Russell Martin - Confirmed as First Team Manager

[honeybradger]

1 hour ago, CornwallFox said:

I disagree. 

I think he's a good player. He may or may not be a problem as a person. Leicester fans clearly think he is. Russell Martin has seen no evidence of this and has praised his professionalism, noting his work with youngsters. That paints a very different picture to what the fans claim about him. 

I'm inclined to trust those that actually know the man.

Out of interest did you watch the game yesterday.

 

Or for that matter have you not seen the last 4 seasons of Faes.

 

He was all over the place against league 2 opposition, he might not even be good enough to play for us in league one. He is also in the conversation for our worst centre back ever.

[BenTheFox]

8 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

MK Dons were a recently promoted club when he took over mid season and kept them up. Once Martin left MK Dons, they had one season and were then relegated. Next season is going to be their first season back in League 1 since then.

 

Martin finished 10th with Swansea. In the three seasons since he left they have not finished higher.

Exactly. Graham Potter got the Brighton job in the premier league after having basically an identical season at Swansea. 

 

His overall win % has been driven down quite significantly by his time at Rangers, which admittedly was a disaster, and his 15 or so premier league games at Southampton where he had a team that was nowhere near good enough for the level. He obviously tried to implement a style at Southampton in the premier league that exposed their weaknesses more against top class opposition, but ultimately no one was keeping that team in the league. However, hopefully with what should be better players compared to the rest of the division, this hopefully won't be so much of an issue for him. His record at championship and league 1 level is respectable. 

[BenTheFox]

One step at a time people. The absolute priority is getting promoted out of this league. Do I believe that this manager has the capability to get us promoted out of this division at the first time of asking? Yes. At this moment that really is the bottom line. It doesn't matter whether we like the guy or not. 

[BlueBus]

21 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

MK Dons were a newly promoted club when he took over mid season and kept them up. Once Martin left MK Dons, they had one more season in League 1 and were then relegated. Next season is going to be their first season back in League 1 since then.

 

Martin finished 10th with Swansea. In the three seasons since he left they have not finished higher than that.

 

Win percentages are not "facts" they mean fvck all to judge a manger on as there are a range of different things to take into account such as number of games managed. I've just checked and Maresca hasthe highest win percentage of any Leicester City manager ever but he's not our greatest ever manager.

How did they do the previous 2 seasons? 

I concede that obviously the teams they manage effect win %, I know this.

 

I was just saying that other managers who have very similar circumstances, I.E the current MK Dons manager, who's managed Rotherham, Derby and MK Dons win more games on average than RM and I didn't include Rangers or Southampton in his 37% win rate in the end. 
 

[Fox92]

31 minutes ago, BlueBus said:

How did they do the previous 2 seasons? 

I concede that obviously the teams they manage effect win %, I know this.

 

I was just saying that other managers who have very similar circumstances, I.E the current MK Dons manager, who's managed Rotherham, Derby and MK Dons win more games on average than RM and I didn't include Rangers or Southampton in his 37% win rate in the end. 
 

Two previous seasons they were in the play offs under Steve Cooper, yeah. No doubt he did a great job and also benefited from his previous experience as he was able to bring in good young players on loan such as Gallagher, Guehi, Brewster, Woodman (and I know he's older but Hourihane too). 

 

But I think the bigger picture are the seasons after, not before, in which Swansea haven't improved and not finished higher than their 10th place that Martin had them. That includes Graham Potter of course who then moved onto Brighton in the Premier League.

 

The current MK Dons manager is Paul Warne. His time at Rotherham was successful so I don't doubt he has a better win percentage than Martin. I still don't think it's a good comparison of managers though.

 

At the end of the day we just want promotion from this league and I think Martin will deliver that.

[Dan]

13 hours ago, HankMarvin said:

Let’s be honest, he is a manager trying to save his own career.

His rocked up in league one with a squad that’s suffered 2 relegations and in the transfers coming in look limited.

its makes perfect sense for him to want to get the most out of a player that was just starting in Ligue 1.

Obviously it’s different for the fans, but personally I wouldn’t give a shit if it meant getting out of this shit league any quicker. 

Yeah I'm done with clean slates for nearly any this lot. They can, and will let us down.

[Lambert09]

The easiest thing Martin could do for himself is to integrate as many youth as possible. If we are a little rocky to start with, if the youth are involved I think people will be lenient.  But if we have a rocky start with bdcr, faes, hamza , Thomas and skipp the wolves will be at the door and rightfully so. 
 

a slow transition but building a team around aluko, braybrooke, page and Alves (or any of the youth taking their moment) is fine by me, as long as we see improvements each week 

 

I hate the idea that we’ll have another manager saying all the right things but week 1 the same old highest earners will be trotting around and the youths amazing opportunities that have been touted, will be late substitutions and the Johnstons paint trophy 

Edited Wednesday at 14:01 by Lambert09

[coolhandfox]

52 minutes ago, Lambert09 said:

The easiest thing Martin could do for himself is to integrate as many youth as possible. If we are a little rocky to start with, if the youth are involved I think people will be lenient.  But if we have a rocky start with bdcr, faes, hamza , Thomas and skipp the wolves will be at the door and rightfully so. 
 

a slow transition but building a team around aluko, braybrooke, page and Alves (or any of the youth taking their moment) is fine by me, as long as we see improvements each week 

 

I hate the idea that we’ll have another manager saying all the right things but week 1 the same old highest earners will be trotting around and the youths amazing opportunities that have been touted, will be late substitutions and the Johnstons paint trophy 

I think we will still see senior players leave be surprised if we still have Faes, Skipp and BCDR by the time the season kicks off. 

[Lambert09]

7 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

I think we will still see senior players leave be surprised if we still have Faes, Skipp and BCDR by the time the season kicks off. 

I hope so. I do think BCDR will  be one of the ones to stay though. 

[inckley fox]

6 hours ago, CornwallFox said:

I disagree. 

I think he's a good player. He may or may not be a problem as a person. Leicester fans clearly think he is. Russell Martin has seen no evidence of this and has praised his professionalism, noting his work with youngsters. That paints a very different picture to what the fans claim about him. 

I'm inclined to trust those that actually know the man.

Well they've all taken your stance, without exception, and paid quite the price for it. It may be old-fashioned of me, but I prefer to judge players by their performances (and his have been suspect in many, many games in the three relegations he's featured in) and actions (e.g. wanting to leave as early as his first pre-season with us, cupping his ears etc.) than by what managers with questionable track records who have spent five minutes at the club say about how great he is. On the one hand is a huge amount of evidence that he's not very good and isn't a particularly great bloke to have hanging around the place, and on the other is an extremely dubious opinion which we've heard several times in the past, and seen with our own eyes, over years, to be misguided every time.

[Les-TA-Jon]

48 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

I think we will still see senior players leave be surprised if we still have Faes, Skipp and BCDR by the time the season kicks off. 

We have 5 competitive fixtures before the window closes. Will probably be some involvement for some of the wantaway/need to sell players. 

[FLAN]

23 hours ago, coolhandfox said:

Why is that his job, his just learning the ropes as a youth coach 

He should be pointing out to any new manager what has gone before. Doesn’t say much for him if he doesn’t. Then again he’s been part of the setup for a lot of this time… gravy train 

[coolhandfox]

39 minutes ago, FLAN said:

He should be pointing out to any new manager what has gone before. Doesn’t say much for him if he doesn’t. Then again he’s been part of the setup for a lot of this time… gravy train 

How do you know he hasn't? 

[FLAN]

37 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

How do you know he hasn't? 

Fair point however the evidence suggests otherwise. Constant rotation of underperformers getting a fresh start 

[coolhandfox]

30 minutes ago, FLAN said:

Fair point however the evidence suggests otherwise. Constant rotation of underperformers getting a fresh start 

I just think we have limited options when you are trying to put out two 11's for a friendly. 

[Chelmofox]

24 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

I just think we have limited options when you are trying to put out two 11's for a friendly. 

For now, this is how i am looking at it. It could me Martin seeing how the group responded to Faes being a leader as well. 

 

Still giving the manager the benefit of the doubt. In the preseason games ive not been horrified by the time we have spent playing out the back.

[teblin]

Listening to him a couple of times now thinking he'll be ok.

 

But needs actions not words. 

[21st Century Fox]

He lives rent free on SaintsWeb.

Makes for some interesting reading, especially as they’re lurking here for quotes.

[HankMarvin]

Need some good young players coming in, if Ings signs that will be 3 players in with an average age of 32.

 

Cooper was panned for the dads army approach, let’s hope we don’t go the same direction 

[Stadt]

57 minutes ago, 21st Century Fox said:

He lives rent free on SaintsWeb.

Makes for some interesting reading, especially as they’re lurking here for quotes.

Quote

Leichampton, surely. 

Someone somewhere else pointed out that over time they've now recruited almost a quarter of the squad that they beat 9-0 (Bertrand, Vestergaard, Ings and McCarthy) plus the Head of Recruitment who helped build that squad (Glover), as well as the manager who they beat 9-1 on aggregate over the course of a season (Martin) and one of his players (Aribo). 

It's insane when you see it laid out like that. Roll on Dani Osvaldo, Giuly Do Prado and Marians Pahars

[slymunn]

45 minutes ago, HankMarvin said:

Need some good young players coming in, if Ings signs that will be 3 players in with an average age of 32.

 

Cooper was panned for the dads army approach, let’s hope we don’t go the same direction 

Before the signings today, we only have BDR who's over 28 in the squad..so its hardly the old team people like to think it is. 

 

Even including the signings (and Ings) we will only have three players over 30.

[HankMarvin]

1 minute ago, slymunn said:

Before the signings today, we only have BDR who's over 28 in the squad..so its hardly the old team people like to think it is. 

 

Even including the signings (and Ings) we will only have three players over 30.

It’s not about the squad it was always going to be a young squad more so given the benefits of being under 21 and home grown.

it’s more about the players coming in.

There is a reason we have struggled to get rid of older high earners.

 

If it’s a mixture of older and younger players coming in, great.

That doesn’t mean every purchase has to be the wrong side of 30, you would hope some of the players that are purchased have a significant resale value as they progress with the club, as opposed to relying solely on the progression of home grown players and older players that will be difficult to shift as we hopefully progress over the next few seasons.

[slymunn]

1 minute ago, HankMarvin said:

It’s not about the squad it was always going to be a young squad more so given the benefits of being under 21 and home grown.

it’s more about the players coming in.

There is a reason we have struggled to get rid of older high earners.

 

If it’s a mixture of older and younger players coming in, great.

That doesn’t mean every purchase has to be the wrong side of 30, you would hope some of the players that are purchased have a significant resale value as they progress with the club, as opposed to relying solely on the progression of home grown players and older players that will be difficult to shift as we hopefully progress over the next few seasons.

We have struggled to shift players of any age for years, or not accepted offers when they maybe should have done. its just the older ones don't have value to other teams so are less likely to be bought than Maddison for example.

The 15 or so first team players that have left for free are not just the over 30s, its the model of signings/wages the club has taken on since the prem win.

 

I would like to hope the youth are going to become the significant resale value as they progress with the club, as we have a core of a team that looks to be coming through. Sunderland re built from a similar position bringing through a lot of youth, so that would be a good place to start.

I do agree we need a couple more players in attacking positions, which I would like to be around mid twenties who are proven (big ask!)

 

[martyn]

41 minutes ago, Stadt said:

It's insane when you see it laid out like that. Roll on Dani Osvaldo, Giuly Do Prado and Marians Pahars

Pahars was a decent player tbf. Maybe replace him with Guido Carrillo.

[whoareyaaa]

Did we sign aribo or was he on loan ?