Premier League 2020/21 Thread

[Hoopla10]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

You're probably right but Maddison won't be thinking like that. He's got a platform to try and win the FA Cup and get CL qualification and all the exposure and hype that comes with that. He'll possibly make the 1st cut of the squad when he names 30 players that will then get cut to 23 so he'll then need to take any chance he gets from the off. 

I honestly don't think he's in Southgate's thinking at all. The recent injury will be used as his easy excuse (along with the number of other choices) even if he does come back firing. Doesn't matter if his season stats rivals or even beats players who'll make the squad. I hope I'm wrong (for Mads if nothing else) but I don't trust Southgate being objective and doing what he said he would by choosing players on merit.

 

A lot pundits saying how good it is that Southgate has this headache of so much talent. But you know what, it'll also be the thing to nail him by if (when) he fails. Going into the competition after we won the league a lot was also said about English talent. Spurs and Leicester alone had some real threat and fire power. Vardy just missing out (by one goal?) from winning the PL golden boot spends a must win game (that we lose) basically on the bench!!!! I'll never forgive Southgate for that. 

[Sunbury Fox]

I wasn't sure that Maddison would make the squad even before this little burst from Lingard. Given the latter, however, I'd say he has very little chance at all now as Lingard will almost certainly be in the squad as he has the tournament experience that Southgate was saying will play a major factor in selection.

 

Real shame for Madders but I don't think that Southgate has ever been a fan for some reason. Even before that silly casino business, he refused to start him, even though the whole country back then was calling for his selection. Similarly, I don't think Southgate fancies Grealish. I think he views Maddison and Grealish as luxury maverick types who won't stick to a plan and structure as much as Mount. Ultimately, though, against the very best teams, you need maverick players to gain the small margins needed to win and breakdown quality defences. Problem is that Southgate is always safety first, hence reverting to 5 at the back and 2 CDMs against any half decent team. 

Edited 6 April 2021 by Sunbury Fox

[Chocolate Teapot]

14 hours ago, UniFox21 said:

https://youtu.be/sS1QEZgjMtc

 

This is an interesting watch, Neville gives actually really intelligent insight on why Trent may likely be left at home this summer and not taken to the Euros.

Obviously Carragher ruins it at the end with his inability to be impartial. 

 

But Neville raised the issues of how Trent is poor defensively due to his bombing down the field, which could be targeted. Really interesting watch tbf.

 

 

I honestly think they were trying to put on a show.

 

Some of the stuff Neville said was plain weird - Maguire being the biggest loss to the squad is laughable, and both of them included Tyrone Mings without question. Konsa is a far better player than Mings, every Villa fan would agree with that, yet he's nowhere near, and if we're honestly going into a major tournament relying on Maguire, we're finished. We have loads of right back, loads of attacking midfielders and a striker who scores a ton of goals, but the squad is ridiculously unbalanced with some major flaws. 

 

They just seemed to be on a mission to get their clip to go viral and we're being deliberately biased in my opinion to keep viewers switched on. When they talked about notable ommisions and talked Ward-Prowse, Lingard and Saka I switched off - if Ward Prowse is a notable ommision then we can hardly be talking about a golden generation.

Have very little interest in England with Southgate at the helm, he's just a corporate yes man and is obsessed about players who've come through the system. He's only reluctantly picked Grealish, and there's no chance he's picking Maddison - he'd probably default back to Lingard far more likely. It's a really uninteresting time to be an England fan.

[Hoopla10]

2 minutes ago, Sunbury Fox said:

I wasn't sure that Maddison would make the squad even before this little burst from Lingard. Given the latter, however, I'd say he has very little chance at all now as Lingard will almost certainly be in the squad as he has the tournament experience that Southgate was saying will play a major factor in selection.

Is that because you don't feel like he warrants a spot or that his name hasn't been circulating like all the others. 

[Ric Flair]

32 minutes ago, Hoopla10 said:

I honestly don't think he's in Southgate's thinking at all. The recent injury will be used as his easy excuse (along with the number of other choices) even if he does come back firing. Doesn't matter if his season stats rivals or even beats players who'll make the squad. I hope I'm wrong (for Mads if nothing else) but I don't trust Southgate being objective and doing what he said he would by choosing players on merit.

 

A lot pundits saying how good it is that Southgate has this headache of so much talent. But you know what, it'll also be the thing to nail him by if (when) he fails. Going into the competition after we won the league a lot was also said about English talent. Spurs and Leicester alone had some real threat and fire power. Vardy just missing out (by one goal?) from winning the PL golden boot spends a must win game (that we lose) basically on the bench!!!! I'll never forgive Southgate for that. 

He very much is in Southgate's thinking, but likely only reluctantly. Southgate kept coming to watch us and always had a concerned look on his face with every Maddison and Barnes goal.

 

The reality is, if a player of Barnes or Maddison's stature in the league continues to perform then he cannot leave them out of the squad, not unless several players in the same positions are performing equally as well or better. Both up to March were the best players in their position in the league in 2021 and would have been in the March squad.

 

Down to them both when fully fit to end the season in good form and put the prat I a difficult situation. Lingard may well make it easier for Southgate to leave Maddison out as he too is in obscene form in 2021 and has done it in the past for Southgate. 

[KingsX]

4 hours ago, AjcW said:

The manager is the only thing that keeps them getting Mendes players. 

 

I've said it before. The Wolves bubble when it bursts it will burst big time, as soon as Mendes gets bored and his re-sellable assets stop going for as much money he will be on to his next project.

 

Neves, Jimenez, Neto are probably the last ones he can make any cash out of, and I wouldn't be surprised to see all 3 leave this summer. 

 

It was always a short term boost for them.... lets just hope for their sake that someone has been squirreling away cash ahead of an inevitable relegation and the need to rebuild their squad into something less Portuguese. 

 

Given that Fosun (Wolves’ parent) own 20% of Gestifute (Mendes’ agency), I don’t think this argument holds water.

 

It was Fosun’s aim to get into the business of profiting from player trading well before they decided to buy a club.  They then decided to vertically integrate, and bought WWFC.

 

I don’t see how that is “boring” to Mendes, nor why Fosun would break up this clever little conglomerate.  Gestifute/Fosun get a PL showcase.  Wolves/Fosun not only get first dibs on the agency’s talent (with no independent party to negotiate high player salaries), but also effectively a kickback on the agents fee for every purchase and sale.

 

No, it doesn’t stop Wolves selling players when their value peaks -- both Mendes and Fosun profit from moving them on.  But I expect to see more promising young talent funneled Wolves’ way by Gestifute.  And maybe their next manager will be another Gestifute client? 

[UniFox21]

3 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

You're probably right but Maddison won't be thinking like that. He's got a platform to try and win the FA Cup and get CL qualification and all the exposure and hype that comes with that. He'll possibly make the 1st cut of the squad when he names 30 players that will then get cut to 23 so he'll then need to take any chance he gets from the off. 

100% Maddison can't and won't be thinking he has no chance, but from a fans view you can't see him being in the 23. I think your most recent post pretty much sums it up perfectly. Southgate has appeared to find any option to not include them, and Lingard rediscovering his ability will be a perfect reason. 

[Leicester_Loyal]

Genuinely don't even get how anyone has any interest in England anymore, it's shite.

 

Grealish is probably our best player and Southgate doesn't even play him.

[Aus Fox]

In the last 8 games + 2(hopefully) in the FA Cup Maddison needs to return to the form he was in pre injury. If he manages 7+ goals and assists taking him to 20 for the season, he becomes impossible to ignore.

Those are some pretty big numbers, but he is more than capable of them if he stays fit.

[Sunbury Fox]

1 hour ago, Hoopla10 said:

Is that because you don't feel like he warrants a spot or that his name hasn't been circulating like all the others. 

He warrants a spot but his face doesn't fit with Southgate. I have edited my earlier comment to add an explanation.

[AjcW]

1 hour ago, KingsX said:

 

Given that Fosun (Wolves’ parent) own 20% of Gestifute (Mendes’ agency), I don’t think this argument holds water.

 

It was Fosun’s aim to get into the business of profiting from player trading well before they decided to buy a club.  They then decided to vertically integrate, and bought WWFC.

 

I don’t see how that is “boring” to Mendes, nor why Fosun would break up this clever little conglomerate.  Gestifute/Fosun get a PL showcase.  Wolves/Fosun not only get first dibs on the agency’s talent (with no independent party to negotiate high player salaries), but also effectively a kickback on the agents fee for every purchase and sale.

 

No, it doesn’t stop Wolves selling players when their value peaks -- both Mendes and Fosun profit from moving them on.  But I expect to see more promising young talent funneled Wolves’ way by Gestifute.  And maybe their next manager will be another Gestifute client? 

Did not know that..... have edited  

 

 

[Gerard]

7 hours ago, Finnegan said:

 

Not for me. I've thought about this a bit but really we want Chelsea in there with us, for purely selfish reasons. 

 

We swim in the same pond as Everton and West Ham generally, we'll attract a similar level of player, we may have the same targets from time to time. Guys like Thauvin and Otavio are going to be looking at clubs about our size if they want to move to the Prem. 

 

Everton may have a bit more fame, West Ham might be in the capital, but if one of us has champions league football and the others don't it's a no brainer.

 

I appreciate wanting other underdogs to upset the apple cart but self improvement is everything for us. 

 

The window of opportunity is sliding shut. After a few crap years, United are undeniably slowly righting the ship, Chelsea have spending power back and have gotten rid of Lampard, Man City proved their wobble was just a blip which bodes well for Liverpool who will be back with a bang next year. 

 

We need our best recruitment yet over the next six or so months if we want to be competing top four again next year. A big part of that could be not sharing the spotlight. 

 

I liked this post after reading halfway through the second sentence.

 

Our real competitors are the likes of Everton and West Ham, the likes of Chelsea are a cut above (see N'Golo Kante), the only time we can compete with Chelsea is on the football pitch. I'm more than happy to see the top four places a closed shop between the big six and ourselves for as Finnegan says "purely selfish reasons".

[Sunbury Fox]

3 hours ago, Chocolate Teapot said:

I honestly think they were trying to put on a show.

 

Some of the stuff Neville said was plain weird - Maguire being the biggest loss to the squad is laughable, and both of them included Tyrone Mings without question. Konsa is a far better player than Mings, every Villa fan would agree with that, yet he's nowhere near, and if we're honestly going into a major tournament relying on Maguire, we're finished. We have loads of right back, loads of attacking midfielders and a striker who scores a ton of goals, but the squad is ridiculously unbalanced with some major flaws. 

 

They just seemed to be on a mission to get their clip to go viral and we're being deliberately biased in my opinion to keep viewers switched on. When they talked about notable ommisions and talked Ward-Prowse, Lingard and Saka I switched off - if Ward Prowse is a notable ommision then we can hardly be talking about a golden generation.

Have very little interest in England with Southgate at the helm, he's just a corporate yes man and is obsessed about players who've come through the system. He's only reluctantly picked Grealish, and there's no chance he's picking Maddison - he'd probably default back to Lingard far more likely. It's a really uninteresting time to be an England fan.

Mings gets in as the only left footed CB, if we play a 3 at the back.

 

So Neville doesn't consider either Barnes or Maddison "notable omissions" but thinks Lingard, after a month or so of good form following years of nothing, and Saka, whose figures are nowhere near as good as Barnes', are?

[Chocolate Teapot]

10 minutes ago, Sunbury Fox said:

Mings gets in as the only left footed CB, if we play a 3 at the back.

 

So Neville doesn't consider either Barnes or Maddison "notable omissions" but thinks Lingard, after a month or so of good form following years of nothing, and Saka, whose figures are nowhere near as good as Barnes', are?

I know I'm biased but I honestly couldn't get my head around it. Maddison and Barnes have been consistently playing at a high level I the pl and europa league but they're held back because they haven't got 100 u21 caps. It's so odd.

[The_77]

6 hours ago, oxtonfox said:

No. I have to disagree.  Lose next week and we're still a point ahead of them (West Ham). Then we have the run of four "winnable" games that if we can't extract a bag of points from then perhaps we're not worth the Champions League slot. 

If we lose to Southampton in the semi final I can only see that having a massive effect on the squad and perhaps then affect our performances for the rest of the season. The Southampton Cup game is a must win as any in the last 4 years. 

A win in the semifinal also makes the rest of the season a chance for each player to make his case to be selected for the final, another great source of motivation. 

[cruzFOX]

Our homegrown lads have been real unlucky with the injuries. Had they been fit all 3 of JJ, Barnes and Madders would have forced they way into southgates squad. 

[KingsX]

I think a summer to recover, and to train on the club's (rather than Southgate's) program, will be just what the doctor ordered for Maddison and Barnes.  As they keep performing in the League, they will force their way into the conversation for Qatar.

 

Plus I'll not waste time watching your country's matches on beautiful early-summer afternoons.

 

Total win-win.

[AjcW]

37 minutes ago, KingsX said:

I think a summer to recover, and to train on the club's (rather than Southgate's) program, will be just what the doctor ordered for Maddison and Barnes. 

Very inclined to agree on this.

 

The good thing for all 3 is that they're young and still have a good 6ish major tournaments left in them. 

 

Good thing for JJ is this will probably be Walker and Trippiers last (one will probably scrape into 2022) and similarly, Shaw and Chilwell need decent competition.

 

For Madders I think it's all about profiting from someone not performing on the international stage, for example Grealish or Mount flopping at a tournament.

 

For Barnes, he will be a shoe in as soon as he's back to full fitness and has done a qualification cycle with the team.

 

Also... unlike the young lads who have been fast tracked recently, there's not a great deal in the U21's/19's at the minute that stands out, so we will need to go back to relying on 'prime players' as well as the young ones who were fast tracked. 

[CosbehFox]

45 minutes ago, KingsX said:

I think a summer to recover, and to train on the club's (rather than Southgate's) program, will be just what the doctor ordered for Maddison and Barnes.  As they keep performing in the League, they will force their way into the conversation for Qatar.

 

Plus I'll not waste time watching your country's matches on beautiful early-summer afternoons.

 

Total win-win.

Totally my thoughts - quite welcome news as well that Jonny Evans will be having a summer off. 
 

There’s at least six players who spring to mind in our squad who are badly requiring a full, proper pre season. A few weeks back to their home countries, two weeks relaxing over here and then into a proper pre season 

[Fox in the North]

[Fox92]

7 minutes ago, Fox in the North said:

£351.4m on wages alone but Kevin De Bruyne and Rhodri don't understand why teams are defensive against them.

[Dahnsouff]

2 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

£351.4m on wages alone but Kevin De Bruyne and Rhodri don't understand why teams are defensive against them.

A solid gold, diamond encrusted elephant in the room. 

[Fox92]

12 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

A solid gold, diamond encrusted elephant in the room. 

Gonna admit I lost it after KDB's comments post game on Saturday. ****.

 

It turned into a Keegan rant.

[casablancas]

11 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

Gonna admit I lost it after KDB's comments post game on Saturday. ****.

 

It turned into a Keegan rant.

What was he banging on about?

[ARM1968]

Going well for Liverpool anyway. Got the away goal