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filbertway

Coronavirus Thread

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Something that I find head scratching disappointing is the lack of innovative thinking when it comes to the organisations for what the government manage. 
 

Like surely this academic year could have been altered in this calendar? Why not have a six week holiday within the winter months? Then have the summer with kids in attendance. Summer when there are less illnesses about and it’s easier to adapt classrooms with ventilation? 
 

It goes back to the point about managing expectations. As a project manager occasionally on construction, you’ll tell a client not to expect work to be completed/or opened for say another month than you actually think it can happen. Equally though you have to ensure the pressure is maintained as well on your builder - you play the balance of it. 
 

Equally when you run a project, you can see the icebergs coming. Through experience you learn that it’s better for you to find out about them rather than just plain ignorance for acting with reactively.
 

Each time it seems like we have another obstacle or hump in the road (ie the vaccination programme), it appears that rather than anticipate and plan - the govt wait and wait and wait until it’s staring them in the face to act. 
 

In fact one of the few actions where that occurred was the hospitality furlough until April 2021. But it won’t be that what kills those business, it will be the rent holiday they’ve granted to stop landlords claiming back rents. Come March, they will be nearly a years rent for some businesses to pay up!

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I went to a National Trust place today (which we were apparently allowed to visit as it is also in a tier 4 area, I don't make the rules) and given that we were outside the entire time and I don't think they were insisting on it, I was astonished by the level of mask wearing among the visitors - it was close to 100%; far higher than I'd see if I went to the supermarket

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37 minutes ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

All London primary schools to remain closed at the normal start of term.

Might as well do it for the rest of the county a few extra weeks to try calm things down and like others have said take a few weeks holiday from other places to make up for it 

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5 hours ago, Sly said:

My wife and I had a discussion on our daughter returning to primary school today. 
 

The reality is, we both work from home full time, rarely leave the house now other than for exercise and drop her at school. 
 

We stand very little chance of catching it, other than from her. They struggle to keep children separated (albeit they’re in a bubble). However these children are mixing with other people externally, we can’t guarantee she won’t get it.  

There is a chance you catch it from your daughter, but there is thousands of people that  may catch it and give it to others too. Doctors, nurses, teachers, footballers, people who work in supermarkets etc etc. Then there are those that ignore the rules that will pass it on.

 

In my opinion we have to try and keep children in education, keep as many people working as much as possible and it’s just a balancing act rather than keeping everyone 100% safe.

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1 hour ago, Nod.E said:

Spot on.

 

What's the point locking everything down and making life a misery for everyone while also keeping schools open? Absolute waste of time and results in the worst of both worlds. 

 

If everything was locked down, including schools, less people would be dying and we might stand a chance of stopping the spread.

 

If nothing was locked down, well at least the economy wouldn't be struggling as much and life wouldn't be miserable for everyone.

 

There is absolutely zero point in half measures, especially where schools are concerned. There is no social distancing and all school children end up back at a house with adults and so, shock, it spreads.

 

It's mind-numbingly obvious, isn't it?

 

 

I don’t think it’s that black and white. Full measures cost too much, no measures mean more deaths and implications on the health service. So it’s half measures. Keep kids in school means people can work. The government know there are risks in sending kids to school, but the costs of full lockdown will mean people in there 20’s, 30’s and 40’s will be paying for this for the rest of their working lives. It’s just a balancing act between keeping the economy going and keeping the health service going, and they will put in whatever measures they want to balance it all out. 
They say it’s about saving lives, but it’s not. It’s about balance but they can’t say that as they will appear brutal. 
 

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17 minutes ago, Md9 said:

Also surely all tiers should have the same so if London is tier 4 and schools are shit should be the same for everyone in tier 4 and they asses any one in tiers below to see if its possible to open at this time. 

I'm sure not all schools in London are shit. ;)

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5 hours ago, Costock_Fox said:

Should have got non Covid stuff at the nightingales.

That doesnt help.  It isnt a shortage of beds, it's a shortage of staff.   If you moved all the non-covid patients out of hospitals you'd have hospitals with no staff.  You cant conjure up nursing staff from nowhere.  The original point was that army medics were "being trained up" for Nightingales.  They would provide the bottom end care provided by health care assistants.  They still need skilled and trained nurses.  They tried looking at recently retired staff, it worked a bit, but ran out of non-covid wards for them to work on, putting nurses that are over 55 on covid wards wasnt the brightest idea. 

 

They also reallocated other staff - school nurses etc.  

 

Bed capacity has increased massively over the last few months, but staffing levels are being stretched.

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4 hours ago, pleatout said:

That doesnt help.  It isnt a shortage of beds, it's a shortage of staff.   If you moved all the non-covid patients out of hospitals you'd have hospitals with no staff.  You cant conjure up nursing staff from nowhere.  The original point was that army medics were "being trained up" for Nightingales.  They would provide the bottom end care provided by health care assistants.  They still need skilled and trained nurses.  They tried looking at recently retired staff, it worked a bit, but ran out of non-covid wards for them to work on, putting nurses that are over 55 on covid wards wasnt the brightest idea. 

 

They also reallocated other staff - school nurses etc.  

 

Bed capacity has increased massively over the last few months, but staffing levels are being stretched.

It would help if they actually brought back the retired staff that wanted to go back and manned these with them for much less serious situations.

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35 minutes ago, Bellend Sebastian said:

I'm almost impressed by the energy behind the Leicester public's desperation to party that led to the Old Bill dishing out 75 COVID fines over New Year, including SIX of the maximum £10,000 fines for gatherings over 30 people.

 

Relatively difficult to have 30 plus folk round without people noticing, and it's not like nobody else has ever been fined, is it?


Fcking madness.

 

How can you be that desperate for a social ffs.

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4 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Does this worry anyone else?! 

 

It's not been proven mixing vaccines work and is this just another way to get around lack of organisation and accessing the 2nd dose of the same vaccine? 

JCVI advises that the second vaccine dose should be with the same vaccine as for the first dose. Switching between vaccines or missing the second dose is not advised as this may affect the duration of protection.

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/priority-groups-for-coronavirus-covid-19-vaccination-advice-from-the-jcvi-30-december-2020/joint-committee-on-vaccination-and-immunisation-advice-on-priority-groups-for-covid-19-vaccination-30-december-2020

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13 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Does this worry anyone else?! 

 

It's not been proven mixing vaccines work and is this just another way to get around lack of organisation and accessing the 2nd dose of the same vaccine? 

Without reading the article, it stinks of us not being able to guarantee a second dose of the Pfizer for those that have had their first.

 

We’re properly s**t aren’t we?

 

 

edit: re-read the tweet and it clearly says if a second dose is not available. Almost feels like this was inevitable.

Edited by Trumpet
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9 hours ago, Rob1742 said:

I don’t think it’s that black and white. Full measures cost too much, no measures mean more deaths and implications on the health service. So it’s half measures. Keep kids in school means people can work. The government know there are risks in sending kids to school, but the costs of full lockdown will mean people in there 20’s, 30’s and 40’s will be paying for this for the rest of their working lives. It’s just a balancing act between keeping the economy going and keeping the health service going, and they will put in whatever measures they want to balance it all out. 
They say it’s about saving lives, but it’s not. It’s about balance but they can’t say that as they will appear brutal. 
 

I wonder how relevant that is right now. With so many people working form home and now with most non essential retail closed, in which many parents work part time, I suspect the number of people affected in this way would be considerably lower than in normal times.

It really is about mitigating the risk of spreading the virus right now and all measures that can be taken should and that should probably mean closing schools. As I and others have said the school year could be extended just for this year into both the Easter and Summer holidays to make up for lost time.

Even locally we are about to see a tier 3 area, Rutland, take in many children from a tier 4 area, Leicestershire, mix with them at school, on the buses to school and therefore risk a more pronounced increase in infection in a tier 3 area.

There are also many people who have followed the rules, pretty much isolated themselves at home whose only risk of catching the illness is through their children going to school. Many of these are in 40 and 50 age groups of which there are a considerable number in hospital right now.

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25 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

The fact that this new strain increases R by 0.4/0.7 screws up the govt modelling 

 

they were comfortable having schools open as they could contra that risk by shutting shops and gyms etc. But this added chunk onto the R leaves them a bit buggered with their strategy....

 

They have a strategy? :o

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