Unpopular Opinions You Hold

[RonnieTodger]

21 hours ago, Buce said:

You actually make my point very well - you're judging an entire demographic based on one incident with one set of Travellers.

Surely anybody will judge any community based on their own encounters with them?

 

It’s nice to hear that your experiences have been positive, but that doesn’t mean some Irish Travellers haven’t caused upset to other people. 
 

Sadly where I grew up, the traveller kids wreaked havoc at my school and in the local area, then subsequently became worse as they grew up. They’d get in fights and if they lost, a whole family would turn up at the gates to intimidate any kids that fought back. 
 

Of course that’s not the case for all of them, but whilst you haven’t had any issues with their community, plenty of others have. Personally, I’ve found that adults have been fine, whereas kids and teenagers have often lived up to their stereotype.

Edited 31 July 2021 by RonnieTodger

[Buce]

2 hours ago, RonnieTodger said:

Surely anybody will judge any community based on their own encounters with them?

 

It’s nice to hear that your experiences have been positive, but that doesn’t mean some Irish Travellers haven’t caused upset to other people. 
 

Sadly where I grew up, the traveller kids wreaked havoc at my school and in the local area, then subsequently became worse as they grew up. They’d get in fights and if they lost, a whole family would turn up at the gates to intimidate any kids that fought back. 
 

Of course that’s not the case for all of them, but whilst you haven’t had any issues with their community, plenty of others have. Personally, I’ve found that adults have been fine, whereas kids and teenagers have often lived up to their stereotype.

 

Not at all; why would you?

 

Assuming you self-identify as English, would you think it ok for Europeans - whose only experience of the English is having their city smashed up by drunken football fans - tarred you with the same brush?

 

I think the real problem here is that anti-traveller rhetoric is the last socially acceptable prejudice; could you imagine the response if one was to label the entire black community as street dealers because that just happened to be one's only experience of them?

[RonnieTodger]

2 hours ago, Buce said:

 

Not at all; why would you?

 

Assuming you self-identify as English, would you think it ok for Europeans - whose only experience of the English is having their city smashed up by drunken football fans - tarred you with the same brush?

 

I think the real problem here is that anti-traveller rhetoric is the last socially acceptable prejudice; could you imagine the response if one was to label the entire black community as street dealers because that just happened to be one's only experience of them?

Tarring them with the same brush isn’t what I meant at all. My point was that  some people’s phobias or fear of groups of travellers will be based on experience rather than what the Daily Mail tells them.

 

I understand your last paragraph, but I’ll try to phrase this carefully. 
 

Everybody should be judged on a level playing field. I think it’s more nuanced than outright racism. I’d argue that anybody who has a negative or fearful outlook of Irish Travellers, would be based on more than “only one experience of them” or “what society would have them believe”.

 

I’ve had good and bad experiences with Irish travellers. Overwhelmingly bad, but I’d find it hard to tell my mum (who has only received countless abuse at work from families of travellers) to be more open and fair.

Edited 31 July 2021 by RonnieTodger

[DennisNedry]

7 hours ago, Buce said:

 

Not at all; why would you?

 

Assuming you self-identify as English, would you think it ok for Europeans - whose only experience of the English is having their city smashed up by drunken football fans - tarred you with the same brush?

 

I think the real problem here is that anti-traveller rhetoric is the last socially acceptable prejudice; could you imagine the response if one was to label the entire black community as street dealers because that just happened to be one's only experience of them?

 

Just a theory here, but surely that's because people's exposure to them is very limited and only ever tends to occur in a negative way?

 

To use black people as your example. In daily life you'll see black people in shops, on the train and at the park. They're your colleagues, your mates, the bloke you sit next to at the KP. Nowadays black people feature prominently in films, in TV/adverts, sport and music. 

 

Contrast that to travellers. When does the average person ever have anything to do with them? I've never even met a traveller. The only time they're ever mentioned by the media or people I know is when they're causing trouble at the location they've decided to stop at. 

[Sly]

2 hours ago, DennisNedry said:

 

Just a theory here, but surely that's because people's exposure to them is very limited and only ever tends to occur in a negative way?

 

To use black people as your example. In daily life you'll see black people in shops, on the train and at the park. They're your colleagues, your mates, the bloke you sit next to at the KP. Nowadays black people feature prominently in films, in TV/adverts, sport and music. 

 

Contrast that to travellers. When does the average person ever have anything to do with them? I've never even met a traveller. The only time they're ever mentioned by the media or people I know is when they're causing trouble at the location they've decided to stop at. 

My only encounter with them was as a child, where they’d setup on a local field near to my primary school.  
 

I was chased by a load of them (children / teenagers) as they wanted my BMX. They were throwing stuff and I got hit on the head by a brick end. 
 

I remember escaping and cycling home to my parents, with blood literally pouring down my face and into my eyes. 
 

My parents took me to hospital to get stitched up and phoned the police to report the incident. The police subsequently did absolutely nothing about it.

 

Rightly, or wrongly, I’d say that has tarnished my lifetime opinion on them and I don’t hold them in high regard. 

[tom27111]

1 minute ago, Sly said:

My only encounter with them was as a child, where they’d setup on a local field near to my primary school.  
 

I was chased by a load of them (children / teenagers) as they wanted my BMX. They were throwing stuff and I got hit on the head by a brick end. 
 

I remember escaping and cycling home to my parents, with blood literally pouring down my face and into my eyes. 
 

My parents took me to hospital to get stitched up and phoned the police to report the incident. The police subsequently did absolutely nothing about it.

 

Rightly, or wrongly, I’d say that has tarnished my lifetime opinion on them and I don’t hold them in high regard. 

 

I've had many encounters with travellers.

 

Absolute scum of the earth.

 

Shitting in a shops changing rooms when I was young and worked in retail.

 

Various incidents in the many years I ran pubs.

 

Up to only earlier this week when I was delivering parcels to their site. Threatened, abused, kids attempting to break in to my van...

 

I'm only referring to them as travellers because I don't want to get banned from this forum.

[Buce]

7 hours ago, tom27111 said:

 

I've had many encounters with travellers.

 

Absolute scum of the earth.

 

Shitting in a shops changing rooms when I was young and worked in retail.

 

Various incidents in the many years I ran pubs.

 

Up to only earlier this week when I was delivering parcels to their site. Threatened, abused, kids attempting to break in to my van...

 

I'm only referring to them as travellers because I don't want to get banned from this forum.

 

Scum of the Earth is ok though?

 

Makes my point perfectly - you would get an instant ban and possible police involvement if you described any other demographic (gays? blacks? Jews?) in that way.

Edited 1 August 2021 by Buce

[RonnieTodger]

Generally I think whilst Irish travellers are officially recognised as a race, people (rightly or wrongly) simply view them as white folk that live a disruptive way of life. 

[LiberalFox]

19 hours ago, Buce said:

 

Not at all; why would you?

 

Assuming you self-identify as English, would you think it ok for Europeans - whose only experience of the English is having their city smashed up by drunken football fans - tarred you with the same brush?

 

I think the real problem here is that anti-traveller rhetoric is the last socially acceptable prejudice; could you imagine the response if one was to label the entire black community as street dealers because that just happened to be one's only experience of them?

Think there are a few communities who it is socially acceptable to be prejudiced against. Think this is spot on though. I've actually encountered a bit of pushback in some places for being English - not going to claim it's racism because that's far too strong and I do think the English have been oppressors but obviously that's none of our problem individually. 

[Livid]

Some of our Social Media fan base are a little nuts*

It’s ok to personally have a go at our players. God forbid you decide to not go to a glorified pre-season friendly or have anything but unadulterated love for the new kit and you’re a plastic.

 

A lot of them are coming across as a real life version of the Fanatical Frank  cartoon from The Fox but on crack! 

 

* Absolutely batsh*t crazy! 

[foxile5]

They don't pay taxes and have robbed my grandmother. 

 

This issue isn't a unique issue either. Trouble and anti social behaviour is very much the norm in their encampments. 

[doverfox]

I once meet a Man U fan from Manchester do I now believe that people from Manchester support United of course not the guy i meet was just a glory hunting plastic fan.

[Sly]

3 hours ago, LiberalFox said:

Think there are a few communities who it is socially acceptable to be prejudiced against. Think this is spot on though. I've actually encountered a bit of pushback in some places for being English - not going to claim it's racism because that's far too strong and I do think the English have been oppressors but obviously that's none of our problem individually. 

I was asked to leave a pub in Omagh, Northern Ireland for having an English accent when I was on my graduate program 20 years ago. 

[ealingfox]

These days if you say you're English, you get arrested and thrown in jail

[bovril]

4 hours ago, LiberalFox said:

Think there are a few communities who it is socially acceptable to be prejudiced against. Think this is spot on though. I've actually encountered a bit of pushback in some places for being English - not going to claim it's racism because that's far too strong and I do think the English have been oppressors but obviously that's none of our problem individually. 

Prejudice is socially acceptable across most of Europe. And I don't think there's a group who don't suffer any prejudice whatsoever (the Swedes?). I lived in N. Italy with a guy from Naples and an Italian whose parents were Albanian. They used to joke that to the northern Italians I was the only one who wasn't 'foreign'.

 

We seem to care much more about this stuff in English-speaking countries. 

Edited 1 August 2021 by bovril

[leicsmac]

It's been said elsewhere, but I think a version of the Olympics where performance enhancing drugs were permitted in any shape or form (so long as they were proven not to be significantly detrimental to the health of the athlete) would make for a great spectacle.

 

Let's see how far we can really push human potential.

[Nalis]

7 hours ago, leicsmac said:

It's been said elsewhere, but I think a version of the Olympics where performance enhancing drugs were permitted in any shape or form (so long as they were proven not to be significantly detrimental to the health of the athlete) would make for a great spectacle.

 

Let's see how far we can really push human potential.

I've often thought this and thought it would be very interesting to see if someone could do something laughably unthinkable like run 100m in under 7 seconds or throw a javelin out of the stadium.

 

I guess the flipside is that you would get some people forced into experimental drugs against their will.

[Voll Blau]

15 minutes ago, Nalis said:

I've often thought this and thought it would be very interesting to see if someone could do something laughably unthinkable like run 100m in under 7 seconds or throw a javelin out of the stadium.

 

I guess the flipside is that you would get some people forced into experimental drugs against their will.

Dunno why but this made me laugh. Imagining a load of javelins, hammers and discuses just landing in the street destroying cars now.

Edited 1 August 2021 by Voll Blau

[Langston]

9 hours ago, ealingfox said:

These days if you say you're English, you get arrested and thrown in jail

 

Can't even order an Indian these days!

[peach0000]

10 hours ago, leicsmac said:

It's been said elsewhere, but I think a version of the Olympics where performance enhancing drugs were permitted in any shape or form (so long as they were proven not to be significantly detrimental to the health of the athlete) would make for a great spectacle.

 

Let's see how far we can really push human potential.

Could even go a step further and start genetically engineering embryos and training them from birth. May not be the most ethical but I would certainly watch it. I've had these thoughts many a time and would love it to happen. I mean imagine if they were to clone Usain Bolt and feed the resulting child performance enhancing drugs through his childhood.  Or even a less extreme case where they had just let Usain Bolt take drugs throughout his career, surely would have gone at least sub 9 seconds. 

[leicsmac]

4 hours ago, Nalis said:

I've often thought this and thought it would be very interesting to see if someone could do something laughably unthinkable like run 100m in under 7 seconds or throw a javelin out of the stadium.

 

I guess the flipside is that you would get some people forced into experimental drugs against their will.

Yeah, you would have to be very careful regarding the athletes consenting to dose themselves up like that, but I think that would be possible.

 

1 hour ago, peach0000 said:

Could even go a step further and start genetically engineering embryos and training them from birth. May not be the most ethical but I would certainly watch it. I've had these thoughts many a time and would love it to happen. I mean imagine if they were to clone Usain Bolt and feed the resulting child performance enhancing drugs through his childhood.  Or even a less extreme case where they had just let Usain Bolt take drugs throughout his career, surely would have gone at least sub 9 seconds. 

Think that might have a problem or two with the above consent issues, but yeah.

[ozleicester]

12 hours ago, leicsmac said:

It's been said elsewhere, but I think a version of the Olympics where performance enhancing drugs were permitted in any shape or form (so long as they were proven not to be significantly detrimental to the health of the athlete) would make for a great spectacle.

 

Let's see how far we can really push human potential.

Who are you and what have you done with leicsmac?

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, ozleicester said:

Who are you and what have you done with leicsmac?

 

I'm still here - informed consent and the safety and health of the athletes would still be the top priority. But as long as that is made as certain as can be...well, why not?

[Footballwipe]

21 hours ago, Livid said:

Some of our Social Media fan base are a little nuts*

It’s ok to personally have a go at our players. God forbid you decide to not go to a glorified pre-season friendly or have anything but unadulterated love for the new kit and you’re a plastic.

 

A lot of them are coming across as a real life version of the Fanatical Frank  cartoon from The Fox but on crack! 

 

* Absolutely batsh*t crazy! 

I'm genuinely interested in the dynamic of this. 

 

I don't know whether it's a seeming need to appease your followers with diehard lcfc content, whether LeicesterTwitter is just a cult etc.

 

What can be said that it's descended a lot to this point over the years. I suspect it's a mix of people trying to cultivate the likes and shares, coupled with people who can't attend games (for whatever reason), so they're doing everything they can to emphasise their staunch support.

 

No matter what that case is, it's really off-putting when you're scrolling and it pops up, because it's absolutely not how I want to support the team.

[LiberalFox]

3 hours ago, leicsmac said:

 

I'm still here - informed consent and the safety and health of the athletes would still be the top priority. But as long as that is made as certain as can be...well, why not?

Thought we already did this and called them therapeutic use exemptions