that threatened to double by November, SAGE urgently recommended a 'circuit breaker' lockdown which the government resisted, prioritising the health of the economy and wishing to avoid a populist backlash. Do you agree with their course of action? 

 

Would you prefer to listen to the British Public or an entire branches of known evidence based Biomedical science? 

Edited 14 October 2020 by Line-X

[Wymsey]

Another 137 have died from the virus, according to the Government's national statistics. 

[FoxesDeb]

46 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

How about people who are worried about the virus stay at home, and everyone else gets on with their life?  

Great idea, not sure why I didn't think of that myself. I look forward to your suggestions of how vulnerable parents with school age children can do that. Or vulnerable people who have to go out to work, especially those on the front line. Or vulnerable people with spouses who have to go out to work. That would be a start, I'm sure there are plenty more.

[StanSP]

I know some won't like this but it made me laugh. 

Oh well. 

 

[Nalis]

18 minutes ago, Wymsey said:

Another 137 have died from the virus, according to the Government's national statistics. 

As morbid as it sounds, I've accepted things are going to be really shit from a deaths / hospitalisations / lockdown perspective until spring or a vaccine, spring will be sooner4 if we are being realistic.

 

Going to try to enjoy things within the realms of what I can do between now and then and try not worry too much about what I can't control.

Edited 14 October 2020 by Nalis

[Nalis]

1 minute ago, StanSP said:

I know some won't like this but it made me laugh. 

Oh well. 

 

I heard they sell a lot of bitter and no spirits.

[Stivo]

20 minutes ago, Nalis said:

As morbid as it sounds, I've accepted things are going to be really shit from a deaths / hospitalisations / lockdown perspective until spring or a vaccine, spring will be sooner4 if we are being realistic.

 

Going to try to enjoy things within the realms of what I can do between now and then and try not worry too much about what I can't control.

According to the FT the trials typically need 150 or so of the 30K or so participants to catch Covid 19 in order to determine if the vaccine works.   At the current rates they must know soon I would have thought.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/e5012891-58da-4a4f-8a05-182adf3ba0e2

 

 

[Kingleicester]

1 hour ago, Col city fan said:

Those willy pullers last night in Scouse land deserve everything that’s coming imo

The problem is it’ll affect us all

Lock down looms because, in part, people are fookin idiots

Expect nothing less from that city 

[Stevosevic]

40 minutes ago, Stivo said:

According to the FT the trials typically need 150 or so of the 30K or so participants to catch Covid 19 in order to determine if the vaccine works.   At the current rates they must know soon I would have thought.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/e5012891-58da-4a4f-8a05-182adf3ba0e2

 

 

The expected result is expected in November. 

 

Then it's a case of having to roll it out...will take a while.

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

5 hours ago, Line-X said:

Quite possibly and maybe beyond. We are living with a global pandemic which will very likely become endemic and require periodic vaccination. Until we have a vaccine, then expect this disruption to continue. Even then, it is unlikely to be fully effective. A partially effective vaccine is preferable to no vaccine at all. The annual flu vaccination is only 50% effective, but it plays a huge part in reducing the clinical impacts of flu in the population. 

 

Accept that the world as you knew it has changed and be prepared to change with it. 

People have to have a life worth living, a lot of the pleasures in life have been stripped away. I’m lucky enough to still have both my parents (they’re in their late 70’s) and I’ve not stepped foot in their house since March, I’ve had a cuppa in their garden but that’s not going to be an option now we are entering the autumn/winter period.
This new world which we need to accept will be one of loneliness for some, limited interactions with loved ones and social activities curtailed.

[Chrysalis]

I have just read the document linked to in the tweet, the url is a uk gov site, so this seems an official document.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/925856/S0770_NPIs_table__pivot_.pdf

 

It states a full national lockdown as a possibility, lists the pros and cons of it.
Interestingly though it states a circuit breaker is planned. and also lists the pros and cons, and states the earlier its done the better it will work.

Some other things listed are alternate working weeks, and Mass school closure to prevent community transmission as a separate action without a national lockdown, this also includes a secondary schools only lockdown as it is believed the spread amongst primary and younger is less.
There is reactive school closures listed, which is kind of a local lockdown style closing of schools, so only closing schools with high transmission rates.
Part time schooling is mentioned, alternating weeks.
Closure of further education.
Closure of higher education (uni level)
Restrict use of public transport to key workers.

I didnt mentioned actions already mentioned such as mixinf of households, and closure of pubs.

 

Most of the things listed have an impact rating of lower than R 0.2, the only one's above that were schools, so it looks grim. Activities outside have a very low impact of spread, this is now recognised, shopping now that masks is required is considered very low risk as well.

 

I think given Boris has said nothing is ruled out and the contents of this document, some kind of education action is now inevitable, unless we very soon get a sudden drop of hospital cases.

[SpacedX]

12 minutes ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

People have to have a life worth living, a lot of the pleasures in life have been stripped away. I’m lucky enough to still have both my parents (they’re in their late 70’s) and I’ve not stepped foot in their house since March, I’ve had a cuppa in their garden but that’s not going to be an option now we are entering the autumn/winter period.
This new world which we need to accept will be one of loneliness for some, limited interactions with loved ones and social activities curtailed.

I'm afraid that you may well be right, but acceptance of this in the short term will hasten our return to normality. 

[FoxesDeb]

26 minutes ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

People have to have a life worth living, a lot of the pleasures in life have been stripped away. I’m lucky enough to still have both my parents (they’re in their late 70’s) and I’ve not stepped foot in their house since March, I’ve had a cuppa in their garden but that’s not going to be an option now we are entering the autumn/winter period.
This new world which we need to accept will be one of loneliness for some, limited interactions with loved ones and social activities curtailed.

I think you are probably right, and I'm interested to know what you think the alternatives are?

[Costock_Fox]

There was an article on Sky news earlier talking about the vaccine and worrying she was saying even if the virus doesn’t give immunity but helps the symptoms it’s better than nothing. Hopefully not setting expectations.

[Legend_in_blue]

The poor use of illustrative data continues into another day on the BBC...

 

 

We'll title it a prediction but then call it an illustration and not a prediction in the small print though.

[RowlattsFox]

Manchester and Lancashire likely to be added to tier 3, probably tomorrow. So Andy Burnham spent weeks moaning about closing hospitality to then suggesting they need to go into tier 3 

[st albans fox]

30 minutes ago, RowlattsFox said:

Manchester and Lancashire likely to be added to tier 3, probably tomorrow. So Andy Burnham spent weeks moaning about closing hospitality to then suggesting they need to go into tier 3 

he didn’t realise that a high level lockdown meant most pubs would stay open ......

 

infact, because he doesn’t go to a gym, bookie or casino, he isn’t bothered !