England v Bulgaria - Wembley Sat @ 5pm (ITV)

[wardyfox86]

Just now, UniFox21 said:

Mate i think you've missed the entire discussion on this.

 

Its the fact he was overlooked for Barkley, Ox and Mount. 

Today was a full strength team pretty much and he wasn't deemed good enough for it. This isn't just everyone moaning that he wasnt given minutes.

We have 180 minutes of football to play over these call-ups. Is Trippier ahead of TAA? Rose ahead of Chilwell?

 

He will get his chance, hopefully from the off, on Tuesday. Barkley had yet another chance today and didn't influence much.

 

 

[Shane]

Have no doubt Choudhury will surpass Rice, quite comfortably too.

[Countryfox]

1 minute ago, Shane said:

Have no doubt Choudhury will surpass Rice, quite comfortably too.

 

Shhhhh ...   they don’t quite realise how good he is yet ...   

[HybridFox]

10 minutes ago, Countryfox said:

 

 

Pretty sure Madders will become an England poster boy ..   just hope he’s still playing for us when that happens ..

Exactly the point. His talent is undeniable but unless you're playing for one of the "top 6", you'll always be an outsider to the England club. 

 

I guess the one way over time will be for us as a club to regularly challenge that status quo.

[reynard]

As long as our players don't get injured that is all that matters. Waste of time these matches as there are so many poor sides. Really need to weed out the weaker sides and make the pre-qualify and then play all the final qualifiers at the end of a season which would cut out these damned international breaks. Bulgaria were no better than an average pub team.

Edited 7 September 2019 by reynard

[Dan LCFC]

Not bothered Chilwell didn't play, won't gain anything playing toss like Bulgaria and he's been injured recently. Maddison was hard done to though and while I think this creativity stat is very overused there's no way on earth Mount gets on before him if the clubs are reversed. The bias as obvious as ever really.

[Tielemans63]

30 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

James Maddison:

17/18 Championship 

44 apps  (3,643 mins) 14 goals 8 assists 

18/19 Prem 

36 apps 7 goals 7 assist 

19/20 Prem 

4 games 2 assists 

 

Mason Mount:

18/19 Championship

35 apps 3,051 mins 8 goals 5 assists 

19/20 Prem 

4 apps 2 goals 

 

So Maddison got 6 goals more and 3 additional assists in his championship season, admittedly playing 9 more games. 

But Statistically was a better player, but then he also has an entire season in the Prem, scoring 7 goals and 7 assists. 

 

How Mount is getting in ahead of him is beyond me.

It's Barkley with 0 goals and 0 assists walking into the side that pisses me off most.

[Merchant_Banker]

4 hours ago, FoxyJim1987 said:

What exactly has Ross Fvcking Barkley done to justify starting. 

Gareth Southgate's love child?

 

I was disappointed that Maddison didn't start, I could even understand Mount coming on for Henderson when we were ahead, but why did he take off Sterling and Kane and leave Barkley on. He was poor all game.

[RoboFox]

Barkley, Ox and Mount played ahead of Maddison because Southgate is a yes man for the FA and more importantly, brand Premier League. It’s really that simple.

[Shane]

31 minutes ago, RoboFox said:

Barkley, Ox and Mount played ahead of Maddison because Southgate is a yes man for the FA and more importantly, brand Premier League. It’s really that simple.

I agree.. Surely the big club bias is driven by the FA. It's been a common trend not just with Southgate but also Hodgson, etc. 

[don_danbury]

would've liked the scoreline to be the other way round tbh

[foxes_rule1978]

What can I say, excellent going forward and sterling really has come on leaps and bounds. 

[Sir Shep]

1 hour ago, Izzy said:

Bloody hell. Chris Sutton isn't such a cvnt after all.

 

England 4-0 Bulgaria

Chris Sutton

Premier League winner with Blackburn on BBC Radio 5 live

I am surprised James Maddison did not start today. I think he's the best English midfield player.

 

 

 

Being right once every blue moon doesn’t stop him being a tw@ but I’d have to agree he is right and tonight the moon must be blue!

[UniFox21]

16 minutes ago, don_danbury said:

would've liked the scoreline to be the other way round tbh

Bore off mate 

 

The Brexit threads on the general chat 

[Phube]

2 hours ago, Walkers said:

Would be interested to know how Maddison's stats compare to Mount in their previous seasons in the Championship?

 

Either way there is no chance Mount gets in this England squad if he didn't play for a top 6 club, let alone coming off the bench today

 

Even Barnes’ stats piss all over Mount’s in the Championship.  And he’s not even in the squad!

[Mickyblueeyes]

Madders has done more in the last year then Ox, Mount and Barkley put together. 

 

Southgate May have got us to the WC semi but he is inept if he truly believes any of those three deserved to sit above Madders in selection. 

[Facecloth]

Jesse lingard has left the England squad, so we're a bit stronger before the Kosovo game.

[NewquayFox]

Bulgaria were absolutely useless tonight, that bloody goalkick routine, if Kasper tries that (again) I’m bringing my rifle.... 

[Dan LCFC]

4-0 was a bit flattering wasn't it really. They've given us three of those goals.

[Ric Flair]

Mount has started the season better than Maddison, no arguments at all. Hope he gets a few mins vs Kosovo otherwise he might as well become a plastic paddy.

[ealingfox]

Was a bit surprised but as said if they both play on Tuesday, although more so Maddison, I won't conclude that they're being unduly overlooked.

[Langston]

Surely Southgate uses him against Kosovo just to ensure he can't change allegiance

[Ric Flair]

I sense Southgate doesn't particularly like him, needs to prove him wrong with more goals and assists. I'm confident he will.

[UniFox21]

4 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I sense Southgate doesn't particularly like him, needs to prove him wrong with more goals and assists. I'm confident he will.

Wouldn't surprise me if he's been called up to appease people and to stop him swapping allegiances. 

[davieG]

England youngsters should get get chance to become battle-hardened in qualifiers

By Phil McNulty

Chief football writer

• 43 minutes ago
• From the sectionFootballHarry Kane scored a hat-trick against Bulgaria as England made it 42 European Champinships and World Cup qualifying games unbeaten

England face a familiar, ominous threat as their path to qualification for Euro 2020 continues to look little more than a formality - but it will not come from any of the teams they will face on the route to next summer's showpiece.

Their opponents in Group A could almost have been hand-picked for a comfortable passage by manager Gareth Southgate and the Football Association.

There is a danger, however, that lies in brushing aside such impotent opposition with monotonous regularity.

Bulgaria, ranked 60th in the world by Fifa, were dismissed 4-0 at Wembley while Kosovo, at 120th, are next up at St Mary's in Southampton on Tuesday. The Czech Republic, England's highest-rated opponents at 43rd, have already been beaten 5-0 at Wembley while Montenegro, at 55, were outclassed 5-1 on their own ground.

Not exactly glorified friendlies but hardly testing occasions either.

• England have now gone undefeated in each of their last 42 Euro and World Cup qualifying games, winning 33 and drawing nine, since the defeat by Ukraine in October 2009.

A decade without defeat in qualifying is hugely impressive but the flipside of that is the fat lot of good it has done England when it has really mattered.

England's run to the 2018 World Cup semi-final was a glorious feel-good surprise, although the perceived success has to be tempered by the fact that they were beaten on the three occasions they met a side of serious quality, namely Belgium twice and Croatia in the last four.

The abysmal World Cups of 2010 and 2014, along with the debacle of Euro 2016, meant the Russian odyssey was an exception rather than the rule.

The make-up of Group A now means England are again presented with the prospect of facing their most taxing competitive tests for two years - 12 months if we count the inaugural Uefa Nations League semi-final loss to the Netherlands - once the serious action gets under way next summer.

The notion of England not qualifying is a non-starter. This is not arrogance but a simple statement of fact. It is clear any starting line-up Southgate assembles from his squad should be good enough to ensure their place at Euro 2020 with the minimum of fuss.

It means there is actually a case for Southgate getting his squad match-hardened for Euro 2020 in the remaining qualifiers with a policy of rotation. There are plenty of promising candidates ready to step up.

 

Ross Barkley was preferred to James Maddison and Mason Mount in England's midfield

This was a relatively conservative selection by Southgate, passing over the claims of in-form pair Mason Mount from Chelsea and Leicester City's James Maddison for starting places, preferring Jordan Henderson and Declan Rice as his midfield anchor men and Chelsea's Ross Barkley further forward.

Southgate also opted for the experience of Atletico Madrid's Kieran Trippier over Liverpool youngster Trent Alexander-Arnold at right-back - despite the latter's vastly superior form over the last 12 months.

The policy cannot be criticised given a 4-0 victory that barely caused England to break sweat but there is still a good case for freshening up England with young blood at St Mary's on Tuesday.

It would not be a case of taking Kosovo lightly, simply giving England's young brigade a taste of the competitive action they will need to prepare them for what may await when sterner examinations come next summer.

Not so much experimentation, more sound common sense in readiness for the acid tests.

Leicester City's Ben Chilwell will come in for suspended Danny Rose at left-back while England's side would hardly be weakened by Alexander-Arnold's inclusion.

Mount won his first cap as a substitute and there is a case for actually playing him or Maddison rather than the extra insurance policy of both Henderson and Rice. They could certainly offer a viable alternative and serious competition to Ross Barkley, not as replacements for the future but certainly as rivals.

The good news for England and Southgate is that the current squad looks like it can bear a fair amount of rotation without seriously weakening the overall package.

England captain Harry Kane, with a hat-trick here to take his England tally to 25 goals from 40 appearances and go above 1966 World Cup final hero Sir Geoff Hurst in the all-time list of goalscorers, and Raheem Sterling are irreplaceable.

Kane, admittedly helped by a regular supply of penalties, is building a truly remarkable body of work with England.

He leads from the front in every respect, his tireless work ethic and consistency a touchstone for this modern England, while his partnership with Sterling increasingly looks like a natural, telepathic fit. Southgate has a pairing that will be the envy of many countries at Euro 2020.

Southgate also has room for manoeuvre elsewhere that hardly strips his starting XI of quality.

 

Gareth Southgate says Kieran Trippier's move to Atletico Madrid has given him "a new lease of life"

In defence, Alexander-Arnold is hardly a downgrade on Trippier in the absence of injured Aaron Wan-Bissaka and dropped Kyle Walker, while those midfield options also include Tottenham's Harry Winks.

Borussia Dortmund's 19-year-old Jadon Sancho has proved he lives comfortably at this level. He will relish more chances and the big, competitive stage.

England would not be belittling Kosovo or any of their future opponents in qualifying by shuffling their pack. It would simply be a case of seeing the bigger picture.

It is an old concern - but it may be the start of Euro 2020, when faced with the sort of forensic examinations the best teams conduct, before we find out just how good this England team is and how much progress has been made since they just came up short in the semi-finals at the World Cup and the Uefa Nations League.

England have been here before. This time they must be ready for when the serious interrogation starts next summer.