yorkie1999 Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 22 minutes ago, twoleftfeet said: I graduated from university about 6 years ago and let me relay to you what I observed on my first day the black boys sat with the black boys, the black girls sat with the black girls the white boys sat with the white boys and the white girls sat with the white boys. I as the 45 year old sat on my own initially. whilst not scientific I do think we like to be with people like us. I would like to think it wasn't for racist reasons but perhaps it was and the safety in numbers thing. Scientists have done experiments on this sort of stuff with children and although, obviously, children are not born racist, they will group together with people of their own race. It's human nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urban.spaceman Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 1 hour ago, StanSP said: Says. It. All. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53051096 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 17 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said: Sorry, not sure I get that! Just trying to understand. You originally said So are you saying we should just the statistics for recorded case rather than criminally proven cases? I think we should take unproven crimes statistics with a big pinch of salt. As they are unproven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahnsouff Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 Just now, Strokes said: I think we should take unproven crimes statistics with a big pinch of salt. As they are unproven. Ok, that is what I imagined too! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innovindil Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 5 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said: Says. It. All. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53051096 Good on the dad for slapping this knob to the police. Hate to think what my old man would do to me if he saw me doing something as shitty as that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pliskin Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 16 minutes ago, ozleicester said: I will just pop this in here... In New South Wales... 83% of INDIGENOUS people with cannabis charges go before the courts 52% of NON indigenous people with cannabis charges go before the courts Hidden racism Also... Aboriginal drivers received 3.2 times more fines from being pulled over by police than non-Aboriginal drivers. But when tickets were issued by traffic cameras, Aboriginal drivers received slightly fewer penalties on average than non-Aboriginal drivers. https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/feb/05/aboriginal-drivers-in-wa-more-likely-to-get-fines-from-police-officers-than-traffic-cameras Systemic racism My overall understanding of Australia is modest, I have never visited myself, but I have been told that the indigenous people of Australia have separate law to the rest of the country? Is this the case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanSP Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 10 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said: Says. It. All. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53051096 Typical. It's nothing to do with football fans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said: Scientists have done experiments on this sort of stuff with children and although, obviously, children are not born racist, they will group together with people of their own race. It's human nature. The good thing about human nature is that it is fact mutable, not set in stone, and can be changed given the will to learn (barring absolute red-mist fight, flight or freeze situations, which this is not). Whether people have the will to change themselves is on them and them alone and should be judged accordingly. We are, for the most part, so much more than the sum of some evolutionary instincts. Edited 15 June 2020 by leicsmac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozleicester Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 (edited) 1 minute ago, Pliskin said: My overall understanding of Australia is modest, I have never visited myself, but I have been told that the indigenous people of Australia have separate law to the rest of the country? Is this the case? Absolutely not. No, it is one law for all. edit - Well actually the racism inherent in Oz policing actually does suggest that there are two sets of rules, one where the First nations people suffer FAR more. Edited 15 June 2020 by ozleicester Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosbehFox Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 Worth mentioning to the debate there has been four governmental reviews on the subject. You can understand the frustration if so few of the recommendations have been carried out 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahnsouff Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 1 minute ago, leicsmac said: The good thing about human nature is that it is fact mutable, not set in stone, and can be changed given the will to learn (barring absolute red-mist fight, flight or freeze or fight situations, which this is not). Whether people have the will to change themselves is on them and them alone and should be judged accordingly. We are, for the most part, so much more than the sum of some evolutionary instincts. Yes, an individual human given enough knowledge and experience is quite able to make informed enlightened decisions. However, it is the power of the pack that often derails the best of intentions, especially when altered by group dynamics. I agree that individualistically we are capable of sensible, empathic choices, but as groups we are sometimes capable of its polar opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 6 minutes ago, StanSP said: Typical. It's nothing to do with football fans! Yeah but If a particular club was going to get shamed, I’m glad it’s them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 1 minute ago, Dahnsouff said: Yes, an individual human given enough knowledge and experience is quite able to make informed enlightened decisions. However, it is the power of the pack that often derails the best of intentions, especially when altered by group dynamics. I agree that individualistically we are capable of sensible, empathic choices, but as groups we are sometimes capable of its polar opposite. You'll get no disagreement from me there. But that just means the enlightened choices are more difficult as opposed to not possible, and therefore still a matter of free will and personal responsibility. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozleicester Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 Between 2014-2016, Indigenous children aged 0-4 were more than twice as likely to die than non-Indigenous children. Indigenous infant mortality was 4 times higher than the national rate. From birth, Indigenous Australians have a lower life expectancy than non-Indigenous Australians: Non-Indigenous girls born in 2010-2012 in Australia can expect to live a decade longer than Indigenous girls born the same year (84.3 years and 73.7 years respectively). The gap for men is even larger, with a 69.1 year life expectancy for Indigenous men and 79.9 years for non-Indigenous men. Indigenous women also experience approximately double the level of maternal mortality in 2016. https://australianstogether.org.au/discover/the-wound/indigenous-disadvantage-in-australia/ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiberalFox Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 1 hour ago, peach0000 said: Can I ask why you don’t support it? I am yet to see what I consider to be a valid reason for not. Yes there are valid criticisms of particular actions of individuals within the movement (vandalism/violence etc) and even some of the more extreme views of particular people claiming to represent the movement, but to completely say you don’t support a movement whose main aim is to stop racial prejudice and solve problems of racial inequality is questionable in my opinion. Probably because people see it as something different depending on perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Horse's Mouth Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 47 minutes ago, StanSP said: The sentence or what he did? The sentence mainly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 1 hour ago, twoleftfeet said: white girls sat with the white boys. ....and what does that say about the white girls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiberalFox Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 I don't agree with the prison sentence either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 40 minutes ago, StanSP said: Typical. It's nothing to do with football fans! Why even mention he was a football fan, it’s nothing to do with anything apart from the media stirring it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 13 minutes ago, LiberalFox said: I don't agree with the prison sentence either. Nor do I, he obviously wasn’t peeing on the statue for what the statue represents, He’d have been better off just peeing in the middle of the street. If your slap bang in the middle of a riot and you’re bursting, what else would you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanSP Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 4 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said: Nor do I, he obviously wasn’t peeing on the statue for what the statue represents, He’d have been better off just peeing in the middle of the street. If your slap bang in the middle of a riot and you’re bursting, what else would you do. You sound like Julia Hartley-Brewer He wasn't peeing 'on the statue'. He was 'beside' it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pliskin Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 47 minutes ago, ozleicester said: Absolutely not. No, it is one law for all. edit - Well actually the racism inherent in Oz policing actually does suggest that there are two sets of rules, one where the First nations people suffer FAR more. I see what you mean, and it further highlights the deep rooted issues that flow through all countries. I would like to think that we don’t have issues to these extents. Statistics are misleading sometimes but they offer substance to begin to looked deeper beneath the surfaces they scratch. it would appear to be two sets of rules for each when there is absolutely not. Like you alluded to earlier, systematic racism is a very real problem, even if people feel the need to say it isn’t, which is why the black lives matter movement is so, so important. This is where countries like the UK need to lead, show all other countries how to be a diverse nation. This can only be done by accepting where the issues exist and what they are. We absolutely have to come together now, and tackle this head on. Dwellling on the issue won’t solve it, acting will. Time for the UK to deliver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanSP Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach0000 Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 1 hour ago, LiberalFox said: Probably because people see it as something different depending on perspective. It is not something different though. If you’re going to claim not to support something the least people can do is stay their reasons behind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowlattsFox Posted 15 June 2020 Share Posted 15 June 2020 14 day prison sentence is a waste of resources. Doesn't change the fact he's a **** though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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